Will white political figures speak out against the Clintons' tactics?

[Anouka]

I appreciate the thought behind a thread like DU's "What would happen if Blacks sat out the 08 election ?", but at the same time I worry.... why should only Blacks be incensed enough by the Clintons, to want to sit out (let alone vote Republican or third party as a group) the 2008 general election? asking 'if blacks' will sit out is the equivalent of writing off black votes, if that makes sense. Why would what is happening to Obama, and the Clintons lies and redirections, only affect blacks? why would it be irrelevant to latinos, to asians, to Americans of all colors... to whites? That worries me, and I think the something that I couldn't put my finger on was that asking the question in such a way proves that the Clintons tactics -- of making this about race, instead of about policies -- has worked after all.

I was over at Daily Kos, just now and read Bob Johnson's thread The dark heart of the Clinton campaign: a strategy designed to make race THE issue and I think Bob did a great job of pulling a lot of information together, a lot of quotes, a lot of links, some analyses; and I agree with Bob's conclusions.

That's not why I write this. I write this to DU because of some of the comments within Bob's thread. Specifically these two:

Macaca didn't work for former Senator Allen
Obama needs some white leaders to condemn the Clintons. I was very happy to see Senator Kerry taking the high road. And we may see Edwards stepping into this.

I'd proudly vote for Edwards or Obama but will never vote for corporate owned Hillary.

I don't know what Senator Kerry said about the Clintons' tactics. Or is the writer only referring to endorsing Obama over Hillary?

yes keep Jeese JR away
from the TV it needs to be white people condemning the Clintons. Edwards was classy and perfect today about this in South Carolina.

What a sad commentary, but a truthful one, and an honest one. Because, speaking of Jesse Jackson, Jr.: I wonder why his comment on Katrina is repeated so often as a negative counterpoint to EVERYTHING the clintons and their surrogates have pulled. He is a trump card -- but no other examples are used. I get the bad feeling that Jesse Jackson Jr is this month's O.J. Simpson, brought out as the ultimate 'how dare you! they do it, too!' counter for Emmit Till, the Scottsborough Boys, the three young men of Marion, Indiana, and (insert any number of lynching victims here). If that makes sense.

Here's more:

Out Foxed?
Race baiting may be the most powerful form of dirty campaigning in US politics. If Obama's campaign responds than white people that can't recognize race baiting kill the messenger and believe it is Obama's fault for bringing up the fact that HRC's supporters are using racism as a tactic. Yet if he does not respond the tactics will influence who knows how many voters to not vote for Obama. He can't fight it but he can't ignore it either. Maybe he should cry.

Yep, the central purpose was to turn Obama
from being the 'transcendent' candidate into the 'black' candidate, and I believe it has worked.

News cycles about black people being offended by the attacks on Obama still help Clinton.

It's well played by the Clintons, as far as getting Hillary through the primaries.

But as far as democratic chances in November, using dogwhistle tactics against one of our own will only lead to lower democratic turnout and bad blood.

She is not just knee deep in it
(I posted this comment earlier on another diary)

How anyone can continue to defend HRC after what is becoming a river of questionable statements and behaviours on the part of her public supporters is beyond me. See this link for another moment in HRC campaigning.

BET Founder Bob Johnson weighs in

I would like to see a President with an ethical core I can at least respect. If these trolls that support Hillary (those various people who have said and done questionable things in support of her but for whom she is not responsible) are her cheerleaders than what type of person is she that she draws their fervent support? Again no candidate is perfect and all have their flaws but damn, why do her supporters lick the Republican side of the bottom of the barrel?

The party needs to unite against Hillary now
The Clintona have reached the point where they would rather see the party burn down around them than to see any other Democrat win. They have to be stopped. We have to squash her in Nevada, then California.

My only question to the writer of this response would have been: Why squash her in Nevada, then California? Why not South Carolina?

Who is 'we'? and why aren't 'we' in South Carolina?

