Obama is OUR employee. We have the right to dictate to him. BZZZT.

[cali]

We have the right to speak our minds to him, to tell him what we want his policies to be. We have the right to call him every name in the book. We have the right to demand he be impeached or tried as a war criminal or whatever, but we don't actually have the right to make him do anything.

The simplistic statement that Obama is our employee and the implicit suggestion that because of that he has to do what we want (whoever we is), is nonsense. Yes, he's the employee of the American people. He's an employee with a contract that enables him to make decisions without us, the people. We assented to being governed by him when we voted him into office. We gave him the powers enunciated in the Constitution. And the only way we can revoke his Constitutional authority is to vote him out of office in four years. Should he commit high crimes or misdemeanors (or simply lie about his sex life), he can be impeached. But that's not up to us either, as we should well know, that's up to the House of Representatives.

I am not saying that everything Obama does is fine and dandy. Far from it, I'm explaining that Obama has no affirmative obligation to listen to the people and abide by what they want- let alone to listen to one slice of the people and do what they want.

We have the right to petition our government. That's not the same thing as some made up right to dictate policy.

Pretty basic stuff.

[MadHound]

1. We also have the right to fire him in four years,

If he continues down the path he's going, that could very well happen.

[cali]

2. And if you'd actually read my OP before commenting

you'd recognize that I said that.

And if he continues down the path he's on with the overwhelming approval he's garnered since the election, he'll be re-elected in landslide. Sorry that disppoints you.

[MadHound]

10. Well excuse the hell out of me

Gee, I can't repeat something that the oh-so-great cali said? Really now, why are you getting so bent out of shape?

Oh, yeah, that's right, my bad. I implied that your god is actually human and fallible:eyes:

Hey, keep those rose tinted glasses on, and don't notice those constituencies that Obama is already pissing off, who are already starting to flee the big tent of the Democratic party. I know that reality can be sooo depressing.

[cali]

13. temper, temper, madhound

and sorry but I certainly don't idolize Obama. If I did, I wouldn't have written and posted threads and comments harshly criticizing him. duh.

You wouldn't recognize reality if it it slapped you across the face with a slipper. Yeah, I know it's unlikely that you get the reference, dear.

[pecwae]

15. Really, WTH were you thinking?

[alwysdrunk]

3. Fire him for who? A more "progressive" candidate?

The path he's on? Unless we are still deep in depression Obama glides through in 2012. Because of how and when he was elected this will by far be the most important metric. Unless he royally screws up, there likely be no Republican who can beat him. If you are thinking of a Democratic primary you're dreaming.

[AllentownJake]

5. If he royally screws up

and that is a giant IF The party should use the primary process. We would have been better off in 1980 with Ted Kennedy than Carter.

[MadHound]

7. Democratic primary, no. 2012 generals, certainly a possibility

Obama is starting to piss off important constituencies within the big tent, LGBT, the anti-war folks, the leftists. I can easily see a scenario where these people either go third party or stay home, and we get a Republican instead.

[FrenchieCat]

17. You were pissed before November 4th......

and now appear to be talking for everyone! I'm a "leftist" and anti-war, and I'm not pissed. So speak for yourself, please!

I can easily see a scenario where you will continue to slime Obama for the next four years.....in your hopes of getting a Republican instead!

Plus, Obama's our employee, not our slave.

[firedupdem]

22. That's ridiculous. Anybody pissed off now when not one policy

has been set was pissed off well before the election. How do you justify being pissed off about nothing? Unbelievable.

[HughMoran]

20. He's not even in office yet you tetrahedron!

%^^^^)*&*&!

[Horselover Fat]

32. don't get too excited about your chances to do that

[AllentownJake]

4. I don't think anyone feels they have the right to "dictate policy"

However, without the moveon.org dailykos liberals he wouldn't have made it out of Iowa and that should influence some of his policies.

[cali]

6. sure some people do. I've read post after post saying just that

and what you're saying is a far cry from what I'm talking about in the OP.

[Skidmore]

8. BS. What moved him out of Iowa

was that Hillary pissed Iowans off with her "inevitable" claim. As an Iowan, I can attest to that. People really resented being told that they were too stupid to listen to candidates and choose the message and not the messenger. Iowans are very proud of their political savvy and their ability to sort through the BS.

[cali]

9. Yeah, I think Iowans and Obama's having run a smart campaign there

had a lot more to do with Obama's Iowa win than MoveOn or liberal bloggers.

[AllentownJake]

18. MONEY (EOM)

[Uzybone]

25. The blogoshere has a very high opinion of itself

dumbfucks who sit and post all day somehow think they have more influence than people who hit the streets, knock on doors and sell the message.

[AllentownJake]

26. Yes that who I am

I'm willing to bet I've made more calls and knocked on more doors than anybody on DU but thanks for playing.

Oh btw those moveon.org fucks sent about 20-40 people to our office every weekend during the General Election.

Forgot to add that the calls I made were volunteer recruitment calls...so I actually grew the army.

[Uzybone]

27. glad you were one of the many who got out there

and did things. Since you are not one of those I am referring to then there is no need to take offense. Thanks for all the hard work you did.

MoveOn.org is not the blogosphere, I've been with them since the impeachment. Your statement that dailykos is the reason Obama won Iowa was what irked me. I am pretty sure you don't really mean that.

[Orsino]

11. I'm not seeing much of a distinction.

Speaking our minds, calling him names and demanding impeachment are pretty much the only ways we have of making him do anything, and these are rights.

[WinkyDink]

12. I reject the "government as corporation" analogy. Citizens are not mere consumers who "hire"

their CEO (which is where the analogy breaks down, anyway. Whoever hires their superior, who then becomes their employee?).

Other than that, your point is well-taken.

[cali]

14. I agree. And I made no such analogy. I responded to those

that make the "employee" argument.

[Clio the Leo]

16. If he lies about his sex life, WE will be the LEAST of his concerns...

.... he'd have to answer to HER!!!!



And Barack ain't stupid. ;)

But I know what you mean ..... it's armchair quarterbacking taken to the national level. One thing I've always hated about attending public sporting events is to listen to the men (sorry, I'm gonna be sexist here, deal with it) yell at the quarterback or the coach about all the things they're doing wrong and how whatever THEY think should be done is better.

I look at Bubba with his beer gut and his bag of popcorn and think, "If you know better why aren't you out there?" You wont hear me shouting at the team. I've never played football, cant relate and certainly dont have the ability to play even half as well as they do.

When it comes to Barack, it's the same concept.

[bvar22]

24. No, it's not the same concept.

Sports teams ARE private corporations.
Obama and all the rest of our congress critters ARE employees of "The People".
Each citizen and taxpayer DOES (or should) have a voice, and a responsibility to participate in our government.




"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[Clio the Leo]

30. lol .... ok.....

Yeah, sports teams are private corporations and they only need answer to the team owner.

The opinion of the people sitting in the stands .... the ones who pay the bills .... are of no important.

Sure ... you go right on thinking that. ;)

[Phx_Dem]

19. That's exactly right. n/t

[stillcool]

21. Supposedly..so are our representatives..

the problem is once they're hired they're an unruly bunch, and can do anything they damned well please, while the supposed 'bosses' kick back and watch the show on tv. If people can't even pressure their state government to do the right thing, how do they think they will have an effect on the federal government?

[NYC_SKP]

23. I am sooooo tired of acusations of Obama idolatry.

Aren't you?

As a matter of constructive discussion, these are discussion stoppers.

Calls for unity are STFU threads to some. Same pointless "I can't make my point so I'm going to piss on yours" way to respond.

I'm with you, somehow people seem to think that Obama is more beholden to them than he is to Joe Sixpack (ewww), but he is in fact held to a broader set of responsibilities and to no particular group.

And he has made that crystal clear.

:toast:

Recommended.

[bvar22]

28. You don't understand.

It is NOT about The Person.
I don't care WHO is The President.
It IS about The Policy.

If Dennis Kucinich tried to escalate the War in Afghanistan, I would LOUDLY oppose him, and do everything in my power to stop him.

If Dennis Kucinich chose Warren to be America's Pastor, I would loudly condemn this choice.

*I will NOT join the lemmings just because my guy got elected.

*I will NEVER join with anyone who thinks more war is a good idea.

*I will NEVER join with anyone who thinks increasing Defense Spending or expanding the Military is a good idea.

*I will NEVER join with anyone who believes that channeling taxpayer money into the pockets of the richest CEOs in the country is a good idea. (Wall St Bailout/mandatory For Profit Health Insurance)

I am a tireless advocate for PEACE.
I am a tireless advocate for Civil Rights and Equal Protections for ALL....no exceptions.
I am a tireless advocate for Rule of Law, no exceptions for the Elite Class.
I am a tireless advocate for The Constitution.
I am a tireless advocate for The Poor and the Disenfranchised.
I am a tireless advocate for Working Americans.
I am a tireless opponent of the MIC.
I am a tireless opponent to the concentration of Wealth & Power into fewer hands.
I am a tireless opponent to Corporate/Republican Influence INSIDE the Democratic Party.

I am all those things BEFORE I am a Democrat.
Good Luck with your calls for "Unity", but they are lost on me.


"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[NYC_SKP]

29. We don't disagree on the points you make. Not calling for unity, calling for civility.

But we might disagree on "form" and "tone" and what kinds of comments make for constructive dialogue.

I didn't call for unity, I call for civility.

[JohnnieGordon]

31. Now that's the kind of statement I can wholeheartedly endorse!

Love the signature quote too.

[Two Americas]

33. straw man alert. BZZZT.

Who claims that we "actually have the right to make him do anything?"

No one, that is who.

Oh, wait. You later say that no one has actually said that - you claim that they are implying it.

Ans how did they imply that? By making the statement that our elected officials work for the people, and not the other way around.

The people do have the right to compel public officials to do things, by the way.

"...whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it..."

"The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."

[cali]

35. Not at all. My inspiration for the OP

was the dozens of posts stating the Obama is OUR employee and should do what we want. But you know what's a riot. You say right in your post:

"The people do have the right to compel public officials to do things, by the way."

That's exactly WRONG, dearie. We do not have that right. We have the right to say what we please, to petition, etc. We have no right to compel our elected officials to do anything. We have the right to try and make them do what we (whoever we is) want, but they have no obligation to follow our dictates.

Please educate yourself. This is basic stuff.

And your inane quoting of the 9th Amendment is laughable.

[Two Americas]

36. whatever

Since we don't know what you mean exactly when you say we do not have the right to try and make them do what we want them to, and since we can't ask you because you claim to be quoting other people, it is just about impossible to do anything but exchange insults, as usual.

Are not elections, protests, legal tests, petitions all attempts at compelling officials to do something or other? Do the people not have the right to do those things? You talk about rights as though they were privileges, or permissions, or practical avenues.

Here is a question for you - do government officials have the right to compel people to do what they want them to do?

[davidpdx]

34. Cali, I agree with you

I'm also sick of people calling for his head even before he's sworn in. People have been getting away with repeating the old tired line that those of us support Obama then and now are worshipers. I tell you before the election, they would have been dealt with, but it seem now that a select group of people have taken that line up as their personal battering ram since they have a grudge against Obama.

The circular firing squad on DU is getting older by the minute.