Edwards, Obama spar over size of table

[BeyondGeography]

INDEPENDENCE, Iowa – With the Iowa caucuses less than three weeks away, it is hyper-rapid-response time. Consider the comments of Sen. Barack Obama this morning inside an event and auction center here. Less than a day after former North Carolina Sen. John Edwards suggested Obama is too conciliatory in his leadership approach, Obama shot back his own, clearly prepared retort.

Edwards, campaigning Friday in a northeast Iowa town that Obama visited at roughly the same time, suggested the Illinois Democrat's proposed leadership style would not serve him well in reforming health care and fixing other problems.

"He talks about bringing drug companies, insurance companies ... to the table and working with them and negotiating and compromising," Edwards said Friday. "I just think that'll never work. If that would work, it would have worked years ago. If that worked, we'd have universal health care. We don't." Obama often suggests he would form a "big table" that would include all interests involved in the health care issue when trying to tackle the matter, although he emphasizes that the insurance industry and drug companies would not be able to buy all the chairs.

But that seems to leave Edwards curious about whether such an approach would really work, considering the more people at the table, the harder it often is to make a decision on even something as simple a pizza flavor, much less health care reform. Would it yield incremental change or the major change Obama is promising? Voters will soon get to decide.

In the meantime, here is Obama's response to Edwards:

"He argued that, that, you know, Barack, the problem is he thinks you can negotiate with insurance companies and drug companies ... You know what, the key to getting this done is to empower the American people, but you also have to have negotiations and you have to be able to listen. Otherwise, stuff is not going to happen….The notion that they will have no say so at all, is just not realistic. It's just not true."==

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/politics/blog/2007/12/edwards_obama_spar_over_size_o.html

Edwards thinks we can clap for Tinkerbelle and revamp health care without including drug and insurance companies in the process. Hope the price of insurance magically comes down anyway before he starts imposing those mandates.

[eleny]

1. When the corporations have a say, we lose

Medicare for all is the only worthwhile goal. Giving corps an inch means they'll come away with a chunk of our hide. Enough is enough.

[BeyondGeography]

2. They already have a chunk and it needs to be reduced

It will be a war, and they will be on the battlefield. An open process in which they participate will expose their nonsense for the world to see. Pretending they don't exist is not a strategy.

[eleny]

12. It needs to be eliminated not reduced

They've made enough off our health needs.

[saracat]

3. Barak is the one that is dreaming.Edwards has dealt with these people.They are not interested in

negotiating.They must be beaten into submission.Barak has not yet had the pleasure of dealing with these people.As Edwards has consistently said , "you can't offer them a place at the table.They will eat all the food". What is not "realistic' IMHO, is hoping these entities would ever be fair or resonable.Edwards has stated they will never "willingly give away their power, and I agree.I love Obama's hopefulness but it doesn't hold up against these battle tested , proven selfish, greedy corporations.

[BeyondGeography]

6. Here's how an open process will work in an Obama Administration

pharma and insurance will be at the table and they will have to defend their pricing practices. Obama intends to use the example of their profiteering to mobilize opinion in favor of a restructured, affordable insurance and prescription drug market. And he pledges to do this before considering across-the-board mandates:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=RjsRcIfMj-E

I'd be interested to see how Edwards "beats all these people into submission" when they're not even involved in the process. Will he just go on TV and whip us all into a frenzy?

Winning civil suit awards for individuals is not the same as revolutionizing health care through the legislative process.

[saracat]

9. But extending a "concilatory hand' is also NOT what is needed.Negotiation

must be done with a big stick. Obama is being way too nice to them.They must be treated punatively, even through the legislative process.There is no way to "entice" them to cooperate.Sorry, there just is not.They have ALL the power.They will not "want" to share or give it away.Other than punatively effecting them, there is NO way to get them to cooperate.

[BeyondGeography]

10. The process discussion starts at 6:15 on the video

What Obama describes will not be viewed as "nice" by the health care lobby. He will also create a National Health Insurance Exchange that will regulate the private insurance market to guarantee affordability and accessibilty. This will also not be viewed as "nice."

Don't let the relative demeanors and the rhetoric of the candidates fool you. Just because Obama doesn't say "corporate" every other sentence doesn't mean he doesn't have a substantial plan for reform.

[saracat]

14. Neverthe less, business likes Obama for a reason.I like Obama too, but not for the same reasons!

LOL!Obama is just not enough of a "pitbull" IMHO. I think Edwards is more of a "fighter" and demeanor does count.I also think Edwards knows where to find the corporate "soft spots' and how to stab them in the heart.I don't really think Obama has that quality yet.

[Little Star]

4. John is right on that one for sure! n/t

[a kennedy]

5. Dennis has the ONLY plan for health care

http://www.kucinichonline.com/pdfs/Kucinich_Universal_Health_Care.pdf



:patriot:

[wyldwolf]

7. I hate to break it to them but I have the biggest table.

[BeyondGeography]

8. This is between Edwards and Obama

the only two candidates with a chance in Iowa. :D

[CherokeeDem]

11. I Watched Sicko This Morning...

I am so outraged about the state of health care in the US that I think that Edwards is right. No table is big enough to bring these greedy corporate monsters to task for their crimes against not only those who don't have health care but against their own policy holderss. Passing legislation that prohibits lobbyists from access or greatly restricts access to elected officials is the only way we can control the greed and also by getting a universal health care plan in place. I am so sorry to say this but, if Moore is to be believed and I think he can be, Hillary sold out and took money from these greedy health care corporations.

Sicko was powerful and frightening and all I could think of is how could I immigrate to England or France so that I could live in a civilized country. It is shameful that this country would so under serve it's citizens that any of us could want to leave for what should be universal care.

[zulchzulu]

13. Hillarycare in 1993 demanded that there be mandated healthcare insurance...

...and I'm so glad the Congress passed it.

:sarcasm:

Reforming healthcare insurance is going to have to be incremental and eventually lead to Medicare for All, a slight variation of single-payer healthcare insurance.

To imply that legislation will get passed using mandates without working with Republicans is living in a vortex. You need to get enough votes to pass legislation. I think some people are either lying about that reality or think people are stupid.

[OHdem10]

15. We have had at least 20 years with Drug Companies,etc

at the table. This is what we have now. The GOP always include
the affected Companies and Corporations.

The reality is if you want change, the Companies and Corporations
have to have less influence. Right now they run things.

[loyalsister]

16. Sadly, he's right

The arrangement of all of the plans is similar.

The drugs aren't even going to be available without some kind of negotiation with drug companies. The bottom line is that there needs to be a change in health care access and delivery.
It is not delivered at all without a go between between provider and patient.
Even Medicare uses Insurance companies.
I think that what they are talking about here more than anything is their "tone."
Rattling off about "corporations" often has a good ring to those of us who have a beef with them.
I appreciated it at first. But, now it is just coming off like a gimmick. I like a lot of what he says, but he just does not come off as real to me.

[jillan]

17. Obama is telling the truth. UHC is not going to happen overnite.

It is going to take years of negotiations - WHY?

Because Congress has to get it done. Think about that.
It doesn't matter who wants what. The person that is going to be able to sell it to the repukes and other non-believers is the one who is going to accomplish getting UHC.

You can't just wish it to come true. Not in the real world anyway:eyes: