LA TIMES: Young Obama Went to Mosque: Bowed to Allah

[AtomicKitten]

LA Times: Young Obama Went to Mosque: Bowed To Allah
As a child, Obama crossed a cultural divide in Indonesia
By Paul Watson, Times Staff Writer
March 15, 2007

JAKARTA, Indonesia -- As a boy in Indonesia, Barack Obama crisscrossed the religious divide. At the local primary school, he prayed in thanks to a Catholic saint. In the neighborhood mosque, he bowed to Allah.

Having a personal background in both Christianity and Islam might seem useful for an aspiring U.S. president in an age when Islamic nations and radical groups are key national security and foreign policy issues. But a connection with Islam is untrod territory for presidential politics.

Obama's four years as a child in Indonesia underscore how dramatically his background differs from that of past presidential hopefuls, most of whom spent little, if any, time in other countries. No one knows how voters will react to a candidate with an early exposure to Islam, a religion that remains foreign to many Americans.

Obama's campaign aides have emphasized his strong Christian beliefs and downplayed any Islamic connection. The candidate was raised "in a secular household in Indonesia by his stepfather and mother," his chief spokesman, Robert Gibbs, said in a statement in January after false reports began circulating that Obama had attended a radical madrasa, or Koranic school, as a child.

"To be clear, Senator Obama has never been a Muslim, was not raised a Muslim, and is a committed Christian who attends the United Church of Christ in Chicago," Gibbs' Jan. 24 statement said. In a statement to The Times on Wednesday, the campaign offered slightly different wording, saying: "Obama has never been a practicing Muslim." The statement added that as a child, Obama had spent time in the neighborhood's Islamic center.

His former Roman Catholic and Muslim teachers, along with two people who were identified by Obama's grade-school teacher as childhood friends, say Obama was registered by his family as a Muslim at both of the schools he attended. That registration meant that during the third and fourth grades, Obama learned about Islam for two hours each week in religion class.

The childhood friends say Obama sometimes went to Friday prayers at the local mosque. "We prayed but not really seriously, just following actions done by older people in the mosque. But as kids, we loved to meet our friends and went to the mosque together and played," said Zulfin Adi, who describes himself as among Obama's closest childhood friends.

more at http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-obama15mar15,0,5315525,full.story?coll=la-home-headlines

*******************************************

Obama takes issue with report identifying him as Muslim
By Helen Kennedy
New York Daily News

March 16, 2007

NEW YORK - Barack Obama wants everyone to know: I am not a Muslim!

Under a headline reading "Just because the L.A. Times writes it, does not make it true," the Obama campaign took issue Thursday with a story that said the Illinois Democrat attended services at a mosque and "bowed to Allah" when he was a small boy in Indonesia.

"Barack Obama is not and has never been a Muslim," the campaign stressed. "Obama never prayed in a mosque. He has never been a Muslim, was not raised a Muslim and is a committed Christian who attends the United Church of Christ."

Obama, who lived in Jakarta between the ages of 6 and 10 with his mother and Indonesian stepfather, has said he was raised in a secular household and attended both Catholic and Muslim schools. Indonesia's population is mostly Muslim.

His spokesman, Bill Burton, said he didn't think the campaign statement was too strongly worded.

"As folks get to know Sen. Obama, it's important that people get the facts straight," he said. "Sen. Obama has been very clear and direct about who he is and where he comes from."

His campaign reacted just as strongly to a story aired on Fox News in January that falsely said he attended a radical Islamic madrassa, or religious school, as a child.

A Diageo poll last month found that 6 percent of voters think Obama is Muslim.

Meanwhile, in horse race polls, a new Harris survey found Obama closing on Democratic front-runner Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y..

Clinton still leads Obama 15 percent to 12 percent among all adults, but her lead is down from 20 percent to 10 percent last month.

A Time magazine poll found Clinton's lead over Obama narrowed to eight points among Democrats, down from a 12-point lead late last month.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/nation/16915362.htm

[Ethelk2044]

1. Muslim

Everyone knows that he is not Muslim this is a bunch of crap. Cnn and other stations have come out against this smear last month.

[fuzzyball]

33. Barack Hussein is NOT a muslim inspite of his name..

but no one can deny his father was 100% muslim.
Obama needs to speak out AGAINST MUSLIM EXTREMISTS
including 911 instigators.
Then he can be accepted by the voters.

