Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Why a multi-party system would benefit the Democratic Party

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 04:11 PM
Original message
Why a multi-party system would benefit the Democratic Party

In a democracy, the idea is for everyone to have a voice. The political process is not intended to be a shouting match between two small (relative to the population) groups of people arguing over which sales associate will display the same bolt of cloth to the people standing out on the sidewalk.

Over the years, both Democratic and Republican parties have done some shifting around, some binging and purging, but they have consistently agreed on a handful of things, the most significant as far as politics is concerned being that there shall be no other parties.

At the same time, like the two leetest sororities on a small Alabama campus, they have moved closer together ideologically. The Deltas toes are painted the same pink as the Rhos, the Rhos are now serving the same little sandwiches at their teas that the Deltas do, and while the Chapter presidents of each may extoll, with wide-eyed charm, that oh, no, they are soooooo totally different, and while they may be sincere, one is still surrounded by the toes, and munching on the sandwiches, while nodding politely at one's enchanting hostess as she gushes an instant replay of what the other Chapter President just said about HER sorority.

It does not matter whether this inexorable fusion into one big Delta Rho is intentional, or if so by whose intention.

The effect is the same: both parties have become stagnant pools with few fish.

Most people in the US do not vote. About 25% do, and that is generally the top 25% income tier, although as the gap between rich and poor widens, and the middle class is phased out, it may be down to the top 20% already.

While the system is designed to prevent the poor from voting in large numbers, it is not true that all non-voters are poor. One thing they share with the poor is the knowledge that whether they vote, and if so, for whom, does not make a hell of a lot of difference.

And if truth be told, most voters know it too. They just like the process, the excitement of campaigns, they fall in love with this candidate or that, they cry when he "loses," and exult when he "wins," they send him money, they wear Tshirts with his face, they hand out buttons.

Anyone who does not like the Delta is by definition an evil Rho, and vice versa.

Issues, policies are secondary. It is understood that there will be no substantive change in policies. People who call for that are anti-social and dangerous elements who have no business in the political process at all and thank God there aren't many of them.

The result is an ostensibly democratic nation that is anything but, a government of a very small segment of the people, whose valuable time is consumed with coming up with new ways to prevent the remaining majority of the people from taking too seriously the fact that in the United States, the people have the power to change their government, or at least understanding that it does not apply to THEM.

Within the parties themselves, there is strife. Every time the gap between the two closes, a few more are purged out, and some resist. There is talk of bases and dialogue and bringing issues to the platform, all every bit as meaningful to the average disenfranchised American as the heirloom dishes used by both Rhos and Deltas at the Initiation Supper.

It is often noted, that of "western Democracies," the US tends to lag behind somewhat in areas of social progress, despite being the wealthiest country on earth. This would not be possible without the concerted effort to minimize the number of people who participate in the political process, the "duopoly" as it has been called recently, although a more accurate term would be a semi-bifurcated monopoly.

Thus the Democrats (and the Republicans) are in a constant state of turmoil and agiation over their bases and their hearts and their spades and acids and diamonds and tents and identities.

And the people are left without a choice, or a voice, and how many among them want a Theocracy, or want a Socialist Democracy, or want Adam Smith's capitalism or classic medieval feudalism or federalism or multi-ism lo-carb snack bar is not known.

Nor is it known when, at what "tipping point" they will decide to overrun both Delta and Rho houses armed with nail polish remover and anti-tea sandwich spray.

A multi-party system, a Sorority Row, just like on the big campuses, would benefit both Deltas and Rhos and all the voiceless people for whom both claim to speak.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. So now you want to help the Democratic Party?
Forgive me if I have my doubts. But maybe you could allay them by pointing to some threads or posts where you make your support and good intentions for the Democratic Party clear?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. You're completely right, of course
:thumbsup:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CO Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
3. I Have a Part-Time Job Circulating Petitions
In Colorado, citizens can petition questions onto the ballot, so it's quite common to see signature collectors such as myself standing outside Wal-Marts and supermarkets.

