If you are under 50 yrs old I doubt you have a real appreciation of

[sjdnb]

the struggle that many faced before you or how much you've inherited/been given as a result of those struggles - not just racial, not just gender based, but also across race/gender -- the basic economic inequity (that the unions tried to fight) that has resulted in the most skilled/productive/qualified, disproportionately, feeding the uber wealthy, corporate/executive parasites who've been allowed, by our gov't, to exploit/use us/them.

[provis99]

1. did you have to walk 3 miles to school everyday in blinding snow too?

[Crunchy Frog]

2. I thought it was ten miles. Uphill both ways.

[BR_Parkway]

28. I actually live in a small village where the kids still walk to school

in the snow. And since we're in the mountains, they do walk up hill both ways - it's hilarious to me that this one will not die out

[itsrobert]

62. My kids walk 3 miles each way through hills and they are in the city

Of course it's San Diego, but the city has deem 3 miles acceptable to walk to school.

[struggle4progress]

105. And barefoot. You forgot barefoot

[JimGinPA]

3. True Story - My Dad Told UsThat Tale & Grandma Called Him Out On It...

She said his school was only 3 blocks away and she drove him if it was even cloudy out.


:rofl:

[ejpoeta]

66. OMG!! that is SOOO funny. hehe

[uppityperson]

6. No, but I got paid almost 1/2 what a guy did at my first several jobs.

Would have had to travel 1500 miles for a legal abortion also.

[roguevalley]

90. I made 95 cents an hour on my first job and I can remember when

school opened with the Lord's Prayer and divorce was illegal. Imagine that. :)

[kickysnana]

32. Get off my lawn!

:sarcasm:

[treestar]

43. Without shoes!

the paper soles had fallen off!

[Harry Monroe]

50. Hey, watch that tone of voice, punk!!

Where's the respect for your elders!!:hippie: :smoke:

[roguevalley]

89. no. I personally lived in a town with a sun down rule. Look that up.

[RebelOne]

113. I had to walk 3 miles in the stifling heat of South Florida in the 1950s.

[murielm99]

4. I agree with you.

It's too bad your post is being hijacked by some little snots.

It is good to have an understanding of history and of what our recent and more distant pioneers did to make our country what it should be.

[devilgrrl]

5. WORD!

:thumbsup:

[uppityperson]

9. It is one of the reasons I continue to fight for choice between legal and back alley abortions.

There are people who just don't know what it was like. Actually, most women of reproductive age growing up in the USA have had the choice.

I cannot speak for racism as I grew up in an almost totally white area of the country, with a parent who was was darker skinned than most. I recently asked parent if had experienced racism growing up or as an adult living where we did and answer was no. It sure influenced we kids though, being not just tolerant of differences of missing the point of noticing often. I was lucky for my parents.

So, yes, it is good to have an understanding of not only how far there is to go, but where we were even 35 or 40 yrs ago.

[murielm99]

22. It is amazing to me how much jeopardy choice is facing.

I can't believe that it is not just accepted that women have the right to plan their families and ask for the morning after pill or abortion on demand.

I have not done much overt fighting for choice lately, but I still give to Planned Parenthood on an annual basis, and I give to Emily's List twice a year. I did attend the March for Women's Lives.

We owe respect to other Americans who came before us, too.

My dad is in his eighties, and he was a committed union man. When I was small, he had older friends who had been part of the union struggles during the twenties and thirties. They used to tell stories to my dad and to me about what it was like. Many of them risked their lives. I appreciate that I got to know some of these men while they were still alive. Their stories about the working conditions and the risks of the early picket lines should have been recorded. How many younger workers realize how tough their forbears had to be just to stand up to management?

This thread is about more than baby boomers.

We have lost some good DUers lately because the tone here has been so poisonous. Is this how we have to behave when we just won an historic election?

[ima_sinnic]

27. right! little know-it-alls who think their pampered, privileged existence is owed to them

and was not gotten without a lot of sacrifice and suffering.

Little shits who never witnessed people being tortured with high-pressure water hoses for having the courage to demand their basic constiutional rights, shot dead on a college campus for lawfully protesting an illegal war, having their head beat in by police "guarding" the Pentagon against outraged antiwar protestors.

Little dumbasses who have never felt hungry or had to squeeze in with 10 other people into a two-room apartment or picked lettuce for hours in the hot sun for a few cents, whose idea of "life" is hanging out in malls with their pants around their knees looking and sounding like lazy, rude little twits.

[murielm99]

102. I hope you forgot the sarcasm icon, because that is not

what I meant at all.

I did say that this thread is not about boomers. Nor is it about Gen Xers or Millennials.

We all have a responsibility to educate the generations that come after us. We need to let them know what we went through, what our parents sacrificed, what our grandparents gave to make this country more like what it should be. We need to give them our sense of history and we need to acknowledge and respect their current and coming struggles. They face a load of student loan debt and a future that offers less material comfort than we had. They will be stuck with our debt.

