Barney Frank is suffering from "POST PARTISAN DEPRESSION"

[polichick]

Speaking with Andrea Mitchell just now, he says that in his opinion Barack overestimates his ability to make right-wingers be nice. Frank's experience with guys like Newt Gingrich and Tom Delay tells him something else.

(This was in response to her question about why he thinks Barack chose Warren.)

[LostinVA]

1. I think Frank hit it right on the nose

Warren is of the same ilk -- he just has a slicker image.

Thanks for posting.

[Dennis Donovan]

9. Agreed. Warren has made it perfectly clear that he is NOT on the fence...

...about same-sex marriage. Why bother with the bigot any longer?:shrug:

[LostinVA]

You can only change the mind of people who want to change

And, Warren doesn't want to change. And why should he? He has a great racket going.

If PE Obama wanted a "cool" Evangelical minister who is a pop culture icon, he should have chosen Jay Bakker. He's pierced, tatted, and ministers to those like him.

[mondo joe]

14. There's no incentive for him to change. He's rewarded for being as he is.

You give the carrot to the horse after it moves - not before.

[Dennis Donovan]

17. If he stopped getting $$$ for his goofy church, that would be an incentive.

Exposing HIM for the bigot he is would help along those lines.

[LittleApple81]

2. Wasn't he great? I was laughing my head off and my husband wanted to know why. When I told him, it

did really not translate as funny as when I heard it from Frank!

[polichick]

8. I was laughing too - he's great with both the words and the delivery!

[MadBadger]

3. Barney's right, unlike Rachel's ridiculous position that Obama is doing it to offend gays.

She thinks Obama is trying to rub it in the face of gays cuz he can.

[alwysdrunk]

31. Did she really say that?

What is her DU username?

[MadBadger]

38. Heard it on her radio show on Friday Night.

[alwysdrunk]

4. Barney Frank is no Barack Obama

How about we wait and see how far he gets.

[WillParkinson]

5. Barney Frank is no Barack Obama...

And I, for one, wouldn't have it any other way.

[LittleApple81]

6. Not everything people say that is critical of Obama is AGAINST Obama. If you do something wrong,

it is good to be made aware of it before you do it again. We still have great hopes for Obama but it is also true that he ain't perfect. If he were, he would not be on earth.

[alwysdrunk]

15. I don't think anyone was being critical

Barney Frank is being pessimistic, based on his own experience. I think Obama has extraordinary political skills, he will get further than Frank has, especially as president. Of course I'm being optimistic.....

[LostinVA]

20. "he will get further than Frank has,"???

[alwysdrunk]

30. He'll get further with the current Repub leadership than Frank did with Newt and Delay

Mainly because he'll be in a better bargaining position, but also because his political skills.

[polichick]

7. Are you alwysdrunk or somethin'?! :)

[LostinVA]

12. OMFG

:rofl:

[alwysdrunk]

18. Heh. Let me buy you one

:toast:

[Teaser]

33. there's nothing better

.

[LostinVA]

11. Thank Jeebus

[Critters2]

13. True enough. Barney Frank really is a fierce advocate for the glbt community.

Barack Obama, not so much.

[tishaLA]

21. Unless you consider transgender people part of the LGBT

because Rep Frank's non-inclusion of transpeople in ENDA is fucked as far as I'm concerned.

[Critters2]

22. I didn't know about this. I'll have to do some googling,

Thanks.

[tishaLA]

24. not to be snarky but

it never ceases to amaze me when people talk about LGBT issues and don't know about the T part. And that Rep Frank, who is the co-chair of the LGBT Equality Caucus, supports a version of ENDA that is non-inclusive of TG people. In other words, Frank's version of LGBT Equality makes some people more equal than others. They really need to take the T off the Caucus' name, at least while Frank co-chairs it.

[Critters2]

26. Transgender issues are my growing edge, I freely admit.

I apologize for not being where I should be on these matters, and for assuming that ENDA included TG people. Thanks for informing me.

By DU standards, you weren't snarky at all! :hi:

[Jim Lane]

32. Your reading should include Barney Frank's own statement of his position

Frank wrote a of his legislative strategy. In sum, he introduced a version of the Employment Non-Discrimination Act that included transgender protection. He encountered unexpected resistance, however. He concluded that, not only would the bill in that form be defeated, but that bringing it to a vote would make it harder to get transgender protection in future years.

Here's an excerpt from his piece:

Even from the standpoint of ultimately including transgender people, it makes far more sense to go forward in a partial way if that is all we can do. Part of the objection to any antidiscrimination legislation is fear of consequences, which fears are always proven to be incorrect. There is a good deal of opposition now to passing even sexual orientation legislation. Enacting legislation to ban discrimination based on sexual orientation and getting a year or two’s experience with it, will be very helpful in our ultimately adding to it protection for people who are transgender. That is, if you always insist on doing all the difficult things in one bite, you will probably never be successful. Dismantling the opposition piecemeal has always worked better.

Whether you agree with him or not, if you read the whole essay you'll see that he's sincerely trying to do what's right in a difficult situation.

[tishaLA]

36. I'm very familiar with his statements on the issue

I also know that the director of the NGLTF has said that Rep Frank has "always" been "squeamish" on trans issues. But you can believe his sincerity, if you like, while TG people are thrown under the LGB bus.

[boppers]

42. Wow, just, wow.

"You may get protection for your personal gender/sex/partner decisions, but only if it's the ones we like".

[boppers]

39. Holy crap, chopping the T off?

Heck, I'm still fighting for adding the Q, (LGBTQ), and Frank's *reducing* the people who should be protected in the caucus?

Really?

Reeaally?

...What?

Got any idea of the logic (?) going on here?

[Jim Lane]

43. Barney Frank has expressed the hope that this year will be different

You ask, "Got any idea of the logic (?) going on here?" Well, yeah, the logic is laid out very well by Frank in of the legislative situation. The choice, given the reluctance of many in the 110th Congress to support protection for transgendered people, was between (1) pass ENDA protecting LGB, and try to come back for T in a later Congress; or (2) force a House vote on ENDA protecting LGBT, lose, and thus get nothing. Frank chose the first option, with the result that, in November 2007, the House for the first time approved some measure of job protection. It did not pass the Senate and would have been vetoed by Bush even if it had. Frank also held hearings on the issues relating to gender identity.

Frank has expressed the hope that a bill inclusive of transgender protection might have a chance in the new Congress. The previous hearings have helped lessen opposition, there are more Democrats in both chambers, and the Bush veto threat will no longer be an issue.

Frank has always wanted to include T along with LGB. His introduction of a more limited bill was only because he thought that a strategy of piecemeal gains was the most likely to succeed.

[mondo joe]

10. Bill Clinton was naive when he took office to, in different ways.

It would be nice if Obama were right and Barney wrong, but it's not a sure thing.

[Froward69]

16. rec #5

off to greatest with ya...

[Renew Deal]

19. Frank might be right. But I think he underestimates Obama's willingness to make deals.

Obama is known to break down barriers.

[WillParkinson]

27. And, apparently...

He does pretty well putting them up between him and the people who helped get him into office. Does he think he's trading up or something?

[glitch]

23. He's not the only one.

Someone should give Obama a book on the political success of the Vichy.

[xchrom]

25. the only way -- the only way -- warren -- or newt and the others

are going to change is if there is real pain associated with their positions.

by their statements -- you can see -- that hasn't happened.

[OwnedByFerrets]

28. One of the smartest things ever expressed in Washington DC

[LaydeeBug]

29. Barney Frank is Suffering for his Audacity to Hope. nt

[yowzayowzayowza]

34. I don't think Obama is doing it to influence Repub...

politicians or Warren directly, rather the open-minded, admittedly few, in their constituency and independents.

[yeswecanandwedid]

35. I'm not that impressed with Barney, from when I have heard him speak during interviews. nt

[bluedawg12]

37. PE Obama would be right

if you exclude free markets, reproductive choice, creationism, unions, stem cell research, gay civil rights and the fact they have been programmed to hate liberal ideals. for three decades.

[ddeclue]

40. Barney's right.. you need to go read Federalist #10...

partisanship is unavoidable in democracy because people have differing interests. Instead of trying to deny it and pretend that we all have to get along, we need to recognize it and work in a system that allows partisan interests to compete but doesn't allow any one interest to grow so powerful as to abuse the rights of other partisan interests as we've had happen in the last 14 years or so.

[AtomicKitten]

41. I don't think his goal is to try and make them be nice.

I think Obama wants to find a handle on them and pull them into his vision of America.

When asked how he would deal with election fraud, Obama said he intended to win big. And damn if he didn't. He reached into every demographic to squeeze out a huge victory.

I believe that's precisely how intends to make some big moves in backing the county out of the ditch. After he puts out the fire, of course.

* edited for English instead