I just don't get Obama

[Girlieman]

I'm sorry, but what's so special about this guy? He has next to no experience, hasn't done anything extraordinary in the past, and offers no great ideas or roadmap to solve the problems that face us. I just can't shake the feeling when I see him that he's all hype and pretty low grade on substance.

Am I alone?

[Colobo]

1. No, there are many people who think like you

and who I and many Obama supporters think are dead wrong.

[DemKR]

45. so you think obama never engaged in any particular attacka nd he's God?

[niceypoo]

78. Personally I like Obama...

...and I think he would be a good president, what I don't understand is why he attracts people who are so quick to lash out at others. 3/4 of the stinkbomb threads on this board are started by Obama supporters, and for all the attacking they do, they implode at the slightest criticism of their candidate. Perhaps is it because freepers on this board use him as a vehicle to attack Hillary, whom they have been irrationally obsessed with for 15 years? And whats with the Obama supporters using right wing talking points? This also leads me to believe that there are more than a few freepers among them.

[Franc_Lee]

2. Quite obviously you've never taken the time out to listen to the man...?!?

[Girlieman]

4. But I HAVE listened to him

What are you hearing that I am not? To me, he just sounds like every other phony, two bit politician.

[journalist3072]

7. Exactly!

[babylonsister]

15. No experience? Google him, his past and his accomplishments.

Are you too lazy to do that? :shrug: If you want to be informed, self-help doesn't hurt.

[annie1]

29. self delete, nev mind, found one.

[Girlieman]

41. You are easily impressed . . .

From Obama's own campaign website, which I presume leaves no "groundbreaking accomplishment" unturned:

"Toured Kuwait, Jordan, Israel, Palestinian territories, he told
Palestinian Authority Abbas that US would never recognize
Hamas leaders until they renounced mission to attack Israel.
In Africa, publicly took AIDS test as example of responsibility"

Now refer back to what I said, he sounds like every other two bit politician out there, renouncing democratically elected leaders in order to kow-tow to the APAC lobby and touting a meaningless photo op gesture as a "groundbreaking accomplishment."

I mean seriously, when you read Obama refer to a public AIDS test as a "groundbreaking accomplishment" how can you NOT just write him off on the spot?

[Franc_Lee]

101. Girlieman, Obama doesn't impress you however Bush and Hillary does...

with their relevant experience

[DemKR]

25. you're not alone

Obama likes to make nice with the kooks.

[bunkerbuster1]

3. No one candidate has it all.

I think Obama is a terrific public speaker, thinks on his feet pretty well, looks good and will represent a lot (not all, but a lot) of worthwhile progressive ideas if he's elected President.

Maybe I'm just worn out from a lot of these Presidential cycles, but that's good enough for me.

[journalist3072]

13. Right....no one candidate has it all. However, I think what some of us are saying

is that Obama really hasn't showed us much of anything.

Now on to some of your other points.

- You say he's a "terrific public speaker." He can be at times (with the exception of instances when he's a stuttering idiot like he was on Wolf Blitzer the other day, when Blitzer asked him about Daivd Axelrod's comments.) But the question is not just how well he talks. I want to know: What is it that he's really saying when he talks? That's more important to me: what he's saying, not just how he says it.

- You say he "thinks on his feet pretty well." One of the problems I have with Obama is that he doesn't appear to think things through very well. He seems to just shoot from the hip without thinking about what he's really saying. We need a President who knows how to think through all the various sides of complicated issues. We don't need a President who'll just talk without thinking first. We need a serious President who knows the issues, and knows how to think through all sides of an issue before just talking.

Lastly, what's up with your comment about he "looks good." Who cares about his looks? I thought we were trying to elect a President here, not the posterboy for G.Q. magazine. What does his looks have to do with anything? Just seems like a really shallow comment to me.

[bunkerbuster1]

51. I kinda hoped to be called out on the "looks good" point.

He's clean! He's articulate! no, wait...

seriously, if I didn't care about looks, then I'd be more bullish about the rather-overweight Richardson or the 7/8-scale Kucinich (please don't flame me--these are intentionally shallow descriptions of decent men I deeply respect, 'k?).

But I do care about looks, and sounds for that matter, because our candidate has to lead, and in order to lead today, you have to look good on the TeeVee. Even a hetero guy like me knows that Barak looks good. With some work on the ears he could be a damn movie star if he wanted to.

It's not all that important, but it can be a disqualifier, and since he's arguably the most telegenic of the Democratic candidates, I thought it worth mentioning.

(Edwards is, of course, a good looking guy, but I think his Southren accent mitigates it just a tad. It's ok to my ears, but I think Barak's speaking voice lends itself better to stirring rhetoric.)

Not to slight your other two points, but I don't take huge issue with what you've written. Yes, he's shot from the hip a bit at times--that might be a hindrance, but sometimes you gotta say "WTF," to quote from that stupid Tom Cruise movie.