I have tried to convey some history to my grown children. I was glad that I was able to learn about the union movement from old, now dead rank-and-file union members. I was fortunate to have parents and grandparents who could tell me about the Depression from their point of view without being preachy.

I don't care who hangs out in the malls with their pants around their knees. Let the kids have their styles and their social lives. Soon enough, they may have to pull up their pants and face a limited future. We owe them some sense of where we have been, so they can face where they may be going.

My children were raised to be citizens first and consumers second. One of my children is running for office. I don't have any disrespect for the generation I raised or the one coming up behind them.

[silverojo]

7. Horseshit

Do you think we Gen X'ers were so stupid, that we couldn't see what our parents were going through? Or that we had no clue of what our grandparents had gone through? There were members of my family who didn't have the right to vote when they were younger, because they were women.

I was around when my aunt knew people who pretended not to be racists...but when a black family tried to buy a home in their neighborhood, they pooled money together and bought the house before the black people could. (And my aunt read them the riot act about their vile hypocrisy, though at the time, there was nothing she could do about it.)

I grew up playing the records by black artists, which my mother and aunt had obtained by taking risky walks into the "colored part" of Omaha, to visit their local record stores. (And let me tell you, in those days, it was DAMNED risky for two young white girls to venture into that territory, given the racial tensions that Omaha was noted for back then.)

BECAUSE of the bra-burning 1970's when I was a girl, I'm the feminist that I am today.

I suppose you mean well, but please don't tell us Gen X'ers or millennials what we understand and/or appreciate about struggles in America. That'd be tantamount to us telling you that you don't know what it's like dealing with AIDS, just because your generation was grown before HIV/AIDS became a problem.

America's struggles affect all living generations. If there are younger people who don't grasp this, it's not the fault of the young people themselves, it's the fault of their parents for not educating them.

[Radical Activist]

8. yeah! what she said!

[uppityperson]

10. I have talked with young women who do not have a clue what it was like.

I will not type cast any age saying all are like that, but have run into enough 20-40 yr olds (more in the younger ages) who do not have a clue what it was like to not be able to get birth control pills or a diaphram and have some control over when you would get pregnant. I know women who look at me blankly when I talk about being able to put off having children until they are 30, who take it for granted that they can do this.

No, all gen whatevers aren't "so stupid" but there are enough who do not understand.

As far as HIV/AIDS, just because we are "grown" doesn't mean it isn't an issue for us. It is not just a young adult disease by far.

I am glad that you, like many here, can see not only how far there is to go, but how far there could be to fall back. I really appreciate people learning and trying to understand since there are assumptions we all make that we don't even know we are making. All of us do this.

[Radical Activist]

77. Whose fault is that?

History isn't magically ingrained in the minds of the young.

And while your point is valid, there's also a problem with people who keep in the mindset of yesterday's battles instead of operating in the political world as it exists today. It's a major problem.

[JimGinPA]

11. On The Other Hand...

I don't feel the need to share many of the things I've gone through in my life with my children in much the same way my great-uncles refused to talk about their experiences during World War II.

[Rebubula]

29. Geez

Lighten up, Francis.

Obviously you are wiser than most.

Still...you have no idea what it was like...you can only read and empathize. That is not a slight on you...just the facts.

[Maine-ah]

33. thankyou.

:applause:

I'm wondering if the OP remembers the fact that our PE Obama is under 50. I wonder if the OP remembers that it was us that put him into office.

[Dawgs]

34. Hells yeah!

You go girl!

[Mad_Dem_X]

82. Thank you!

I'm 42 and I understand very well!

[jumptheshadow]

104. A little history?

My generation was grown before HIV and AIDS was a problem? Get a history book. I am over 50. I knew many of the first gay men who contracted AIDS, even before it had a name. Many of them vacationed at the Pines and danced at the Saint. There was a series of rumors about people getting sick. A dark fear gripped the community as one, by one, men were stricken. One of my friends, who was about 23 at the time, died with what would later become known as the dementia form of AIDS. They couldn't diagnose it because it was so new. There were always funerals; everybody read the obituary pages to see which acquaintance was gone. The epidemic led many people of my generation to activism and community service.

I have a friend who teaches history in high school. She is shocked by the ignorance of her students about many of the basic facts of history. That's one of the legacies of No Child Left Behind and a nation that has relegated education to the back burner. And, yes, I do believe that many younger people take the sacrifices of generations before them for granted.

[Warren DeMontague]

12. And GET OFF MY LAWN!

Damn kids.

[CreekDog]

13. I'm under 50 and I'm grateful

those that fought in the 50's and 60's opened participation in society to countless numbers who had been excluded before.

and in so doing, they started a trend whereby more and more become included as we go forward.

[MadBadger]

14. Is there a Point to this Thread?

I'll take out the granny reference

[habitual]

15. we under 50 year olds

forgive you older 50 year olds who constantly need to remind us that we are under 50.

there is a tact to dealing with us. but i guess age ISN'T really the issue, it is your wisdom that matters.

shit on this age superiority crap. and no, you don't really know how old I am, do you?

[dbmk]

18. 33 and I understand the OP

It is a growing problem in all western countries. People are becoming less and less aware of the changes that made their position possible today. And as a consequence they start eroding the foundation that was built. The paradox is that the improvements allow people to care less about them.

I don't think there is anything superior about it. And most of all I think the problem is not really present in this forum, and I don't think the OP thinks so either. But it is a problem in general. And I don't think we really have a true appreciation of the struggles.

But it could have been worded a lot better, granted.

[Indenturedebtor]

115. Worded a lot better, and not so reflective of the ignorance of the OP

Us whippersnappers face some of the greatest challenges in the history of mankind. For one thing those who have come before us have raped the planet and allowed businesses to shut the common man out of government. We work more hours for less than people have in generations here in the States, our healthcare system is broken, our educational system is broken, etc etc etc.

If you oldies weren't so out of touch and sheltered perhaps you would understand the heart freezing despair that the world you've left us to fix leaves many of us with.

[ellisonz]

16. This 22 year old history major says: bug off!

Seriously?

[Kablooie]

17. You young whippersnappers have no idea what it was like to emerge from the primeval slime.

I remember it all too well.

[WildEyedLiberal]

19. Oh my God another self-satisfied boomer thread? Christ

You people did not singlehandedly save America, for fuck's sake. Nor do you have a monopoly on "struggle."

[Ecumenist]

20. Oh, but SJDNB, you're wrong. I'm under 50, not by much but I am

and I have faced pure, unadulterated racism and sexism. I have experienced things you wouldn't believe. I have been stopped leaving a store and asked to empty my purse because a loss prevention agent thought he saw me slip items into my bag, only to watch as a group of 3 white women run past me with their haul they were able to take because this moron was too busy watching me with my caramel complexion taking NOTHING I DIDN'T PAY FOR, while those broads robbed the joint blind. The store apologised to me PROFUSELY after I showed them my purse and threatened to sue them. As a child, I was actually told by a "minister" that black gospel and the rhythm that it has was sinful and Jungle music and that the reason that my skin was brown was because of generational sin. I can tell you things that would piss you off to no end. I haven't had the "pleasure" of being prevented by the law of the land from buying a home in certain neighbourhoods or taking my life into my hands simply by exercising my right to vote as my uncle was. I am a black woman married to a white bohemian czech...SOUTHERN man from TEXAS and that in itself brings comments from idiots and pinheaded morons, (not too often as my husband is SUPER-PROTECTIVE and more than a bit trigger happy) but trust me, in my 44, soon to be 45 years on this earth, I have struggled and sees the inequity visitted on my family generation by generation and how far we've come and how much further we have to go to really have a level playing field.

[gblady]

21. wow...just wow....

Come on people, smile on your brother....

[No Elephants]

23. True Dat. About 20 years ago, a man was all angry bc he lost his job to a

woman because of affirmative action (or so he claimed. He could just have been sub par). He said, "I could see it if I lost my job to a black, but to a woman? What did they ever go through?" He was not THAT much younger than I was then, either, but he was still clueless.

Before the various protest movements of the 50's, 60's and early 70's, it was all white bread, Joe McCarthy and Herbert Hoover and everyone but WASP's trying like hell to "assimilate," but never quite making it.

It's too bad that those who are younger on this thread are refusing to believe that they cannot possibly fully get it, even if they have read and heard the stories about African Americans, women, etc.

That is part of why I want so much for others, like our GLBT brothers and sisters, to be able do a post like this SOON, telling their younger counterparts how far they finally came, too.

[1776Forever]

24. Like in 1970 when my husband had to say it was OK for me to be "allowed" to have my tubes tied.

That was once for each child and this is after I had 5 children in Ohio. If he hadn't have said "yes" all 5 times then the surgeon wouldn't have done it. My health was really poor at the time and with 10 pound babies it couldn't have taken much more. I love my kids but seeing women now having their tubes tied after 1 it is really amazing how far women's rights have come.

Here is to change we can believe in!:headbang:

[FlaGranny]

25. I wonder how

many "young whippersnappers" ;-) know about THAT?

P.S. I had my tubes tied in 1974 in New Jersey, and at that time and place I didn't need my husband's permission, but he was in agreement.

[Kalyke]

48. You had your tubes tied five times and it didn't work?

"If he hadn't have said "yes" all 5 times then the surgeon wouldn't have done it."

Am I reading this correctly?

BTW, my hubby opted to do the surgery after my second baby. My first was 10 pounds and the second was nearly 9 pounds. I'm 5'1", so I don't want to go through that again either. It's ruined my stomach both aesthetically and physically (I have major stomach problems as a result of two C-sections).

[1776Forever]

56. No - I had to have my husband say out loud that he agreed once for each child before they did it.

If he had said "no" once they would not have. Thank God it worked fine:)

[Kalyke]

72. LOL... glad it did and sorry I was confused.

But still, it seems odd the physician would ask the question of your husband once for each child.

But, in any case, it seems odd to me as a 30-something that he would even need to be consulted. I can't imagine. However, I don't agree with the OP. I still see discrimination based on gender, color and sexual orientation; so, it's not as if I don't have an understanding of the struggles my mother and grandmother endured.

[BuelahWitch]

55. It was still like that in 1992 in SLC, Utah

At least, when I as a 30 year old asked to have them tied at a pretty progessive women's clinic, I was told "No." A married friend of mine in her mid '30s had to have her husband sign before she could get the procedure done.
Now that I'm old and my eggs are stale, I might be able to get it done at Planned Parenthood. But I still have no husband, so they may still say NO.

[BlooInBloo]

26. That's just fucking stupid.

[Harry Monroe]

51. What the younger generation needs is a draft

By God, we'd see them in the streets then!! Even the chickenhawks!!

Bow down and kiss our feet, punk!!

Fortunately, we as a nation had the good sense to elect Obama as President. Perhaps a McCain presidency would have galvanized you guys to action out of necessity.

[Radical Activist]

78. No kidding. What liberal did the boomers ever elect President?

ummm.....

Young people voted 2/3 for Obama. I'll take their wisdom over the 50+ set any day.

[Harry Monroe]

81. Jimmy Carter comes to mind

Clinton, however, was a moderate.

[Romulox]

30. Errr, weren't the over 50 set also ENGAGED in the racism and sexism as well?

And there is a greater disparity between rich and poor than there has been since the "gilded age" in the 1920s. So your point about economic inequity is hard to process. :hi:

[WinkyDink]

38. Not really. I'm 59, the Boomers, the 60's, Civil Rights marches, anti-War marches, and all?

So, no, NOT "over 50's" were the racists.
We WERE, however, the 55,000 dead in VietNam.

[Tyler Generation]

47. Wow, everyone over 50 is a tolerant non racist left winger?

I wasn't aware of that! :sarcasm:

[Romulox]

68. That's silly. SOME marched in civil rights marches. SOME counter-demonstrated.

[Radical Activist]

79. And it was never a majority.

A majority of boomers voted for Nixon and Reagan.

[jkirch]

96. The 1920's...

...were the "guilded age?"

[Romulox]

112. "Guilded" ="belonging to a guild". Just FYI.

I got the dates wrong. You got the word wrong. You should be more embarrassed, imo. :hi:

[rosesaylavee]

31. Just turned 50 (no applause please)

and have to say I don't think age has a lot to do with acquiring wisdom. I meet ignorant people of all ages who don't have a clue what their brother/sister have had to do to survive. Spent a weekend with a bunch of them in fact.

I think those of us who do understand the history of gender/race/glbtq equity issues are obligated to pass on that history. I do run into girls of my son's generation who don't understand the struggle and heart ache I experienced when the ERA was lost, don't understand how the color of a person's skin could keep someone from working and/or living in certain places. But EVERYONE knows - I don't care what social group they belong to - EVERYONE knows what it's like to not belong, to not be allowed to belong. Unfortunately, it's a common mean streak in our human experience.

Cultivating empathy is one of the most important things I feel I have taught my son, encouraging him to see and think about what the other person is going through. Empathy first and hopefully positive action to address whatever wrong is present will follow.

[catgirl]

35. Yes, people under 50 live in a vacuum

We're unaware that men make more money than women, that blacks are still discriminated against,
many immigrants are forced to take jobs that... oh, don't get me started.

Your comments are a just plain ole load of crock.

[JTFrog]

36. Adultcentrism. Judging society through your all knowing, experienced everything eyes.

None who have walked the planet less years than you can appreciate struggle, eh?


Homelessness, hunger, sickness and poverty are your basic economic inequities. They will strike the vulnerable in their path regardless of age. Struggle and suffering are NOT AGE BASED.

The OP is egocentric and bigoted.

[stray cat]

37. And if you haven't served in the military you have no appreciation of what they do for the country

And if you haven't served in politics you have no idea of their challenges, and if you have not been illegally inprisoned you have no appreciation of freedom.

[Odin2005]

39. The arrogance of you Boomers is astounding.

"don't appreciate" my rear end. I'm sick of this Crown of Creation shit the Boomers pull, as if everyone else is unworthy. Fuck that.

[NoPasaran]

41. As is the total lack of respect and overall whineyness of the following generation

Fuck you right back, kid.

[Tyler Generation]

45. If the Boomers were so successful

Why are we in Iraq? Why are these corporations more powerful and exploiting more people than ever? Why does institutionalized sexism, racism, and homophobia still thrive in our systems of employment and justice?

Boomers have very selective memories and a lot of them want to act like they were all fucking front row at Woodstock and every last one of them took a bullet in the ass in Vietnam. Nostalgic bullshit.

[roguevalley]

91. the problem with what has happened now is EVERYONE'S fault.