[Crunchy Frog]

I deny that his father was "100% Muslim".

His father was an atheist as an adult. There is no more burden on Obama to speak out against Muslim extremists or 911 instigators than there is on any other candidate of either party.

I'm astounded at the bigotry that I sometimes encounter at this site.

[Crunchy Frog]

55. Delete.

[NDP]

57. Yeah, and most of the charges against Clinton during Whitewater were false as well, but

it doesn't matter. The "discussion" will not end, and neither will the belief that "there may be something to it" by many voters who are "looking for any excuse that they can find" to satisfy their conscience because they don't really want to vote for a black candidate. We live in a dumbed down society with a lot of "hidden" racism.

[Benhurst]

2. I am so relieved. I was afraid he had been raised a Baptist.

:+

[karynnj]

13. Oh God, not another Southern Baptist !!!

Seriously, is this really 2007? I mean between Romney is a Mormon and Obama was maybe a Muslim until he was 6 years old - not to mention that in 2004 it was a problem that Kerry was a Roman Catholic.

In Obama's case, can't he claim special credit for actually CHOOSING to be Christian. Surely in an evangelical religion converts are welcome and special.

[venable]

22. hilarious

very good, and puts this non-story into perspective.

well done.

[smalll]

3. Good to have Obama address this issue.

There's only one problem I see if Obama was ever a Muslim, either because of his activities in Indonesia or because his father was a Muslim: Obama is now a Christian, and so he counts as an apostate in Muslim eyes. Certainly every Jihadist would believe that for that reason, he deserves death. Not all Muslim schools believe that apostasy deserves death, but it seems they do believe that it deserves some kind of punishment. Here's a relatively even-handed link on the subject: http://www.rferl.org/featuresarticle/2006/03/698d27d4-ec5d-429d-9ded-286e8d29d6eb.html

All this means, I guess, is that the Secret Service will have to be its usual vigilant self. Could they successfully protect a President Obama? They've kept Bush safe over these past 7 years as hated as he is around the world, so I'm sure they could do the same for Obama.

[PresidentObama]

4. Oh dear, I can't vote for anyone who bows to Allah. Gasp.

I notice the Democrats like to wear Livestrong bracelets. Wheres the WWJD bracelet? Those damn liberals need less Inconvient Truth, and more Purpose Driven Life. Did you know God hates gays, and that Ken Lay is in heaven?

Oh by the way, have you worshiped your Ronald Reagan cardboard cutout today?

BROWNBACK/HAGGARD 08!!!!

:sarcasm:

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

5. Does the summer I spent in New Jersey in 1988 with observant relatives make me a jew?

[PresidentObama]

7. But....but....if the MSM reports it, it's the truth. Don't ya know that? n/t

[Debi]

6. What exactly would it matter if he were Muslim? Muslim is not evil

I understand his desire to have the truth out there and I also see the manipulation by the right-wing nut-jobs that think Muslim=terrorist. But we should ask ourselves, what if he were Muslim? what if he had been raised Muslim? Would it change how we feel about Barack Obama?

[DFW]

8. Like I care what he did when he was six.

If GHW Bush took Junior with him to China before we established diplomatic relations,
does that mean W has been working for the People's Republic of China all this time?

Hmmmm, no wonder we ran up all this debt, and we now owe them a trillion dollars.....

If I didn't have more important things to do tonight, like make tea and go to bed,
I could probably come up with ten or twenty more...........

[Eurobabe]

69. We need to investigate his beliefs as a fetus

:eyes: :sarcasm:

What a load of crap this article is, and who really fucking cares?

MSM, get a grip on yourselves and investigate some REAL stories?

Thanks in advance.

[Pirate Smile]

9. Hotline: Obama and Islam: A Caution

Obama and Islam: A Caution

The Los Angeles Times makes some provocative points this morning about a five-year old Sen. Barack Obama "bow to Allah," about how, though his mother went to Church, "Barry Obama" would often choose to attend mosque, about how he was registered as a Muslim at school.

Campaign spokesman Bill Burton sent a listering, bolded, underlined response: "Barack Obama Is Not and Has Never Been a Muslim."

Depends on what the meaning of the word "is," is, but really: how many young children have fully formed religious identities -- especially young children in mixed religion families? Do we really know why Obama liked to hang out at the mosque? The Times article suggests that the mosque served as a communal gathering place for him and his friends.

