Washington Post has photo/video, obliterates Clinton Bosnia claim

[kpete]

Washington Post http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/03/hillarys_balkan_adventures_par.html
has photo/video, obliterates Clinton Bosnia claim
By - March 21, 2008, 1:18PM

Looks like Hillary's sometimes hard to believe foreign policy claims may be finally catching up with her. For instance, on March 17th this year Hillary said of her trip to Bosnia that:

"I remember landing under sniper fire. There was supposed to be some kind of a greeting ceremony at the airport, but instead we just ran with our heads down to get into the vehicles to get to our base."

But now there are several accounts, a photo, and video that all directly contradict this statement. This comes from the Washington Post's "Fact Checker":

Far from running to an airport building with their heads down, Clinton and her party were greeted on the tarmac by smiling U.S. and Bosnian officials. An eight-year-old Moslem girl, Emina Bicakcic, read a poem in English. An Associated Press photograph of the greeting ceremony, above, shows a smiling Clinton bending down to receive a kiss.

Clinton's tale of landing at Tuzla airport "under sniper fire" and then running for cover is simply not credible. Photographs and video of the arrival ceremony, combined with contemporaneous news reports, tell a very different story. Four Pinocchios.

more at:
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/03/washington-post-has-photovideo.php

[faithfulcitizen]

1. This is the funniest lie I've ever heard from Hillary's campaign. Astonishing!

[mythyc]

3. you didn't hear this?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=UMQytRKk4Ig&feature=related

:rofl:

(I promise it's not a ricknroll)

[faithfulcitizen]

5. yes, I just can't believe it! :) "35 years of combat service" LMAO!

[merh]

21. omg - she is paying way to much money for the advice

that is being given to her - that is just the dumbest play on words

[stratomagi]

55. Then I guess you didn't hear the one about her beating Osama

Bin Laden at thumb wrestling.

[mythyc]

2. you should include the image, it makes her harrowing mad dash to cover hit home all the more

:eyes:

[Catherina]

46. That little girl was an Al Qaeda terrorirst holding a knife

Can't you see under HRC's left arm how the little girl's hand is pointed towards Hillary's chest?

[tabasco]

58. Look behind the second guy from the left.

I SEE A SNIPER IN THE TREES!! RUN HILLARY RUN!!

[Coexist]

4. unreal

[Inuca]

25. That's a perfect description n/t

[mythyc]

6. this is my favorite part

"The First Lady's schedule, released on Wednesday and available here, confirms that she arrived in Tuzla at 8.45 a.m. and was greeted by various dignitaries, including Emina Bicakcic, (whose name has mysteriously been redacted from the document.)"

The poor 8 year old girl who read her the poem in that picture there, her name has been redacted from HRC's itinerary for that day?

O Hillary you trickster you!

O8)

[MH1]

8. "8 year old" - that's why it was redacted, I'm sure.

Why name a child when it isn't necessary? Personally I don't see any potential harm to the child by having her name appear, but when it comes to children (who have no say in these matters), I think it's better to err on the safe side.

It's irrelevant to the story anyway.

[PM7nj]

31. The girl would be about 22 now.

[Enrique]

7. that's embarrassing for her

score one for the Obama campaign.

[roguevalley]

30. score one for truth.

[MH1]

9. This makes no sense though. Could Hillary have possibly thought

that the moment wasn't captured on film?

Is this subconscious political suicide, or what?

Or is there any possibility that Hillary was referring to a different event?

This just seems so...dumb.

[ThatBozGuy]

11. 10 years ago this wouldn't have spread far enough or fast to catch up to her falsehoods........

That is why in general she is failing on so many fronts, Triangulation only works in isolation, say one thing to this group.
Triangulate and then say what this group wants to hear even if it contradicts what you said to group one.

Ms Clintons "problem" is all the groups can now and do talk to each other, and crowd sourcing can now debunk a false claim or conflagration with out it being presented by an alternate campaign.

When you count on people not being educated and they educate each other, sometimes at the speed of light, you can never go faster than your own lies carry you.

[MH1]

13. Yes but, wasn't she paying attention in 2004?

"Information at internet speed" had a huge impact on the 2004 race. (Well then in many cases it was DISinformation at internet speed).

I think the biggest lesson Kerry learned - that some of his people have communicated to Obama - is how fast information and disinformation propagate via the internet. It's pretty amazing if the Clintons weren't paying attention enough to realize that too. It also says Mark Penn ought to be behind the counter at McDonalds.

[ThatBozGuy]

14. To be honest they were not interested in Mr Kerry s succes and were to wrapped up in the DLC and DNC

Civil war to pay attention to the presidential race. They and many of their circle were busy laying ground work in the DNC in 2004 based on the old way and it is that ground work they are relying on today, the problem is in 2004-2008 the world of information changed exponentially again and this time it dropped right out from under them.

[MH1]

18. True, but it isn't very smart to ignore the way the marketing world is changing

Politics is all about marketing, after all.

I guess I'm just thinking that this points to them being less bright than they are usually given credit for.

[Drunken Irishman]

35. This is very true.

A big reason why Clinton lost this primary was that she ran a campaign that would have worked...20 years ago. This isn't 1988, it's 2008 and a lot has changed. Obama has adapted his message to fit that. I mean, it wasn't until February of THIS YEAR that Clinton figured out how to use online campaign contributions to better her campaign. Prior to that, most of her fundraising was done the old fashioned way.

But I think this proves how out of touch she really is with the modern political world. It's like she is really still stuck in the 1990s, along with Bill and this reluctance to move into the 21st Century has cost her dearly. Which tells me, if she had been the nominee, the GOP machine -- far more modernized than it was when the Clintons faced it in the 90s -- would've crushed them.

[Elidor]

44. The only reason she lost this primary is her vote for IWR

If she had voted against the war, Obama would never have gotten the traction he has.

Actually, that's too hasty. I still think Obama would have made a good showing, but I don't believe he would've won.

[Drunken Irishman]

52. It's possible, but we would've been sunk in the general.

Because Clinton has run a horrible campaign and if she would've walked to the nomination, those faults within her campaign would've come out sooner or later. I think Clinton's campaign will go down as one of the worst in modern political history, which really is a shame, because I do believe Hillary is a very smart woman and she really didn't deserve the horribly run campaign. I mean, she had everything on her side and still couldn't get it done. Losing to Obama would have been like Clinton losing the 1996 nomination to another candidate -- a major upset.

[Inuca]

24. I agree

Partisanship aside, it's incredibly dumb. And embarrassing. I saw the clip from a week or so ago when she made that statement after I read the WP article, picture included. Hearing her recount the "event" was mind-boggling. As was commented on KO the other night, how could they assume that if the first lady had indeed come under snipper fire, this would not have been mentioned all over the media at the time? Just incredible!

[Recursion]

47. If you tell yourself something long enough, you start to believe it

Never underestimate the power of that.

[C_U_L8R]

10. INDUBITABLY... Commander Hillary McBragg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VPgKs70Uu4

This is the World of Commander McBragg
Your hair will curl in the World of McBragg.
He fights monsters galore
And then asks for still more
Or so says the brag of McBragg.

When on the hill the marines plant a flag
They may be led by Commander McBragg.
With a cannon in hand
He can beat any band
Or so says the brag of McBragg.

Fencing and fighting and round table knighting
And slaying of dragons, too.
Shipping and sailing and great harpoon whaling
There's nothing McBragg can't do.
Hunting and trapping and gold miner mapping
And flying to Timbuktu.
Roping and riding and Indian guiding
Commander McBragg comes through.

This is the World of Commander McBragg
Your head will whirl in the World of McBragg.
He can do anything
In his world he's a king
Or so says the brag of McBragg.

[Bonobo]

12. "Or so went the brag of McBragg!"

"Indubitably!"

[jakem]

26. LOL. is the professor on Hillary's um... creative experience team?

[blogslut]

15. sad sad sad

:(

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

16. Give her a break. She mistook "sniper fire" for "poem from an 8 year old girl."

That could happen to anybody.

[bicentennial_baby]

17. !

:spray:

:rofl:

[wileedog]

23. LOL

:rofl:

[DeschutesRiver]

19. Bold

I heard Clinton herself speaking of ducking the sniper fire, running, and the greeting ceremony being called off due to the danger and gunfire.

There is something wrong with this candidate, something unbalanced about her mental state - and seems to be for her dh the former prez as well. To not tell the truth when the eye of the public is on you and recording your actions, and to do so repeatedly even when you get caught outright? Because this is not the first time for this.

I had no idea that the Clintons had become almost unhinged until these last few months. I saw the puffing of the resume, and figured that happens (though not typically to the degree it was with Clinton). Then when things got tight, there was crying about illusionary sexism. At that point, she should have just bucked up and plugged the developing holes in her character, which is what was at issue. It can be done.

But now she is making up stories wholecloth, that are easily disproven?

[Bonobo]

20. FOUND! Video of Hillary's trip!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VPgKs70Uu4

[meow mix]

22. heh

good one
:hi:

[whatchamacallit]

36. Ha, that about sums it up.

:applause:

[Inuca]

27. Two updates in the article

UPDATE Friday 6:45 p.m.

Lissa Muscatine, who served as Hilary Clinton's chief speechwriter in 1996 and accompanied her on the Bosnia trip, feels that I have failed to provide a full picture of what took place. She gave me her "vivid recollections" of the arrival in Tuzla, which I quote below:

I was on the plane with then First Lady Hillary Clinton for the trip from Germany into Bosnia in 1996. We were put on a C17-- a plane capable of steep ascents and descents -- precisely because we were flying into what was considered a combat zone. We were issued flak jackets for the final leg because of possible sniper fire near Tuzla. As an additional precaution, the First Lady and Chelsea were moved to the armored cockpit for the descent into Tuzla. We were told that a welcoming ceremony on the tarmac might be canceled because of sniper fire in the hills surrounding the air strip. From Tuzla, Hillary flew to two outposts in Bosnia with gunships escorting her helicopter.
UPDATE Saturday 8:45 a.m.

Gen. Nash says that I misquoted him in saying he was unaware of any "security threat" to the First Lady. While he was unaware of any "sniper threat," he now tells me there were a couple of "security concerns" that day, which he found out about after returning to his headquarters after greeting Clinton at the airport. There was a "non-specific report" of a possible truck bomb in the area. The military also had information that "some of the communications associated with the First Lady's visit were being monitored."

"In both cases, we took appropriate security action," said Nash, adding that Clinton's visit was not disrupted.

[Bonobo]

28. Doesn't explain this quote anyway:

"There was supposed to be some kind of a greeting ceremony at the airport, but instead we just ran with our heads down to get into the vehicles to get to our base.""

[Inuca]

43. Of course it does not n/t

[suston96]

29. Selective quotes from the WP to enhance your story? Did you check the updates in the article?

UPDATE Friday 6:45 p.m.

Lissa Muscatine, who served as Hilary Clinton's chief speechwriter in 1996 and accompanied her on the Bosnia trip, feels that I have failed to provide a full picture of what took place. She gave me her "vivid recollections" of the arrival in Tuzla, which I quote below:

I was on the plane with then First Lady Hillary Clinton for the trip from Germany into Bosnia in 1996. We were put on a C17-- a plane capable of steep ascents and descents -- precisely because we were flying into what was considered a combat zone. We were issued flak jackets for the final leg because of possible sniper fire near Tuzla. As an additional precaution, the First Lady and Chelsea were moved to the armored cockpit for the descent into Tuzla. We were told that a welcoming ceremony on the tarmac might be canceled because of sniper fire in the hills surrounding the air strip. From Tuzla, Hillary flew to two outposts in Bosnia with gunships escorting her helicopter.

UPDATE Saturday 8:45 a.m.

Gen. Nash says that I misquoted him in saying he was unaware of any "security threat" to the First Lady. While he was unaware of any "sniper threat," he now tells me there were a couple of "security concerns" that day, which he found out about after returning to his headquarters after greeting Clinton at the airport. There was a "non-specific report" of a possible truck bomb in the area. The military also had information that "some of the communications associated with the First Lady's visit were being monitored."

But by all means, keep posting the bullshit. Typical of the hate on this forum board that will permanently divide the Democrats in November no matter who the nominee is.

[Pryderi]

34. Lissa Muscatine is a big fundraiser for Hillary. I'm sure she speaks the truth.

[suston96]

40. And Gen. Nash? Misquoted? He works for Clinton also? nt

[karynnj]

41. Even these updates to not match HRC's story

Saying that they were told the welcome ceremony MIGHT be canceled, obviously doesn't mean it was - it is clear from the news coverage that the welcome ceremony occurred - neither have the chutzpah to even think of backing the run from sniper fire.

It's as if - hearing the risks, HRC fell asleep and had this vivid dream that she now remembers as fact, forgetting the more mundane reality. She needs to admit that she exaggerated - that there were concerns and she did go to a country at war - but the event described clearly didn't happen. Any parent would call their own kid on making stuff up. Imagine what the Republicans would do with this story.

[Inuca]

51. So these updates say that she

"ran with our heads down" under snipper fire? They don't. Muscatine, even setting aside her allegiances, says that there was "possible sniper fire near Tuzla" and that they "were told that a welcoming ceremony on the tarmac might be canceled". Well.... there was NO snipper fire, and the ceremony was NOT canceled. And the general simply mentions unspecific security concerns.

Updates or no updates, it's in incredibly blatant and shameless LIE.

[tabasco]

59. How many times must I debunk your debunking?

1. The statements by Hillary's speechwriter are ridiculous. The C-17 is the workhorse US transport plane. Hillary was flying on one because that is what flew into Tuzla EVERY DAY.

2. Hillary's statement that she ran from the plane with her head down because she was under sniper fire is a LIE.

3. General Nash said there were "security concerns" but no snipers. Where, exactly, does the First Lady travel that there are NO SECURITY CONCERNS?

4. Hillary's statement that the greeting ceremony was canceled due to snipers is a LIE.

[Pryderi]

32. K&R! David Geffen was right about the Clintons.

[IndianaGreen]

39. It's not that the Clintons lie, but that they do it with such ease.

That's what former Friend-of-Bill Geffen was quoted as saying.

Hillary is beyond lies. She now lives in a fictional world of her own creation, just like Bush.

And her husband Bill is now channeling Joe McCarthy.

[Inuca]

45. But at least I thought

they are SMART liers. THIS is not a smart lie.

[Quixote1818]

33. This is extremely bad for her. This looks terrible! nt

[Quixote1818]

56. Kick

[Pryderi]

37. Rat Patrol. :P

[killbotfactory]

38. Yeah, but the truth doesn't poll test as well.

[cliffordu]

42. I laughed so hard I think I peed a little...

[2rth2pwr]

48. I give her an"A" for dramatic flourish.

[Pisces]

49. Sinbad already embarassed her now this.

[Forkboy]

50. The brazenness of the lie is astonishing.

Did she think no one would find out? If not, she thinks people are stupid, at best. And if so, what the hell does THAT say?

[mythyc]

53. due for a kick

nt

[tabasco]

60. Brazen lying. A trait she shares with Bush.

She knows that she has the corporate media on her side until November.

[mckeown1128]

54. Don't you know..

photography has an Obama bias.

[Umbram]

57. Not surprising. (nt)

[loveangelc]

61. hillary clinton and liar are synonyms