Just finished reading "Secrets of the Tomb" by Alexandra Robbins (Skull)

[seventhson]

She goes into depth on the Bush family connectiosn to Skull and Bones and asserts that the Bushes are the family with the second most members after the Tafts.

It is, as I suspected, less than a solid critical analysis of the ruling elites, as Robbins is a Yale secret society member herself (I would guess Berzelius or Wolf's head) and so she still has the admiring gloss of the experience to keep her critique to a minimum.

However she does provide a VERY useful history and analysis of the Bush connections to the Hitler financiers as well as the men who ran the Manhattan project.

The ties that she establishes demonstrates the extent to which Bush is a Boodle Boy (one of the names they give themselves) - that basically he was an unproductive drunk who only achieved his status or got into Yale or Harvard at all because of his Skull and Bones connections and that he used and continues to use these connections to the present. The first head of Homeland Security after 9-11 was a Skull and Bonesman.

Kerry, on the other hand, is not treated much by the book at all. Most of the focus is on Bush and other huge elites - including the CIA connections of Skull, Yale, etc.

I highly recommend it with the caveat that you must read it in conjunction with her interview at Guerilla News.com:

http://www.guerrillanews.com/counter_intelligence/doc808.html

and remember that it is not so much an expose as a history - and to some degree a flattering history - which ultimately seems to endorse the secret society systems while noting and documenting the criticisms and readily apparetn flaws. Some of the book seems almost glowing in its praise of the "character development" in Bones. Other parts critique the elitism, but glosses over or omits certain factors completely.

For example: in one portion she mentions that Prescott Bush was on a Director of the bank which bankrolled Hitler. She fails to mention that three of the seven directors were Bonesmen, a fourth was another Yale man, (meaning the majority of the directors of this Nazi agent bank in New York were Yale men and most of them were Bonesmen) and the other three were German Nazis. She left this out completely - which is a HUGE omission.

I think that, based on her interview, she learned more and became more critical AFTER she finished the book, which has a hurry-up-and-get-it-finished wrap up feel with little enlightenment. Part of that critical analysis MAT have been some of the heat she took here at DU - which I think is a good thing. She got hotter and more heated in her criticism AFTER being baptised by fire here.

I do recommend the book though and urge people to read it along with the myriad websites like Tarpley.net and boodleboys etc. which add MORE to the historical record and have more objectivity than the Yale-enamored Robbins.

In retrospect I wish we had engaged Ms. Robbins more here and got her involved instead of (me mostly) haranguing her for being to soft on Bones and relying to much on Bonesman for the facts (almost all anonymous sources re: actual inside information). There is a decent bibliography too - but not much from a real CT or left perspective.


All in all I think it helps all of us to know what we are up against in the BFEE and how tied in they are.

Kerry, a Bonesman and insider, perhaps knows better than anyone how to sdeal with these elites and outfox them.

I think it is entirely possible to believe that Kerry can use his background as an advantage to beat Bush's ass in November - which I admit is a very good thing.


If Kerry wins, however, (and nader is certain to raise the stakes with his sorry spook-ass Princeton secret society type self) we will HAVE to be on the case to be sure that Kerry KEEPS his faith with the PEOPLE and NOT with the elites whom he is proposing to oust so that we can recaliam our government from a legion of thieves and crooked liars.


There is a gold-lining to the bonesman cloud: Kerry KNOWS what they know and can use it against them.

[JohnKleeb]

1. Kerry has shown that he is for the people not the elites

I know its not that big of a deal but I appreciate someone who can do this.

The day a republican marches with a union affiliated with the AFL-CIO is the day I choke on pretzels and get bruises. I think he has shown that he can be very unsuspecting. Good to see you possibly warming up to Kerry.

[seventhson]

2. I HAVE to count whatever blessings there are in a Kerry candidacy

You all who know me here know that I fight hard for what I believe.

What I believe now is that Bush must be defeated politically by any legal means necessary.

I believe that kerry can and will defeat Bush in November and that we will begin the resurrection of America from a voodoo like grave that Bush and his evil legion of devils put us into after 9-11.

