Where is our party on the political spectrum?

[Padraig18]

Poll question: Where is our party on the political spectrum?

There seems to be disagreement on where the Democratic Party is currently, and I'd like your opinion, please.

:)

[Feanorcurufinwe]

1. The Democratic party is:

WAYYYYYYYY the hell left. , Far left. , Left of center., Centrist. , Right of center.


All of those

[Padraig18]

2. Shhhhh!

Don't let the cat out of the bag--- you'll upset the purists. ;)

[GreenArrow]

36. rephrase it then:

the "power-base" of the party is right of center and heading further right. The rank and file, for the most part, will follow the leader.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

55. You rephrased a question into a statement.

:wtf:

[GreenArrow]

56. this is one of those times where the answer/"statement"

itself implies the question.

Just for the sake of clarity:

The question in the original post was something to the effect of where does the party stand on the political spectrum. You replied, quite correctly, that there are people of varying beliefs within the party.

My response to that point was simply to ask the initial question in a slightly different way: where does the power base of our party sit on the political spectrum? Though the question was not asked directly, it was implied by the answer ("statement.")

Viewed this way, I think the party is quite obviously sitting and trending further rightward.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

63. Wrong, totally and completely wrong.

It is true that your statement implies a question, but that just shows how poorly worded that question is. A question that implies only one answer is rhetorical question, not a real interrogative.



If you were to actually rephrase the original question into the question:


"where does the power base of our party sit on the political spectrum?"

I would have to ask you what 'power base' means? Because I don't believe there is any such thing.

[GreenArrow]

64. we'll have to disagree

The question, (perhaps rather to oblique for the average reader, but not poorly worded) -- "where does the power base of our party sit on the political spectrum?" -- does not imply one single correct answer, as you suggest. I gave my own opinion on the matter, but there is plenty of room for other answers, including your own, that there is no such thing as a power base. Of course, in light of my own opinion, I disagree with yours.

If one accepts that the party has "leadership", then doesn't it follow that if some are leaders, then others are followers? Are force, authority and influence spread evenly throughout the Democratic party? You can answer however you choose, but consider the power dynamics of your workplace, schools, or social groups; is power distributed evenly in those places?

[Feanorcurufinwe]

65. Well I do think there is such a thing as party leaership

that spans the spectrum of viewpoints I listed in my original post. The term 'power base' is one that I'm not familiar with in this context. Since you used the term, could you define it, and explain how it is different from the party leadership?

[IndianaGreen]

3. Bush = Hitler to me, therefore the Democratic Party is...

way, way to the left even if Lieberman were the nominee.

Of course, all of this is relative. If we were to break this down by issues and by office holders, we will find some Republicans to the left of some Democrats, and some Democrats to the right of some Republicans.

[ScreamingMeemie]

4. It depends on what is defined as the center these days.

I mean, is it conservatism without the Christian Fundy values??? I'd be hard put to figure out what is middling anymore. :hi:

[IndianaGreen]

5. We keep sliding right every year

but so is the GOP--they are now on the Mussolini/Hitler end of the spectrum, but we are catching up to them with such gems as PATRIOT Act.

Today's middle, was yesterday's sensible conservatism.

[Mairead]

30. Yes, it's rather pointless to ask the question without defining the zero

since then it becomes entirely subjective.

Which suggests that most of the respondents so far would be people LBJ and Nixon would consider Republicans.

[Padraig18]

6. What idiot voted way right?

:wtf:

[IndianaGreen]

7. If you don't like how people respond to polls, don't have polls!

It wasn't me, so spare me the witch hunt.

[Padraig18]

8. No witch hunt

Just found it remarkable; of course, I also find it remarkable that some people vote 'Bush' in presidential polls here, as well... :shrug:

[IndianaGreen]

12. Other than the occasional Freeper...

I think most people that vote "Bush" are people that are sick and tired of so many polls.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

18. I think it has more to do with immaturity.

[jpgray]

24. I suggest that guessing at motivations in an internet poll is time wasted

:D

[Feanorcurufinwe]

27. I suggest 99% of time spent at DU is time wasted.

For me, anyway.

[Endangered Specie]

54. Some people probably miss-click too

[fujiyama]

23. My question is...

who voted way the hell left?

[Cuban_Liberal]

28. Also a good question.

:shrug:

[jonnyblitz]

38. i want to know who the idiots were that voted left or far left.

its HARDLY a leftwing party.