A more interesting question is why Obama so forcefully takes exception to having his childhood labeled as such. Certainly, if it's not true, he has a right to object. It could be that, as a Christian, he is offended by those who claim that he once inhabited a different moral universe. It could also be that he knows a general prejudice against Islam exists in America today, and that his identification with that religion could hurt him politically. (A recent poll found that seven percent of those surveyed thought Obama was Muslim -- that can't be helpful in a general election). Or maybe Obama, already a precocious autobiographer, objects to a different interpretation of his history.

Editorial side note: I attended a small high school affiliated with the Episcopal Church. Every Wednesday, all students attended a mandatory prayer service. When the students stood, I stood. When they bowed their heads, mine inched down. You might have even caught me mouthing of a few of the hymns. But I was Jewish, as were about fifteen percent of my classmates. We weren't Christians. We didn't become Christians because we sat through the services. Attendence was required; it was a prerequisite -- a community standard.

http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/archives/2007/03/obama_and_islam.html

[Colobo]

10. If I'm not Christian, and someone

makes up a story about me speaking in tongues in a Baptist church, I will forcefully deny it.

[Ethelk2044]

11. Obama

Obama needs to file lawsuits for anyone who continue to put out these lies.

[Colobo]

12. I would LOVE to know who's REALLY behind this...

[draft_mario_cuomo]

39. Who has the greatest motive to do opposition research on Obama?

Some will do anything and say anything in their lust for power. :(

[AtomicKitten]

52. I was rather stunned to see it come from the LA Times.

[ProudDad]

62. Here's a clue

http://www.tribune.com/

The L.A. Times was bought by these fucks and has had their editorial and newsroom staff cut and purged...

It's just another corporate paper for now...

[HRC_in_08]

14. the people who care about this won't vote for Obama anyway. EOM.

[Ethelk2044]

20. Attack

The more they attack him the more his numbers goes up.

[Hatalles]

29. I don't know.

I think you might be underestimating the amount of Islamophobia on the left. I've found that "liberals" can be just as bad when it comes to conservatives on this matter.

[HRC_in_08]

32. have not seen this. if true, it is sad. eom

[Hav]

35. .

Sadly that's true. Even on DU there are certain people who are bringing up that Obama is a Muslim and by that trying to discredit his run.

[HRC_in_08]

42. have not seen this...

I would gladly support Obama. I do not believe these stories, but even if true, it would not affect my views of him.

[MasonJar]

15. This is another "swift boat" attempt by the "liberal" press. All dem

candidates need to react to them "swiftly" this time around. I have never gotten over how the war hero Kerry got Swiftboated" by the Draft dodger Cheney and the AWOL Bush. Americans are often so dense.

[AtomicKitten]

51. I agree.

I found this article aggressively over-the-top and downright obnoxious.

[TheConstantGardener]

16. I really dont' care what religion my candidates are

That's their personal business; unless their religion is something like "I like to kill kittens for fun" or something. : p

[Solon]

66. That would be Bill Frist.

Then again, what would you expect from a Republican.

[southernleftylady]

17. About to come on Tucker and msnbc next nt

[Ethelk2044]

18. Obama

I see this as taking people for stupid. People will vote for him. Like before people will see this as an attack on him and that means they will back him even more.

[Ninja Jordan]

19. Maybe Obama isn't ready for primetime?

This stuff is serious.

[TheConstantGardener]

21. How is it at all serious?

Everyone knows immigrant children like him experienced many religions. It has nothing to do with his governing capability.

[venable]

26. I hope all candidates, including mine, back him up

in a couple of ways - one to get the swift-boating to stop, and two - (and more importantly) to make it clear that we do not live in a theocracy, so that in matters of government, it simply doesn't matter.

there are some good points here though. the fact that there is a candidate for whom Islam is not an 'other' is a wonderful advantage in this era.

And i say this as an avid supporter of Edwards.

[TheConstantGardener]

28. They have to fight back as soon as the idiotic swift boating starts

They can't hold any punches here.

[AtomicKitten]

53. The MSM LUV being bitchy with the Democratic candidates.

This is from an article I wrote:

CNN's Reliable Sources August 10, 2002 was a genuine eye-opener. Guest Josh Marshall, webmaster of Talking Points, stated, "... I think deep down most reporters just have contempt for Al Gore. I don't even think it's dislike. It's more like disdain and contempt." None of the talking heads disagreed. Guest Dana Milbank, White House reporter for the Washington Post offered,"You know what it is? I think that Gore is sanctimonious and that's sort of the worst thing in the eyes of the press. And he has been disliked all along and it was because he gives a sense that he is better than us ... as reporters."

[Ninja Jordan]

44. It's serious because it reeks of swiftboating 2.0

[Ethelk2044]

24. This is not Serious

Please. They do not have anything on him. This all they have. So you are telling me if your stepfather was a muslim then you are at fault. That is the same conculsion you are saying about Obama. People need to get over that.

[ripple]

58. quite the opposite

The fact that Obama fired back to this thinly veiled smear in a clear, unambiguous manner shows that he's more than ready for prime time.

[rocktivity]

23. Was that religion class for Muslims only, or for all children?

Two hours a week in a public school hardly qualifies as a madrassah. And her SOMETIMES went to Friday prayers? Of his own will or his parents'?

Once again, nice try.

:eyes:
rocknation

[Ethelk2044]

25. All Children

They did not teach religion. It was a regular school. CNN had the Principal on TV about a month ago because faux tried put out that he was muslim.

[Tellurian]

27. The US president a Muslim? It will never happen..nm

[NYCGirl]

34. I don't think Keith Ellison is interesting in running anyway.

:P

[Ethelk2044]

38. Stop Trying to Smear Obama

It is very obivious what you are trying to do. I do not care that you support Hillary, but you do not have to try to smear him. Is that her last hope to have her friends smear him. If that is the only way to win, then she is a lost cause.

[TheConstantGardener]

40. Hopefully a war criminal also won't be US President (after Dubya that is)

[Crunchy Frog]

56. The US president a lesbian? It will never happen. n/t

[Unvanguard]

30. It's saddening that any candidate needs to make this insistence. n/t

[Cha]

31. And?

[PresidentObama]

36. So if I bow to Allah, combine that with my homosexuality, and I'll never be President. But Bush can?

Oh dear!!

Why does America buy into the bullshit the Republicans and sources like Faux News feed them?

Ignorance?!?

:shrug:

[Raksha]

37. The L.A. Times is being less than honest.

Re >>But a connection with Islam is untrod territory for presidential politics.<<

A connection to Islam (real or fabricated) is not just "untrod territory," it is a liability. It will be used by the right-wing smear machine to label him a "terrorist," as it has been already. So why don't they just come out and say so?

[zulchzulu]

41. OK! I admit it! I went to a native Hopi sweat lodge ceremony once!

Actually it was the best religious experience I ever had...but I digress...

I guess I'm a Hopi.

[Bucky]

54. Didn't Bush say Hopi is a religion of peace?

[ProudDad]

65. I did a sweat in Las Cruces, NM

It WAS the closest thing to a "religious experience" I'VE ever had...

[AtomicKitten]

43. I had computer trouble earlier when I posted this and couldn't elaborate.

I was originally sent this from someone who had seen it as BREAKING NEWS on the Fox Noise Channel and researched it back to the original LA Times article.

Interestingly I found that the LA Times had been accused of coddling Obama which I thought was pretty amusing in light of this beauty they printed yesterday well AFTER this medrassa crappola had already been dispelled pretty thoroughly.

Anyhoo, FNC had a field day with this mess and all Obama can do is put out statements poo-poo'ing it over and over again.

This struck me as something the wingnuts will do .... it never occurred to me that they would be aided and abetted by the allegedly "ultraliberal Obama-coddling LA Times," or in other words, it's election season again and the Dems better bring a gun to the knife fight.

[HuffleClaw]

45. so?

that is newsworthy?

[AtomicKitten]

49. I thought it was interesting.

I thought the LA Times article was aggressively over-the-top and that Obama must be getting sick and tired of having to correct the misinformation that the MSM seems to love passing around about him.

Ya know, you don't have to post on a thread that you find so lacking of newsworthiness.

[ripple]

59. This was definitely worth posting, AK

I wonder if the other poster was referring to the fact that the LA Times somehow thought it was newsworthy.

This silliness makes me think back to when I was a kid and my mom and stepdad thought we should be more spiritual as a family, so they sort of "church shopped" for a while. They drug me to several churches of different denominations, with the longest stint being at a mormon church.