I HAVE to believe that Kerry is a decent enough man with a sense of history and an ethnic and spiritual background that will take us off the collision coursew which the Waspy anglogermanophiles have led us on since the death of JFK the First.


I LIKE what Kerry is saying. He seems to have cojones.

I am with him. I am behind him.

And, as with any leader, I will follow hgim into this political fray (or even lead him into it) as long as the battle is joined and he is on the side against evil.

[JohnKleeb]

3. WASPy anglo philes speakin of them

you know how people say Jewish folk run the country. i think its them. I know, I am weird. Kerry has been great lately. Hope you keep seeing for what he is, hes giving these bastards what they deserve.

[seventhson]

9. By "them" you mean the waspy anglo-germanophiles? Right?

right?

I thought so.

[corporatewhore]

4. i dunno NAFTA/WTO/IMF/IWR/PATRIOT ACT seem to say something else

[JohnKleeb]

5. I disagree with you on it but I wont fight with you

Lets be honest on the patriot act though, only one senator voted against it. I wont give you or Kucinich a hard time though. Plenty of long time advocates of workers rights have been for free trade, its a shame, and I do prefer Kucinich on the issues to Kerry but damn I like Kerry. BTW if you dont vote Kerry, wont get mad at ya, I understand your motivations. I admit I am being a little pragmatic.

[seventhson]

8. All past bets are off where Kerry is concerned

We have to start him from here on out with a clean slate.

For better or worse Kerry is a totally political animal.

That means that whatever his decisions in the past they were all so that he could get to where is RIGHT now - to DEFEAT Bush.

Whether we liked the votes or not - the fact is that from a political point of view they put him with the mainstream of AMERICA in the sense that at the time of the votes it was perceived that it was the right thing to do. It cannot now be held AGAINST him vis a vis Bush in that Bush cannot OUT-PATRIOT him.

As a democratic insider said to me recently - high up - we get him in the office - get Bush OUT - and then we tweak him to get what we relly want.

From my point of view Kerry is a politicl cipher in many respects: I have no idea what he will be likely to do first or what he will focus on policy-wise.

Whatever it is it will be better than Bush.

If we hate Nafta or WTO or globalization -- whatever it is - we will be beter off policy wise with Kerry in office.

[Minstrel Boy]

6. good summation, seventhson

I read it a few months ago, and appreciated Robbins' take on S&B more than I'd expected.

She largely avoided the sensationalism of the S&B story (though she supported the case for it having stolen Geronimo's skull), while confirming my apprehension about the society's influence.

[seventhson]

7. Thanks - there is plenty that she COULD have been sensational about

and I wish she HAD been.

But overall if you put that into context with her interview and the other materials available online (along with books like "The Power Elite") the puzzle pieces fit together nicely.

One thing that she confirmed, and I knew from second hand experience (via friends of mine in prep school) that the secret order types are recruited (including for the intelligence community) in high (elite prep) school.

The recruitment of teenagers int the secret socieities as conduits into the intel communty (especially covert and blackops) is deeply troubling to me.

[Hekate]

17. Recruitment of adolescents for secret societies

Very interesting, seventhson. I have to admit that such things are a world away from where I was raised and the worldview I was raised in, so I draw analogies where I can.

A couple of years ago an elderly colleague of my husband's self-published a "spiritual autobiography" as a testament of his life, in which he spent many years in the Roman Catholic priesthood, later becoming a psychotherapist.

Only one thing in it surprised me, and that one thing actually appalled me: the age at which boys were recruited to the priesthood. Our friend was chosen when he was in the 7th or 8th grade, just barely pubescent and utterly idealistic. (And no, abuse was not part of his history with the church.)

If S&B and other secret societies (others? sheesh) start their recruitment at the high school level, they really do have quite the opportunity to mold character and attitudes, for better or worse. I vaguely thought S&B was just another fraternity horsing around instead of studying: guess I thought wrong.

Thanks for sharing what you can, yet again.

Hekate

[seventhson]

25. I was asked to "take a year off" from an exclusive prep school

after getting caught in a midnight jaunt with the son of a Bonesman (and CIA-Banker spook). Nothing improper - but I was NOT so well connected and I was asked to leave. I went to an ethnically mixed (and coed) public school and never went back to the spooky investment factory of prep school.

I think the only Jewish classmate I had committed suicide a year after he finished there (otherwise it was very waspy except for the few internationl financial heirs)

Anyway as I was in my final days there (at age 14 after being there three years from the beginning of my 12th year alive) - and a secret society tried to recruit a well-loved jock - a Junior of age maybe 16-17 and captain of his team. They had threee taps -- I think one for Yale, Harvard and Princeton. All to become spooks (CIA-NSA) later in life.

This guy threw off the bag thrown over his head and kicked these guys asses. The police were called and the whole school buzzed about it - even a lecture at "Chapel" . Years later i heard from a classmte, the son of a spook, that all the old spooks were "Furious" that the tap was made public and that this bastard had exposed it at the school.

This is what Bush came out of. This spooky untoucable background which goes all the way through to the destabilization and assassination of democratic world leaders to protect the assets and mines and plantations of the heirs to the Holocaust.

THAT is what this democracy is facing as its greatest enemy and greatest challenge,

My brothers were in secret socities at Yale (none were Bones, though a cousin and an uncle was - he's mentioned in the book and he worked for ne of the bastrds that financed Hitler)

It is no bullshit man.

I just hope we can trust Kerry. I have no alternative but to ho[e that he is one who was not totally corrupted by these lying freaks and necrophiles.

[WilliamPitt]

10. I pray you don't take this as a personal attack

but this is the best, sanest, most balanced post I've seen you toss up in, well, maybe forever. Had you approached this subject matter in this tone from the start, I certainly would have paid you a lot more respect and attention.

I don't know if this is a dick thing to say - it probably is - but you have driven me and others right up the wall and through the light fixture with some of your stuff. This, however, is excellent. Looking forward to buying you a drink in Cambridge.

[seventhson]

11. The artist'writers in the European underground drove each other nuts too

so I suppose it is okay.

I am retrofitting for Kerry.

I may never be happy about it, but you gotta love the one your with if you can't be with the one you love.

I hope I can make it.


I could tell you some stories...

[WilliamPitt]

12. "Retrofitting"

Beautifully phrased. :)

[seventhson]

15. Thanks. Feel free to use it. It's friggin' apt.

Especially for someone like me who spent almost two years here at DU trying almost every means available to stop Kerry from being on the ticket.

It is something that I think DU is slowly doing. We are adapting. We are continuing to strategize with the huge curve ball thrown our way and many of us are not ready.

But I am working on it.

I had to wean myself from the need to reiterate my memes every time the good Junior Senator from massachusetts was praised or his crown was raised.

What is your poison, anyway, WP?

I'll try just about everything -- but the underground guys drank absinthe while lolling by the Mediterranean in cheap French brothels in southern France while they were plotting the fight against evil fascist Nazis. Not exactly Boston.

[WilliamPitt]

16. I'm a Harpoon IPA guy at People's

but I'm a cheap date regardless. :)

[seventhson]

24. I LOVE Harpoon IPA!!!

It really is the best!

Sounds good. My wife is a fanatical Dennis fan - so hopefully she will come (and drive me) and you can tell her some DK anecdotes.

While I guzzle a few IPA's

[no name no slogan]

13. No, Will, this is a dick thing to say

(Not quite sure what the hand gesture is supposed to mean, though. Maybe he's bragging?)

[WilliamPitt]

14. Might it be this?

http://www.poe-news.com/features.php?feat=31845

:)

[molly]

18. I thought you read that LAST YEAR?

:shrug:

[wyldwolf]

19. I thought he read it last year, too.

In fact, he has used it as "evidence" of Kerry being a Bush collaborator before.

[Cocoa]

21. me too

I recall lengthy discussions of Alexandra Robbins.

And seventhson has devoted his life to researching Skull and Bones, so it seems odd that only now would he get around to reading the most prominent book on the subject.

