Right now Democrats should be seen as the Party of Fresh Air -- But we're polluting it. Why?

[Armstead]

Think back to last year. GW Bush hitting ever-lower numbers in the polls. People fed up with GOP scandals and divisiveness. The country wanted out of Iraq. The economy showing danger signs. Gas prices straining budgets. The list goes on and on....

People were looking for change. Big change. The big pendulum of history was swinging in a leftward direction after 30 years of conservative Culture Wars and Gilded Age uber "free market" economic polarization of Wealth and Power.

A golden opportunity for the Democratic Party. A large field of potential presidential candidates, including the first woman and the first African American candidates with a chance of actually winning.

This had the makings of a clearcut battle between the GOP's Same Old Shit and a Democratic Fresh Start. Between the nastiness and pettiness of the GOP and and an open and more principled Democratic Party.

But instead of a Big Tent Grand Coalition, we're fracturing into little pieces. Instead of Big Ideas we're reverting to the divisiveness over race and gender that used to be the specialty of the GOP.

So what happened?

[BeyondGeography]

1. The Clintons happened

These overindulged children MUST get back to the White House, or else.

[C_U_L8R]

2. Hillary farted in the elevator

: - )

[msmcghee]

3. A lot of this is human nature.

Reminds me of a few start-ups I've been involved with. At first when there's a dream and not much money everyone is part of the team struggling against mighty odds to fight your way to success. You come to work with a gleam in your eye and the drive to do what you can to make the company go.

Once the product gets recognized and investors start laying the big bucks on the table it's amazing how motivations can change. Now, it's "what do I get for all I've done in the past" and "I did way more than that person so why are they getting the big office and the title" . . etc. And now, the marketing person and the engineering person are hating each other and both claiming they should be running the place and the other one fired.

[Armstead]

4. That's a hard one to overcome I guess

But at this point it looks like we're telling the investors to go away -- or scaring them away by acting like a bunch of nitwits.

[msmcghee]

5. I think a lot of it comes down to the maturity . .

. . of the original investors. (The Dem voters in this analogy.) If they've had some experience at doing this before they are more likely to take an objective view of how to get to the next stage - willing to hire smarter people with proven experience to help. If they've never done it before they are more likely to passionately take sides in the management wars and blow the whole thing for the sake of their own egos. They are the ones with the most to lose.

[Armstead]

8. True...Look who the investors chose for the last eight years

[msmcghee]

9. Personality comes into play too.

The personalities of the original investors - the Dem voters. I think we express our tribalism differently than the right. They tend to unite around common values of religion and nationhood. They then project those values onto the personality of their nominee and that gives them a strong motivation to defeat us tied up with God and the flag and all.

We tend to unite around particular issues - and there's lots of issues. So we end of more factionized and more prone to internecine warfare. And with all the issues complicating things we tend to identify with the symbolic characteristics of the candidates - such as gender and race.

But I think the maturity thing is the key to understanding this race. Older folks are going for Hillary and younger for Obama.

[Armstead]

13. Yes, that's long been a problem. But we've lost the glue that holds the big tent together

At its' core, the Democratic Party (at least the version that emeerged from FDR) did stand for certain core principles that transcended the individual special interests.

That was a progressive (liberal) economic vision that was in contrast to the elitism of the GOP. The Democratic Party has to withstand the strain between moderates and ideologues, racists and civil rights advocates, and other interests. But underlying it was a sense that Democrats were the balance to the unrestrained capitalism that the GOP represented.

I wonder if the erosion of that underlying unifying vision is on reason we are devolving back into smaller splinter factions.

[Eurobabe]

6. What's this "we" bit?

I see only a chosen few up at the top of the food chain polluting it for their own personal gain. Makes me sick. (Glad to be an Independent. Although my voting card says Dem.)

[Armstead]

7. The rest of us are enabling it

They pull our chains and we follow in the direction we're told and we snap and bark or pull back on command.

[Eurobabe]

23. time to revolt!! N/T

[Jersey Devil]

10. Hillary turned it into the potty of fresh air

"We" didn't do anything. Clinton's slime machine destroyed our opportunity.

[NashVegas]

11. IMNSHO

I am lately of the mind that the money people who control the Democratic party decided who the candidate would be sometime in January - just as they did four years ago.

However, I believe they miscalculated and expected Hillary to defer, got very pissed off when she didn't, and that's pretty much led us to where we are now.

[SeaLyons]

12. What happened is unresolved

racial and gender issues. The country doesn't know how to deal with it, and is supersensitive on both sides.

[Armstead]

15. That's probably true - - But we're all in the same boat

What I find most unfortunate is that the vast majority are being squeezed by the same issues -- regardless of race or gender. The Democratic Message -- regardless of candidate -- should be "We're all in this together."

The hollowing out of the economy and the Markets Uber Alles value system is an equal-opportunity oppressor. When a factory shuts down, wages are surpressed, etc. people of all colors and genders are affected.

The erosion of civil liberties doesn't make a distinction between spying on an Elliot Spitzer or a member of Code Pink.

That, IMO is what the Democratic Party ought to be representing right now. A reassertion of everyone's economic and political rights.

[SeaLyons]

17. I'm with you

agree 100%....it's going to be an interesting summer.

[Armstead]

20. Transcending differences for the common good -- Wotta concept

One hopes that all Democrats, regardless of candidate choice, could pass that barrier. Wotta concept

[msmcghee]

14. I was attracted to this thread because of the intelligent way . .

. . you started it. These are interesting questions. Thanks.

P.S. I also like the quote by Bernie Sanders in your profile.

"It’s very easy to make fun of George Bush, but that ain’t going to do it. What we have to do is knock on doors and go into communities where there are people who disagree with us on certain issues. And we have to talk to them. They’re our friends.We can’t see them as enemies." --- Sen. Bernie Sanders

[Armstead]

16. Yes, Bernie knows the score

I wish Democrats would look at his brand of inclusive progressive populism

[Orsino]

18. Money.

It buys Democrats almost as easily as it buys Republicans. Don't expect fresh air when money is allowed a place at the table.

[Armstead]

19. Money is a polluting factor to be sure

[Carrieyazel]

21. Two candidates who don't give you any advantages in a general election

is part of it. The problem with Democrats is that with presidential primaries we often don't use our heads and think strategically, and have put forth for nomination two candidates who won't be able to change the electoral map.
And Hillary and Obama are both part of the Washington insider group that has given us the same old crap for years. And outside of DC candidate would have been optimal, but we didn't want it.

The Repukes though came to their senses and nominated the one candidate who could win a general, even though he's part of the same old same old.

On the bright side, we are making big gains in Congress, state/local offices. We are mowing them down in those areas.

[Armstead]

22. I was an Edwards supporter, but we got voted off the island.

So did several other adults.

I think our current candidates could have carried the General but...the campaign has degenerated into tearing each other down so much that much of the work of the GOP has already been done for them.

[Armstead]

24. kik

[reflection]

25. Two powerful forces collided.

If the Democratic Party could have staggered these two historical peaks a few years apart it could have assured a new 12-16 year era of politics. You can really make an impact with that kind of time in power.

[Armstead]

26. It's a shame because they shouldn't be mutually exclusive