Last weekend, I was collecting signatures for the recognition of two new minor political parties - the Gun Owner's Rights Party and the Pro-Life Party. The way I figured it, if either of these parties gets recognized, they'll be taking votes away from the GOP.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Great idea!
Thanks for posting this idea.

Something we can all do to ensure as many disillusioned republicans as possible know they have other options in November.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dhalgren Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
4. Great post!
A joy to read. Also,even if most Deltas and Rhos won't admit it, multiple parties need not be automatically antagonistic to one another. Parties would group together where mutual support was deemed advantageous and split where ideals simply could not mesh. I think it would be healthier for our country to have more choice, not less.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cosmicdot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 07:34 PM
Response to Original message
6. Rhos and Deltas ...
... great analogy
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. Great post :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sistersofmercy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 08:46 PM
Response to Original message
8. Interesting
I agree that perhaps in the future such a possiblity might be a productive outlet but for the present we have the most divisive and corrupt misadministration to take on. So do you believe that policies and events have not changed for the worse since Clinton?

DF well written piece and a strong argument for your position, even if I disagree with it at the moment.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Well most folks want $hrub out
but we have to have goals for the future.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sistersofmercy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Of course, we need goals but to claim that the parties are similar
overall is erroneous.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. They've changed for the worse for a lot longer than that

And more resources have gone into steadily fewer hands: material, and also political.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sistersofmercy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. But you didn't answer my question
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. It goes a back a long time before that

The last time the Democratic party flirted with anything substantial was arguably in 1972.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sistersofmercy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. That still didn't answer my question and you are being purposely
evasive.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. Not sure what I didn't answer

Yes, I think things have gotten worse, and the handcart to hell has definitely accelerated since bush, but the acceleration was itself planned, it was back in 73 when Kissinger said his famous thing about oil being too important to let Arabs have it, and Winston Churchill wanted to gas the Kurds and the Afghans waaay back before THAT!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Feanorcurufinwe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. So you agree that the Republicans are worse than the Democrats
Edited on Fri Mar-05-04 12:16 AM by Feanorcurufinwe
and believe that the Republicans have been plotting their evil at least since 73. And you also accuse Churchill - a politician from another country, of plotting war crimes ( I have no idea whether that is true or not).

And this is supposed to advance your argument in what way?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. Feanorcurufinwe, go pet a kitten. Breathe. Have some pie. Here, have a

:grouphug:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Feanorcurufinwe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 12:27 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. I recognize that you don't feel up to the task of debating me
but that won't stop me from trying.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 10:11 PM
Response to Original message
13. election reform is coming
Slowly, but coming. As municipalities and states try to change over to ranked voting and clean(er) elections, we will slowly start to gain some public officials who are open to making more of those changes. We just have to keep plugging away at the grassroots level. So yeah, it really could take decades to get this change we need.

But, then again, maybe not. A lot of voters are getting pretty ticked off out there, and a lot of the election reforms they turned their noses up at before are looking pretty good to them now.

Clean elections: Still running into resistance on that as far as being "forced" to hand money via taxes over to candidates the person in question doesn't support. Also there are some concerns about the First Amendment issue. However, folks are starting to feel queasy about how much time and money $hrub has wasted on stumping and fundraising. The lower costs of Clean campaigns are looking pretty good to many who thought it was pointless or even dangerous before. And many are beginning to understand that the free speech rights of the poor are being trampled under the current campaign financing system.

A paper trail from voting machines: A look at the Florida 2000 fiasco has even some Repubs willing to concede we need verifiable paper counts AND honesty inside the machines.

Open debates and fair treatment from the media: This one mostly still concerns third party and independent folks, but there are some from the big two who support them in the interest of fairness and democracy.

Ranked voting: Florida 2000 pushed this one into the light as well. Again, I stress IRV may not be the perfect answer, but a lot of folks are willing to give it a try over what we have now.

