Isn't it ironic that by methodically killing the UAW, the "big" 3 have cut their own throats?

[leftofthedial]

If there still were millions of good, secure union middle class jobs in the auto industry, they might have enough influence in DC to get their loans. As it is, though, they killed the power of the unions and now the "democrats" have become a second corporate party. Unions have less than zero influence in DC.

[amborin]

1. you're right,but it's more complicated than that

the unions' early 20th c failure to organze the 'right to work' south has allowed foreign competitors and run a way shops to flee there to non union areas

[leftofthedial]

2. part of the agenda for this latest "crisis" is to kill what little is left of the UAW.

the corporate "democrats" and repukes won't rest until the whole country is "right to work" and subject to the whims of the "free market."

We've been had. Again.

[amborin]

6. exactly, it's a thinly veiled attempt to finally decimate the UAW

[TahitiNut]

25. Bingo. That's precisely the agenda. No doubt about it.

We even see the DU corporatists cooperating. It's disgusting.

[TahitiNut]

27. The "'right to work' south" didn't want to unionize with blacks.

It's that simple. :shrug:

[happychatter]

3. When I'm sitting on the curb, washing down potted meat and crackers with Thunderbird Wine...

I'll ponder the "irony" and laugh maniacally

[leftofthedial]

4. and a warm feeling it will give you too!

the Thunderbird that is.

[mkultra]

5. suprisingly, i foolishly assumed it was the inferior engineering

and the "large car" market approach that tanked them. Never mind the fact that just 2 years ago, the ford CEO said that Americans would always demand large SUVS.

The unions got fucked because mad max hit him on the head to kill master.

[leftofthedial]

7. bad management (for two generations) has certainly dug them a deep hole,

but killing the unions (and the formerly labor-friendly Democratic Party) killed any leverage they might have had now with Congress.

[Sex Pistol]

8. There is enough blame to go around...

The auto workers should have been more loyal to the companies that write their checks.

[leftofthedial]

9. "loyal"?

that's a laugh

an utter crock

and a laugh

[Sex Pistol]

21. I find it curious that you consider loyalty to be laughable.

I imagine that many within the UAW feel the same way that you do. And that is no doubt one of the reasons that they are in this fix.

[Cobalt-60]

12. Rubbish

Ive heard attempts to blame the workers before.
And it all boils down to "gee, if they provided their labor free everything would be great."
I place the entire blame where it belongs: on the management.
They're in charge so its their fault. Period.
Bad judgment and incompetence in the board room created the disaster.
Excessive executive pampering and compensation adds insult to injury.
That arrogant prick at GM told us that we would buy what they wanted to sell.
And now he wants us to bail him out for the results of his own attitude.
The curs now before us with their 1000 dollar hats in their hands worked hard to hand
Washington to more corporate criminals. Those criminals proceeded to beggar the auto companies
customer base, the American Worker.
And there's now way they didn't know thats what the Republicans had in mind.
As far as I'm concerned, they deserve to be hanged like the criminals they are.
So I've got some conditions for loaning borrowed money to their companies.
I want to see every executive fired without further compensation.
I want a condition that the total amount of wealth transfered from the company to any executive is
to be limited to a very generous 10 times what the lowest paid regular or contract employee makes.
That has to be permanently burned in, too. No reversion to the Republican Way next year is acceptable.
The Auto Workers have already made substantial concessions that haven't even taken effect yet.
Thats enough from the workers.

[Sex Pistol]

22. Like I said, there is plenty of blame to go around.

To infer that the "entire blame" belongs to the management is either naive or just plain stupid. Bear in mind that one of the reasons auto makers pushed SUV's was the fact that profits were higher on those vehicles. And when a company's costs are high, their profits must be high too. But the nature of running a business is something that someone with your mind-set will probably never understand.

[MadMaddie]

13. What happened to companies being loyal to those loyal

employees?

There was a day in this country when many companies coveted their long time experienced workers.

Why would employees be loyal to a company and it's CEO's who would not think twice about finding a way to get rid of employees. But the companies and CEO's never suffered, they got their million dollar bonuses and perks while the middle class was destroyed.

You do realize it was the Unions that got Americans 40 hour work weeks and safe environments to work in.

Go to China, Vietnam, Mexico and work then come back and tell us how those workers, working 12-15 hour days and getting paid on the dollar are doing? Tell us how children are put into the labor force and maimed or killed on the job.

The workers and their ingenuity make the companies successful, it is the companies that should be so lucky and grateful.

[Sex Pistol]

23. I'm not anti-union, in fact, I agree with the points you make

regarding working hours and a safe working environment. However, the UAW pushed the pendulum too far. The Job Banks are a perfect example of this. But it is encouraging to see that they are willing to put this item on the negotiating table. Nevertheless, it will be necessary for them to think outside the box if they really want to help save their jobs.

[amborin]

16. what kind of anti-union meme is that????????????

[Sex Pistol]

24. I can tell that you put quite a bit of thought into your comment. But...

it's not anti-union and it's not a meme.

[Libby2]

20. Stupidest post of the day.

[Sex Pistol]

26. Wow, that was an inspiring comment...!!!

And it was delivered in a manner that suggests you have your head firmly planted in the sand.

You need to get your hands on a shovel. Fast!

[Donald Ian Rankin]

10. Only if they'd made it this far without going bust already.

If they hadn't broken the power of the unions, they would probably be in even worse shape financially than they currently are, which would very likely mean they'd already have gone out of business.

Companies don't dislike union power just because they're evil; they dislike it because it means slimmer profit margins.

[leftofthedial]

11. short-sighted

the greatest prosperity of the auto makers (and indeed all American manufacturing) cam ewhen unions were at their strongest.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

14. Causation is not correlation.

Also, remember that the ideal situation for an auto manufacturer is to have unionised customers (so that they can afford to buy more of your products) but an ununionised workforce (so that you don't have to pay them so much) - ideally, you'd like everyone elses workers to have strong unions, but not yours.

[leftofthedial]

15. opposing unions and using nominal reductions in labor costs

was a short-sighted approach. In the time-honored failed tradition of Amurkan capitalism, it showed nice temporary increases in stock price. Boards and stockholders were happy. But, it continually eroded quality, company morale and worker loyalty, which in turn eroded customer loyalty. It also had the ripple effect of ratcheting down incomes for all workers, creating a consumer base that is now longer able to buy a car no matter who makes it, no matter how cheap it is and no matter how green it is.

capitalism has slowly, but inexorably, gutted itself over the last 30 years.

[amborin]

17. i can't believe i'm reading this crap on DU; profit, as in the decimation of the middle class! it's

b/c of their NON UNION foreign competitors that the Big Three are in trouble

[RepublicanElephant]

18. india has the fastest growing middle-class in the world and only about 5% of the country own cars.

u.s. automakers want "in" on that market (as well as china), with very little safety/environmental standards.

so why not kill manufacturing here, set-up shop in india or china, and make cheap cars for asia or any other market with lax standards?

profits before country.
screw america.

[amborin]

19. they're already doing just that; and destroying India (china is already long destroyed)

all the farmland and habitat in India is going to be concreted over for highways

i, personally, am hoping for a massive global depression: only way to stop loss of biodiversity