As for the content of his speeches--yeah, I listened to him last night on C-SPAN, and it's not necessarily all that great on paper, but it does work and I think he connects with a good range of voters. And I can't really argue with most of what he says.

[jbnow]

99. I looked into the top candidates

(once I couldn't have Gore) and started with the same impression of Obama...speaks well, so what?

I have to say I find it odd that our top candidates are the least experienced but so it is.

I ended up so impressed with Obama's past...really a picture of someone who put service and people ahead of glory or financial gain. Sounds corny but from the time he graduated from college that was the choice he always made. He was briefly a financial writer for some international firm after college but left when he got a low paying position as a community organizer in Chicago. He left a lasting impression on so many people. He didn't just get things changed, he empowered the people to make change happen, to get their voice heard. They learned the skills and gaied the confidence so that they'd be able to continue making a difference.

When he left for law school he said he'd be back but people didn't expect it...especially when he was elected Harvard Law Review president (first black thus elected btw). That is so prestigious it opens the door to everything though it was assumed he'd take a Supreme Court clerkship. Really all the best law firms would snap up this person.
But he did return and took a position in a civil rights law firm. No glamor, no riches, important work. He did other community work at the same time. Again the impression he left on people made an impression on me.
When he was elected to the congress there he still did work for the firm on summer recess, no pay.
He also taught constitutional law for 10 years. To continue once in Congress he held his classes at unpopular times...late Fridays and early Mondays. Always full. The local paper read through his evaluations...2nd highest rated of all and so well regarded. He had a different way of teaching, not just talking at them but listening, making them think, drawing them out. Empowering them.

I keep mentioning what people said about him but it was some time ago I read them so I'll give more my impressions. He worked very hard but didn't try to star, he lifted up others...empowered is a good word. Honesty, integrity, dedication...doing things differently. I mean he took the work seriously and it was about getting things done, the money to the right places used most effectively.
I couldn't find any negative reactions to him in those years and I really looked. That doesn't mean much although you can find negatives on the others. He just seemed so highly regarded that even those you'd expect to criticize had good things to say.

He is also the least wealthy candidate in either party which perhaps impreses me even more that he didn't go for te big bucks that were so available to him.

He doesn't have a lot of international experience or Washington experience or domestic policy experience. But this man is so smart, he LISTENS so well, find ways to get things done...ad is so about the greater good that I have no doubt his decisions will be sound.

You say we need "a serious President who knows the issues, and knows how to think through all sides of an issue before just talking" and that's just what he seems to offer. In fact he was often described as very serious.

Bill Clinton had no foreign policy experience but was bright and curious and that is clearly part of Obama.

I am not easily impressed and as I said wasn't an early fan of his beyond his pleasant surface. In the end I was wowed.

These aren't the best links I read but I recently looked for some that described some of his early experience.

An article (from 95) that describes much of his community activist work
What Makes Obama Run?

About his legal work
Obama got start in civil rights practice

teaching
Professor Obama was a listener, students say
Law students gave Obama big thumbs-up

I hope this at least helps you see what people might see in him.

[last1standing]

5. Personally, I see this Obama campaign as a big mistake.

I really think he has tremendous possible potential but I also think he was pushed into this race far too quickly. I would be much more inclined to vote for him in another few years after he spends some time proving himself versus riding the wave of being a media creation with little history to back him up.

Once again, I don't dislike him, I just don't feel there's anything there that would suggest I vote for him at this point. My personal hope is that Edwards wins the nomination and brings Obama in as VP. That would give him more experience and allow the public to get a better sense of where he stands for 2016.

[corkhead]

16. I agree with you exactly, I would add that I think he was propped up

by the corporate media to act as a foil to split the anti Hillary vote. If he wasn't in the race, it would already be a one way race and Edwards would be a foregone conclusion, IMHO.

Yes, I am a cynical :tinfoilhat: wearer

[last1standing]

23. LOL! I'm not that cynical and I think Obama has real possibilities.

I just think he was pushed in before he was ready and unfortunately, that could hurt him in future elections. Of course that's what I thought about Edwards last time around and yet I'm supporting him now.

[Jade Fox]

85. Good analysis.

I agree.

[ShadesOfGrey]

94. I agree with what you said.

Plus, I don't think he's ready at this point to clean up the mess left by the Bush administration. It's going to take a strong fighter. I too am voting for Edwards because he's proven that he has what it's going to take to stand up and fight for change.

[yy4me]

95. Very reasonable position. I too feel Obama could use a bit

more experience. Being second to Edwards wouldn't be bad but he could also fill a cabinet position. All of the Democratic candidates have strong points, most stronger than Obama's. A few years more and he'll be ready for the job.

[journalist3072]

6. I definitely agree with you. I'm not impressed by him at all

I will admit, I loved his speech at the 2004 Democratic convention. I even had the words "audacity of hope" taped to my desk at work.

But he's been a huge disappointment for me since his arrival in the Senate. One of the first things he did as a new member of the Foreign Relations Committee, was to vote to send Condi Rice's nomination to the full Senate. I was so disappointed in him for that. I felt like she never understood her role as National Security Adviser, and didn't deserve to be promoted to SoS.

