Why is it so important the Hillary win????

[Perky]

My sense is that in some respects that it is no longer about her gender.....On DU is is squarely about her competence and her politics. So its begs the question more fundamentally,,,,Giver her politics and here poliitcs, why is it so important that Hillary win. Is this really about the Retrun of Billary? Is it about harkening back to some sout of pre-Bush ere of good feeling?

[jmp]

1. It's not.

It's just that all signs point to her winning. Not that many are what I would call "excited" about her winning the nomination. Most just accept that it is likely.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jgraz]

3. Because otherwise the Rethugs will take the WHITE HOUSE!!!!!1111

Wait...Im being told there are other - repeat: other - Democrats in the race. I'll have to check into this and get back to you.

[HughBeaumont]

24. Dear God I've NEVER understood this line of BS from the Hillaristas.

Seriously. Whether I leave my vote blank should Hillary get the nomination is not going to matter one iota. Personally, I don't think she can fix a Kleenex box, but that's just me.

But the whole "It's the same as votin' for a Republican" scare tactic is a BIT much.

This is the WEAKEST GOP field since the one that sent grouchy Bob Dole to the race in 1996. The only name recognition candidate they have, and this is just BARELY, is "Mr. 9/11", and he's so unbelieveably flawed, not even a maelstorm of MSM praise will save him.

The others . . . well sheesh, you got an actor, a "progressive" Republican (who's a flat-taxer, pro-lifer and passes out flyers that have pics of him and Reagan. Yeah, THAT'S going to get me to vote for you), a generic panderer, a xenophobe, a once-great war hero-turned-Bewsh-sycophant, a religious-right whack-a-doo . . . I mean, PLEASE.

There's no Bewsh to run away with this thing or to inspire theft among the Corporations. The Pukes KNOW they're screwed.

If the Dem candidate no matter WHO they are cannot beat the Repuke by at least 30-40 electoral votes, then maybe the problem isn't with the voter. Maybe the problem lies with the fact that we refuse to nominate a Dem that inspires enough voters to elect them.

[AzDar]

4. Haven't you heard ? She has been chosen. Resistance is futile.

It's a DLC 'tsunami', baby....

[Ninga]

5. Her gender IS 75% of this dynamic, and married with her politics and experience, gives her an

overwhelming boost.

For those of us who list gender or race third, rather than first, her competence and her politics matter, and in my view, does not make her number one with me.

I remember the words of the late Molly Ivans, who when assessing John Kerry, wrote that he was lacking the "Elvis factor," which Molly expressed was important.

Barbara Boxer has the Elvis factor.

Olymipa Snowe does not.

Dodd, Biden, Obama, Edwards have the Elvis factor.

Brownback does not.

Neither does Hillary.

[Tellurian]

6. Hillary has the Bill factor; Obama and Edwards do not!

[Ninga]

9. It is not enough, and quite frankly, falls into the same catagory as VP. People don't vote

for the VP over the top of the ticket. When the voter is alone in the booth, ready to pull the lever, the face they will see will be hers, not Bill's.

[Tellurian]

13. hahaha! Sez you!

:rofl:

[MadHound]

10. And that's a good thing?

Despite the spin and the hype, there are many people, Democrats and liberals, who not only weren't impressed with Bill, but are disappointed and angry with him over his pro corporate, pro military stance. Under his watch, we had our media voices silenced, our social safety net shredded, and watched as 500,000 innocents were killed due to sanctions or thrice weekly bombing runs in Iraq. Sure, the man looks like a genius right now, but hell Nixon looks good in comparison to Bush.

Don't automatically assume that Bill's cache is a good thing to all people. Many of us oppose Hillary because of Bill's actions and reputation.

[Tellurian]

15. People do remember "Peace and Prosperity"..

in spite of what you may think. Many people oppose Hillary just because... you and they fall into the land of the lost catagory.

[MadHound]

33. LOL, yes that's right, land of the lost

All those reasons for not voting for Hillary that you're hoping somehow are lost. Her vote for the IWR, her long term support for the war, her close corporate ties, her health care program, yes, all these and more you're hoping will go away. The trouble is, they won't, and these are the reasons that many people won't be voting for Hillary.

[Tellurian]

39. The people voting for Hillary are winners...

Anyone voting for another candidate will suffer with EHS... :nuke:

That is not my problem..

[Dawgs]

11. Hillary's popular because of her sex first, name second, and what she brings third.

I think this is what annoys me about her supporters more than anything. She is running on the fact that she is a woman that is married to a popular President; and this is all that matters to her supporters. When's the last time any of us saw a Hillary supporter post anything that didn't have to do with her popularity. It's truly scary.

If she was a another white male Democratic Senator she wouldn't get anywhere close to the nomination. She is a bright, capable, intelligent Democrat. And IMO, that is all.

She scares the hell out of me. I think she votes based on how it will look for her Presidential run. I think a lot of Democrats support her because they think it will be another Presidency like Bill's - which wasn't as great now that many of us look back on it.

I feel it's time we try something new, because we can do better.

[Tellurian]

17. Hillary is popular because she exudes confidence to the voters..

She ALWAYS knows what she is talking about and doesn't need campaign staff out there clarifying her words. People want a president that can stand on their own and think for themselves and hit the ground running on day 1. They call it "experience."

[CTyankee]

20. Tellurian, how best can Hillary control her message once she is the candidate?

The RW slime machine will do what it always does. It will try to take Hillary's narrative away from her and replace it with THEIR narrative. The MSM, even tho it may have doubts about the RW's "facts," seem to just pick it up and the next thing you know you are seeing it on GMA and The Today Show. Dems are left sputtering in rage. How do you think Hillary can keep that from happening, because once it does it is a downhill slope?

Just my increasing paranoia speaking here...

[Tellurian]

35. Believe me when I say, there will be nothing holding her back from taking the RW down completely..

I give John Edwards, no vote of confidence after lending his name to Bush's website supporting the War.

Obama is a blood relative to Bush. He can never be trusted. He isn't worthy of my vote.

[Dawgs]

22. Then "people" are stupid. They should vote for someone based on judgement, not experience.

And, if they are voting for her because SHE exudes confidence, then we are lost as a party and a country.

[Tesha]

28. Bush (used to) exude confidence. Look how well *THAT* worked out!

Now I won't pretend that Bush and Hillary are similar;
Hillary has more brains in her little finger than Shrub
has left in his entire drug- and alcohol-addled cranium.
But confidence alone is *NOT* a sufficient characteristic
for good leadership.

General Custer probably had confidence too.

Tesha

[Tellurian]

37. Could you put that post in the form of an affidavit..

And let's pretend you didn't post the malarkey you did and try again later when you're feeling better.

[Tesha]

45. Look, ad hominem attacks are not going to carry the day for you.

No matter how many places you attack me.

Tesha

[Tellurian]

46. Don't flatter yourself..

you presume to speak for so many, yet offer little in the way of progressive conversation.

[Tesha]

48. Whereas you offer none. So I'll settle for my "little". (NT)

[Tellurian]

36. Obama is a confused underling.. He has delusions of grandeur..

He associates himself with felons and the Chicago mob. They are responsible for his rise to power.
I don't like his forcing religion down everyone's throat. He fosters discrimination between age and gender groups.
The more I get to know him; the more I dislike him.

[Armstead]

38. So does Bush

[Tellurian]

41. If you actually believe what you're saying..LOL!

[Armstead]

42. I do

Confidence is obviously a good quality in a candidate...But it's what's behind the confidence that matters.

[Tellurian]

47. no points..

Semantic response, preaching to the choir.

[Tesha]

7. If Hillary wins the nomination, Republicans are assured of a win.

If Hillary wins the nomination, Republicans are assured of a win.

They may win directly by actually winning the election.

Or they may win indirectly by having the most-Republican
Democrat win. And she can be kept closely in check by
the vast Right Wing Noise Machine, ensuring that she
doesn't do anything that the Corporatists don't like.

Either way, they win.

Tesha

[peace13]

8. I second that!

[Dawgs]

12. Blind love(and hate) for the Clintons will keep us where we are for at least another four years.

It's truly depressing.

[Tellurian]

18. RW TRIPE!

Nut-Roots analogy!

[Tesha]

26. And your counter-argument is what?

How many times have we heard Bill Clinton called
"the best Republican President in recent memory"?
Do you really think Hillary will be any different?

Tesha

[Tellurian]

34. Delusion isn't an argument..

grow up!

[Tesha]

44. Ahh. I see. You have no argument so you hurl names in the hope that I'll back off.

No such luck.

Tesha

[durrrty libby]

19. People like YOU are the problem

Dems afraid of a crumbling disorganized and failing repuke party drag the dem party down

You people are like abused spouses and cower in the corner waiting for more whacks, rather than
standing up to them

It is vomitous to watch.:puke:

[Tesha]

27. Ahh, well reasoned (not). All ad-hominem, but I guess that's all you've got. (NT)

[AllyCat]

40. I used to believe that, but now, I'm not so sure. I hear she has been

meeting with DimSon (as has Obama to be fair--wish I could find a link for that--maybe someone can help). I also think she is so favored by the corporations they would be just as happy with her in there as any of the meek Repukes running. I really think she could beat any of the Repukes, but then I think nearly all the Dems could beat them.

I am NOT a Hillary supporter. In fact, she is my last choice, but I don't think the Repukes will win automatically if she is elected.

[Dinger]

14. All I Can Say is That. . .

I'm keepin' my mouth shut.

[durrrty libby]

16. It is important for Hillary to win because she is the best candidate

and will make the best president

She is smart, tough and competent

No doubt that Bill is a huge bonus. He will be an amazing good-will ambassador

and can help restore our standing as a decent country.

[cobalt1999]

21. We have a winner!

Great post and summarizes nicely why people are voting for her.

[durrrty libby]

25. Thank you and I do believe it is as simple as that

:toast:

[Perky]

29. Ok....here we go.. what makes her "smart, tough and competent"

[LeFleur1]

30. Smart, Tough, Competent

A. Smart: She was born with brains and trained herself to use them.
B. Tough: She can take punches and still remain standing. She doesn't back down from anyone. She's not perfect, but she's tough.
C. Competent: She doesn't rise to the bait of the incompetent Republicans. She retorts to their shameful attacks with short, to the point replies.
She votes in the 90% range for liberal causes.
She has shown herself to be able to try to make up for mistakes. She admits she is not perfect. She knows something about the world and wants the best for it. It isn't just a new wanting, either. She's been working for liberal causes for the people since law school days. She knows how the government works and can work within it. She wants to bring the country together which might take some negotiation, but we won't be strong again until this terrible divide is healed. That means everyone has to give a little in a reasonable way. (That doesn't mean giving in to neocon nonsense.)

We're not sure how Edwards voted in Congress because he didn't vote in so many instances. He did vote to give Bush "the power" even though he was on the committee that had more information than regular senators.
I will vote for him if he's the nominee, but I don't see why he's better than Hillary. He hasn't proven it in any way, except with words.

Obama has great potential, but we don't know how it will play out. His voting record is good. His experience (which does count with me) is lacking. I'd vote for him if he's the nominee, but I'd worry.

I think either Dodd or Biden would be good presidents. Kuchinich might be, but he alienates people rather than bringing them together which, as we've seen with this administration and majority, is necessary to get anything of value passed.

Gravel could do the job, too, I have no doubt.

People should work for their candidate. Any of the candidates could run the country and most likely do it well. Why tear, punch and kick them? The Republicans will do a good job of that. That's where their expertise lies.

[Perky]

31. I was looking for evidence and anecdote that proves your case.

On legislation?
On Policy?

On this Campaign?

On any other Campaign whre she was the candidate?

Or actually the peson who posted that she was all these things.

[Armstead]

43. It's important for (Fill in the blank) because s/he is the best candidate

and will make the best president

S/he is smart, tough and competent

No doubt that Bill is a huge bonus. He will be an amazing good-will ambassador

and can help restore our standing as a decent country....

AND, if any democrat wins the White House they will likely use Bill in that capacity.

[mod mom]

23. 1. Because it's the only chance the Republicans have in '08 (her devisiveness) 2.

the corporate profiteers will take a hit if we elect a populist president.

[ChiciB1]

32. FWIW... I Honestly Believe Most Think That Things Were So Much Better

when Clinton was in office. What I THINK they miss is, that HILLARY is not Bill! As a Boomer, looking back to the past it seems that it was so much better, but there WERE things going on that were pretty frightening! We had a LOT of Upheaval going on, the '68 Convention was a Disaster... but still I remember OUR boots on the street activism, which is all but impossible today! We got a LOT OF ATTENTION because of what we did... today the only way "boots" will get noticed is if we gather together in the millions!!

But still, I BELIEVE IN REVOLUTION!! To many Hillary = Bill, that's what I believe, because she's much more to the RIGHT of me, and seemingly more to the RIGHT of even BIG DAWG himself!

[Exultant Democracy]

49. So that she can lead us into war with Iran?

:shrug: