What To Expect on Tomorrow's FISA Vote

[berni_mccoy]

Expect many Democratic Senators, Including Obama, to Vote FOR the Amendment to strike immunity from the Bill.

But that Amendment won't pass.

Then expect many more of your "progressive" Democratic Senators, including Obama, to Vote FOR the FISA bill. There will be many more Democrats (including "Progressive" ones) who you can turn your anger to besides Obama. Even some who have been very vocal about this bill.

This is what will happen. Obama will uphold his commitment: that he would support Dodd's amendment to strike Immunity but that the FISA Bill was necessary.

[Maat]

1. You are correct.

I have heard Obama's reasoning for voting for the bill; I do not agree with it.

That does NOT, however, mean that I'm not going to vote for Obama. It just means that we disagree on this one issue.

[vaberella]

2. I believe you're right. Is it going to be on tv so we can watch? ^_^

[Muttocracy]

4. likely to be on C-Span or C-Span 2 (both stream online) - think the vote is 11am? nt

[vaberella]

7. Thanks so much. I'm there.

[NattPang]

3. I think heads are going to explode

just because they can.

[berni_mccoy]

24. Yep, you are correct... heads are popping all over DU.

[midnight]

5. I'm so lucky my wonderful Senator has worked so hard for

our rights. I can't say enough for this mans wisdom in siding with the law. But he is not running for President. He didn't say he would fight it and then say he would support the FISA ammendment. This is why there is great saddness with Obama. Who said the FISA bill was neccessary? I say it is not necessary. In fact it was not neccessary until Fisa law was broken. It was broken before 9-11 by Mr. Bolton.

[merh]

19. If you say the violations occurred before 9/11

the new FISA law does not protect anyone. Pre-9/11 actions are not covered.

[PM7nj]

6. It will pass no matter what Obama does.

Some people can't get their heads around this. He could vote NO and it would still pass. There is plenty of blame to go around. I don't know why all the anger is directed at him.

[gateley]

8. Yes - look at all the Dems in the House that voted to support it. nt

[highplainsdem]

10. If he is our party's leader now, as many say he is, he should stand against it.

He is no longer just another US senator. His opposition would have carried more weight now than it would have before he became the presumptive nominee. The "plenty of blame to go around" rationale doesn't work. Especially with roughly half the Democratic senators willing to oppose the bill, according to Newsday.

[depakid]

12. Why associate one's self with an unpopular bill- and a Congress with single digit approval

in order to give a profoundly unpopular pResident a victory in an election year?

What's he getting in return for the loss of face and respect?

:shrug:

Telecom money?

What's the upside to another round of go along to get along with the DINO's?

He already has the nomination.

[SidneyCarton]

25. Yup, and his stand would go down in history,

I can see it now: Custer, the Light Brigade and the Obama 2008 campaign implosion over FISA.

If he votes against it McCain and his throwbacks will nail him to the wall on it and all we will have for our 8 years of suffering will be another crucified candidate.

Find someone else to be your Messiah.

[highplainsdem]

26. Following your line of reasoning, Obama should back all GOP positions so he won't be "nailed to the

wall" by McCain and his supporters.

[SidneyCarton]

27. There are last stands and there are last stands...

Note I didn't mention the battle of Thermopylae in that list. All of them got killed too in a battle that considered without perspective would be thought of as equally futile. Yet it bled and slowed the Persian advance while allowing the other Greek City States to mobilize, in this sense it was a sacrifice for a purpose.

The current mess is a meaningless sacrifice. The nation is not mobilizing behind FISA (believe it or not there are millions of Americans outside of the Netroots) Now you will likely cry, as all who have come before, that FISA regards the Constitution, and there are no meaningless sacrifices where the Constitution is concerned...

Look around you for a moment: We are operating concentration camps, torturing people. Up until last month Habeas Corpus had been tossed on the ash heap of legal history, giving the government the right to black bag you and drop you to rot in a prison forever without charges or trial. The Constitution, my friend has been suspended. If the branch of government that is charged to execute the law refuses to execute it, the law is merely words on a page, high minded ideals without the force to apply them.

Surely these are impeachable offenses? Of course, but the Legislative branch, most notably the House, in which the power of impeachment is invested, refuses to fulfill its duties, hence the only power to be leveraged against a rampaging executive is left unused. As for the Judiciary, Forget it. We're lucky they decided to restore Habeas Corpus, if Scalia had his way we'd all be in camps.

Your frustration, while totally justified, is misplaced. If you want to save the constitution, call Speaker Pelosi and try to get her to do her job and impeach the President.

[DogPoundPup]

13. And then, McCain: "See there, Obama won't keep America safe" Politics stinks

so you either hold your nose and learn how to play, or learn to accept it so McCainiac doesn't win.

[Justitia]

14. "See, Democrats are soft on terror! Democrats protect terrorists!" - yup, I can already hear it.

Only republicans can keep you safe! If you aren't a terrorist, why do you care?

Lather, rinse, repeat ad nauseum.

[vaberella]

15. also Osama bin Laden might send more videos---God why can't we get this guy?!

With more videos then we have the Repubs saying our national security is threatened and Obama did nothing to stop it.

I know if I was watching MSM and didn't make sure to educate myself on the goings on, I would fall for that one on Obama.

[Breeze54]

17. He ditched Feingold and Dodd and changed his position on this bill.

He was against it before he was for it. :grr:

[blogslut]

9. And let's not forget

IF the Dodd amendment passes and is added to the FISA bill, and FISA passes, Bush said he would veto it.

[highplainsdem]

11. ??? Are you saying that because Bush threatened to veto the bill if the Dodd amendment

passes, that makes it okay for Democratic senators to vote for it without the amendment? Wouldn't that mean that Democrats should never vote for any bill the chimperor might veto?

They are our elected officials and they should stand for our principles.

And I really do NOT think there's a Democratic majority for FISA.

[NattPang]

16. I'm still confused of how this gets rid of

the Patriot Act II.

That seems to be
the bill that gutted
our 4th Amendment rights.

[Breeze54]

18. BUSH COMMITTED A CRIME...DID SURVELIANCE WITHOUT WARRANTS!! THAT's ILLEGAL!!!

:banghead:

[blogslut]

20. I'm saying that will be the result if the Dodd amendment passes

Bush said as much yesterday.

He's vetoed every single piece of meaningful legislation that has been passed by the 110th Congress. Even when he signs new legislation, he attaches some BS signing statement that contorts it to his design.

If you read the H.R. 6304, you'll see that it actually puts a certain amount of approval power back in the hands of the FISA court. It is not the best piece of legislation but it is better than what we had with the Protect America Act.

Personally, I don't think it matters whether or not H.R. 6304 passes with or without the Dodd amendment. President loser will still punk it up with another signing statement.

What matters is voting republicans out of office for the 111th Congress. What matters is having a Democratic President and overwhelming majorities in both the House and the Senate. That way, we can finally pass legislation that is in the best interest of we Americans and our civil liberties.

[berni_mccoy]

21. Obama Just Voted To Strip Immunity

[debbierlus]

22. It is unacceptable. Period.

[berni_mccoy]

23. Vote for McCain then.

[berni_mccoy]

28. Looks like I was right.