I've also been disappointed in his not even bothering to vote on some issues. For example, he didn't even bother to vote yes or no on whether the Senate should hold a no-confidence vote against Alberto Gonzales. Here we had the most corrupt Attorney General of our time. And Obama, as a U.S. Senator, won't even vote yes or no on whether the Senate should have a no-confidence vote against that A.G.

And then, I've been disappointed in the way he's conducted his Presidential campaign, using the Tom Joyner Morning Show to try to get Black America to engage in group think and vote for his simply because he's Black. I'm also disappointed in some of his talking points in his stump speech, such as his "I don't want to re-fight the battles of the 90's." In other words, I guess he thinks that Ken Starr and Newt Gingrich's hatred of Hillary Clinton, should disqualify her from being President. Blame the victim here.

Honestly, if Obama is the nominee next November, I will either 1) stay home, 2) vote for the Republican nominee or 3) write someone else's name in.

[CPschem]

9. What was it about his appearance on BET

that convinced you that he was trying "to get Black America to engage in group think and vote for him simply because he's Black? I think he was attempting to appeal to african-american voters, just like other candidates do. What's wrong with that? Bizarre reason to "either 1) stay home or 2) vote for the Republican nominee" IMO.

[journalist3072]

27. I didn't say anything about an appearance on BET. I'm talking about his appearances on the

Tom Joyner Morning Show, which is a radio program.

And, as an African-American, I just have a problem with the way his campaign appears to have used the TJMS to get we as African-Americans to engage in group think and simply get behind the African-American candidate.

- For example, when Obama was on the TJMS, he said "this is a once in a lifetime opportunity." Meaning, he seems to believe that from now until eternity, he will be the only via African-American candidate for President. So we better elect him now. Tom Joyner has sadly echoed those sentiments.

- During one of Michelle Obama's many appearances on the TJMS, Tom Joyner asked her "What is up with Black women?" Meaning, he thinks there is something wrong with every Black woman out there (that would include me) who doesn't support Obama's candidacy.

- When Tom Joyner had Rep. Kendrid Meek of Florida (who is supporting Sen. Clinton) on his show, he asked him "There is a perfectly qualifed Black man running for President. Why aren't you supporting Sen. Obama?"

I was also disappointed in something Barack Obama said when he was on Tavis Smiley's radio show. Tavis Smiley asked Barack Obama about the notion that some in the Black community apparently have, that if Barack Obama received as much support from the Black community as Jesse Jackson did when he ran, then in Tavis' words Sen. Clinton would "have to go home right now." Barack Obama agreed with that, saying "There's no doubt that if we consolidate the Black vote, that would have a profound shift in the national polls." I just flipped when he said "consolidate the Black vote." In other words, he's suggesting we vote in lock step. I thought the appropriate answer, would have been for him to say something like 'Well Tavis, I don't want anyone voting for me simply because of my race. I want them to vote for me because they believe I represent their interests and values.'

[EffieBlack]

40. You blame Obama for a question that Tom Joyner asked Kendrick Meek?

I find it interesting that no one says a word when white people sit around on television and radio and analyze black candidates and voters, yet when black people do it, they're "trying to get Black America to engage in group think."

People vote for candidates for all sorts of reasons. Because they like the way they talk, because they agree with them on the issues because they're from the South or from somewhere near where they're from, etc. One reason - and I say only ONE, not the only reason - to vote for someone is because of their race. Lots of people see the fact that Obama is black as an exciting component of who he is - and what his presidency could say about this country - just like a woman president at this time in our history would be interesting, compelling and exciting.

[journalist3072]

54. Barack Obama and his campaign have pimped the Tom Joyner Morning Show

And as an African-American, I think it does a great disserivce to our community. We face some important issues. As an example, there's a disconnect between the overall unemployment rate, and the African-American unemployment rate.

And I just think it does a disservice to our community, for Tom Joyner's show (which has a huge audience) to be used to get us to engage in group think and simply follow behind the Black candidate. That's what Tom Joyner has done, and the Obama campaign has been complicit in that.

It troubles me that while pimping for Obama, Tom Joyner has never held a serious policy discussion with him. Every time Barack Obama comes on the Tom Joyner Show, there's this lighthearted banter "How are Michelle and the kids" and things of that nature. There's no serious policy discussion.

Yet, when Sen. Clinton came on there, Tom Joyner berated her about her health care plan, asking her why wasn't it FREE health care for Americans. But she was a trooper, giving him very specific details about her plan. She wasn't afraid to talk policy.

He never has had that type of conversation (at least on his show) with Obama.

And that, for me, speaks volumes.

[RaleighNCDUer]

87. So NOW he's responsible for what Joyner asked Hillary.

?????

[ellacott]

60. I agree

Hillary's campaign has sought out the women's vote and been very upfront about this. Some of her endorsements have come from people who are supporting her because she is a woman.

It's ok when she does it.

[journalist3072]

68. I'm not always comfortable with how the Clinton campaign has trumpeted the first woman President

thing either. I don't think African-Americans should support Obama just because he's Black. And I don't think women should support Sen. Clinton because she's a woman.

I do think that sometimes the Clinton camp has over-reached a little in terms of hyping up the first woman President thing.

However, to their credit, they have never suggested that all women get behind the woman candidate. They've never made a statement like "There's no doubt that if we consolidate the woman vote, it would have a profound shift in the polls." Contrast that to Obama's statement on Tavis Smiley's program about consolidating the Black vote.

[ellacott]

74. I didn't interpret his comments the same way

I listen to Tom Joyner also and did hear that exchange. I saw it as talking in the hypothetical. I've also heard him say on Tom Joyner's show that people shouldn't vote for him just because he's black.

[journalist3072]

75. The comment about "consolidating" the Black vote was on Tavis Smiley's show, not Tom Joyner's.

But as I pointed out, he's made distressing (at least for me) comments on Tom Joyner's show too.

One time, Tom Joyner said something to Barack Obama that if every Black person currently supporting Sen. Clinton would support Obama instead, the race would change. Barack Obama concurred, saying her lead would virtually be gone. I do not think that as an appropriate response. Right then, he should have said he didn't want people getting behind him just beecause he's black.

[ellacott]

77. They talked about his comments on Tavis's show on Tom's show

I am well aware of his answers to this question. Again, I only see it as hypothetical answers.

And I have heard Obama say on Tom's show that he doesn't want people or expect people to vote for him just because he's black.

[chimpymustgo]

12. Whoa, that's awfully reactionary - you'd vote Rethug or say home? You may have some

deeper issues. I like the guy - but I don't think he's ready to be President. I'd like to see an Edwards/Obama ticket.

But if Obama got the nomination, I'd work my ASS off to help him - and any DEM - WIN.

[journalist3072]

30. Well, I've come to a point where I vote for whoever I best believe

represents my interests and values. I used to look for whoever had the "D" behind their name. But, I've learned that not all Democrats represent my interests and values. For example, although I love how John Edwards has focused on poverty, and helping the people still trying to recover from Hurricane Katrina, I cannot vote for him because he's not on the right side of THE most important issue to me right now- D.C. voting rights.

[chimpymustgo]

36. I'm for DC voting rights, too - I live here! We'll NEVER get it with a Rethug Pres.

Never. I cannot believe any caring, thinking Democrat or Independent would say they'd stay home or vote Rethug, rather than vote Obama. It makes me wonder if you have some other issues here.

We're supposed to be on the same team.

[Adelante]

80. Obama's your man! THE most important issue to you right now - DC voting rights

S.1257 District of Columbia House Voting Rights Act of 2007

A bill to provide the District of Columbia a voting seat and the State of Utah an additional seat in the House of Representatives.

Sen Bennett, Robert F. - 5/1/2007
Sen Boxer, Barbara - 9/17/2007
Sen Carper, Thomas R. - 5/21/2007
Sen Clinton, Hillary Rodham - 5/2/2007
Sen Dodd, Christopher J. - 7/11/2007
Sen Durbin, Richard - 6/27/2007
Sen Feingold, Russell D. - 5/14/2007
Sen Feinstein, Dianne - 9/12/2007
Sen Hatch, Orrin G. - 5/1/2007
Sen Kennedy, Edward M. - 5/3/2007
Sen Kerry, John F. - 5/11/2007
Sen Landrieu, Mary L. - 5/2/2007
Sen Leahy, Patrick J. - 5/2/2007
Sen Levin, Carl - 6/11/2007
Sen McCaskill, Claire - 5/15/2007
Sen Menendez, Robert - 7/16/2007
Sen Mikulski, Barbara A. - 5/7/2007
Sen Obama, Barack - 5/3/2007
Sen Pryor, Mark L. - 5/21/2007
Sen Sanders, Bernard - 6/22/2007

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:SN01257:@@@P

In addition to co-sponsoring, Obama voted it Yes out of committee in June:

The DC House Voting Rights Act (S. 1257) passed 9-1 in a Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee held on Wednesday, June 13, 2007 at 10:00 AM in 342 Dirksen Senate Office Building.

Senators Joe Lieberman (I-CT), Susan Collins (R-ME), George Voinovich (R-OH), Norm Coleman (R-MN), Carl Levin (D-MI), Daniel Akaka (D-HI), Mary Landrieu (D-LA), Barack Obama (D-IL) and Jon Tester (D-MT) voted for the measure. The sole no vote came from Senator John Warner (R-VA). DC Vote's supporters and coalition partners played a crucial role in bringing the support of the three Republicans who voted for the bill!


http://www.dcvote.org/events/event.cfm?eventID=335

A month later when the Mayor of DC endorsed Obama, Obama said:

"Folks in D.C. still don't have a voice in their national government. That's wrong," Obama said. "Residents shouldn't be treated like tenants."

He also co-sponsored S.195 in 2005:

A bill to provide for full voting representation in Congress for the citizens of the District of Columbia, and for other purposes.

Sen Boxer, Barbara - 7/17/2006
Sen Clinton, Hillary Rodham - 6/9/2005
Sen Corzine, Jon S. - 1/26/2005
Sen Dayton, Mark - 1/26/2005
Sen Dodd, Christopher J. - 1/26/2005
Sen Durbin, Richard - 1/26/2005
Sen Feingold, Russell D. - 1/26/2005
Sen Jeffords, James M. - 7/24/2006
Sen Kennedy, Edward M. - 2/1/2005
Sen Kerry, John F. - 2/1/2005
Sen Leahy, Patrick J. - 2/1/2005
Sen Mikulski, Barbara A. - 1/26/2005
Sen Obama, Barack - 1/26/2005
Sen Sarbanes, Paul S. - 1/26/2005
Sen Schumer, Charles E. - 1/26/2005

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d109:SN00195:@@@P

And stood to introduce it on the Senate floor:

109th CONGRESS, 1st Session

S. 195 To provide for full voting representation in Congress for the citizens of the District of Columbia, and for other purposes.

http://www.dcvote.org/advocacy/material.cfm?legID=27

Whatta guy!!

[journalist3072]

83. Sorry...but I support Sen. Clinton. I'm glad that Obama is on the right side of the DC voting

rights issue. That's great! But so is Sen. Clinton. And I'm in agreement with Sen. Clinton on many other issues where I have some heartburn with Obama.

So Sen. Clinton does it for me.

[Adelante]

84. Fair enough

Supporting the candidate you believe in is what is most important.

[journalist3072]

86. Exactly! But I'll tell you this: I don't support Obama, but I'm extremely pleased that he is on

the right side of the DC voting rights issue. I will defnitely give credit where it is due.

One of the reasons I can't support Edwards, is because of what he did in 2004.

During the 2004 Democratic primary, our local leaders here in DC wanted to spotlight the issue of DC voting rights. To do that, they decided to hold a (non-binding) first-in-the-nation primary. It was before Iowa and New Hampshire, and we had a non-binding presidential primary. We then had the regularly scheduled BINDING primary a few months later. But the whole point of the non-binding primary was to bring national attention to the issue of DC voting rights.

Anyway, 5 of the 9 Democrats running for President that year, wrote to the DC Board of Elections and Ethics, and asked to have their names removed from the ballot here. Apparently, they did not appreciate that we were holding a primary before Iowa and New Hampshire voted---even though again, it was non-binding.

I wrote to them and explained that they were putting tradition (Iowa and New Hampshire's first in the nation status) above the interests above DC residents who were being taxed without representation.

His wanting to have his name removed from the DC ballot, is a major reason why I can't support John Edwards.

[durrrty libby]

18. Like you, I was impressed with his convention speech. but

that's all he wrote. There is no there there.

[desi]

26. Well....that and...

He did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Danged Pats.. :toast:

[durrrty libby]

31. Yes, dang those Pats right to another Super Bowl win

I hope Hillary gets the same kind of awesome run.

Happy New Year :party: :toast:

[desi]

39. I'm going to have to agree with you...

on BOTH counts. I did expect a blowout though so my team did me proud. Gongrats !!!

Happy New Year to you and yours and let's hope that this time next year it will be President-Elect Hillary.

:toast: :party:

[durrrty libby]

43. Yes they did put up quite a fight, but at times Tom is other worldly

:toast: :party: :hi:

[Adelante]

63. Obama and Alberto Gonzalez

2) vote for the Republican nominee

You do that.

Contrary to Navarrette's and Limbaugh's suggestion that it is primarily white liberals, along with "a pair of immigrant-baiting members of Congress" who are leading the charge against Gonzales, Republican Sen. John H. Sununu (NH) and Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL) are among those who have called for Gonzales' ouster. On the March 19 edition of CNN's Larry King Live, Obama said that he "voted against Alberto Gonzales' confirmation for precisely the reason that we're seeing now." Obama added:

OBAMA: What you get a sense of is a -- an attorney general who saw himself as an enabler of the administration as opposed to somebody who was actually trying to look out for the American people's interests.

And for that reason, I think it's time for him to step down and for another attorney general who can exercise some independence to be put for the reminder of this president's term.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200703280008

U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes 109th Congress - 1st Session

as compiled through Senate LIS by the Senate Bill Clerk under the direction of the Secretary of the Senate

Vote Summary

Question: On the Nomination (Confirmation Alberto R. Gonzales to be Attorney General )
Vote Number: 3 Vote Date: February 3, 2005, 04:29 PM

Illinois: Durbin (D-IL), Nay Obama (D-IL), Nay

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00003

Obama Renews Call for Gonzales to be Replaced as Attorney General
Thursday, March 29, 2007
Printable Format

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
CONTACT: Ben LaBolt

Attorney General should be advocate for people, not President

WASHINGTON, DC -- U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) today released the following statement in reaction to the testimony of Kyle Sampson, recently the top aide to Attorney General Gonzales, who said that Attorney General Gonzales was one of “the decision makers” in the firings of U.S. attorneys.