[molly]

22. Maybe he forgot?

hmmm - how could he - we had some pretty heavy duty fighting going on - refer to post 10.

[seventhson]

26. No, I would not buy it and was advised by the writing of Ron Rosenbaum

(a Yale classmate of Bush and longtme progressive writer for the NYObserver) tht the book was very poorly done and manipulated by Bones.

I said that at the time, The inbterview is what made me want to read it and it is pretty poor in many respects but of value in other ways - but in context of the other writings.


Hers is hardly the definitve or authoritative book on the subject.

But I grew up with these people. I did not NEED her book to learn a lot of it. I knew it already. But she provides details and leaves OUT important details.

NOW I have read it - and can say it has some value for those who want to learn more.

With a skull vs skull election coming up, I would suggest people who think they are knowledgeable about the candidates should have at least this fundamental knowledge of this subject. It is not bullshit. It is a real sociocultural indoctrination for the elites who WANT power -- and you should know about it.

[Cocoa]

28. how does Robbins's credibility compare to Drudge's?

I always thought anything written by Drudge was by definition not even worth thinking about, but some people were so bent on smearing John Kerry that they promoted his stupid "intern" smear about him.

Pretty low, I thought.

[WillyBrandt]

30. Nobody at DU would promote a Drudge smear about Kerry

Perish the thought!

Only crackpots believe that kind of stuff.

[seventhson]

31. I believed it at the time

But I don't know. Credibility is a funny thing.

[Cocoa]

32. you believed it?

Who knows, maybe you did. One thing for sure, you promoted it.

more sad than funny, imo.

[seventhson]

33. I promoted it because I believed it

I am not sure about it now. I was hoping it would catapult Dean back into the lead so I wanted to believe it.

I still think it is a possibility --- but ANYTHING is a possibility.

I am behind Kerry now for what it is worth.

[Nicholas_J]

20. I read it too

Having spent 20 years having to review books for purchase based on their accuracy, reliablity, and authoratative, this book ranks up there with Sean Hannity and Bill O'Reilly's materials, and misinterpreted data an sources. Bad writing and misdirection are just as reprehensible from liberals as it is from conservatives.

[seventhson]

27. Yeah - but it has some useful information

as well as what mught be termed disinformation.

I thiunk you read it in context with other materials and with a grain of salt and it has some merit. Maybe not a huge amount (it is kind of a puff piece) -- but it is still worth the read for details (like some even I did not know about and have not seen elsewhere)

When the Bonesmen quoted are all anonymous, it makes it a lot harder to trust their perspective, especially when they admit to hyping the myths to promote themselves.

[frank frankly]

23. i agree with you on this, seventhson

and I too hope that Kerry can use all this connections for reform and justice...

:hi:

[cally]

29. I find all of this fascinating

and I'm impressed that you now support Kerry. I know a little about the secret societies. I think some, like Bush, get immersed in them. Many enter them for a year or two and just plain grow up. I think Kerry is a grownup.

Thanks for your support of Kerry and your dedication to liberal values.

[jsw_81]

34. I don't buy any of this Skull and Bones conspiracy stuff

If it's all a conspiracy and if Skull and Bones is so powerful, then why did Skull and Bones members William Howard Taft and George H.W. Bush both get crushed in their re-election bids? Why did GHWB lose two U.S. Senate races? Why did Dubya (and Kerry) lose U.S. House races back in the 1970's? Why have so many other Skull and Bones members lost elections and been failures in business? Doesn't sound like a very efficient conspiracy IMO.

No, if you use Occum's razor, you'll see that Skull and Bones is just a silly secret society for rich Yalies who have nothing better to do on a Friday night. All this stuff about world domination and conspiracy is just a scam to sell books to gullible people who want to believe such nonsense (a lot like the various Kennedy assassination conspiracies).

[KC21304]

35. Just saw this thread late Sunday night and all I can say ,Seventhson, is

HALLELUJAH !:toast:

[seventhson]

36. Kerry or Bust!

And it will be a bust if he loses.

Now I need to focus my research skills on Nader and Bush.