Is it possible for Susan Rice as UN Ambassador to have more

[dkf]

clout than Hillary Clinton as SOS?

If Obama decides to do more diplomacy through the UN how would this work?

[rockymountaindem]

1. It just depends on who he wants to listen to more

Clinton will have precedence as the head of the State Department, and can negotiate beyond the scope of the UN. But, if Rice has Obama's ear, that's an important factor.

[Whisp]

2. ooo, he does play chess and not checkers...

I'm comforted.

[dkf]

3. Maybe his message will be: Play nice with the UN or I'll sic Hillary on ya.

[Whisp]

5. I think it's vice versa.

[FrenchieCat]

4. Those serving under Obama will all have the appropriate clout for their positions.....

Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State -- In accordance with the United States Constitution, the Secretary performs such duties as the President requires. These include negotiating with foreign representatives and instructing U.S. embassies or consulates abroad. The Secretary also serves as a principal adviser to the President in the determination of U.S. foreign policy and, in recent decades, has become responsible for overall direction, coordination, and supervision of interdepartmental activities of the U.S. Government overseas, excepting certain military activities.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Secretary_of_State


Susan Rice as Ambassador to the U.N.-- She will be charged with representing the United States on the UN Security Council, as well as being the representative of the United States in all plenary meetings of the General Assembly except in the rare situation in which a superior officer of the United States (such as the U.S. Secretary of State or the President of the United States) is present. Like all United States ambassadors, he/she must be nominated by the President and confirmed by the Senate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Ambassador_to_the_United_Nations

[joshcryer]

6. He won't do much more through the UN than Clinton did.

In other words, the UN will remain as irrelevant as it always has.

[dkf]

8. Maybe that's not what Obama wants.

Susan Rice is his main go to foreign policy advisor. The fact that she is going to be UN Ambassador tells me he is going to put a lot more effort into that part of the equation.

[joshcryer]

13. That's a rather hopeful, if naive, position. Obama isn't going to reduce US power in the UN...

...by ceding to the UN on any matters of significance. There may be gestures, sure, I'll give you that, but as to real matters the US will remain a veto power and will continue subverting the purpose of the UN as a fair governing body.

Anything less than that would be outright unbelievable.

[PBS Poll-435]

7. ...

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Keep grasping straws and casting asparagus.

[dkf]

9. You are right that I will not be resolved to Hillary Clinton running our foreign affairs.

She stands for everything I was fighting against when I supported Obama. I'm kind of feeling like I was sold a bill of goods and it is making me very upset. I hope I didn't buy a pig in a poke.

[PBS Poll-435]

10. But, you didn't.

The smartest people "in the room" are now going to be in charge.

Look at the folks who are in power now. Now look at our President-Elect and the team he has assembled. If you can't see a difference...

[Kalyke]

22. Actually, he's left out a number of smart people.

Disturbing.

[kennetha]

12. Since Obama and Clinton disagree

on almost nothing. How could Clinton stand for "everything you were fighting against?" That makes no sense.

[dkf]

25. War in Iraq...belligerant rhetoric against Iran...

Lack of seriousness in pursuing Al Queda as evidenced by a very late conversion to getting out of Iraq. An umbrella of deterrence in the middle east.

I think Hillary's foreign policy is crazy.

[BzaDem]

32. Do you think John F Kennedy was crazy?

Do you actually denounce the idea of deterrence? Do you really think the only problems in the world are ones that can be solved through a nice talk? I think most Democrats agree that force should be used as a last resort and Diplomacy as a first, but the idea that we can just ignore the concept of deterrence for those enemies who won't negotiate with us is pretty ridiculous.

I mean, that kind of attitude is probably one of the very reasons he went with someone like Clinton and not someone who you would favor. It would seem from your attitude that anyone who you favored would be unqualified by definition.

[Diamonique]

14. Hillary will handle foreign affairs however Obama wants her to.

Not the other way around.

[dkf]

26. The SOS is supposed to be the President's foremost advisor on foreign affairs.

I'd rather her hawkishness not influence Obama at all.

[LostinVA]

16. Since PE Obama and Senator Clinton are THIS CLOSE on most issues

Including foreign policy, how the hell can she "stands for everything I was fighting against when I supported Obama." If that's the case, then you haven't been paying attention to PE Obama's political history and career.

[dkf]

27. She could barely apologize for her vote on the Iraq war.

It was like pulling teeth. I still doubt her sincerety on that issue.

[Beacool]

28. She never apologized for her vote and why should she?

To satisfy the left? She explained why she voted the way she did, but did not apologize for her vote.

[dkf]

29. You know you are right. She said it was a mistake but she

never apologized for it. That is disgusting. She won't apologize when she is responsible for the deaths of thousands of Americans and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis. No wonder I can't stand her. Thank you for reminding me why she is so wrong for this job.

[Beacool]

30. Oh please, quit the drama.

Want to blame someone? Blame Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld. Stop the dramatics, Hillary didn't cause the death of anyone.

:eyes:

[BzaDem]

33. Does this mean you hate Senator Kerry as much as you do Senator Clinton?

If you assumed that Clinton did apologize (before you were reminded otherwise), then how could you support Kerry for anything with a straight face? He voted for the war.

Oh that's right, you really just hate Clinton irrespective of her positions.

[rvablue]

35. .......crickets.............of course...............that's what happens

when you make a rational point to someone on a tedious and irrational rant.

[LostinVA]

15. Seriously, it's absolutely comical now

[Maven]

23. wrong place

[bridgit]

11. I wouldn't think so. She'll be at the table with a rock hard world hearing "No!" in several...

languages sometimes all day long. Bush has fuckered up so much stuff the whole of our diplomatic corp up & down the line will have plenty to do is my guess

[LostinVA]

17. You really need to get your Clintonitis looked at by a professional

I believe it's went beyond clouding your judgement.

[wyldwolf]

18. they are looking for every little angle, aren't they?

[rvablue]

34. Funny! n/t

[Mass]

19. It depends who will have the ear of the president. This remains to be seen once

Obama is president. Also, do not forget that in the past, National Security Advisors have often been more influential than SoS, and that Biden will be a very trusted advisor on these issues, as may be other people that are not directly in the cabinet.

So it is hard to know how this will play.

[vanderBeth]

20. I think it will depend on the role of the UN in the US

As the poster above me mentioned, I was hoping Biden will be a major player for foreign affairs, perhaps the person with the most clout. In the end, I think it will eventually be Obama's policy that will be implemented.

[Stand and Fight]

21. Laughable and pathetic. n/t

[Maven]

24. According to the NYTimes, it's likely that Obama's new diplomat corps. will give Clinton more clout

not less.

[BzaDem]

31. The SOS is the UN Ambassador's boss.

Often, when John Bolton (UN ambassador under Bush) said various things that didn't make sense, other ambassadors would call the SOS to confirm that Bolton represented the US government on particular issues.

So, in a word, No.

You are in the denial stage of grief.

[rvablue]

36. Although I agree with your "diagnosis" of the OP

In all fairness, as I understand it, Obama is going to reelevate the UN Ambassador back to a Cabinet position.....just one other thing that was dismantled by the Bush administration.

[dkf]

37. The UN Ambassador under Bush wasn't a cabinet level position.

Obama is changing that and elevating it back to cabinet level as it was under Bill Clinton. Hillary Clinton isn't Susan Rice's boss.

[Hippo_Tron]

38. UN Ambassador is a lower ranking position than Secretary of State, that being said

Obama's most influential advisor is going to be whomever he lets influence him most. Kissinger as National Security Advisor greatly upstaged Rogers (Nixon's first Secretary of State) and Cyrus Vance had to constantly struggle with Brzezinski for influence over President Carter.

However it is less likely, although not inconceivably, that the UN Ambassador would have the ability to do this like the National Security Advisor would. UN Ambassador is part of the State Department and thus is subservient to the Secretary of State. The National Security "triangle" as it is called generally is the Secretary of State, Secretary of Defense, and National Security Advisor. UN Ambassador gets some influence but not the same degree as the big three.

But again, this is Obama's Administration and he is going to be influenced by whomever he wants. Additionally, I can't remember a Secretary of State that served a two term President all the way through. Susan Rice would likely be Clinton's logical successor in Obama's second term.