“I voted against the nomination of Alberto Gonzales for Attorney General because I was concerned he would act as the President’s lawyer, not the people’s lawyer. Mr. Sampson’s testimony underscores my concern that Attorney General Gonzales subverted justice to promote a political agenda. I renew my call for Alberto Gonzales to be replaced as Attorney General with an advocate who will defend and promote the rights and liberties of the American people.”

http://obama.senate.gov/press/070329-obama_renews_ca/

S. J. Res. 14: A joint resolution expressing the sense of the Senate that Attorney General Alberto Gonzales no longer holds the confidence of the Senate and of the American people.

Co-Sponsors:

Sen. Daniel Akaka
Sen. Joseph Biden
Sen. Jeff Bingaman
Sen. Barbara Boxer
Sen. Sherrod Brown
Sen. Robert Byrd
Sen. Robert Casey
Sen. Hillary Clinton
Sen. Kent Conrad
Sen. Christopher Dodd
Sen. Byron Dorgan
Sen. Richard Durbin
Sen. Dianne Feinstein
Sen. Thomas Harkin
Sen. Daniel Inouye
Sen. Edward Kennedy
Sen. John Kerry
Sen. Amy Klobuchar
Sen. Frank Lautenberg
Sen. Carl Levin
Sen. Robert Menéndez
Sen. Patty Murray
Sen. Bill Nelson
Sen. Barack Obama
Sen. Harry Reid
Sen. Bernard Sanders
Sen. Debbie Ann Stabenow
Sen. Jim Webb
Sen. Sheldon Whitehouse

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:SJ00014:@@@P

Yes, Obama was campaigning during the cloture vote of the sense of the Senate resolution of no confidence in Gonzalez, as were candidates Biden and Dodd; however, Obama co-sponsored the no confidence legislation, as did Biden and Dodd. Does the fact of Obama's not voting for cloture accurately portray his record of fighting against Gonzalez? Not in the least. I've seen you do this before in trying to mislead DU readers - that time it was DC Voting Rights.

[DemKR]

8. K&R

[Colobo]

11. You are a true enemy of Obama. Incredible.

[journalist3072]

14. So someone's an "enemy" of Obama because they don't want him to be President? Geez. You are sick.

[last1standing]

17. DemKR smears Obama/Edwards and you smear Clinton/Edwards...

What's the difference when you're both just trying to drag someone else down?

:shrug:

[Colobo]

21. Can you prove I've smeared Edwards and Clinton?

Any evidence of my suppossed attacks will help.

[last1standing]

24. If you don't see many of your posts as smears then I feel very sorry for you.

n/t

[Colobo]

28. Give me one example.

I post positive things about my candidate, as I'm not really interested in posting anything about anybody else.

[Colobo]

32. Still waiting.

[last1standing]

35. If your waiting means one less hateful post then I'm a happy guy.

n/t

[Colobo]

44. Nice strategy, given the fact that you can't prove what you claimed

about me. Admit it: you know I don't post crap about other candidates.

[last1standing]

50. Or perhaps I don't feel like digging up trashy posts.

:shrug:

[Colobo]

52. You know you can't find them. They don't exist.

You lied about me.

[last1standing]

53. Throw tantrums much?

Of course this is how most of your posts go so there's no surprise.

[Colobo]

57. I'm just pointing out that you lied about me.

It is easy to prove I'm a hypocrite- just find one post in which I'm smearing another candidate.

[last1standing]

58. And obsessive, I see...

LOL

[Colobo]

65. I'm done over here. Glad to know

you couldn't back up your claim. :)

[last1standing]

69. Glad to know you, too.

Take from that what you will.

And Happy New Year.

[tired_old_fireman]

10. I don't get these types of posts.

Obama obviously inspires a lot of people. That alone makes him special.

[Girlieman]

19. Anna Nicole Smith for President then . . .

"Obama obviously inspires a lot of people. That alone makes him special."

[desi]

34. Thanks for the memories..

[annie1]

38. Was that a real cover? lol. cuz that's hysterical.

[desi]

42. Yes it was...

and it was right on the money losers.

[annie1]

20. He doesn't really do it for me either. But apparently sometimes he has...

his moments. ? i'm still waiting. There is something to be said for newness, and i have to say his judgment was pretty good to stand up against the war, but other than that, he doesn't really get me going at all.

[desi]

22. You're not alone

I'll K&R and say that he reminds me of the present occupant of the WH...an empty suit if you will. And we are all well aware of the disaster the Repukes "blessed" us with the last two presidential elections.

[VarnettaTuckpocket]

55. Self-delete

Didn't mean to post in a sub-thread

[desi]

66. Preach it sister !!!!

Happy New Year and Congrats to The Jayhawks on a great year. :applause: :toast:

[VarnettaTuckpocket]

71. Hey thanks

Had to move the post, but thanks for the reply.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

33. He Has A Compelling Life Story And Is Charismatic

Will that be enough?