[AntiCoup2K4]

9. Depends on your definition of "party".

I would say that the overwhelming majority of Democrats range from liberal to center, while the party "leadership" has been taken over by the right wing, who seem to care for their corporate funders far more than the Democratic voters.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

11. The party is made up of everyone who says they are a Democrat.

[IndianaGreen]

13. Zell MIller?

Zell is a superdelegate for Georgia at the Democratic Convention, yet he is openly and actively supporting the Bush/Cheney ticket.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

14. Do you live on a planet where Zell Miller is not in the Democratic party?

I might like to live on such a planet, because Miller is a right-wing scumbag, but on the planet Earth, Zell Miller is indeed in the Democratic party.

[AntiCoup2K4]

20. But should DINO's be allowed to be leading the party?

I have no doubt there are some Democrats who are to the right of me on various issues. Take the I/P dungeon.... assuming everybody there is NOT a Freeper (which is a huge leap of faith on some days), then they obviously have some right wing viewpoints, at least on those issues.

But do those viewpoints speak for the majority of Democrats, and should they be the "official" position of the party?

I can respect a Ben Nighthorse Campbell more than I can a Lieberman, Bayh, or Miller. Because, at least when he realized he was a Republican, he aligned himself with the "correct" party rather than continue to pollute a party whose core values he didn't support. By the same token, maybe Jim Jeffords should have come all the way over to our side, rather than claiming Independent and voting with Democrats all of the time.

Bottom line is that we have a minority of Puke lites deciding the agenda for this party and it's killing all of us. And I don't just mean politically, given the DLC contributions to the current state of the world.

[sangh0]

22. Zell Miller leads the Democratic Party?

Since when?

:crazy:

[Dhalgren]

47. Well, an argument could be made

that "superdelegates" are in "leadership" positions in the Party. So, in that sense, Zell "You got a purdy mouth, boy" Miller would be a "leader" of the Party.

[sangh0]

52. I'd sure like to hear that argument

because it really makes no sense.

[Hippo_Tron]

33. In the grand scheme of things caucus votes are more important than purity

Granted Zell Miller REALLY comes close to crossing the line there. He endorses Bush and goes out of his way to help the Republicans in the senate in every way possible. I still believe that Lieberman is liberal enough on fiscal issues and some social issues to be a democrat, though I will admit that he is a centrist, and I'm not particularly familiar with Bayh's record but considering he comes from Indiana I'd take a DINO who votes with the Republicans a lot but doesn't appeal to the far right interests groups, over a Republican who caucuses with the Republicans and acts just like every other Republican. If Bayh was not the senator from Indiana his seat would be held by a Republican like Tom DeLay, not a Republican like Lincoln Chafee.

[Hippo_Tron]

32. But he openly endorsed Bush...

If he cannot support the party's nominee over Bush then he should have absolutely nothing to do with the democrats on the national level.

[Ficus]

51. Wouldn't that be scary

but ol' Zell said he wasn't attending the convention. At least not ours (Democratic).

[messiah]

10. Right of Center

people must be voting in terms of just US politics and not looking at the evolution of modern industrial contries.

[RichM]

15. It's right of center - militarist, imperialist, refusing to defend civil

liberties at home, content to spend $400 B yearly on the Pentagon. The party (aside from Dennis) refuses to talk seriously about universal single-payer health care. It rolled over on its back for the Telecom Act of '96, and cooperated with Republicans in "welfare reform" - helping to dismantle the social safety net.

While less loathesome than Republicans on the environment, selection of judges, and minimum wage, overall, the party cringes on its knees in front of big corporations and is kissy-kissy with the MIC. The party is simply the less reactionary of the 2 US big business parties, & nothing more.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

17. Yes, the Democratic party is all those evil things!

We are so lucky to have you speaking out, since the rest of us are absolutely lacking a moral compass. :eyes:

[Padraig18]

19. As I said in another thread...

Some people here consider anything to the right of Mao 'right wing'...:eyes:

[Feanorcurufinwe]

25. It's really not that attitude that bothers me

as much as the simple lack of understanding so many people have about what party politics are all about. It's about working together to achieve shared goals, even with people who disagree about other goals. It's not about achieving a unanimous opinion on the issues.

[Hav]

29. Correct..

I wouldn't mind about their positions as they are not per se good or bad.
What bothers me is the attitude some show towards those who don't share their beliefs 100% and the unwillingness to compromise, an essential element in politics and the lack of tolerance they themselves demand.

[edzontar]

37. Which policies of Mao's are you referring to?

He was a pretty weird guy--and not exactly "left" in the simplistic way you suggest here.

What made Mao especially creepy (and hard to pin down) was the way he actively set different factions of his government and party against each other and sat back to enjoy the resulting carnage.

What he was in the end was a Machiavellian dictator with an anarchist streak--not the guy you want running a country of a billion people.

[Padraig18]

44. Let's not be pedantic, edzontar.

You know exactly how I meant the phrase, and so did everyone else who read it, so let's leave it at that, OK?

[JohnLocke]

59. Heh.

I want a values debate! :)

[jpgray]

16. In the US, left of center. In general terms, center-right. (nt)

[ulysses]

21. officially? weighted centrist

and fairly heavily.

[Cuban_Liberal]

26. Centrist, with slight leftist tendencies.

The Democratic Party is decidely centrist, with occasional flirtations with leftist/socialist ideas.

Edit: typo

[Hippo_Tron]

31. Depends on what issues...

On domestic issues I'd say we are liberal but not far left. Social issues same thing. Defense, on the other hand, we are pretty conservative.

[mohc]

34. Left and right are of course relative terms

So my answer depends on context.

1. Current US Politics: Center Left
2. Historical Politics: Far Left
3. Current Western Politics: Center Right
4. Current World Politics: Left

[arewethereyet]

35. if the spectrum is 1 yard wide

we're 1/32nd of an inch to the left, the republicans 1/32nd of an inch to the right.

the spectrum is a lot wider than you guys give it credit for being.

[flaminbats]

39. Most responses reveal a conservative perspective at DU..

There are slightly more DUers who fear that our party has become too left-wing than those who believe it has become too right-wing. The majority of those polled believe that Democrats politically are either centralist or right of center.

If most DUers don't believe this party should represent the virtue of liberty, then who does?

[corporatewhore]

40. very high on the imperalist/neoliberal scale left and right are not good

measurements

[Feanorcurufinwe]

41. It's a classic bell shaped curve.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

42. Has no clear identity

which is one of its problems.

[canuckagainstBush]

43. Right of Centre

http://www.digitalronin.f2s.com/politicalcompass/usprimaries.html

[DaveSZ]

45. Canuck is correct

I was about to post "center-right" and post that same picture.


Where do the Canadian parties stand on that scale?

Paul Martin looks to be about where Kerry is.

:)

[canuckagainstBush]

46. Martin is almost exactly where Kerry is n/t

[DaveSZ]

48. .

Isn't Martin NDP?

What are the Canadian parties and what do they stand for again?

Refresh my memory.

If Bush is reelected I might move to Canada lol, but the Canadians will suffer too since our economies are so interdependent.

[DaveSZ]

49. Also

What do you guys think of some of our heroes like FDR, and Jack Kennedy and where they stand on that scale?

I would like Edward Kennedy except for the fact he killed that young girl when he was drunk driving. It's hard for me to get over that even though I agree with him on many issues (except gun control).



I hear many (even conservative Dems) talking about how those old timey liberals were strong on defense, and modern liberals aren't. Did the foreign policy of the Democratic Party move leftward and align itself more with pacifism, or is that simply hyperbole on the part of people like Limbaugh et al?

Personally I think we need a leader willing to kick some ass in regards to Al Qaeda, but realize the Iraq war was a mistake.

I'm a bit concerned about how Kerry would conduct the fight against Al Qaeda, but it seems Bush is quite inept at it if Clake is to be believed.

This is why I favored General Clark in the primaries, because I agreed with his foreign policy, and I knew he would be a man to share our liberal values and still be strong on national security.

[DaveSZ]

50. Answering my own question about Martin:

http://www.paulmartintimes.ca/


LOL

[ACK]

53. The Democratic party is centrist

Yes, I agree too centrist on many issues.

Hopefully a man with a slight left of center liberal voting record overall with years of experience in Congress can move the party left of center again with a victory to take back the White House.

If you examine American politics in a vaccumm, I will stand by my statement.

If you look at politics in comparison to the world at large, the Dems are just right of center.

Now, the Republicans are incredibly right-wing dangerous psychopaths but that is a different thread entirely.

[GreenArrow]

57. visualize a line

divided equally into two halves, the center denoted by the 0, each half representing one end of the political spectrum.
--------------------0--------------------

As to where the current Democratic party leadership sits on this line, represented by d:

<--------------------0-------d------r---->

So where is the center?

[Finbar]

58. centerist

[jsw_81]

60. It's center/left where it should be

Anyone who thinks that our party is "right-wing" is nuts.

[edzontar]

61. Right now, it is too far to the RIGHT...

We have all this crap breaking on Bush, and who do we get speaking in the pukeboy's defences, but JOE BIDEN and JOE LIEBERMAN.

And hardly a word from Kerry (Ted K was been good though).

I really worry that a once great (or at least somewhat decent) party is in danger of losing it's soul--not to mention the election....

[LoneStarLiberal]

62. Quite Centrist

Overall, in comparison with ideological spans for Western European democracies and Canada and Australia, both of our parties are extremely centrist.

It gets a little dicier with you look at it by issue; on some issues we're to the right of the Republicans. On most we're to their left.