If the fuckers who could vote -too damned many of them among the youngers- had voted things might be different. You can't blame fuckers like bush on just the older people. We vote and always have. You have had the vote since eighteen and too damned many young people don't. Sanctimony cuts both ways.

[1776Forever]

59. An open mind is better then a closed one - It is not with "arrogance" but urgency that we speak.

We don't want the younger generation to go back wards. We are steadily getting older and just want to share those good things that have occurred since we were young, because even a few short years ago the country was moving ahead nicely and then came W. The atmosphere can change and does change, not for the better sometimes. It is not with bragging but with faith that the younger generation will strive for an even better tomorrow for our country. Someday when you are in your late 50's and 60's you will understand better. That is what is important now.

I pray in 40 or 50 years from now there will be wonderful things that will happen that you can pass down to your or others children and grandchildren.

[Radical Activist]

80. Especially considering the slogans they threw around in their youth.

Luckily I think many activist boomers would recognize the hypocrisy of the OP and welcome a new generation of progressive leaders.

[starroute]

40. The real problem is that the history of the left is always eradicated

We boomers don't really know what our parents went through in the 30's to win labor's rights -- which is why so much of it has been casually tossed away since Reagan.

We know even less about the struggles of the early 20th century -- the sweatshops and slums that our grandparents endured. Or the shocking health hazards before the enactment of the Pure Food and Drug Act.

Some of this may be general historical amnesia -- but a lot of it is because the stories of the people who really shook things up and forced the establishment to accept changes rarely get into the schoolbooks. Like those "missing" verses of "This Land is Your Land," they get gently smudged out in the name of a bland liberal consensus.

We boomers were more than arrogant enough in our own day -- back about 1968, very few of us thought there was anything we could learn from our parents' generation's struggles. (And the fact that our parents weren't talking about a lot of it for fear of being called commies didn't help.)

But we've sort-of, kind-of learned better -- and so should you young whippersnappers. The last thing we ever need is to take our rights for granted.

[treestar]

42. I'm officially too young to have this appreciation

I'm 49! I'm under 50!

Thanks for making me "young" :rofl:

[rosesaylavee]

85. Oh, you won't get the "Crown of Creation" mentioned above.

I have mine. I turned 50 last week. :P

[Danger Mouse]

44. More dumping on young people. Why am I not surprised?

[HamdenRice]

46. Ignorant and damned proud seems to be the response of some younger DUers

But I agree with your post. I don't think that it's possible for many younger people to imagine what it was actually like.

They seem to believe they can. Yet some of them are the same people who are screaming that we can't imagine what it's like to be them in the wake of Prop 8 or having to see Warren invited to the inauguration.

Go figure!

[kdpeters]

49. The older I get, the better I was.

[Froward69]

52. Here is Blatant age discrimination

No I am not over 50. and No I have never been sprayed with water hoses nor attacked by police dogs simply for marching in protest.
I have been tear gassed though.
But Having three siblings that are 'mulatto' or 'Mongrel' I can attest I have lost relationships, been ostracized and discriminated against BECAUSE of my membership in this family. I have on more than one occasion "gone in" to prove the discriminatory acts of others as when they do not know I am related to the person they just discriminated against. it becomes easy to expose them as the bigots they are. as I look white.

This post is Bullshit as it is not aimed at the color of my skin... it is aimed at my age via a calender.

Although Dr. King did not say it directly... Age is but one of the aspects people use to feel superior.

[cottonseed]

53. Oh fiddlesticks...

My grandmother used to say that about something that was bullshit. Now at her late 70s she came from what most in America consider our best generation.

[RichGirl]

54. I am over 50...

My view of the world is much brighter than yours. It's not that either of us is right or wrong. There have been many bad things, but way more good things. It's all a matter of focus. I choose to focus on the good things. This doesn't prevent me from seeing the bad and working to change it. I have spent more time in activist causes than any other thing in my life. You DO NOT have to get angry and depressed to see what is wrong and see the need for change.

I enjoy my life everyday and the wonderful things in it...and especially this wonderful new president we have. And I will continue to try and work for change in the world, to better the lives of all.

[bvar22]

57. If you are under 50, you probably don't remember a time when...

...
* a non-college educated parent could work a single job and make enough to:
send 3 or more children to college,
own a new cars every few years,
have adequate health insurance,
and buy a house & pay off the mortgage.

*a person could put Himself/Herself through a state college by working part-time, and graduate debt free. You could do this AND own and drive a used car.

[itsrobert]

64. 10 cent a gallon gas

And nobody recycled.
Cruising down the streets on Fridays and Saturday Nights.
Smoking at the ballpark, horse track, etc.
Ash Trays on peoples desk on the job with workers puffing on cigs around the clock.
etc.

[dana_b]

117. great post!

I hate the us v.s. them theme here, but you pointed out some evident changes and yes, hardships that the younger generation has had to face.

Times are different. People have little time to fight the good fight and causes. They spend too much time working two jobs while going to classes too. Not that some older people didn't have to do that, but now it's a necessity for almost everyone AND almost everyone graduates with a ton of debt.

[Connie_Corleone]

58. Gee, thanks for telling us we're too ignorant to appreciate history.

Especially those of us who have relatives who grew up during the Jim Crow era, experienced all forms of discrimination and economic inequality.

[Lyric]

60. Bullshit. Poverty ages people beyond their years

at least emotionally and mentally, and usually physically too. If you've collapsed in sobs and dizziness in the middle of a sidewalk because you're pregnant, you haven't had the money to eat in three days, and the smell coming from the restaurant across the street is making your stomach gnaw at you like a wild thing with claws, then you know what it TRULY means to "struggle"--it doesn't matter HOW young or old you are. And yes, I mean that in a political sense as well.

*I* was twenty when that happened to me, FYI.

[uppityperson]

61. If you are under 100 yrs old I doubt you have a real appreciation of

the struggle that many faced before you or how much you've inherited/been given as a result of those struggles - not just racial, not just gender based, but also across race/gender -- the basic economic inequity (that the unions tried to fight) that has resulted in the most skilled/productive/qualified, disproportionately, feeding the uber wealthy, corporate/executive parasites who've been allowed, by our gov't, to exploit/use us/them.

Teach your children about your history, about how things were. But realize that most will probably take offense as so many have here, missing the greater point that no, you won't really appreciate or understand. You may learn about how things were, but no, you won't have a real appreciation of the previous generations' struggles since those are long past and now is how things re. teach your children, and young friends. Talk to them, let them know that it could easily turn back.

For those taking offense, I am sorry that you are doing so. I cannot fully appreciate what my grandparents went through and I do not think you can fully appreciate how things were when you were young or before you were born. This is not a slam on anyone, just how it is. Ask older people what things were like, what they went through, listen and learn and appreciate them. This does not mean worship them, or that they don't appreciate you and what you are doing, in no way does it mean that.

Things change, things happen again. NO ONE can fully appreciate what life was like before they were living it. Appreciate and learn from each other.

[Starry Messenger]

63. I got the picture ten years ago.

I haven't ever been able to afford a house, have children, get health care or have savings. I'm 38. What did I inherit? I'm an art teacher and I work pretty hard.

[Alcibiades]

65. Are you really being the person you want to be right now?

It is the job of elders to give young people the insight that makes such appreciation possible. My elders did that for me, and I'm doing it for my two kids. I went to school in the south, a few years after the public schools were integrated, and I understood, even then, the full significance of that. My Dad went to Vietnam when I was a kid, and came back rather ill-equipped for family life, so my parents got a divorce when I was three, and I understood the significance of that. When I was growing up, progressive values were very much in the air, and I, along with many other folks my age, learned them deeply and have never abandoned them. My first political memories were of the antiwar movement, the civil rights movement, Vietnam, and Watergate. I was partly raised by my depression-generation grandparents, who taught me that the Republican Party is the rich man's party. My grandfather taught me about his experiences as a combat infantryman in WWII and Korea, and taught me to be skeptical of militarism, even in a military family.

I saw income for men without high school diplomas peak in 1979, and go down ever since (the pay of women has gone up over that time, but mainly because they are working more hours). Saw it, and lived it when I joined the workforce. Worked blue collar jobs in both union and non-union shops. Went back to school and earned a PhD and accrued a lot of debt in the process. A lot of what we inherited has, in fact, been a history of lurching backward as well as forward, and I understand that as well. I've been an independent adult since I was 18 years old. I'm a 40 year old man with two kids, and have been with the same woman for the past seventeen years. I chose, in this last election, to spend a great deal of time away from my young family to work for a candidate who represents the best chance we have seen in my lifetime to continue the struggle you doubt I can "really" appreciate. I've traveled to 45 out of 50 states, 13 foreign countries, and have held about 20 different jobs. I've been politically active for my entire adult life, studied politics, and have read widely in history and philosophy, among a great many other subjects.

And yet, all my life, there have been folks in the older generation who have been anxious to say that I'm somehow unequal because I did not have the same experiences they have had. I have also met many in the older generation who are not patronizing, who share the same values, and who have been willing to partner with younger people to accomplish real change. In my dealings with the younger generation, I strive to be more like the latter than the former, because they need mentors who will help them to become their best selves, not grouchy old geezers who are bitter and threatened by the hope and promise the younger generation represents.

[truedelphi]

67. In part, one reason that younger people might not have a real appreciation

For what others have gone through is that the politics of the collapsing economy have re-aligned much of the gains.

So what if blacks or females could not be carpenters, sales agents, union workers, or CEO's decades ago but can be those things now? The fact is that the construction trades are idle, as are real estate and insurance agencies, and union jobs are few and far between.

Now all of us are equally allowed to be dead broke. Worried about our next meal. For sure, some of us face these struggles because of over-investing in certain bubbles. But even as gains were made for people of color and for women, the down ward spiraling economy has offset the gains that integration attempted to provide.

[Jennicut]

69. I am 33 and grew up with mothers being able to decide if they wanted to work or not

That was the beginning of it anyways, the mid to late 70's. My Mom stayed home but had her own business from her home making crafts for extra money. Lots of social upheaval in the 60's she has said. I think we who came after luckily did not have to go through some of that. Women especially have more choices. I think African-Americans have come a long way what with Obama about to become president. Gay rights is the civil rights movement of today.

[Warren DeMontague]

70. Yes, clearly you must be a wise old boomer to appreciate the value of a post-n-run thread.

Nice.

[SteppingRazor]

71. If you are under 500 yrs old I doubt you have a real appreciation of

the struggle that many faced in throwing off the oppressive feudal system and replacing it with the mercantile system of the Renaissance, which gave rise to the middle class.



Anyway, my point is, while a lot of big changes happened in the middle of the 20th Century, it's perhaps a bit self-important to declare that that period is central to the fight for equality throughout all of human history, and it's maybe a little arrogant to assume that people not around during that time period have no appreciation for the struggles that took place during it. I was born well after the 1960s, but I've also read Howard Zinn.

[HughMoran]

73. I was born in 1961 just after Obama was born

I think that makes me under 50. It's awfully presumptuous of you to assume that I wasn't old enough to appreciate what was going on at the time - especially with activist parents. I hate stereotyping - just don't do it.

[comrade snarky]

74. Funny, no one of that age ever mentions the 80s

It's like the "greed is good" years never happened.

Wasn't that the hippies too? Oh but that was the other boomers, right? Not the good ones like you. Do you think you could extend the same courtesy to the rest of us and learn that there are idiots in ever group? No, probably not.

Posters like this are in too special a group and not being understood is inherent in being one of the elect. When they were young no one older could understand what it was like. "Don't trust anyone over 30" and all that. Now they are over 50 it's everyone younger than they are who can't understand.

Some people in that generation did great things. No doubt about it. However, some are the whiniest most self centered bunch the human race has ever spawned. Those are the ones who need to keep reminding the rest of us how great they are because they were born at the right time. Like no other generation has ever faced struggles like they did or fought to change their societies.

Suffragette movement? It was all flower petals and ice cream. No beatings or police dogs for them right? Or do you have no real appreciation for that they went through because you're under 100?

[Lucky 13]

75. Oh please educate us our wise, learned elder!

Does your post have a point or are you just bragging about your advanced age?

[Juche]

76. I doubt you have a real appreciation for what your elder did for you

Germ theory, penicillin, the nuremberg trials, sufferage, anesthesia, brown vs mississippi, weekends off, 8 hour workdays etc. Back in the 70s you probably cared more about trying to get laid while listening to Doors music in your GTO instead of all that. See I can be condescending too.

FTR, I realize the previous generation did alot of good. But they also gave us movement conservatism and Reagan. You guys seem to always forget that part.

My generation (I am 29) is alot more concerned with global problems like climate change, global human rights, poverty, disease, etc. We are also more tolerant of gays and various other small subgroups who just want to live with peace and dignity than our parents. Hopefully my kids (which I won't have, I'm speaking metaphorically) will take that progression even further. Hopefully the generation being born now will grow up to have an even more global agenda with even more concern for liberty and freedom.

You do have a point though. There is something called 'shirtsleeves to shirtsleeves in 3 generations'. I believe when a parent is rich, there is a 50% chance the kids will blow all the money, and a 90% chance it'll be blown by the time the grandkids get through with it. The reason is the kids and grandkids took it for granted and didn't know what it was like to have to work for money. So I understand your point that those of us who take benefits for granted lose them, but that is a human flaw, not a flaw of everyone under 30. The fact that the boomer generation threw the union movement in the toilet and elected Reagan was because all the boomers took it for granted that jobs paid well and offered benefits.

In alot of ways I do have to give Bush credit for increasing civic spirit by fucking the country up so bad that people were forced to start paying attention.

[PM Martin]

83. Not everyone who is young

is some type of stereotypical ingrate that you imagine exists.

[jeffrey_X]

84. I'm 39 and I have a great understanding.

Mainly because my wife is African American and I've read more than 20 books related to African American history or written by African American authors. My wife thought it was important (as did I) that I have a keen perspective of African American history if we were to ever have children.

[rvablue]

86. Sometimes I get so freakin' sick of the "we know better" lecturing from Baby Boomers

it's so tired. Didn't you also bring us Nixon and Reagan?

And, BTW, you do realize that the condescension in your post, given the age limit you put on it, applies to Obama as well?

Please..........

[benld74]

87. Damn Kids! Where's my Metamucil?

[LWolf]

88. I'm 48. I have a razor-sharp understanding, thanks. nt

[GinaMaria]

92. I am acutely aware that

my grandmother was born without the right to vote. my parents grew up with separate drinking fountains. School integration was treated with hate and fear. I was not supposed to amount to anything other than wife or mother. I had to secretly watch Billy Jean King kick some idiot's ass on television so my father wouldn't go into his women's lib and she's a lesbian rant. my mother, my aunts and my sisters and I have been grossly underpaid. I am under 50 years old.