The next response is a reply to someone who said it was 'dumb as hell' to say Hillary Clinton is running a disgusting campaign, and the writer would not be voting for her no matter whom the Republican nominee is:

Is it?
Or have you forgotten that the Democrats lost control of Congress under, you guessed it, the Clinton administration. We can rebuild our party and create lasting majorities, but people like Hillary Clinton will ultimately destroy it.

Finally:

Fair (doubtful), smart, not.

Do you think it fair that HRC's supporters could alienate the most loyal constuency the Democratic Party has? Why don't you name the election of the past 40 years where Democrats have gotten less than 85% of the African American vote. Do you think it's smart for HRC to possibly divide the party for her ambition and put another Republican into the WH. If the Democrats want to become the Party of Dixiecrat campaign tactics, than they will do it without African Americans

To which I answer: a) why should only blacks be alienated by her tactics, b) Dixiecrats were Democrats before they were Republicans... and some of them never left the party, c) obviously blacks aren't THAT important if the Clintons are gambling on these tactics ensuring a win for themselves.

Particularly since those tactics are working.

Anyway: Should the Clintons be supported if Hillary is the nominee for the General Election?

What does holding one's nose accomplish, that not voting for her does not?

Who would you like to see speak out against the Clinton's tactics? In that same vein, whom do you you think would be the most authoritative voice in speaking out against the Clinton's tactics?

should anyone non-black (but particularly white) tackle them at all?

or do you believe there isn't anything to tackle in the first place (this being a wide forum with many viewpoints and reasons for those viewpoints, after all)?

[knowledgeispwr]

1. They should.

White politicians should speak out against the tactics, but I do not know if they will.

If Sen. Clinton is the nominee, I believe people should vote for her because she would be better than any of the republicans and there may be important Supreme Court appointments to consider.

That said, it shouldn't just be blacks who are put-off by "dog whistle politics."

I wish Obama could speak out against these tactics. But he can't. So often, if blacks speak out against legitimate incidents of loaded language/actions, they are called "overly sensitive" or "pulling the race card." Being in a situation where white people (in general) are loathe to discuss race, Obama can't afford to get in such a discussion.

Relatedly, this is why people like Tim Wise (white anti-racist activist, author and speaker) are so important, because some people who dismiss black people actually listen to him just because he's white.

[Anouka]

6. Thank you for bringing up Tim Wise.

I've enjoyed reading him in the past.

And you are right about him; as well as right about why Obama can't bring any of this up.

I can't agree with you about voting for Hillary; but I respect where you are coming from for the good for the Party.

[2rth2pwr]

2. you're equating bringing up J Jackson Jr's statement with

lynching?!? Have you lost all sense of humanity?

[Anouka]

3. Bringing up JJJr in the argument = OJ; Clintons = lynching victims

There are many examples of the Clintons b.s.; Clinton supporters (and Edwards supporters on a roll) can only bring up JJJr, but boy do they bring up JJJr.

Likewise, there are many national examples of outrageous lynchings; there is only one OJ, but boy is that example beating to hell and back.

So in conclusion, yeah, you're right, it's probably inhumane of me to make the comparison in the first place.

[ruggerson]

4. You call Hillary a "skank" bitch

in one thread and then you think you're going to be taken seriously?

[Anouka]

10. No. But I ask anyway.

What is your opinion of Bob Johnson's thread, and the responses I posted above from some Kossacks to Bob's thread?

Do you believe that whites should speak out? or do you feel there is nothing for whites to speak out against?

[ruggerson]

12. I don't accept the premise of it

I think there's plenty of blame to go around on both sides in terms of using race. It's very easy to divide people into camps - most Americans are tribal by nature. A black man and a white woman get into a brawl and unfortunately the result of that will more than likely break along racial lines. If I were to lay the blame with anyone it would be the media, who have inflamed and distorted the story on both sides.

Go to the homepage on aol.com

The lead story is "Black billionaire blasts Obama"

That's how this is playing out in the MSM. Kos is irrelevant.

