In my humble opinion, Blagojevich's crime is that he was honest about his dishonesty.

[IsItJustMe]

I will not stereo type and say that all politicians do it. But in reality, for the most part, this is what our politics do. They make deals.

You scratch my back, and I will scratch yours. Tit-for-tat. Quid pro quo. Deal making it seems, is at the very essence of being a politician.

Lobby group A donates huge amounts of money to candidate B, and low-and-behold, guess how candidate B votes when it lobby group's interests comes up for a vote.

Another example would be supporter A spending huge amounts of time, money and resources to make sure candidate B gets elected. And low-and-behold, guess who gets employment opportunities when candidate B gets elected.

The list is endless, and I am sure that you could throw in your own examples. It seems to be a part of human nature to help those who help you. I think this is why our Civil Service was created to begin with, in order to avoid the nepotism that this type of practice promotes.

In my mind at least, it is confusing on where the lines are drawn between the distinction of what is legal and what is not.

This is a sleazy practice, especially when a decision to indulge in this type of behavior is when your sole consideration that this person or group did something for you, and now I must return the favor, without regard to your continuance or the higher purpose of the good for all.

I think that what Blagojevich is accused of doing is bad because because it was about personal gain. But with that being said, I do ironically find some honesty in what he was doing. You donate a million dollars to my campaign and I will make you a Senetor. EXPLICIT!

With other politicians, you would have to read the tea leaves. If I donate a million dollars to this candidate, and when the time comes I will most likely get what I want. IMPLICIT!

[Critters2]

1. Yeah. He was honest about withholding funds from a poor children's

healthcare program while waiting for a kickback. Why would that bother anyone? Let's give him a fucking award!

I suggest a few years in federal prison.

[IsItJustMe]

4. You miss the point of my post. I said it was bad.

[stillcool]

13. I didn't read that...

I read that he wanted a donation from the hospital executive in return for the funding. But what happened? Did the hospital get the funding? I think Blago would be a wonderful example to discuss how our government works, from local through federal. How contracts are given, how funding is granted, how business and government should work, and how it does work. And how, each step along the way the pot gets bigger, and the stakes get higher. Pay to play is a reality, not an anomaly.

[IsItJustMe]

29. Exactly. Just look at the no bid contracts given out during this war. Our entire political system

is drowning in a pool of shit.

[DiverDave]

2. Fuck him, he's a criminal

I hope he gets a looooong stretch.

Oh, and, "they all do it" don't cut it with me.
A crook is a crook and they all deserve jail.

[IsItJustMe]

6. Yes he is, No doubt in my mind. But what I want to know is when does quid pro quo become illegal.

What he did was wrong because it was for personal gain. Would it still be true if he had done this for his constituency rather that for personal gain.

What he did clearly went over the line, but what I want to know is where is that line drawn.

[Peace Patriot]

10. No doubt in your mind? I hope you aren't put on his jury.

Just sayin. What is your conviction that he is guilty based on? News reports, most likely. Who provides you with news reports? The war profiteering corporate 'news' monopolies who shilled for the Iraq War and two Bushwhack stolen elections. You trust them? I don't. You trust the DoJ or any prosecutor these days. I don't. I don't even know if a person who is convicted is actually guilty, there is so much bullshit going on in our so-called justice system.

[whistler162]

12. I believe 1/1/2009 is the date set by

the Illinois legislature and supported by President-Elect Obama. Which is what pushed Blago over the edge.

[IsItJustMe]

18. From my reading, I believe you are correct. The new ethics rules come into effect on that date. I

think Blogo was trying to get all he could before those reforms went into effect.

[truedelphi]

3. Oh thank you.

When doing staff reproting at The Coastal Post, I had people tell me about things that were on the order of the Blago scandal. The problem being, this person knew part A of the puzzle, this person part B, and then no one knew about C, D, and E, but you could see for yourself that F occurred.

And you cannot run with a story like that, unless you get really lucky and call the politician and say, "I have been told that the inner gatekeepers of the Democratic party have hired a woman to party with you, engage in scandalous activities, keep you boozed and coked up, and then since you are so often in this deplorable stte, fail to exercise due diligence over the Elder Care Protective Services here in Marin. In fact, because the woman you are sleeping with is a lover of the woman, 'W,' who semi-heads that agency, you allow for 'W' to confiscate the property of the elderly whose neighbors have turned to the County to oversee the care of the incapacitated elderly." (Not confiscate in the sense of provisonally take care of the elderly's house, land and fortune, but actaully put these properties and real estate into W's name, for the purpose of W's enrichment.)

"Would you care to comment, Mr B?"

ANd of course, do you think I could make that call? Do you think if I did make that call that Mr B would say, "Oh, yes, that is ALL so true. You have found me out. Please run with the story."

[saltpoint]

5. Blagojevich will have his say in a court soon enough.

He is not a criminal until he is proven to be one. He is almost certainly done politically but all the laws that should be applicable and followed remain applicable and will likely be followed.

Politics is a rough-hewn business. There are deals struck and deceits conjured and employed. Lies fly every which way from many lips and feelings get hurt and grudges get held. I don't hear anybody saying that Blagojevich's conduct is the lone sample of misconduct, if that is the verdict of the court, among any and all politicians.

As a point of reference, I would recommend RICHARD III, quite a play by that guy from England. If you want an example of remorseless transgression in the pursuit of political clout, it's hard to beat.

Articles of impeachment were instituted regarding Nixon's conduct. It was no defense at all to say, "Well, all politicians are sneaky and pull levers behind the scenes, why pick on just this one," when the point of being a public servant is to serve the public. Blagojevich allegedly abandoned the public interest in favor of the primacy of his private gain.

I just can't warm up to Blagojevich, nevermind see him as a victim. It appears that he has made many enemies over the long haul and the chickens have come home to roost.

The tapes reveal him to be of the ruthless political model, at least as far as a possible Senate appointment is concerned.

[napi21]

7. There's a big difference between "I'll scratch your back if you scratch

mine" and flat out bribery! THAT'S what Blogo did. One is deal making, the other is personally profiting from that deal and THAT is illegal.

Think about Cunningham (who's now in prison) who did "favors" for his construction buddies by voting for contracts for them, in exchange for 'PERSONAL GAIN OR PROFIT".

The thing that got Blogo into trouble was when he talked about $500,000 up front $$ and $1 million in campaign contributions FOR HIM! That is extortion.

[nemo137]

28. Exactly. He was looking for a fat paycheck when he left office.

Not just handing a favor to some supporters.

[nichomachus]

8. He wasn't honest -- just incredibly arrogant and stupid

No politician with an ounce of sense would demand specific payments himself. That's why God created bag men. They get the word out in very obscure ways that can never be traced to the politician and the payments come in the same way.

Blago didn't do it out of some sense of honesty -- he was just too arrogant to think that it was eventually going to bite him in the ass.

I've known a lot of crooked pols and I've never known one who made his own deals.

[regnaD kciN]

9. His biggest crime was that he was incredibly stupid...

It's one thing to be a corrupt politician, it's another to open up the store for public auction, especially when you're going to have the national media spotlight on you like never before.

It's as dumb as O.J., after being acquitted of murder, writing "If I Did It."

[LaydeeBug]

11. Doesn't he just make your teeth cringe, though? nt

[IsItJustMe]

17. Tell you who really makes my teeth grind, GWB.

[Unsane]

14. I want a "FREE BLAGO" t-shirt.

[book_worm]

15. I'm not convinced he has committed a crime (Until I hear all the evidence) but he should resign

just because the wiretaps do expose a man more interested in enriching himself and f**k the people of Illinois. Hell, he doesn't even want to be governor according to one transcript, so he may as well resign.

[iconicgnom]

16. oh jeez, gag me before I do something awful

I'll just say, Blagojevich's "alledged" crime is pretty fokkan sick.

That isn't the kind of "dealing" a Governor is elected to do. In other words, if there's to be a pay-to-play auction of a Senate seat (a very valuable property, yes?), it should be an open auction, as in "I auctioned it off on eBay!" -- not some kind of insider trade where only preferred candidates get to cross palms.

[bridgit]

19. No doubt crass, in-your-face politics, if politics was what it was...

Cause it played like extortion

[BlooInBloo]

20. IMNSHO, A person's crimes aren't a matter of opinion, they're a matter of law.

[Two Americas]

21. ok

Is that why minority people are much more likely to be stopped, to be arrested if stopped, to be incarcerated if arrested, to be convicted if tried, and to be executed if convicted for the same offenses when compared to white people? Poor people do much worse than wealthy people in the justice system, as well. Something must be at work other than some neutral, benign and consistent force called "the law."

Saying that "it is the law" is just a way to distract us from looking at whom is selectively enforcing the law, and who is being selectively targeted, and who benefits from that.

[BlooInBloo]

22. That might be the most bizarre response I've ever received...

Yah.... I'm trying to distract people from black people being unfairly targeted by cops.


BWAHAHAHAAH!!!!!!!

:rofl:

[Two Americas]

23. you missed the point, apparently

You said "a person's crimes aren't a matter of opinion, they're a matter of law." I cited examples where this is not true. A person's crimes are often a matter of the prejudices and motives of those enforcing the law - a "matter of opinion" in other words.

[BlooInBloo]

24. Hush - I'm busy hanging nooses.

[Two Americas]

25. ?

Weird.

[BlooInBloo]

26. right?

[Two Americas]

27. huh?

...