[annie1]

37. not trying to be cheeky, *should* that be enough?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

47. I Hope Not

~

[indimuse]

70. I have a compelling life story AND

can guarantee...extremely Charismatic..:smoke:

[Sulawesi]

46. Obama is the only true leader in this race...

To me, he seems like the most honest, optimistic, idealistic, forward thinking person running. He'll say unpopular things and stick by them. People that say he ran too early just want someone else to win instead. That is totally fine. But if he is so great, put him in office now! I do not buy this focus on experience at all. Bill Clinton was inexperienced. Obama is the one hope we have to make people like the president again. It does not have to be about war, and combat, among each other or overseas. There are a million things we could agree upon and do if we just break out a bit, and have some principled leadership in place.

If you are a democrat, why you must buy everything the dems say, and hate everything everyone else says, on all things? Isn't it just possible that McCain might have a point to make? about something? Same with the other side. Hate, concede nothing, not one thing. Score the zinger at the debate, head to spin room and sell it. I guess I am just tired of all the games. There is nobody out there who is perfect for me on all the issues. Fine, but Obama is the closest thing I have seen who can just break out of the mold a bit, and lead.

For me, to elect Obama president, would do so much for the African American Community (race is such a huge undiscussed pressure point in our country) as well. This is our chance to go with youth, diversity, optimism. Instead, people want some sort of battle royale to finally edge out conservatism forever. Hello out there...there will always be a right and left wing, and they will never come to agreement. It is the tension of a political opposition that keeps the minority from getting trampled. But it does not have to be war war war, all...the...time. Obama is not necessarily the solution to all this, but I would like the trajectory!

Sorry for the rant...

[Vickers]

48. So who are you FOR? And WHY? And what is their ideas/roadmap?

:shrug:

[Cameron27]

49. I don't understand his appeal either.

I don't dislike him, as a matter of fact, because of the IWR vote, he was my favorite for a long time. The way he handled Kyl-Lieberman gave me doubts, but Donnie McClurkin was the deal breaker. I don't believe he represents hope and change, because he's never defined how his changes would be significantly different from any other Democrat who happened to get elected.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

56. He Is The Change

~

[journalist3072]

61. If that were true, why does he keep trying to be the Bill Clinton of '92?

I remember during the debates, it was reported that Obama and his campaign were studying Bill Clinton from the '92 debates. That's who they wanted to emulate. And why does Obama keep bringing up the number of people who served in Clinton's administration, who support him?

He's trying to have it both ways: 1) claim to be an agent of change, and making comments like "I dont' want to re-fight the battles of the '90s and 2) bragging about the number of former Clinton officials who support him.

Seems like double-talk to me.

[Sulawesi]

90. He is trying to say that he is the type of outside that Bill Clinton was...

it is now 15 years later, and Hillary/Bill want back in. Obama is trying to makes the case that he is now the one that can change. You might not agree with him, but it is not inconsistent. The fact that past advisers line up with him is to make the case that as new as he is to the process, he is making sense among people that have been around.

[VarnettaTuckpocket]

59. I'm glad someone's finally had the courage to say homophobes are good, moral and decent

Their poor feelings have undoubtedly been hurt when they've been called haters and bigots. But now Obama has come along to comfort them, and explain to everyone that as long as you only hate gays and not some other group, and as long as you couch your hatred as a religious belief, you aren't a bigot at all. Thank you Jesus someone is finally coddling the precious homophobic population of Amerikkka!

Obama: "These events have provided an important opportunity for us to confront a difficult fact:There are good, decent, moral people in this country who do not yet embrace their gay brothers and sisters as full members of our shared community."

http://www.queerty.com/obama-talks-gay-again-20071112/

[Hippo_Tron]

62. Here's why I don't agree with you

I wouldn't say that political experience or accomplishment is a minus or a plus really. Honestly I think that some of my college professors would be better presidents than anybody standing on that stage. Political experience doesn't inherently make someone the best person for the job.

Obama has taken the shortest possible path to national recognition and honestly I have no problem with that because he's subverting a process that I think is complete bullshit. If I had my way, you wouldn't have to spend any length of time in elected office to become president.

The arguments that the other candidates have "put in their time" or they have "earned it" and Obama hasn't don't hold any water with me. The presidency is something you win, not something you earn.

That isn't why I'm voting for Obama, but that is the reason I look past his "inexperience". I'm voting for Obama because I believe that he is open minded enough that he is willing to start to make steps on some of our bullshit policies like the Cuban Embargo and the Drug War. I know that Hillary won't touch policies because she has pretty much said that she won't. That troubles me considering that anybody with a brain can't possibly believe that there are good arguments to support those policies, other than political reasons.

Lifting the Cuban Embargo and changing drug policies are "liberal" they are common sense. Obama seems like he is willing to listen to common sense and come around. Hillary knows exactly what she is going to do in office and nobody is going to change her mind.

