I'm curious -- just who did set fire to the green dragon?

[RebelOne]

I'm hoping it was not someone from our side.

[snyder]

1. Someone Inside It Smoking A Joint?

[Gin]

2. it was a dragon...they breathe fire....so..it had one hot breath too many.

g

[swag]

3. I was going to ask this in the meeting room, since it occured to me

while I was soaking the the tub this afternoon, that lighting the fire to the green dragon right outside the MSG looked almost ritualistic, like some sort of mythical or magical spell or curse.

It spooked me to associate it with the moment when Gore Vidal's "Kalki" did the Dance of Shiva in Madison Square Garden at the pivotal point in that novel. No Kalki spoilers, now.

Anyway, I'm an atheist and a skeptic, but would very much like to hear of any associations in myth, magic, supernatural belief, whatever, to such a thing as a burning dragon. What would the assocation be?

Now tell me I'm Sunday night loonybins and should fuck off.

Thanks.

[RebelOne]

6. Yes, I am an atheist and a skeptic, so that's why I am

questioning the reason for the burning of the dragon.

[swag]

You make me smile, oh RebelOne.

Atheism and skepticism don't obviate symbolism or ritual. Symbolism and ritual have existed for thousands of years without any god or any supernatural intervention.

[RebelOne]

4. OK, two viable reasons.

All I know is that I was watching the march and all of a sudden the cameras switched to the burning dragon. It happened so quickly and there seemed to be no explanation as to who did it.

[babylon_system]

5. There were RW agent provacateurs at the protest

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1202518/posts

[NYCGirl]

7. Here's a link to the website of the group Greene Dragon.

They're a sort of "political theater" group, so maybe that was part of the act?

http://www.greenedragon.org/

[RebelOne]

8. OK. I think they are the guilty party.

But I wish they hadn't done that, as it just gives the media another reason to point out what left-wing fanatics the Democrats are.

[LiviaOlivia]

9. Per WABC

http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/news/gopcon/wabc_082904_anarchists6pm.html

<snip>

It was nearly hour number four when Sunday's peaceful protest stopped being peaceful. It started with a fire directly in front of Madison Square Garden. An anarchist used smoke bombs hidden in cardboard poles to ignite a paper dragon. When an officer moved in, he was assaulted. Police quickly arrested two suspects less than a block away. Teams of task force officers moved in, and temporally stopped the march by Herald Square. Cops caught up to the suspects and made more arrests there.

<snip>

Nine anarchists have been charged with felony assault. The police officer who was attacked is being treated at St. Vincent's hospital. Another officer suffered minor burns in the hands while making an arrest.

<snip>

[RebelOne]

11. I don't care which side these people were on, but I am

happy that the guilty parties were caught. This was a blight on what was a peaceful protest and you know that this incident will be a field day for the right wing press.

[Warpy]

12. Right, when somebody said they were in black

with black face masks, I suspected they were the trashers, the angry young men who hate everybody.

They've completely missed the point of anarchy.

[AngryAmish]

10. Zell Miller

[demgrrrll]

13. Fox News

.

[seventhson]

14. I was watching when it happened - they were agent-provocateurs

Bushco, Roveco, whatever you want to call them.

It was a setup to disrupt the march and create chaos. But it failed miserably.

I suspect that the theater group was set up by an insider-agent who helped plan the action without anyone in the group knowing it was to happen.

All it would take is ONE agent to have set the thing on fire - but he/she would have had to been inside the group for awhile to be trusted enough to get so close.

Since we KNOW that the anarchist groups were being trailed for weeks - it HAD to have been a setup by the BFEE.

[seventhson]

15. This event COULD have meant death for many. My daughter, 14, was nearby

when this occurred (behind by several blocks, but close enough to have been hurt if the crowd had panicked or the police overreacted.

I think this legal case MUST be watched carefully to see WHO set the thing on fire. I am sure there are many videos of it happening. But the perpetrator HAD to have been an agent of the BFEE, whether knowing or unknowing (a sap set up by the BFEE agent who prompted them into it)

Thanks the Creator there was no one seriously hurt.

Anyone who supports this kind of thing is as bad as the BFEE IMHO.

MANY could have been hurt seriously or even killed.

Starting a fire in a crowd like that is attempted murder as I see it.

[snyder]

16. There Were Arrests

so it will be known who these people are

[seventhson]

19. well - if the real perp didn't get away. But

at least the core group shoulf be known.

But it also sure as hell could have been a diversionsry smoke bomb AND the fire set quickly by someone other than the masked people.

I worked on a legal case involving such an action in DC once.

The photos will tell the story hopefully --- but the CSPAN camera was looking at the "snake dancers" down the block and missed it.

[snyder]

20. Are You Kidding?

Come on, every square inch of the protest route was photographed by surveillance cameras. One thing they won't have trouble doing is scoping out who started the fire.

[seventhson]

25. I would not be 100% sure

there were enough people around that a small incendiary device could have been thrown from nearby or inside the dragon's head where no one could see it.

I was watching it. It could have been done.

BUT you are right that it probably was captured somewhere.

Anyone with photos or video should be looking.

[gardenista]

22. I couldn't agree with you more! nt

[eleny]

18. I agree with you

The tempo of the entire march was very peacful - even playful. Then, all of a sudden, an "anarchist" lobs a smoke bomb. No way. Agents caused the trouble in Chicago in '68 and this one smells. Too bad the cop got burned. But the right wing doesn't care what happens or who gets hurt. So long as they get their way. Pfui!

[gardenista]

23. I'm very sorry to hear a cop got hurt. It makes their measured response

even more impressive.

[gardenista]

21. Plausible. But why was everyone wearing masks?

They were also carrying umbrellas. As soon as I saw the umbrellas, I knew something was going to happen.

[PaDUer]

26. Of course...

they've taken along their bag of tricks to make the peaceful protestors look bad, get arrested, and lock the entire area..Be ready for their next set of tricks..Don't forget, the groups are infiltrated and these pukes have been a "member" of whatever group and getting all the info. THEY are the ones who should be charged w/ criminal offenses!

[Warren DeMontague]

17. That sounds like a line from Lord of the Rings.

Anyway, a quarter of a million people, only one thing on fire-- that's a pretty good track record.

[Ithuilwen]

27. Ha! I can just picture local hobbits getting a little too happy from pints

and pipeweed, and setting fireworks off too close to the local pub!

[Armstead]

24. Did anyone else think they saw them on CSPAN?

A few minutes before the fire, CSpan showed a bunch of people in face masks carrying some big green thing over their heads. I don't know if it was the dragon, but it struck me as odfd when a few minutes the TV showed a green thing burning.

[berry]

28. Yes, I saw them on c-span too.

On Saturday on c-span, they showed a meeting about keeping the protests peaceful--and someone brought up the point that masks were against the law, and would get you arrested. And someone told the story, in fact, of 3 people who had been arrested that day because they had masks in their pockets(--so how did the police know? the story wasn't all that clear). But when I saw the masks, I wondered--why didn't the police stop them? They were walking along the side of the street, not in the middle, and with big black umbrellas. The thing is, there are policemen every few yards along the street, so they must have passed several.

This makes me think that it could have been a set-up. Oh, sure, the police at that particular spot may have been feeling generous and didn't want to disturb the protesters? Maybe. But at that planning meeting, it was made VERY clear that masks are against the LAW (not just a ruling or decision for the duration of the protests). When I heard the discussion, I wondered about *Bush-masks and costumes (like the lion and lamb I saw on c-span on Sunday). But these masks were like the outlaws in TV westerns. Quite odd.

Oh well. I know nothing further. Just thought I'd chip in these thoughts.