Why's Clark So Excited?He's Being Attacked By Dean (Flyer Flap-Slate 1/7)

[KittyWampus]

Note- go to link to see what flyer contained. Same old, tired crap. No big deal, IMO. I purposely left out the flyer contents so you'll have to go to Slate to read it.

Personal Note- Clark's supposed "attacks" are always by suggestion... his comments are about HIMSELF and can only be INDIRECTLY related to other candidates. He depends on the listener making their own inferences.


General Electric
Why is Wesley Clark so excited? He's being attacked by Howard Dean.
By Chris Suellentrop
Posted Wednesday, Jan. 7, 2004, at 3:12 PM PT


PETERBOROUGH, N.H.—The metaphorical moment of my first 24 hours on the Clark trail took place late Tuesday, when a college student handed her résumé to a Clark aide and asked for a job. The objective emblazoned across the top of the page stated that she wanted a position with the Kerry campaign, except the word "Kerry" was scratched out and "Clark" was hand-written below it in ink. If that's not proof of Clark's newfound No. 2 status in New Hampshire, Howard Dean's campaign produced still more evidence when it authorized volunteers to distribute anti-Clark flyers at a Clark town-hall meeting Wednesday here in Peterborough.

snip

Clark strategist Chris Lehane paints this as hypocrisy on Dean's part. After calling on Terry McAuliffe to put a stop to intra-party bickering, the former Vermont governor aims his guns at his fellow Democrats when the tactic serves his interests. Fair enough, but who cares? More important is Clark campaign's sense of pride that it has arrived as a serious Dean rival. No campaign has ever been happier to have a target on its back.

snip

The Clark campaign insists that it was never engaged in any negative campaigning, and it's true that Clark has refrained from explicitly attacking Dean or any of his opponents at the three events I've attended so far. But there's no disputing that a healthy anti-Dean undercurrent runs through Clark's events. "You want to find the candidate you like, and you want to find the candidate who can win," says the man who introduces Clark in Peterborough. President Bush will run for re-election on national security and tax cuts, and Wesley Clark, he says, unlike Dick Gephardt and Howard Dean, can win on both.

Clark himself is even vaguer, but it's clear to whom he is referring when he opens each stump speech with a declaration that the party must rise above its anger in this election. "I'm not running to bash Bush," he says. "I'm running to replace him." The rest of the speech focuses on his patriotism, his faith, and his policies, but I wonder if this is another quiet shot at Dean. During Vietnam, "Every man in America understood that he had a military obligation," so it's no big deal that Clark served his country, Clark insists. (Did Dean understand his obligation?) And then, at a quick press conference after the town hall, a reporter asks Clark to respond directly to the flyers. Sounding more than ever like the man who just attacked him, Clark replies, "I guess that's what professional politicians do."

http://slate.msn.com/id/2093587/

[sandnsea]

1. Professional politicians, rotfl

He is so goddamn smooth. Another beautiful zing by Clark. I love the way he lays them in there.

[BobbyJay]

2. Clark is a true leader

Dean wants to raise taxes and tear down war heroes.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

3. Well, It Sure Looks Like This Story Has Been Confirmed!

"If that's not proof of Clark's newfound No. 2 status in New Hampshire, Howard Dean's campaign produced still more evidence when it authorized volunteers to distribute anti-Clark flyers at a Clark town-hall meeting Wednesday here in Peterborough."

What say you, Dean supporters? Will you now condemn this tactic, as some of you said you would?

DTH

[Padraig18]

Where did the alleged 'authorization' come from?

I'll not denounce it yet; I'm still waiting for proof.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

13. OK, But It's Now Being Reported by CNN, MSNBC and Now Slate

It's starting to add up, but I take your point.

DTH

[Padraig18]

18. they're all whores.

They're all reporting what the others say. if they were any sort of journlists, they'd have a name by now, eh, rather than continuing with 'the Dean campaign'? :)

[maddezmom]

29. yeah like Trippi and NYT about the phone calls

where are the names of the 10 folks?

[bitchkitty]

45. Reported by the media?

My God, it must be true! I'm switching to Clark as soon as I finish my cigarette!

[KittyWampus]

23. What Would You Consider "Proof"?

Dean apparently doesn't even know what his campaign is doing in his name (he said so himself)... So someone in his campaign would have to 'fess up to it. How else is it going to be proved?

Honestly, I'm just curious... :)

[Padraig18]

28. First of all...

... a flyer with the DFA logo on it; "the Dean Campaign" is not official in any way. Secondly, I would like to know the name of a person from the NH Dean campaign office who authorized this.

Not much to ask for, IMO.

[LuminousX]

12. The contents of the flyer weren't 'smears'

I call it a good attack.

I still want to see if it was the Dean campaign (official) or the Dean campaign (supporters), but if all it was was a sheet of Clark quotes... I see no problem. Just like I don't have a problem with the deanfacts.com website Gephardt put up. It is called politics.

[KittyWampus]

26. Then Dean's A Hypocrite For Whining To Terry

Fine, you want to call it an "attack".... then Dean looks like an ass for complaining.

[Hawkeye-X]

37. Debunked! Dean never whined to McAuliffe.

Please provide proof of such quote. I bet you won't find one.

If you can find me such cite, I will donate $50 to Clark. If you can't find one, then you donate $50 to Dean. Fair enough?

[Feanorcurufinwe]

60. This is the NY Times story that started that ruckus, in case you missed it

"If we had strong leadership in the Democratic Party, they would be calling those other candidates and saying, 'Hey look, somebody's going to have to win here,' " The New York Times quoted Dean as saying Sunday during a campaign swing in Iowa.


http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/29/politics/campaigns/29DEAN.html


I'm sure it won't fit your narrowly defined criteria however, lol.

[Hawkeye-X]

68. OK. So you found an article..

SHOW ME WHERE IT SAYS DEAN WHINES TO MCAULIFFE, IF YOU CARE.

BECAUSE THERE ISNT ONE!

STERRRIKKEE 11 BILLION!

[LuminousX]

51. lol.. ok, whatever

[worldgonekrazy]

4. BS, Clark campaign was behind attack ads on Dean

But they didn't even have the integrity to put their name on it.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

6. I Call Complete and Utter Bullshit

Care to provide any evidence or information whatsoever as to what you're talking about?

DTH

[Hawkeye-X]

9. Sure.

Club for Growth. Sound familiar? It was founded by Clark's ex-employer

[jmaier]

17. Hawkeye

That's not proof -- it's not even evidence. That's a very old Rovian trick of smear by association. I'm sure the Stephens Group, or whatever, has many other employees. Perhaps one of them did it and not Clark. Why don't you go see if you can find the real culprit.

This attack is so weak it only becomes more transparent through incessant repetition. It's certianly no anti-Clark :nuke:

[DoveTurnedHawk]

36. You're Replying to HawkeyeX?

I'm very sad about that, and I mean that sincerely.

DTH

[BobbyJay]

39. LOL!

Clark is a conspiracy!!!!!!







www.clark04.com

[bhunt70]

65. yeah add him to ignore like I did.

[Renew Deal]

63. Yeah, OK

Right, the son of someone that Clark used to work for is on the other side and Clark is responsible for the ads? Sure.

[KittyWampus]

8. Whoa Nellie! Might Want To Back That Up With Some Links

Unless you're talking about that attack ad Dean made about himself and then leaked to the press so he could get some sympathy, shore up his base and start another fund raiser... :D

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[maddezmom]

19. what attack ads?

:(

[Renew Deal]

62. E'm, hello

What ads?

[Hawkeye-X]

5. Clark is nothing but..

A wolf in sheeps clothing. Check my threads in this fora here.

[maddezmom]

21. yeah ok

whatever...... :(

[BobbyJay]

40. a true American leader and hero who will lead us into the new century?

yup





www.clark04.com

[Hawkeye-X]

56. He's no leader.

Yes, he was a MILITARY leader, but he aint no civilian leader.

They continue to say clark WHO? around here.

[metisnation]

42. agenda

what in your opinion hawkeye x is clark's agenda?

:dem:

[Hawkeye-X]

57. Fluff.

That's exactly what it is. No proven record to back up his policies. All fluff and no substance.

[maxr4clark]

58. Why don't you try suporting your candidate

rather than tearing down others?

[LuminousX]

7. Interesting quote

Sounding more than ever like (Dean), Clark replies, "I guess that's what professional politicians do."

[Melinda]

10. So where's the lie?

On one side, the flyer reads "WESLEY CLARK: PRO-WAR," followed by a list of the general's much-discussed statements in support of the congressional Iraq war resolution. It's the stuff that gave Clark grief when he entered the race in the fall: He advised Rep. Katrina Swett in October 2002 to vote for the resolution, and he told reporters this past September that "on balance, I probably would have voted for it." On the other side, the flyer reads "WESLEY CLARK: REAL DEMOCRAT?" followed by Clark's much-discussed statements in praise of President Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney, and the Bush Cabinet, plus evidence of his pro-Republican voting record in presidential elections (until 1992).

Are you claiming Clark never said/did any of what "this flyer" asserts?

[killbotfactory]

16. You can't use people's statements of record against them

It's unfair.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

22. I Know I've Seen You Complain About Dean's Past Statements Being Used

Negatively against him. How about some consistency?

I knew this was going to happen, though. First Dean supporters would say it wasn't them. Then when it appears it WAS them, they would say it wasn't an attack, or that there was nothing wrong with it.

Very, very predictable. And sad.

DTH

[killbotfactory]

25. When you act like it was a total smear job of Rovian proportions..

And it turns out to just be a page full of Clark's statements... It's hard to feel sorry for you.

Stop crying wolf.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

27. Negative Campaigning Is Negative Campaigning

Especially when Dean the Hypocrite claimed just the other day how he was running such a positive campaign.

Oh, and btw, I never once claimed it was a "smear job of Rovian proportions" or anything like that, but nice try with the straw man.

DTH

[Clark4VotingRights]

70. I just can't imagine General Clark running to Terry Mcauliffe...

To make Dean stop attacking him!

[KittyWampus]

20. Clark Advised Swett To Support "A" Resolution

Not "The" Resolution, as I understand it.

And the other quote has no context whatsoever... although maybe you didn't read the words on balance
And one definition of an "attack" is taking words out of context.

[blm]

30. and Dean supported a resolution for use of force, too....

.

[Melinda]

50. That's not what the article states the alleged flyer says - you're spinnin

Read it again - "The Resolution", not "A" Resolution".

[KittyWampus]

67. I'm Not Spinning A Damn Thing. Swett Fabricated Her Story

Swett asserted that Clark knew everything in the IWR but reading her quote it's obvious that she, a LIEBERMAN supporter, is fabricating information:

``At that time, frankly, he spoke with great knowledge about Iraq and the upcoming vote,'' she said. ``My impression is that he knew more about it than most of us.''

"MY IMPRESSION" Swett says...

And her quote doesn't specifically say Clark knew alot about the details within the IWR that got passed.

But you go right ahead and take the word coming out of the Lieberman campaign.

[killbotfactory]

14. Every man in America had a military obligation in Nam?

WTF?

Is he defending the Vietnam war?

[KittyWampus]

31. He Is Just Stating Facts

and those with an agenda or chip on their shoulder read what ever they want into his words.

That's the Beauty & Strength of General Wesley Clark

[Rowdyboy]

32. No, its a statement of fact

Not a defense of anything. At that time, every man in America had a military obligation in Viet Nam. That, my friend, is called a statement of fact.

[killbotfactory]

34. I don't believe anybody has obligation to serve in an immoral

and pointless war.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

35. Look, the Fact Is, Most People Back Then FELT Like They Had an Obligation

Stop playing word games about how YOU feel, it's not about that, it's about the prevailing mood in the country at that point in time. The anti-war movement was powerful and wonderful, but it was a very small fraction of the general public.

DTH

[killbotfactory]

41. Sure...

I'd like to See Clark's comments in full to judge for myself.

Do you have a link to his speech this is refering to?

[DoveTurnedHawk]

54. I've Only Got the Same Link You Do, Listed Above

So that's what we've got.

DTH

[hedda_foil]

47. No, DTH, Most people "back then" did NOT feel they had an obligation

to back the filthy war in VietNam. Especially not after 1965. I have no problem with people who did feel it was their duty to volunteer, or to accept the draft (as most draftees did) or to enroll in the service academies. I have no animus for those who served in that terrible war. But I'm of an age with all our candidates, and I remember the times very well indeed.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

52. Whatever

:eyes:

The problem with many far-left liberals is that they think the entire rest of the country believes exactly like they do. It's self-denial, and it's completely out-of-touch with reality, IMO.

Frankly, I wish it was as you say. But I'm discerning enough to know that it wasn't, and honest enough to say so.

DTH, Who Has No Animosity Toward People Who Didn't Serve, But Also Has Great Respect for Those Who Did

[Rowdyboy]

48. WE certainly had a legal responsibility

which required people to make extremely difficult decisions. One could always file a CO and serve in a medical unit, but it was either serve, go to Canada, or go to jail. You may not "believe" it, but thats how the world was then.

[jonnyblitz]

44. wow. n/t

[maddezmom]

15. so is Slate saying...

<<<If that's not proof of Clark's newfound No. 2 status in New Hampshire, Howard Dean's campaign produced still more evidence when it authorized volunteers to distribute anti-Clark flyers at a Clark town-hall meeting Wednesday here in Peterborough.>>>

The Dean campaing knew about the flyers?

[jpgpenn]

24. Great post

Thanks:toast:

[Rowdyboy]

33. Flawless link...thank you so much

Pieces like this reassure me that my instincts were right and this man is going to be the next president.

[Bread and Circus]

38. If this statement is for real, I am really shocked...

"Howard Dean's campaign produced still more evidence when it authorized volunteers to distribute anti-Clark flyers at a Clark town-hall meeting Wednesday here in Peterborough."

-- I find it hard to believe the Dean Campaign authorized those
flyers, it seems so petty and pathetic. I bet it is probably
some interloper trying to run interference, either just an idiot
"volunteer" or some nefarious agent from a third party.

But, if Dean's Campaign did authorize it, WTF were they thinking?

[maddezmom]

43. WTF is right.

no one wants to address this part of the article?

[retyred]

46. You were expecting......

what? we're talking dean here, come on!


retyred in fla
“Good-Night Paul, Wherever You Are”
So I read this book

[Renew Deal]

61. This is more proof that Dean runs it like Bush.

It totally reminds me of what they did to McCain. I wonder if these were some of the surrogates.

[CWebster]

49. There is no question he has Dean in his sights

He was flipping pancakes at some VFW breakfast in New Hampshire (on C-Span), making snide remarks about how the maple syrup better not be from Vermont, someone assured him that it was NH maple syrup.

[Renew Deal]

59. It's called a joke

ha ha

[Feanorcurufinwe]

53. I guess it really happened.

lol

[Renew Deal]

55. This is funny stuff. Dean is such a loser.

Why would Dean approve of something like this? Hypocritical whining baby.

:hurts:

[Clark4VotingRights]

64. General Bullseye! I love it, I friggen love it.

Ah, the downside of ascending.

[knight_of_the_star]

66. Back of the hand!

I think Dean is learning that it is a BAD idea to go after the General. That and the whining that he and his people have made about "unfair bashing" sort of rings hollow in light of what they just did. I don't care of Howie himself ordered it, his people have been big about "Oh you're bashing Howard! How dare you!" yet they have no problem with reciprocating it. What hypocracy. Almost as bad as Bush.

[RandomUser]

69. Hilarious! lol.

I found this statement hilarious.

After calling on Terry McAuliffe to put a stop to intra-party bickering, the former Vermont governor aims his guns at his fellow Democrats when the tactic serves his interests. Fair enough, but who cares? More important is Clark campaign's sense of pride that it has arrived as a serious Dean rival. No campaign has ever been happier to have a target on its back.



Bullseye! :)