If Obama doesn't get us single payer healthcare, the Republicans will

[leftstreet]

Americans want it.

Healthcare workers want it.

It's one of the dirtiest little secrets in American politics since at least Truman. And it's the last thing Republicans can rebuild their fucked up party on.

[Thrill]

1. Republicans will never do that.

[leftstreet]

5. Nixon wanted it

Christ, Nixon wanted a Guaranteed Minimum Income!

[mrreowwr_kittty]

10. But he fell for the for-profit propaganda in the end.

The taped conversations were revealed in "Sicko".

[leftstreet]

18. Truman, Johnson, Kennedy, Carter, Clinton (sort of)

I don't know if "fell for it" is the right phrase, but they all wanted it and obvious forces prevented it.

[Pirate Smile]

2. Are you kidding?

:eyes:

[firedupdem]

3. I doubt that would ever happen. They wouldn't even promise it. n/t

[TahitiNut]

4. Ohhh....

.... I want some of that wacky weed. :smoke:

[leftstreet]

7. LOL I don't think it's covered under the new insurance plans

The Repubs have nothing left.

Wedge issues are dead.
Militarism is dead.
Boot-strap pulling is dead.

:shrug:

[ProSense]

9. Maybe you should go pitch this to the RNC. n/t

[leftstreet]

15. I'm sure they already know all about it. Bill Kristol certainly does.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122826686559774533.html

Still, conservatives have always dreaded the day that Democrats discover (or rediscover) that there is a happy political synergy between delivering liberal economic reforms and building the liberal movement. The classic statement of this fear is a famous memo that Bill Kristol wrote in 1993, when he had just started out as a political strategist and the Clinton administration was preparing to propose some version of national health care.

"The plan should not be amended; it should be erased," Mr. Kristol advised the GOP. And not merely because Mr. Clinton's scheme was (in Mr. Kristol's view) bad policy, but because "it will revive the reputation of the party that spends and regulates, the Democrats, as the generous protector of middle-class interests."

Historian Rick Perlstein suggests that this memo is "the skeleton key to understanding modern American politics" because it opens up a fundamental conservative anxiety: "If the Democrats succeed in redistributing economic power, we're screwed."

[ProSense]

17. Right because he's a trustworthy figure.

If Americans choose to believe the likes of Bill Kristol, then they get what they get.

[leftstreet]

19. I doubt he's trustworthy, but that has nothing to do with his intelligence

He stated openly that a political party that won single payer would have the loyalty of the working classes.

That's not a moral statement. That's just smart.

[ProSense]

21. Kristol said the U.S. should attack Iran.

His intelligence is called into question. He made a point, has nothing to do with the Republicans delivering single payer.

[leftstreet]

29. Apples oranges

:crazy:

[Crunchy Frog]

6. No, the Republicans won't.

They'll do everything they can to persuade the American people that it is evil and socialistic, and that they would rather die (literally) than have it.

[leftstreet]

8. Actually, the Obama Administration is about to do that

And people like Gupta will be front and center convincing us that single payer is evil and socialistic.

[firedupdem]

11. okay...it looks like the GOP is back in business for you...see ya! n/t

[Crunchy Frog]

12. I'm willing to suspend judgement on Obama

until I see what he actually does. Frankly, I'm not holding out for single payer, but I think that there are other avenues towards making sure most people have basic coverage. Not every country with universal healthcare has it in the form of a single payer system.

[anonymous171]

34. wrong post.

[PurityOfEssence]

13. Just as Nixon opened China and Clinton reformed Welfare, the conservatives will socialize medicine

Here's how it's going to happen: GM (or fill in any major manufacturer) is going to howl bloody murder that they're trying to sell cars in Africa and they're competing against Peugeot, a company that doesn't have to cover huge healthcare costs with the price of its product.

In a global economy, all economies have to start to operate similarly or they can't compete.

Once the profit motive and sheer survival of vast sectors of the economy are seen as in question, even the ideologues will turn on the concept that profit must be the engine of EVERY business.

[anonymous171]

33. You cannot undo the Reagan "revolution" in a year.

Or even ten years. He seriously fucked up the GOP.

[Armstead]

47. They will do it like Mitt Romney did -- Bogus but "universal"

Force people to buy health insurance in the private market. Include a fig-leaf form of coverage for the poor -- but which does not provide for the only-slightlu-better-off working poor or the middle class.

Voila. people are screwed but employers are off the hook and the insurers are happy and we've got "universsal health insurance."

[avaistheone1]

14. Funny, isn't it that rank and file Democrats and Republicans of this country want universal health

care, but the leadership of this country is completely deaf to this. In fact, American explicitly do not want the employer based health care Obama is trying to force upon us.

Where is the CHANGE people?



Oct. 20— Americans express broad, and in some cases growing, discontent with the U.S. health care system, based on its costs, structure and direction alike — fueling cautious support for a government-run, taxpayer-funded universal health system modeled on Medicare.
In an extensive ABCNEWS/Washington Post poll, Americans by a 2-1 margin, 62-32 percent, prefer a universal health insurance program over the current employer-based system

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/living/US/healthcare031020_poll.html

[leftstreet]

16. Thanks for that link. Yes they've wanted it for a long time

But the subject is pretty touchy with Democrats right now.

:-(

[firedupdem]

22. well you just had a GOP president. If the republicans wanted it

why didn't they get it done?

[leftstreet]

24. Cheney and Bush didn't need to revitalize their party. Apres them...

..the party is dead.

Voters repudiated the 'conservative' policies and values of the Republican party. It has to rebuild itself somehow.

[ProSense]

26. So they knew this all along and decided to kill their own party in order to give Obama and

Democrats a significant victory, down to the last weeks of the election labeling Obama's health care plan socialism?

[leftstreet]

28. Hmm...why didn't that desperate 'socialism' label sink Obama?

:shrug:

As for killing their own party, that's been a long time coming. Conservative wedge issues, terror-mongering, military spending, tax cuts for the rich, God, Guns, Gays, etc. It's all over.

[ProSense]

31. Because no one believed it. n/t

[leftstreet]

38. Or, maybe they did n/t

[avaistheone1]

27. Because traditional Republicans sat back and let neocons run their party.

Now that so many of themselves are losing coverage through their employers, or their actual employment they are awakening to the fact that government should have a central role in health care -and that is universal health care like Medicare (not an employer sponsored plan).

[anonymous171]

35. They also let the Religious right run their party, and the free market fanatics.

[Cleita]

20. But if they do it, there will be a string attached that unravels the whole

thing. No thanks. I've had enough of liars bearing gifts that turn out to be social bombs.

[DJ13]

23. Some dont believe you, but I do

For the Republicans it would be an easy matter to flip (flop) on this issue since they could sell it as being good for US companies.

If our Party is smart, we would take that approach before they think of it.

[leftstreet]

25. Thank you. It's been a dirty secret in American politics for a long time

:hi:

[anonymous171]

30. Unless Nixon rises from the grave and becomes president, never going to happen.

You can thank Ronald "The Dangers of Socialized Medicine" Reagan for that.

[leftstreet]

36. I know what you're saying, but Reaganomics has been rejected

The "welfare queens in cadillacs" meme is over.

Younger voters don't even know what that means.

[anonymous171]

39. Have you met a young republican?

They are all free market religionists, even if they are socially liberal (many now are.)

[leftstreet]

41. Actually, those are probably Libertarians

I'm surrounded by people who've self-identified as "Republican" for generations.

They want single payer.

[ProSense]

32. Obama is going to have a strong advocate for his health care plan

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/1/8/13352/37665/23/681369">Howard Dean

[grantcart]

37. 80% of Americans cannot even identify it correctly mistaking it for

universal health insurance.

[leftstreet]

40. It's like porn. We know single payer 'when we see it.'

}(

[grantcart]

43. We do but the average person simply thinks that private insurance needs to be

fixed.

Unfortunately there just isn't exposure to the different systems that are available.

If it was explained carefully I think most Americans would choose the German system that fixes a universal percent for all citizens, non profit providers to administer benefits and allows Doctors and practitioners to remain private.

No government bureacracy, no insurance for profit and broad choice for individuals.


(as I understand it).

[avaistheone1]

42. I think leftstreet is on to something. Who thought the republicans would embrace tree-hugging?

Now the republicans are talking about being stewards of the environment. Also, now the republicans are talking about green jobs and a green future. Why? because that is where the American public is and that is where the money is.

Now the republicans won't be able to envision universal health care making themselves wealthy. BUT, supporting universal health care can keep them in power and make them more powerful if they show some leadership on an issue that they constituency both needs and favors. Republicans are about money and power and the health care issue speaks to their power needs. So I think the Republican could out maneuver the Democrats if the Dems don't do something bold and sensible first like HR 676.

[truedelphi]

44. I hate to say this, but every so often the Republicans get together and do the right thing

It was just as likely for it to be the Republicans who opposed MTBE while holding positions of power in the state legislature in California. The Dems were all bought out or ignorant (on the state level - US senators Boxer and Feinstein were very good on the issue)

[avaistheone1]

45. Suprisingly true.

It doesn't happen often though.

[Vinca]

46. It would be turning the world upside down, but that would

turn things around for them if they demanded single payer, universal healthcare. Needless to say, it's nothing we'll need to worry about in elections any time soon.