[sjdnb]

93. You're right -- I was wrong

I'm just surrounded by 'angsty' teens who, for an example, think if I don't take them to the mall for a shopping spree, they are facing injustice.

[sjdnb]

94. You're right -- I was wrong

I'm just surrounded by 'angsty' teens who, for an example, think if I don't take them to the mall for a shopping spree, they are facing injustice. My oldest two are not like this, but it's all about location.

[comrade snarky]

95. I dont want to be a jerk

But geese, think before you post\insult such a large number of people.

Anyway, no hard feelings. Hope your day got better, a teenager can turn anyone into a misanthrope. That's a group we can all agree to insult :evilgrin:


Edited for spellnig

[sjdnb]

98. I apologize for the blanket stmt - not for believing that

many, if not most -- but obviously not all, members of subsequent generations have grown up without a true appreciation of what had gone before.

[comrade snarky]

107. Well... then nevermind

You apparently did intend to issue a blanket insult. Neat.

But you apologize for the statement and not the stupidity of insulting a lot of people. Is that right? I'm confused by what I'm reading from you.

Is it a general lack of knowledge of history you are decrying because it sounds more personal. Frankly whiney.

[Hellataz]

97. Well that's insulting, don't assume you know the depth of anyone's feelings or ability to understand

I'm under 50 and completely feel grateful for the struggles others went though to give me the right to vote. I'm under 50 and am still able to be passionately appalled at the race/hate crimes that not only happened in the past but still happen today to a lesser extent. I watch documentaries and read books about the early racial and gender oppression and it tears me up inside, just as it does today to see how the GLBT community is treated. You don't have to be 50+ to understand the importance of fair and equal treatment towards your fellow human, nor to appreciate what others went through to get us here.

IMO, it's the 50+ crowd that doesn't have the real appreciation, since most I've talk to are ones that are still set in their ways and still think it's ok to call African americans "Those Colored People" and still think it's ok to let the "Man be the Man" and leave all the bread winning and decisions up to him.

Before you jump up my ass....OF COURSE NOT ALL 50+ people, but a lot of them, simply because they come from a different time, a time where racial and gender oppression was tolerated and encouraged. Many 50+ people are still going off of the intolerant lessons of their parents and refuse to embrace the world we live in today. So many of them, I've heard myself, talk about those times as "the good ol days" and how they wish they could get back to them. So it would strike me that THEY are the ones who do not only NOT appreciate the struggle people went through, but also don't give that struggle any validity what so ever.

[bridgit]

99. Make that 'under 30' and you *may* have a specific gravity here...

;)

[boppers]

100. If you're over 40 I doubt you understand, in the same way as those who are younger:

AIDS, the Internet, global poverty, global warming, the cold war, DNA, evolution, television rules, immigration, poly-, metro-, homo-, bi- (and everything else) sexuals, industrial/goth/rap, F/OSS, video game censorship, minimum rage, and a whole slew of other things that weren't really part of the zeitgeist of your youth.

Different generations have many different struggles, and many different perspectives.

Putting several generations down does nothing to diminish each generation's struggles.

[stillcool]

101. I've never been to Iraq..

and I doubt I have a real appreciation for what the Iraq's are going through.

[JI7]

103. then why did the older ones elect Reagan ?

[comrade snarky]

108. I keep asking the Baby Boomers to explainn the 80s

And so far no takers.
Seemed like the same people to me although I was just a kid. I could swear I remember all the yuppies being embarrassed about their hippie pasts.

It's a conundrum. Were they evil clones? Aliens? Pod People? My money is on the pods.

[Tyler Generation]

116. Duh, because the 80's don't count...

Every single boomer on DU hung out with Jimi and Janis and lived on Haight Street. Every last one of them was in the front line of every single protest getting sprayed with fire hoses. They all went to Woodstock and never had a racist or sexist thought ever. Or maybe most of them just watched this stuff on tv and since the younger set wasn't there to see it, they can bullshit enough to subdue their unwarranted self importance.

[struggle4progress]

106. Here's a Boomer slogan for the younger set: "Don't trust anybody over 30"

[KakistocracyHater]

109. u sound like you're over 50

perhaps you don't know about this: there are these little devices, mostly iPods, that can play something called "audio-books", also pdf downloads-it's just like a book! & that whole literate thing.....history books.....fashion history...class laws....biopics...."Dangerous Beauty" is a good 1...:dilemma:

[Norrin Radd]

110. Connor MacLeod understands more than anyone here.

[sohndrsmith]

111. Well said. But what you said is only the introduction for what needs to be

discussed... you encapsulated it skillfully - I hope your words prove to be a catalyst to the bigger dialogue, because we need it.

Thanks for the good post.

[GreenEyedLefty]

114. I'm "only" 37 but have experienced gender discrimination

[WritingIsMyReligion]

118. Do you want us to run along and get off of your lawn now?

:shrug: