At the risk of "Talking about Fight Club," this Warren business hasn't been about Obama for days

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

1) Obama decides to honor Rick Warren.
2) Many people say, "That sucks! What the hell is he thinking?"
3) Many other people say, "There's nothing wrong with it. Your outrage is fake and part of your conspiracy to bring down Obama."

At that point the issue has very little to do with Obama. It is about DUers fighting with each other over things said about l'affaire de Warren.

So the "hasn't this gone on long enough" posts miss the point. The Warren threads are 90% reactions to DU posts, not world events, and are mostly quite timely since posts are ongoing.

Which kind of makes sense, since this is a discussion forum, not a wire service.

If you consider attacks on Warren as attacks on Obama by proxy then you are equating Warren and Obama. Not a good place to go. Only a minority of anti-Warren posters would like to see Obama fail. The great majority merely want to see Obama stop legitimizing social poison. If Obama ever says, "My administration is mostly about promoting hostile RW religion in America" then people would turn on Obama, but he hasn't said that. He has said, "I want to play around at the margins of promoting hostile RW religion." And the only thing that will prevent him doing more of that is if the effort costs him more than it is worth. Representative Democracy is an ongoing negotiation, not the periodic election of absolute monarchs.

[KG]

1. i hate paragraphs that start with 'a word to the wise'.

:eyes:

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

3. You know... you're right. Corrected.

[BeFree]

2. Ongoing negotiation?

Now you've just told all those who won't negotiate that they are not being a part of Representative Democracy. And you are spot on.

Thing is, there are way too many here who ARE using this to divide us. Way too many. One is too many, eh?

[Name removed]

4. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[No Elephants]

5. With a nod to the movie Airplane, Obama picked the wrong day to start pandering.

[KittyWampus]

7. You just illustrated the hypocrisy- Obama can reach out to breach the divide but

not when it's inconvenient for MY personal interest group.

[NWHarkness]

8. GLBT is not a "personal interest group"

If the state can withhold basic rights from one group, they can withhold them from anyone. Gay rights=human rights.

[KittyWampus]

6. I haven't heard many people saying "there's nothing wrong with it, Your outrage is fake"

What I HAVE noticed is there is a small numbers of DU'ers who are either stoking the outrage either by mischaracterizing what other DU'ers say or starting multiple threads that fuel the anger.

In my family, we know exactly what buttons to push when we are pissed at each other. You know what? It's inevitable we get angry. And it's okay to express that.

What isn't particularly healthy is when someone gets angry and refuses to progress onto other emotions. It's even more unbalanced when others keep egging the angry person on.

There are DU'ers who log on and INTENTIONALLY keep the outrage going. It probably gives them a sense of power.

[HamdenRice]

9. A lot of it is about a tiny sub-group trying to define as beyond acceptable our own Party's choices

I think that as a strategic move, the Warren invitation is smart, even though I don't agree with Warren on anything.

But for a dedicated group of spammers to tell me and others that if we accept the strategic decision of Obama and the Democrats, that we are bigots and homophobes ourselves -- that's just blatant Orwellian nonsense, and most of us are having none of it no matter what our positions on the underlying issues. As many posts have pointed out, that tiny sub-group's tactics don't seem to even represent a consensus of DU's GLBT community.

[BeFree]

10. ...

Really, they represent nothing but themselves, and in this society of increasing openess they take great advantage to make themselves seem above all others.

They seem to think they are the new elite.

[Jamastiene]

13. Why don't you just come on out and say "Uppity Gays?"

Could you be any more hostile and antagonistic toward the GLBT community? :eyes:

[BeFree]

23. Was Gay in my post?

No. It. Wasn't.

But odd that you read it that way.

The new elite referred to in my post are the ones who think that the world revolves around them: elites.

Whether gay or what the fuck ever, they use our free and open society to stand upon trying to lift themselves above all others.

How could anybody think that some of the most oppressed folks, gays, be elite?

Man this place is getting weird.

[rockymountaindem]

17. WTF???

I'd say they're rightly tired of being pushed around and being treated as expendable by the party that's supposed to stand for the rights of all.

[BeFree]

24. Hey, we're all expendable.

Howard Dean has been expended. I have been time and again. We all have.

Mostly expended by the new elites. And there seems to be a group of them here of all kinds of sexual orientation who think they can just walk all over everybody else to elevate themselves to a lofty perch and look down on the rest of us.

[salin]

20. How ridiculous.

Almost orwellian level of ridiculous.

Somehow I doubt the folks in California who for only a brief moment in time were able to marry their life partners - who just lost that right - and are now facing the threat by lawsuit of having those marriages disolved - really see themselves as "the new elite".

[BeFree]

25. Again with the Gay centric?

what the hell is wrong with you people? Gays as a group are not elite! Geez.

[salin]

27. wtf with the "you people"?

I am straight. But I have the quality of empathy - and the comment that I was responding to per asserting that some gay folks now were acting as if they were the new elite (look back to the post to which I responded) screamed for a response per how ridiculous.

[sniffa]

21. Deleted Message

:eyes:

[BeFree]

26. Smart move

Smarter than the ones above, anyway.

[Kurska]

14. Get out of MY PARTY, homos!

You're just a tiny subgroup, stop getting in the way of our bigoted strategic decisions! God damnit having morals is hard, why can't we just be like republicans and throw our supporters under the bus out of the gate?

[HamdenRice]

15. Obviously, you did not even read my post. You read this guy's post--->

What my post actually said is that there are dedicated spammers here who are trying to define, as beyond the bounds of acceptable political positions, the support of our new, Democratic president-elect Obama, and the Democratic Party. Moreover the people making this language "move" (the tiny sub-group) don't even represent a consensus of DU's GLBT community, according to several threads started by GLBT people.

If you try to equate support of Obama and the Democrats with homophobia, then you are engaging in Orwellian language stupidity.

That's plain dumb. If you try to do that, you lose.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

19. Name someone who has said being a Democrat means you're a homophobe or STFU

[HamdenRice]

22. "or STFU" -- Oh, the irony!!

Coming in a series of threads about who is trying to suppress whom's speech!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Do you read the stuff you write or what?

[ruggerson]

16. coming from a minority yourself

makes your post even more mind boggling.

[HamdenRice]

18. See post 15. Read it slowly and carefully, for comprehension

rather than for outrage addiction.

[Starry Messenger]

11. Thank you Kurt_and_Hunter for the post.

I agree with what you've said here--"The great majority want to see Obama stop legitimizing social poison." There are a few DU-ers who keep making this issue out like it only applies to gay folks.

I will use this opportunity to say again: Prop 8 did not simply outlaw gay marriage...it was written to REMOVE rights from the State Constitution. That should be scary to any American who wants equal protection under the law.

Frankly (and I'm probably going to get my ass handed to me) I don't know why the people who are always stressed out about gun rights aren't up in arms over this rights removal.

There are my pre-coffee thoughts on the subject.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

12. I see that your thread has become a rogue's gallery of bigots

[boppers]

28. You missed the point of Fight Club. eom