Anyone Else Here "Please Not Gep"?

[DrFunkenstein]

Personally, I would love to have Edwards on the ticket. I think his youth, energy, and charm make a nice compliment to Kerry's gravitas and erudition. Honestly, I don't know much about Vilsack, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

But the thought of Gephardt on the ticket makes me feel all yucky inside. I'm not sure if it was his Rose Garden performance, or the fact that he looks like Skeletor, but I, for one, have my fingers crossed.

[denverbill]

1. I wouldn't mind Gep myself.

He probably had the strongest liberal credentials as far as labor issues of anyone except Kucinich. He'd definitely help the ticket in Missouri and the midwest. He's articulate, intelligent, and can be hard-hitting.

[chimpymustgo]

3. Dull as dishwater. Edwards all the way.

Energy. Passion. Let's fire this thing up!

[Cyrano]

5. It's hard to get people to vote for a guy who doesn't have eyebrows

[denverbill]

19. Yes, we should pick a leader based on his looks.

[Trajan]

2. No ... Im not ...

Gep is a good man ...

Comparing him to a cartoon is somewhat petty, considering what is at stake ...

[apnu]

12. He is a good man... but doesn't help defeating Junior.

I think the Seketor picture is out of place, Gep isn't that bad.

The problem with Gep is, his heart's in the right place but he doesn't have what it takes to get it done. Hell, if Dean couldn't survive the barracuda-fest that was the Dem primary, what are Gep's chances?

He's a lot like the Dems version of Bob Dole. A decent good guy, but doesn't stand a chance against Rove and his demons.

I don't know if Edwards has it either, but my gut says he's the best choice based off the pickin's we've been shown.

Personally, I'd love to see Kerry win (with whoever is the veep) and then pick all the other nominees for cabinet positions. How cool would that be? :)

[Trajan]

14. You put too much stock in a VP is a 'primary' attribute for this election

There are HUGE issues that FAR outweigh the selection of a VP ...

I personally would accept ANY and ALL candidates, though Im not too fond of the McCain option ...

Yet, MY point is: HERE we have a GOOD Democrat with PROVEN liberal bona fides ... and here he gets his ass tied to a mule and dragged down the street so his 'friends' in the Democratic Party can spit on him .....

This derision of such a good man is truly unfortunate ...

WHETHER he is the 'best choice' is subjective ....

WHETHER he is a GOOD democrat is beyond question ...

He is better than this ...

[apnu]

32. I'm not disagreeing with you

I just think that the Democrats should put up the strongest force possible.

I believe that this election is going to be hard fought over, that the envelope for acceptable behavior will be pushed to its furtherest limit, and the amount of dubious legal activities will be tremendously huge.

I'm not knocking Gep out of spite or preference. None of the people I preferred are in the running now, but, if Gep can drag down the coming fight, even in the slightest, then he's not the best man for the job.

As for subjectiveness... isn't that what politics is all about? Politics is perception! Logic has nothing to do with it, reason has nothing to do with it, statics have nothing to do with it, and yes (as born out by 2000), legality has nothing to do with it.

Human beings are irrational creatures, we are things ruled by whim, happen chance, bigotry and greed. This election will be factored by those things, just as all elections have.

If Gep hurts our chances, I don't care if he's a saint, out the door he goes. This close to the election, its law of the jungle time. There will be plenty of time after the election for second guessing, spilled milk, and bruised psyches, believe me.

[incapsulated]

4. We should stop picking on monochrome man

What if he is the pick? Then we will have to spend our time defending the colorless candidate, heh. ;)

But I hope not.
:scared:

[Trajan]

6. As soon as we find a 'perfect set' of candidates ...

We'll call you ..

By then .... The Bushtapo will be ruling the world, and you'll be wondering why you havent eatn in a week, or why they cant remove the shackles from your arms and legs, or if your rags will clash with the newly spilt blood coming from your ears ...

[incapsulated]

13. Gee, overreact much?

I made a litte joke, said we should probably stop picking on him, now I'm not voting for Kerry and will wind up in a prison camp?

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[incapsulated]

17. WTF?

Meant what?

Calling me a liar is really going to far, why do you spend your precious time attacking people on DU?

Get a grip.

[Trajan]

24. Perhaps I went too far ...

And I apologize ...

The notion that 'joking' isnt about truth telling was the source of that comment .... but I went too far in response ...

My apologies ...

But: Ive gotta say: we have bigger fish to fry, and a HUGE task at hand: namely defeating the GOP in the polls next november ... This unfortunate derision of a good Democrat seems 'counter-productive' to that cause, and seems unwarranted given Gephardt's good standing in the party ...

Gep is a good man, and doesnt deserve to be bashed here ... whether he would make a 'great' candidate, or just a strategic choice ...

Again: my apologies ... I overreacted ...

[incapsulated]

28. Accepted

I don't think Gep is the most exciting choice, but as I said, if he is chosen their strategy may be to take Ohio and then the rest of the blue states. Hey, it if works, I have no beef. Winning is the bottom line.

:hi:

[Sagan]

7. I just don't think he brings all that much to the ticket...

Yes, strong labor support and good support among stolid Democrats, but they're going to vote for Kerry anyway.

My personal choice is for Clark with Edwards second. Clark can carry Arkansas, I think and really help with the Southern strategy in general. I just don't see Gep having all that much appeal outside of St. Louis.

[k in IA]

8. Previous threads here seemed to be dominated by that same feeling,

including myself.

[Trajan]

9. What can be said here ? ..

Some complain about DLC influence ...

Yet Gephardt is as 'Democratic' as they come ...

Some complain about leaning to McCain ...

Yet MORE come to bash a good, if kinda boring democratic candidate than who take issue with picking a GOP vp ...

WTF is so wrong with Gephardt that ALL of you feel so inclined to gut him and string him up ? ...

GEEEZ .... WTF do you want ? ... Take Gep out of the picture: and you'll fight about EACH and EVERY remaining possibilty ...

Really ... you guys are hopelessly lost in ego ...

[DrFunkenstein]

21. I Said I'd Keep My Fingers Crossed

It's not like I'm calling him the lord of all evil. Just saying he bears a resemblance... ;-)

If Geppie gets the nod, you'll here nothing but praise for his immaculate labor record, and how his connections will make Kerry's higher CAFE standards go down easier with the auto unions.

[Tosca]

10. Gep as VP

Kiss of death.

[Trajan]

11. Why ? ....

Explain ...

[Tosca]

16. Gep

He's had his time. It's over for him, as far as the national "limelight" is concerned. He's a good man and
a good senator, but Kerry needs someone who conveys a bit
more passion. It's all about freakin' presentation and TV,
unfortunately.

[Democracy Died 2004]

18. Why has no one

Considered my favorite. Gov. Mark Warner?

[Lefty48197]

20. Gephardt all the way

We need Missouri, and he'll deliver. Edwards won't deliver SC or NC.

[DrFunkenstein]

22. A Compelling Argument

If it's going to be a close one, an electoral edge would be nice. But my gut tells me that a Kerry-Edwards ticket would hlep him pull away from Bush.

[DaveSZ]

23. Gep is a good man

He'd kill our chances though.

[Trajan]

25. Im curious ...

HOW many votes, by absolute value or by percentage, would be lost because of a Gephardt candidacy and why ? ...

[Nicholas_J]

31. Actually none..

Only Nixon ever put the facts on the line about a VP choice. A VP cannot help a candidate, only hurt them so your best bet is to chose a candidate who is relatively benign, and one who has no possibility of raising controversy. Someone who has been examined for many years and who has had nothing controversial come up in their record. A few years back a person being vetted for running mate was found to have suffered from depression and havin once taken anti-depressants, and this alone was enough to kill that persons shot at the vice presidency. I think that was Eagleton...

In 1972, the disease had suddenly caused a political storm. That was the year presidential hopeful George McGovern chose Senator Tom Eagleton for his running mate, that is, until it was discovered that Eagleton had suffered from depression.

That was the end of Eagleton’s chance at the vice presidency. But much has changed in the past quarter century. Depression is more widely understood and is finally beginning to come out of the closet. The woman who could be the next first lady, Tipper Gore, is talking openly about her encounter with the disease.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2000/10/09/60II/main239704.shtml

While it is unlikely that something like depression would not cause a candate to be dropped, it is still very likely that such a revelation could have adverse effects on the campaign. facts are that while Gephardt does not appeal to a number of people on DU, this seems to be base on the fact that most people who are selecting other cadidates here are hanging onto those candidates because they are choosing a VP for the same reasons they wouyld choose their cnadidate for the presidency. AS things get closer to the convention, and the nomination becomes more of a real thing, I anticipate that Gephardt will poll even higher than recent polls indicate. A few weeks ago, Gephardt was literally behind all of the other choices. And it is obvious that Kerry may not be seriously considering Edwards or Clark, as the discussions about Mc Cain seem to be quite serious, even though Mc Cain has totally refused. Such an offer indicates one thing for certain. That Kerry is looking for someone with a considerable amount of years in office.The public also seems to be coming around to Gephardt, as the most recent polls have him in second place in the veepstakes, having passsed General Clark.

Recently, it has been suggested that the choice has alrady been made, and is know to only Kerry's closest staff.

The latest poll in the Veepstakes indicate that adding Edwards to the ticket does not change Kerry's lead over a Bush Cheney ticket. IN fact, accoring to that latest VP poll, Kerry does as well against Bush/Cheney with a theoretical Kerry/Gephardt ticket. In the latest poll, only adding Mc Cain to the ticket changes the polling data. A Kerry/ Mc Cain ticket changes the polling greatly, giving the ticket a 14 point lead over Bush/Cheney with Kerry/Mc Cain pulling 53 percent of the vote, Bush/Cheney pullinh 39 percent. The only ticket giving Bush/Cheney a tiny edge would be a Kerry/Vilsack ticket. Yet most of this is the result of name recognition. The latest polls indicate that if Kerry chooses Edwards or Gephardt, Kerry polls the same, indicating that Kerry would not lose a single vote if he selects Gephardt:

None of the potential candidates made much of a difference in a hypothetical matchup against the White House team.

Like the Kerry-Edwards tandem, a Kerry-Gephardt ticket tied Bush-Cheney while pairing Kerry with Vilsack or Clark resulted in a slight lead for Bush-Cheney.

http://www.azdailysun.com/non_sec/nav_includes/story.cfm?storyID=88939

So the answer seemsto be that if Kerry selects Gephardt, he wont lose a single vote.

[CarlWoodward]

26. Gep

I greatly admire Gephardt - I lived in his district in south St. Louis for years and voted for him on numerous occasions. And he would help in the Midwest and with labor.

But that said, overall I fear he wouldn't bring quite enough to the table. Kerry needs a dynamic VP and I think Gephardt, for all his great qualities, isn't the right man right now.

[newyawker99]

45. Hi CarlWoodward!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Crunchy Frog]

27. I feel that Gephardt

would be an exceptionally bad choice too. I think that he's dull, weak, and has the air of a loser, and would be unlikely to win many extra votes, and would probably lose some.

My own major preference is for Clark, but I think that there are many other choices that would be much stronger than Gep.

[Mz Pip]

29. It's hard for me

to muster up much support for a guy who came in 4th in a State he put all his money in,thought he might win and needed to win.

I thionk Gep's moment passed years ago. He's a good guy but just doesn't inspire much.

I'd rather have Edwards or Clark. someone with a bit opf fire in the belly.

MzPip
:dem:

[wjsander]

30. If Bush ends up still being the most personable canidate...

I think I might just end up voting for him. Might as well. Kerry will make one of the dumbest moves if he picks someone as dull as he is. How come everytime Kerry talks, his approval drops? He needs to pick someone who will pump some life into this campaign... not suck the rest of it dry. :eyes:

[DrFunkenstein]

46. That's It - Edwards Is The Only One With More Personality Than Bush

It's beyond sad, but it's true.

[JI7]

33. i would be happy with Gephardt as vp

he isn't my first choice, but he isn't at the bottom of my list either. i would be happy with him as vp. he has a good record on economic issues. and he is a true "regular guy" unlike bush.

[lojasmo]

34. I never thought I'd say this

Among the front runners, I feel that only Clark has anything to offer the ticket. Any other choice among the "front runners" would make me less inclined to vote for kerry (I didn't think it was possible.)

[Scoopie]

36. Amen

None of the other front runners have the FP we need to overcome - for whatever reason - Bush's trouncing of Kerry on this subject (I don't know why it is, it just is).
That is unless Joseph Biden is a front-runner this week. It seems to change every other day.

[lojasmo]

42. Perhaps they're al Boooooring

politicians. That's it for me. Edwards is charasmatic, but has little experience, and comes off like a teen-ager.

[Timefortruth]

35. Much of Kerry's support is that he is ABB.

That might be enough elect him, but people want more.

As of today Chimp is edging back up in the polls. We shouldn't count on one of Chimps scandals electing Kerry. The Plame grand jury could stay out until after the election. Gep doesn't give people who might get out for a reason other than ABB to vote.

It would be nice if there were some excitement on the ticket.

[phillybri]

37. All the unions will be with us, no need for Gephardt...

Get Edwards in there. We need some damn charisma on the ticket!

[Nicholas_J]

50. Not necessarily so.

The unions will not neceesrily give the same degree of support, or the same amount of money of they do not see that a candidate of their own choosing is chosen. Hoff did not meet with Kerry and state that they wanted Gephardt for nothing.


The woring from the Washinton Post was that Kerry was "urged" by Hoffa

Kerry Urged to Put Gephardt on Ticket
Teamsters Leader Says Congressman Would Increase Support From Labor
By Jim VandeHei
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, May 17, 2004; Page A04


LAS VEGAS, May 16 -- Democratic presidential candidate John F. Kerry should tap Rep. Richard A. Gephardt (Mo.) for vice president as a way to maximize union enthusiasm and turnout this fall, James Hoffa Jr., president of the Teamsters, said Sunday.

Hoffa, in town for the International Brotherhood of Teamsters annual conference, told reporters he has lobbied Kerry three or four times to pick Gephardt because of his unwavering support of organized labor's political and policy agenda. The union endorsed Gephardt during the Democratic primaries and threw its support behind Kerry only after Gephardt and other Democrats dropped out of the race.

"I think Dick Gephardt does bring a comfort level with regards to organized labor," Hoffa said in an interview at Bally's Hotel Casino. "He's traveling with John Kerry today, so I think things are coming along."



http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A31699-2004May16.html

And indicated that Kerry would get a lot more from the unions if Gephardt was selected than if anyone else was selected. Even a very small degree less support from any large union, particularly one of the size and power of the Teamsters could easily make the differnce between winning and losing an election with polls as close as the ones for this campaign indicate. Hoffa was letting Kerry know who they wanted, and this was very much a hint to Kerry that his chice could make a big differnce in the support he receives, and that Kerry know that anything but the strongest support all of the large unions could hurt his chances of winning. The fact that the AFL-CIO has spent more money since the they endorsed Kerry than they have spent for any campaign in history and we are still months away from the election may indicate that Kerry may have already made the choice the unions have urged him to make particularly in the last week or so, as the unions have in the last week begun a dor to door campaign for Kerry that is slated to finish by the end of June and which has spent 45 million dollars, mostly in the battleground states, with the largest campaign going on in Michigan.

This is as good an indication that Kerry may have already selected someone, and that the selection is, if not Gephardt, someone who they feel as strongly about ass Gephardt, and given that most of the money was spent in the Midwest, the candidate may be likely to hail from that region.

[depakid]

38. Gephart's a loser

He couldn't handle the right wing when he the congressional leader- his presidential bids never went anywhere- what makes ANYONE think he'd be able to do any better as the VP nominee?

Frankly, it's difficult to imagine a weaker choice, given his track record.

[Capn Sunshine]

39. ABG, baby

Gephardt is the poster boy of simpering scheming backbiting whining liberal wrongness that is bullseyed by the right wing.

He is also the surest way to loss, and if Kerry picks him, my theory that his candidacy is designed to lose like a senate gentleman will be confirmed.

[noonwitch]

40. Kerry needs to pick someone with a pulse-that's not Gephart

I have no problem with Gephart, personally, but the independent voters will think he's boring.

[TexasSissy]

41. Me. But if he'd help us win, then whatever.

I'm voting for Kerry no matter what, so I'm not the one he has to appeal to. It's those darned "undecideds" in the battleground states.

But I just don't think Gephardt would appeal to much of anyone. But hey, I'm not a campaign strategist, so I'll leave the decision up to those guys.

[zulchzulu]

43. Gephardt has Sec. of Labor written all over him...not VP

I doubt that Gephardt will get the nod. If they are doing focus groups on the choice, you can bet Gephardt is near the botom of the list.

[MaineDem]

44. I'd have a hard time getting behind a Kerry/Gephardt ticket

I'd do it, but I can never forgive Gephardt for the Rose Garden stunt. I felt it was a major cave-in and I was very disappointed.

I met him shortly after that stunt at a campaign event for our Congressman. There was a very large anti-war contingent in the background. Under different circumstances, those of us there to support our candidate would have been with the anti-war folks.

[gulliver]

47. Yep, I would not feel good about Gep.

1. Tried twice to get the presidential nod. Soundly trounced both times. This proves he is not very marketable, IMO.

2. Too "Democratic." (Note the quotes before you flame me.) We already have a Democratic icon at the lead of the ticket--Kerry. I want someone at VP who will bring in independants and sane Republicans.

3. One Congressman is enough. One insider is enough. Both of these are negatives. Gephardt brings no balance to the ticket. There is no synergy there.

I want a born leader, intellectually brave, charismatic, highly intelligent VP candidate with great foreign policy credentials.

Gephardt is a good man, but if he is the VP candidate, I will feel let down. BTW, I am from St. Louis.

[BootinUp]

48. You took the phrase right outa my mouth -eom-

[edkohler]

49. Edwards over Gep

I think Edwards would be a better choice because he compliments Kerry's biggest weakness of being too rich to be someone who understands the needs of the less fortunate in our country. Personally, I don't think this generalization holds weight when put against Kerry's voting record and initiatives, but to your average layman voter, Edwards seems to address this to a higher degree.

[Hippo_Tron]

51. Constitution mandates that the Vice President must have eyebrows...

Sorry Dick, you don't qualify.

[JNelson6563]

52. But a debt is a debt!

There is a price to be paid for Iowa friends. This may be it.

Let us hope not.

Julie

[Cheswick2.0]

53. I think I would prefer him to Clark or Edwards

neither one of whom has built up much party bonifides AFAIC.
Edwards served one term in the senate and declined to run again assuming he would get the nomination. We needed him to hold onto that seat. The best thing he could do now is go back to NC and help the democrat running win it. Plus he is too conservative.
Clark may be just as genuine as all his supporters think he is, I just have no way of knowing that and no one else does either.
Obviously I am a Dean fan. However I would be happy if Kerry chose a long time loyal party liberal and/or populist or a woman or a minority or all of the above. I am sick to death of the pre-packaged, slick pretty white boy party politics.

[GreenPartyVoter]

54. Will vote Kerry/Gep if that is what is presented

and I like his pro-Union stance. But that's really all I can say about him that is positive.