[Anouka]

19. And AOL compounds by ensuring that it's a BLACK billionaire in the title

-- a thing -- instead of giving Johnson a name, humanizing him, making him an individual. Instead, the focus is on his race. You wouldn't see that headline with FEMALE (and some of us know we wouldn't see it with WHITE).

Sometimes I feel this is a losing battle. Besides, the media is following the lead of the blogosphere, not the other way around. Kind of like the Trent Lott deal at Strom Thurmond's birthday; no one in the media cared until the blogosphere blew up. If I remember correctly, those who were there didn't think there was anything to Trent's praise of Strom, they either agreed or ignored as the normal fluff said for an old man on his day.

This is a little more important. Kos -- or rather, Bob Johnson -- isn't irrelevant at all; he spells out exactly what is going down, and you pull up an online headline which underscore's Bob's point.

Do you really not feel it? not sense it? not accept it?

[jackson_dem]

5. I hope so. I "hope" they speak out against Obama's racial tactics too

[Anouka]

7. I and others have asked for examples. You don't quite give them.

But I ask again: what racial tactics are you referring to? in detail if you can provide it.

For example, if you feel 'preacher talk'/'black talk'/'southern accent' is racial code, then say so, and why, and why you find it offensive to whites and other non-blacks.

Likewise, if you can provide an example of code talk against whites from Obama or someone speaking for him.

[jackson_dem]

8. I've and many others have posted them numerous times

Obamites take it in one year and out the other.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNrlSn7ndAA
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/12/read-obama-campaign-memo-_n_81220.html
http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2008/01/obama_spokesperson_asks_is_there_something_bigger_behind_bill_and_hillarys_race_comments.php

[Anouka]

14. In other words, you have nothing.

1) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNrlSn7ndAA Courtesy of http://www.veracifier.com/

Jesse Jackson Jr. on Hillary faking her tears, and not crying for Katrina. That's racist against whites.... in what way? Is it sexist, instead? Or do you mention it as generic 'hit the other guy/gal'ism?

2) http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/12/read-obama-campaign-memo-_n_81220.html
"Read Obama Campaign Memo On Clintons' Politicizing Of Race" (HuffingtonPost)

"The Obama campaign recently prepared a detailed memo, obtained by the Huffington Post and made public elsewhere, listing various instances in which it perceived the Clinton's campaign to have deliberately played the race card in the Democratic primary.

The memo, which can be found below, is organized around five incidents in which either Clinton, her husband Bill, or campaign surrogates, are said to have made comments that could be interpreted as racially insensitive.

Please explain? The HuffPo piece is about the Obama campaign preparing a memo detailing comments Hillary/Bill/campaign surrogates have made. It doesn't detail how Obama's campaign is going to strike back. It doesn't detail what Obama's campaign has on the Clinton's. It doesn't detail what Obama has said negatively towards the Clintons.

For you to mention this as mudslinging from Obama, just reads to me as a crude -- but effective -- attempt at perception becoming reality. If a person repeats a falsehood enough times, then the falsehood takes on a life of its own. There's the added bonus of the slurs being repeated, WITHOUT any specific slurs being attached to the Clintons themselves.

Genius. Dishonest, but genius. And completely not what I asked for, but what you claim to have been supplied multiple times by yourself and others as proof that Obama has slung mud himself.

Where is the racism against whites?

Where is the sexism against women?


3) http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2008/01/obama_spokesperson_asks_is_there_something_bigger_behind_bill_and_hillarys_race_comments.php
"Obama Spokesperson Says There's A "Pattern" Behind Bill And Hillary's Race Comments"

Again, cataloging what someone else has done against you is not slinging mud. It's cataloging.

Where are the lies?

Where are the misrepresentations of Hillary Clinton's voting record? as the Clintons had misrepresented Obama and falsely claimed he is a near Republican seeking to remove a woman's right to choose?

I'm looking for first blood, jackson_dem. Not responses to someone else's first blood.

Where is it?

Where is the racism against whites?

Where is the sexism against women?

[jackson_dem]

15. They are implying Hillary and Bill are racists

[IndianaJones]

9. bwahaha. nt.

[Beacool]

11. Keep up the race baiting!!!!!!!!

Just remember that there are more white people in this country than black, and most know that the Clintons are NOT racists. Your guy already lost one vote if he ever becomes the nominee, a friend who has always voted Democrat said that she would rather vote for Mccain than Obama or not vote at all.

Keep it up..........

[Anouka]

16. Why isn't she voting for Clinton?

(since JEDNE)


Should you really be 'bwahahaha'ing?


Really: why would she choose McCain, over Clinton, since she's deadset against Obama (for reasons you haven't detailed)?

[ShadowLiberal]

13. Great points, I think this does effect more then blacks wanting to sit out

I think this whole controversy will piss off more then black people though, I'm a white guy who once considered supporting Hillary over Obama until a month before the Iowa Caucuses, and the Clinton's tactics have been really pissing me off ever since she lost in Iowa. Before people starting voting I could have easily pulled the level for Hillary if she got the nomination, now the only reason I'll be voting for Hillary in the general election if she gets the nomination despite losing all respect for her lately will be for supreme court nominations.

[Anouka]

18. Where are those white voices who are also disgusted, however?

Hillary has whites and blacks to do her dirt for her.

Is there still political fallout to deal with if a white does anything more than say 'I endorse Barack Obama'? or is that seen as the best and most potent way to deal with Hillary?

Can it really be potent, if Hillary is going to cruise to the nomination?

I'm just very perplexed, and a little disappointed in all this, is all. Voting for Hillary would be the equivalent of co-signing what she's done... and that's all that's going to matter, come the General Election.

If Hillary manages to win (in spite of extreme Republican disgust with her), she can say that it was all worth it. And it shouldn't be.


What positives outweighed negatives with Hillary, before Iowa? if I may ask. and what do you like about Obama that you don't find in Edwards?

[countmyvote4real]

17. It's not the race/gender. It's their policy (or lack of) that offends me.

I can't see myself voting for anyone but John Edwards.

[Anouka]

21. You're rare.

Will you vote for neither or Republican in the GE; or are you hoping they KO one another and Edwards scoots in?

How do you feel Edwards will heal the party? or does it have to go that deep?

[countmyvote4real]

23. I honestly don't think it will get "deep" enough for Edwards to remain a viable candidate.

So, I guess I do hope HRC and BHO cancel each other out in the process. The last few days have been very telling/disturbing.

I don't ever foresee myself voting for a Republican candidate, but I do have problems with the two top Democratic candidates:
HRC: Been there. Done that. They must be crazy to want to do it again.
BHO: Too bipartisan and naive for me at this time. Bless his heart in the nicest sense of that phrase, but there's still a big but.

[Barack_America]

20. Ugh. This isn't helping Obama at all.

Which I think is your aim.

[Anouka]

22. I have no idea what it's going to take to make this unprofitable for the Clintons

Helping or Hurting Obama -- I prefered there were ways to help beyond pretending none of these things were happening. But Obama is being placed in a position no one should be placed in.

The way to stop it, is to make it unprofitable for the Clintons. I believe one of those ways would be for a white face to speak out against the Clintons tactics; therefore, they wouldn't be able to draw Obama as the 'black candidate' instead of 'the candidate who happens to be black'.

The Clintons get a twofer (themselves as appearing multi-racial being the second) which each plantation negro they get to slap Obama. Obama doesn't have that luxury. Yet. Perhaps he never will.

Having important voices on his side who happen to be white would give Obama the appearance of being multi-racial (how screwed up is that after all is said and done, right?) and would provide a contrast with the Clinton's use of black surrogates to slap a black man. It would be, basically, using the Clinton's methods against them......... while defending, instead of offending.

Get a white to make Jesse Jackson Jr.'s comment about Katrina.... and what happens? Like that, Kristi. Add a Latino, an Asian, to Obama's side...........

The Clintons are showing that the race game is still alive and well in America. Might as well turn it to one's advantage, to the greater good. In my opinion.