Today, I'm a devout agnostic and I'd find it laughable if someone were to try to tag me with a religious label. That appears to be exactly what the LA Times is trying to do to Obama. It's beyond absurd.

[quinnox]

46. If Obama did bow to Allah

he should just say so and stop running away from it. He is only reinforcing the bad stereotypes of muslims as terrorists by not embracing his past. Heck, it may even win points on the left as shown by some of the responses.

[Clarkie1]

47. I think that's very cool that he did that. nt

[AZBlue]

48. I appreciate any politician that understands, respects and even investigates different religions.

Besides, Islam is a very peaceful religion, doesn't hate others, and doesn't try to convert them either - traits it would be nice to see in more religions, imo.

Typical Fox News falderal, pandering to their bigoted and unintelligent viewers. Disgusting.

[AtomicKitten]

50. Obama has a fascinating diverse background

... and I get the impression that the MSM either doesn't understand that or are trying to exploit it opportunistically just to be bitchy. They have a tendency to do that with Democratic presidential candidates.

[fujiyama]

60. A misleading headline to say the least

Yellow journalism at its finest.

The article makes it sound like Obama is or was at some point in his life, Muslim. God, it's almost sounding like "are you, or have you been a member of the communist party?". Unfortunately we can see some idiots above on this same thread falling into the trap. My favorite is he needs to "denounce the 9/11 instigators". Wow, that's some real ignorance and it pisses me off that anyone would question his patriotism this way. Disgusting. Why the fuck wouldn't any sane thinking person not condemn 9/11? But the same poster claims Hillary made the "right choice" in her vote on the war resolution.

Either way, he wasn't Muslim. He lived in a Muslim nation and he likely wanted to fit in as a child and be accepted by the society he was in. His father was Muslim but it seems as though he didn't play such a huge role in his life. I'm sure he learned a lot from those he met when he was young and his different perspective on the world is what would be needed in government now. After all, many leaders in other nations have studied and spent some part of their childhood in the West. In the post Bush world, as we will seek to repair relations with Muslim nations, and Obama may have a better chance than most in dealing with them. He will likely be more culturally aware for one. And his insight may be key in pressuring leaders in those nations to make necessary reforms to create more secular tolerant societies with greater emphasis on education and development. Maybe that's a stretch, but you never know what's possible when you don't come off as an ignorant messianic dumbfuck believing to be acting on the orders of God.

I went to Bible classes as a child with friends. My parents weren't Christian and I never converted. But it was one way to hang out with some friends and we made some arts and crafts.

So are people going to accuse me of being Christian now because of that?

[Forkboy]

61. I would prefer someone who didn't bow to any god

but if you're going to Allah is as good as the next.

[ProudDad]

63. When did you stop beating your wife??

That's the class that this "story" belongs in.

It shouldn't matter what anyone's religion is or whether they have any at all. But in this christo-fascist country, you gotta be a "christian" -- whatever the fuck that is...

[ProudDad]

64. FYI - so much for the "liberal press"

http://www.tribune.com/

The L.A. Times was bought by these fucks and has had their editorial and newsroom staff cut and purged...

It's just another corporate paper

[JerseygirlCT]

67. Allah = Arabic for "God"

There is so much ignorance in this country!

Who cares that he prayed in a mosque (if he did)? That headline is just fodder for the slavering religious bigots out there, eager to paint the charismatic senator as somehow a buddy of Osama bin Laden...

[loudsue]

68. This would be a great talking point about school prayer.

When kids are in an environment where they are supposed to "go along with the majority", it can come back to bite them as adults running for office. They can be persecuted by a general public that prays to a different "god", and they're just children! They don't really get a choice.

THAT is one good reason to keep religion OUT OF SCHOOLS!!!

:kick::kick::kick:

[Blue_Tires]

70. swift boating part 2

why do i get the feeling that the RW is paying dozens of private investigators to scour the globe until they find one of Obama's classmates from all those years ago?? Classmates that with a little financial prodding would be willing to SWEAR to the msm that they saw six-year-old Obama swear loyalty to allah or something??

[nadinbrzezinski]

71. Oh like the... Arkansas project

nah, yuo don't say, they are so honest they have never done that (arkansas Project, swifboating, et al),

:sarcasm: