Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Above Obama’s ‘pay grade’-are conservatives being purposefully obtuse?

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:37 PM
Original message
Above Obama’s ‘pay grade’-are conservatives being purposefully obtuse?
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/16595.html#more-16595

Above Obama’s ‘pay grade’
Posted August 18th, 2008 at 12:40 pm

snip//

Maybe the right is being deliberately coy here, and looking to manufacture another controversy, but I thought it was pretty obvious Obama was referring to God

Over at BeliefNet, Steve Waldman understood the message, but seemed to think Obama’s response was confusing.

{Gary Bauer} hated Obama’s line that determining when life begins is “above my pay grade.” I agree that this was a poorly framed answer. If he was going to make this argument, he should have been more direct and say, “Only God really knows that. But since we have to pick someone to make this choice, I believe the choice should rest not with the legislature or the courts but with the women in consultation with her pastor.” He was too clipped and cryptic.


Maybe. Obama has a bad habit of treating voters like adults, and not talking down to them. He assumes, perhaps incorrectly, that Americans want to be spoken to as if we’re grown-ups. He doesn’t spell things out for us, because he believes his audience is fully capable of understanding what he’s saying.

But given the response, that’s apparently not the case. When dealing with weighty philosophical, scientific, and moral questions such as when an embryo or fetus is a “person,” with “human rights,” Obama suggested God knows more than a policy maker, but went on to talk about abortion policy in a more practical way.

Ann Althouse criticized Obama’s response on Sunday, but took a more measured line today. (emphasis in the original)

{T}hinking about it this morning, I’m pretty sure he meant to refer to God.

“Above my pay grade” is an expression of humility and submission to God: I don’t purport to answer the question that belongs to God. He’s trying to be folksy, coining a phrase akin to “the man upstairs.” When someone says “the man upstairs,” you don’t start railing about how we’re on the top floor, but that’s because we know we’re dealing with a folksy expression. People are too touchy on the subject of abortion to process the less common “above my pay grade” as an expression.

Obama may have thought that, in a church, talking to a pastor, with religion hovering around every question, listeners would understand that he was putting himself beneath God. But I didn’t pick that up last night….


How did all of you perceive this when you heard the line?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. I took it the way it was intended.
But I wasn't looking for nefarious meanings in every word he says, either.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. I also did, and I'm not at all religious. So what's their problem?
This blows my mind that they didn't 'get' it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Maybe they got it, but it serves their purposes to pretend they
didn't.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elkston Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. There was no question in my mind he meant God.
BUT, I agree. He should have just said that instead of using figurative speech like, "above my pay grade".

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
3. That Obama doesn't presume to know exactly when life starts
as there are many debates on the issue....and that God knows, and we only debate the issue based on our personal opinion.

That's how I understood it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. That's exactly how I took it, too. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Thrill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
4. I took as what he meant. That he is not God. Anyone with sense knows thats what he meant
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ContinentalOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
5. I didn't think it referred to god but I guess that's because I never think about god at all.
Doesn't that guy work as a volunteer anyway? I thought heaven was a nonprofit?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SurfingAtWork Donating Member (788 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
8. I also interpreted what he said was in reference to not being god.
However I also knew he was going to get hammered by the media for it, and it would be a sound bite that could bite him in the ass because it could be played over and over out of context. Personally I think it was a poor choice of words given that the media jumps all over stuff like this, and this just gives them ammo they didn't need to have.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lucinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. Yup.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dbonds Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
9. It was obvious he was referring to god.
That is a common statement when people are saying that someone higher than them is making the decision. In this case that someone higher was obviously meant to be god.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OwnedByFerrets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
11. Only an idiot or someone intentionally being obtuse
would misinterpret this line.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Saturday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
13. Obama was perfectly clear in his answer.
They just need to try to make something out of it. That's their MO.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun Nov 03rd 2024, 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC