Bigger government: Dean picks up where FDR left off - Dean bashing ahead

[Sean Reynolds]

This was an editorial in the NH Union Leader, attacking Dean on his 'FDR' style plans.

Bigger government: Dean picks up where FDR left off

SPEAKING at Manchester’s city library yesterday, Howard Dean called for a “new social contract” in America and proposed a host of federal initiatives designed to protect Americans from just about every kind of financial insecurity one can think of. And afterwards he had the nerve to say he was not proposing bigger government.
It is time for “a fundamental renegotiation of the rights and responsibilities” of American families, corporations and government, Dean said. He likened his domestic agenda to that of Franklin Roosevelt. A Dean administration, he said, would offer Americans new protections like those Roosevelt offered. They would include federal subsidies for health insurance, child care, college tuition and retirement. Health care, child care, college and retirement security are, he said, “rights.”

Nevermind that a right as our Founding Fathers understood it was something that was granted by God and could never be taken away. And nevermind that to provide each of these new “rights” the federal government would have to take money from one group of Americans and give it to another — therefore setting into law a “right” to someone else’s money, not to mention someone else’s services. (If child care is a right, then no child may be denied entry into a child care center.)

What Howard Dean is proposing is nothing less than a dramatic redefinition of “rights” that would permanently expand the federal government to a size and scope that would dwarf the leviathan Americans already struggle to fund. When he denies he is proposing an era of bigger government, as he did yesterday, don’t you believe him.
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http://www.theunionleader.com/opinion_show.html?article=30403

Now I could be wrong, but wasn't it FDR that helped us get out of a Republican mess? wasn't it FDR that helped build the middle class? Before FDR took office the United States was JUST about to become a two class society, upper and lower. He saved the middle class because of his 'big government' ideology.

What happened under Hoover is happening under Bush. So yes I think it's time we get some FDR type leadership back into the White House.

[ibegurpard]

1. I like FDR

So obviously the comparison is favorable in my opinion.

[Sean Reynolds]

2. It is to me too.

Which makes the article that more odd. It's like the paper is ACTUALLY attacking FDR.

I'm sure if FDR could run for president he'd sweep all 50 states and hammer Bush in the largest landslide in American history.

[slinkerwink]

3. didn't they try to get FDR off the dime and put Reagan on it?

[Sean Reynolds]

5. Yup.....

The right wing can't stand the thought that America's greatest president of the 20th Century is in fact a Democrat.

[Myra]

4. I agree Sean, except that the US was a two class society until FDR

And we are again because the right wing radicals have
rolled back most of FDR's great society programs.
Now they want to erase him from history (and the dime).

I think FDR bashing has become the acceptable (wink nudge)
way of attacking progressives. Sort of like how attacking
affirmative action is the acceptable way of less directly
bashing anyone of color.

Uh, is that a real newspaper you took this from???

[Sean Reynolds]

6. Yes.

It's a daily New Hampshire newspaper.

I kid you not. Go check the website out, it's in their issue today.

[BootinUp]

7. FDR's plan was

a response to the greatest depression in the last couple centuries. Dean can't sell this rhetoric to the majority of Americans right now, and anyone who thinks he can must be inexperienced in politics.

And FDR didn't have to use angry rhetoric to get elected either. What does that tell you?

[stickdog]

9. It tells me that your post is inconsistent.

Is it bad to be like FDR or not like FDR?

[BootinUp]

13. I'll state it more directly for you

If the country goes into a depression, then the majority of the country will favor an FDR like plan. Otherwise I'd get ready for another 4 years of the chimp.

[stickdog]

15. This country is being rapidly Latin American-ized. We're ready for

big changes right now.

Proposals like the ones Dean is floating will give 30 million more Americans a real reason to get their asses out to their voting booths.

Business-as-usual triangulation won't change the President or anything else.

[OrAnarch]

16. If people do not wake up...

and start demanding a renewed and fufilled social contract now, this country will undoubtable hit a depression, which probably wont effect the lives of big business owners too much. Depressions and revolutions DO NOT have to be prerequisites to liberalistic progression! Damn..look at Europe.

[Myra]

10. Well...in all fairness FDR was coming back for his third term

And didn't have to worry about reelection
and did take advantage of the opportunity
to do what he wanted domestically.
I love what he did domestically; the right wing doesn't.

[OrAnarch]

11. huh?

"Dean can't sell this rhetoric to the majority of Americans right now, and anyone who thinks he can must be inexperienced in politics."


Um. Dean is merely laying out a liberlistic doctrine. Can't sell this? In one way or another, ALL non totalitarian states operate within their own relative social structure based on progressive liberalism. The social contract is nothing more than Natural Law manifested into a non-chaotic social structure. This is very simple and basic stuff that has nothing to do with rhetoric. Liberalism is a statement of fact along these terms: it is more cost effecient for the ruling class to cede desired "rights" than it is to wage war. In any case, such becomes true. Only by teaching the lower class of such contracts can you empower them to set up progressive movements to gain more rights. It doesn't take a depression to establish a new social contracts, but rather a large enough demand and a realistic, viable request of the ruling class.


Since the right has been stripping away the progressive social contract that has been laid before us to nothing more than a set of those famous static "god-given" rights, it is time to totally reestablish a new social contract rather than merely act as a buffer which slows down the right.


It is time we stop catering and pandering to the "majority of the Americans right now" in this country (who wanted the war undoubtably); it is time to reach out and teach them, pull them to the left, give them hope, and lay a new groundwork for liberalism in the 21st century. There is little about the concept you can criticize (but feel free to go after his less-than-progressive examples of how to do this).

[BootinUp]

17. This is a nice dream

to teach the lower class and get them active and all. If Dean can get the idiots to the polls in November then he has a chance. But my point is that it takes a lot of pain to get people off their asses. I don't see it happening. What I do see is people active already and listening to Dean are excited, the kind of people that vote in the primaries for instance.

I'm anybody but Bush, hence I have to vote based on who I think has the best chance to beat him.

[stickdog]

19. We're ready to go door to door. We just need a powerful message of

positive change.

Dean is giving it to us.

[OrAnarch]

21. Here a point of mine

I would rather have a candidate try to reach out, get them active, pull them to the left and teach them, than I would have a candiate who panders to the general population. I feel the general population is very right of center at the moment, and to elect a candidate that appeals to such, well, hell, what difference does it make. Maybe Condi would run on the dem ticket?

I think Dean is doign the best job of reaching out and tryign to teach people thus far. There is no way I can fault him for this and gotta give him major props for this speech on the social contract...it is about time I hear this. (perhaps others have mentioned this language before and i missed it)

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. Have yuo looked at Junior's

job creation for this Presidency?

Oh you mean his Negative Job Creation....

Only RW economist argue we are in the midst of a recovery... by the way they made the same argument when Hoover ran for reelection in '32... just like Junior (or is it the other way around) Hoover was predicting sunny days ahead

Oh and I may add... just for kicks LISTEN to some of FDRs speeches on the stump... they were pretty angry as well.

Now I am not saying that I will compare Dean to FDR, quite frankly Kucinish reminds me far more of FDR than Dean, who reminds me of Kennedy, but that is another story.

[stickdog]

8. Government growth is out of control under Bush's credit card gouging.

Shouldn't we GET something out of our tax money for a change?

[windansea]

14. average american works till May

just to pay their taxes...is Deans plan for bigger government and repealing tax cuts a solution for the shrinking middle class?

San Diego has a median home price of $340k and less than 25% earn the $100k per year necessary to qualify for a loan to buy.

Taxes and inflation are killing the middle class...a better solution is a robust economy and efficient regulation and taxation of corporations.

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[windansea]

22. these are facts

that I am sure some of the other democratic candidates running for the nomination would agree with..

you do realize there are a few other guys running don't you?

calling me a freeper is a copout and against the rules

adios

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[windansea]

27. Dean's tax strategy is a sure loser

for the middle class

and several DEMOCRATIC candidates offer alternate tax plans

as long as there is a 1st amendment you have zero chance of shutting me up

[slinkerwink]

31. POOP

[Sugarbleus]

18. Thanks for this post Sean

I am past ready for a new social contract. If Dean is true to his words (and he will have to fight like a junkyard dog in congress etc)..then HE'S MY MAN.
I hope to see a better, fairer, more sensitive society someday; maybe not for myself but certainly for my grandchildren.
Even the playing field. I don't want to "take" money from anyone. I want the taxes that are already collected to be spent more wisely. I can be done.
For starters, take that MasterBush card away from dubya quick!

[patricia92243]

24. FDR was a great Preez - pulled us out of the great depressio

If Gov. Dean is half as good a leader as FDR, we can look for some wonderful days ahead

[sandnsea]

25. Again, it's the wording

Everybody is proposing these kinds of programs in one form or other. Everybody would be hit with "liberal grand plans" to some degree as well. But with Howard, it's the choice of words he uses and the way he chooses to offer programs. He lumped the whole thing into one huge social program instead of sticking to the hierarchy of jobs, education, and health care and putting these programs under those "acceptable" goals. I'm not exactly sure why he chose to go further left in presenting his plans, we'll see if it sells I guess.

[OrAnarch]

28. Its the wording alone perhaps...

...that has changed me almost overnight to deciding to support him! :)


Don't ya get it...this is the "Big Picture". This would finally get me to the booth. Dean may not neccessarily be a progressive at all, but liberalism, in the sense of a social contract, is a dynamic concept in other societies, leaving room for progression always based upon the societal circumstances. This would be the great first step to reconstruct our society, IMO, and move us from the regressive or cyclic status quo to a progressive nation. This would almost keep me from emmigrating.


I agree that everyone is proposing a few social systems (many better than Dean's). But to me, it is the concept that he caught me on, as I highly advocate and support such movement, and I see this school of thought absent from American politics today. This, IMHO, is a major step, which would greatly empower the lower classes and set the course for future generations born into a liberalistic society that admitted it was one (not one which only cedes "rights" that God grants). :)

[sandnsea]

34. It worked so well for Nader

We still live in the U.S. That's why I doubt this kind of presentation will work with the mainstream. But who needs them I guess.

[KaraokeKarlton]

29. He's not explaining his plans to pundits and politicos

He's explaining them to everyday people. He doesn't care if the media labels him as liberal or if Republicans try to use it as if it's something dirty and bad. He's talking about things that really matter to people and presenting them in ways they can understand. The press are going to say whatever they choose to say regardless, so instead of fearing the press he just delivers his message to the people as he always has and let them decide. It works for him, always has. It might not work for other politicians, and this might contribute to the nervousness some feel about Dean. But he has some unique qualities and methods that are very unconventional...and they work well for him. As long as they do, he should stick with them.

Did you catch his townmeeting in NH on CSpan last night? If not, you should try to catch it either online or if it replays if you can. The way he delivers his message to people has a pretty profound impact on people. He's able to make people connect Bush's policies with the things going on that they aren't happy with. He explains things in a way that is impossible not to understand. This really goes a long way with voters who aren't political junkies like many here probably are. Should he get the nomination, this is going to be the trump card he has that will convince people that Bush is the wrong guy to vote for.

[KaraokeKarlton]

26. Dean was really great at that town meeting last night

I'm not sure how many people here got to see it, but he was just phenomenal. I saw at least a couple of grown men wiping tears from their eyes. I know there are a lot of people here who don't like Dean. I'm thinking that most of that dislike comes from them supporting someone else and just being frustrated that Dean has come out of nowhere and hurt their candidate. So, whether you support Dean or not, there is something I'm thinking we can all agree on...he really knows how to frame the issues and deliver them to people in a way that just hits home with them. He's able to lead people to make a clear connection between Bush's policies and the actual harm they do and how people like them are getting screwed from those policies. He's reaching through all the media brainwashing and getting people to see the reality. This is one hell of an important gift to have right now. I also think it's the key to why he's doing so well. THAT is Dean's magic elixir that pulls people in that supporters of others just don't understand. I'm guessing his town meeting will be on www.cspan.org at some point in the near future, and everyone needs to watch this, regardless of who you support. These are the kinds of things every person here can use when talking to people who you're trying to convince to vote for the democrat this time.

[slinkerwink]

30. that's why Dean can win

;-)

[KaraokeKarlton]

32. yep

it is!

[HFishbine]

36. He was friggin fantastic!

Amen and Halail, Halij, Halal ... pass the gravy.

[SadEagle]

33. Looks like a success by Dean in framing the issues...

...really, if they are going to attack Dean by calling him "an another FDR", it's big win for us.

[HFishbine]

35. Big Mistake

Comparing Dean to FDR -- that's bashing? Please sir, may I have another?

[mzmolly]

37. Really with bashing like that, who needs endorsements?

:)