[Girlieman]

73. I didn't use the expressions "political experience" or "political accomplishments"

I simply said experience or accomplishment. Period.

Obama's position on the Cuba embargo and drug war are simply mainstream at this point. He is, as I have said, a mainstream politician that sounds pretty much like any other politician looking for which way the wind blows.

[Hippo_Tron]

81. I think once he's in office, Obama will be more open minded on these issues

He has already made some strides, supporting loosening the restrictions of Cuban Americans to travel back home to see family. And on the drug war I think that given his background, he will make the issue a priority.

Obama was a community organizer and taught constitutional law before going into politics and frankly that's a good enough resume for me. I'm not saying that every community organizer can be president, but I'm saying that I'm not really all that concerned about resume.

[Adelante]

88. And practiced civil rights and voting rights law

I'm with you, Hippo_Tron. I think his 11 years of legislative experience is all well and good, but it's his real world experience that means more to me, and combined it's certainly sufficient experience. Law-making is great and it has to be done, but it's not the be all and end all for the presidency. If he's less of a politician than he need be to some people, it's all the better to me.

[Girlieman]

91. Take a good look at that "experience"

He practiced law for all of 3 years before going to the state legislature. A lawyer with that little experience knows almost nothing about practicing law and can hardly made an impact at all.

Checking him out on Pacer shows that his name appears on all of about 5 federal lawsuits during that period of time. He was not lead attorney on those cases. They were not all civil rights cases.

This was not exactly Clarence Darrow.

Don't get fooled by labels. There's a lot of money to be made in doing publicly funded real estate deals, which is apparently something that Obama's law firm did a lot of.

From what I can tell, his legal "career" was pretty much a big pumpkin.

[Adelante]

92. I'm not looking for Clarence Darrow, either

I simply added a point to what Hippo_Tron was saying.

I care more about choices made. He could have gone with a big Wall Street firm and made a fortune. He could have clerked on the Supreme Court; he was asked. He chose to go with a civil rights firm. He worked on behalf of ACORN with other groups like Mexican-American Legal Defense and Education Fund and the League of Women Voters over the Motor Voter law. He built a case for a whistle blower. He worked on a lawsuit against Citibank over redlined mortgages to blacks and other residents of minority neighborhoods. When he went into the Illinois Senate, after three years with the firm, the law firm wanted him to keep taking a salary and open a branch office for them. He went of counsel instead for eight years and on to the job he was elected to do. Now, I don't claim, and Obama doesn't claim, that he did the star turn in the courtroom. He was a backgrounder, doing research, writing briefs, and prepping depositions; probably like a lot of three year associates. Just about every case, about 30 cases, he worked on won. Nobody says he did it himself, though. And nobody's saying he's Clarence Darrow. What I will say is his law career fits into his 20 years of public service.

[indimuse]

64. Agree Completely!

Had No intetion on running UNTIL somebody said YOU should run for POUS...AND to show you how dedicated this person REALLY IS...IF he does NOT get the nomination...HIS wife has informed him, he will never run again...so much for CHANGE AND HOPE!THIS IS IT PEOPLE VOTE FOR THE ONE NOW....HE IS ONLY GOING TO COMMITT TO HELPING YOU IN 2008 NOW OR NEVER...(sounds like bush...you are either against us or for us...):evilgrin:

[cali]

67. no. there are lots of people as ignorant about Obama as you. n/t

[Missy M]

72. You're not alone....

I feel the same.

[no name no slogan]

76. S'aright. I doubt he gets you either.

[bigwillq]

79. I feel the same way

Obama does "nothing" for me. I don't get the hype either.

[loveangelc]

82. lol, yes.

[NMDemDist2]

89. me either

:shrug:

[coco77]

93. You are correct and ,,,

I feel the same about edwards when I see them both I keep wondering what are these people seeing that I am not. I have taken second, third and fourth looks and I just don't see it.

[ChiciB1]

96. No, I Watched Him Yesterday On C-Span & While I Don't Like To Knock

the other candidates, he did not inspire me in any way. In fact, I wanted to watch to see if I could get "hyped" about him, but he came off as kind of dull! Maybe I should say low-key instead, but I wasn't very impressed. Even Clinton has more spunk, and she's LAST on my list!

But, she WAS once first!

[Stop Cornyn]

97. December's been a HORRIBLE month for Obama. He attacks ham handedly; he's better suited to the role

of "rising star" than defensive front runner.

I'm glad Obama peaked in late November/early December.

If I had not seen this "ugly front runner" side of Obama, I might still count him as my second choice.

Six weeks ago, I would have done anything for his campaign, but now I'm done with him. If he gets the nomination, I'll vote for him but nothing more.

[DemKR]

98. u go...and i'll donate to rick noriega for that comment! n/t

[Stop Cornyn]

100. Rick Noriega could really use your support: he a truly decent guy running against a malformed goblin

[2hip]

102. I was thinking the exact same thing when I saw your thread!

Obama just doesn't energize or inspire me.