July 9, 2008 - The Day America....went right on just the same as it ever has.

[Political Heretic]

The passage of the FISA bill is certainly a shame. The question of who is really to blame, and who should be responsible to do what in response is the one we typically debate here. But the bill, and its passage - which was guaranteed from the moment it was allowed onto the house floor, with our without Obama's vote, is certainly disappointing.

But that's all it is - disappointing. Why does everyone always have to exaggerate things to hysterical extremes? It's as though we can't oppose something unless we pretend it is the biggest issue to ever face America in its entire history. But guess what? It isn't. It's wrong, its bad - but it's not the end of America. It is not the day the country died. It will barely be a footnote when historians write the history of America's decline.

No, I'm not suggesting that makes it "okay." But a little perspective would be nice. For every person posting here, and 99% of all other Americans, the odds overwhelmingly predict that this bad bill will never affect them in any way. So is it a big deal - yes because the principle matters, and because (though this is a slippery slope argument) it is very dangerous to begin to accept erosion of our constitutional protections because it makes more egregious violations more likely....

But at the same time, some responsible, adult sense of perspective and context would really be refreshing. For most of the people who are claiming that it is quite literally the end of life as well know it, their lives are going to go on exactly the same as they always have, with zero tangible impact whatsoever.

[SidneyCarton]

1. We will go on.

These are bad times, but we've seen bad times before, and we will again, we over came them, we will over come this. The melodrama is neither accurate nor helpful.

K&R

[kimmerspixelated]

2. Same as it ever was,

Same as it ever was, same as it ever was.

This is not my beautiful house...this is not my beautiful...

[azmouse]

3. Thanks. Nicely said.

Gee, the way some are carrying on you'd think Tim Russert died again.

[ErinBerin84]

4. Are you sure?

Because Joan Walsh on Hardball just said that BARACK OBAMA HAS SHREDDED THE 4th AMENDMENT!!!!


Don't get me wrong, I'm disappointed and understand the frustration and outrage...but Joan Walsh just bugs. Does she post here?

[NattPang]

6. She was a Hillary Supporter,

so she may be found
at a different website.

[ErinBerin84]

8. yeah, I probably wouldn't have been annoyed if it wasn't coming from her

[JoFerret]

18. Are you totally completely absolutely sure

DU has been properly cleansed?

[TexasObserver]

14. Joan Walsh was even more annoying than usual today.

I can't even look at her, with that Debbie Downer frown and contorted face she's always got.

Pained is the way she looks 99% of the time. She must be a really unhappy person to have her default face be so grimaced. She always looks as if she smells something really foul.

[DevonRex]

5. same as it ever was. yep. nt

[high density]

7. Why is everybody also assuming that Obama will not have

congress reconsider this issue when he becomes president? Everybody is freaking out like these are permanent changes. Laws can be changed.

[Political Heretic]

9. It's unlikely that telecom civil immunity would be able to be "undone"

sort of a cat out of the bag kind of thing. But certainly FISA can be revisted -- it already has been several times, so that proves it. :)

[high density]

11. OK

I guess the problem is that I have a hard time imagining that all of these outraged DUers are so pissed off about civil immunity on its own. For one thing, Obama made it clear he was against it and voted for the Dodd amendment. Were all of these disgruntled people standing in line with their lawyers waiting to sue the telecoms? I'd say no.

[LVjinx]

17. Actually, several hundred cases were pending that have now evaporated

[vaberella]

10. I thought the day America died was when Bush was elected. This election has changed my views

and I don't think this is such a dramatic issue as people make it out. Nothing beats the Patriot Act in my eyes.

[MGKrebs]

12. They don't always get to choose between a good bill and a bad bill.

This was one of those times. They only got to choose between a bad bill and no bill, which was even worse.

They don't even get to choose between standing on principle and abandoning principle. They have to choose between competing principles.

If someone wants to insist on purity of principle, national politics in a democracy is a tough gig to work in.

[OwnedByFerrets]

13. It wont go on the same as it ever was......

IF IT FUCKING HAPPENS TO YOU!!! If you get tapped illegally and rendered with nothing to be done about it, it will matter then wont it. What if it happens to your neighbor? Will it matter then? Just as long as it doesn't happen to YOU, I suppose its OK. :puke: Disgusting.

[Political Heretic]

15. Well maybe when it becomes more than 0.01% of the population I'll get hysterical about it.

[MGKrebs]

16. I'm not sure that illegal wiretaps are the issue here.

I respect the ACLU's intent to challenge the constitutionality of it, but my understanding is that this bill pretty much reverts back to the way it was when the FISA court had to issue a warrant to get the wiretap (except in emergencies) which has been in effect for decades.

The big controversy here is the retroactive immunity.

[Political Heretic]

19. kick.