Election Holidays and extended polling hours: I rarely hear anything on this idea, for or against. I think if we could persuade the Congress to actually put it into action the only folks who might complain are some employers and the folks running the polls. Maybe
budget types too.

The Electoral College: Another topic hot from 2000. I myself have yet to make up my mind on it, whether I'd rather get rid of it or reform it somehow. (It depends on what else we do for reforms, for one thing.) But I do know a LOT of folks are clamoring to get rid of it. So that's another area of reform your everyday Jane and Joe are giving thought to.

Proportional representation: This one probably meets with the most resistance, next to clean campaigns, mainly because a) it's a sweeping change and b) it really will knock some power out of the big two's hands, no question about it. However, I find that folks are more open to only instituting it in the House at the federal level. So that's a starting point. With full representation and ranked voting we can pack the Progressive caucus full of progressives from the Greens, Socialists, Labor, Dems, Indies what-have-you. While big two folks who vote party before candidate are opposed to the change, folks who vote candidate before party are willing to concede they would rather vote for or be represented by a progressive from another party than a regressive.

The more I talk to folks about these things, the more I feel the undercurrent. People are not happy with the status quo. Change is definitely coming. Whether it will be fully in place before I leave this Earth, I don't know. But there are people who admit the great U.S. democracy experiment has grown stagnant and needs a shot in the arm. Election reform will help us to elect better leaders, and better leaders means better policies.

So hang in there and keep the faith.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Feanorcurufinwe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #13
19. As
a Montanan, I'd fight abolition of the Electoral college.

One reform that should be undertaken, that would go a long way towards making the United States more democratic, would be expanding the number of reps in the House. Congressional districts are WAY too big (especially mine, lol).

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #19
24. I wonder
what the capitol would look like if they added onto it so that it actually accomodated the number of reps that the Founding Fathers had intended ratio-wise.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BradCKY Donating Member (325 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-04-04 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
14. Here is how a third party can help the democratic party
Get a Ross Perot reform party candidate in the race!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
drfemoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 05:54 AM
Response to Original message
22. A few of those "voiceless people" ..
Halley Suitt's Weblog
This Isn't A Political Campaign

... Something is embedded in Dean's network here in Vermont that I didn't expect to find. They are practicing a new and old religion. They are respectful and kind to one another, smart and funny, helpful and trustworthy. Trust. They remind you you can trust your neighbor. They remind you of the happy comfort and optimism of a pre-9/11 world.

They aren't about the "new normal." They are about the old normal.

They are about taking back the America we knew. It was a good one.

They are about reminding us what a good one it was and can be again.

They are shape-changers to be sure -- every time you think you've got them pinned down, they defy description. If you think they are simply liberal Democrats, you are caught up short to realize there are some solid, conservative American values at work here. They can feel very strick and conservative, these down-to-earth Vermonters. Almost like the good Republicans I grew up around in Connecticut a long time ago.

They make you feel you can return to that simple honest pre-9/11 world of trusted neighbors. Driving up from Boston, you cover beautiful country, especially the last hour from Montpelier through to Burlington. The terrain really begins to climb. The mountains of Vermont, hold us in an embrace, but they are solid and cold, rather stern, suggesting deep straight American values of trust and reliability. You can count on them. It feels like an opportunity to reset your whole life, this strange campaign, to leave the "don't trust your neighbor" life behind and get back to a hopeful life of mutual trust.
...
http://www.halleyscomment.blogspot.com/2004_01_25_halleyscomment_archive.html#107516801684955814
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iverson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-05-04 06:15 AM
Response to Original message
23. an apt analogy
Democracy would be helped. Those within the major parties who do not like democracy would not be helped.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:45 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. Indeed. And it would seem that they are legion.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. D.A.D. Strikes Back!
Democrats Against Democracy! A bunch of warm furry critters if ever there was any!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Jan 14th 2025, 03:31 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC