Wow, I think I just heard our future first woman President giving a great interview

[mtnsnake]

at the Waldorf Astoria in NYC. Syracuse TV was covering her press conference live just now for those fortunate enough to catch it.

Seriously, this lady is intelligent, quick, and very SHARP. Wait until you hear her for yourself, I think you're going to be impressed.

Oops, I almost forgot....I'm talking about Senator Kirsten Gillibrand, of course. :smoke:

[AtomicKitten]

1. Tracy Flick is certainly ambitious but you were wrong about Clinton's inevitability too. n/t

[asdjrocky]

4. Tracy Flick, omg, that is so funny.

[AtomicKitten]

10. "Kirsten Gillibrand called Tracy Flick of NY Politics"

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0109/17877.html

[Merlot]

34. Oh Gawd, I love that movie!

Reese at her best!

[PBS Poll-435]

6. Wow! Original and funny!

[Metric System]

7. You talk about ambition like it's a bad thing. Also, I'm tired of the comparison of female pols to

Tracy Flick. Give it a rest.

[mtnsnake]

11. Thank you!

Did you ever nail it. :thumbsup:

[Captain Hilts]

24. Agree. It's okay for men to be ambitious, but not for women. nt

[dkf]

25. You know what is more annoying? Its attributing Tracy Flicks obnoxiousness to being a female.

Wow this is beginning to piss me off.

Why is all criticism of Gillibrand derided as being anti female? I'm sooooo sick of it.

[Captain Hilts]

27. No one said that. No one's referred to Pres. Obama as "Tracy Flick." nt

[dkf]

35. Because he isn't anything like her.

What people can't stand about Tracy Flick was the obviousness of her ambition and how it turned her into an unpleasant person who was in it for her her her.

That isn't what Obama is about at all. Obama is a nurturer and a constructive fixer of problems. His motivations are different from Tracy Flick.

[pnwmom]

38. But every female politician is Tracy Flick, to someone or other. n/t

[Sebastian Doyle]

39. I don't believe I ever heard anybody compare Sarah Palin to Tracy Flick

Though actually, she would be closer to Tracy's opponent..... a not too bright candidate thrown into the campaign for purely cynical reasons.

[CitizenPatriot]

43. I did, on this site...a few times. No takers, though.

Now that she's outed herself as Grifter Palin, might be different. Tracy Flick was smart, though...so there's that.

It was the blind, kill-for-it ambition that I was referring to. I was pretty sure McCain would have to watch his back, his food, etc.

[Captain Hilts]

51. Oh yeah they did. nt

[dkf]

42. Not DiFi. Sometimes the woman drives me crazy with her stances, but

I've never seen her compared to Tracy Flick.

No one would compare Caroline Kennedy to Tracy Flick either. Maybe that is what makes her "unqualified".

[Captain Hilts]

50. But his ambition is rarely noted or criticised as women's ambition is. nt

[dkf]

53. Because it doesn't seem to consume him and he doesn't look ruthless doing it.

He is Mr. Cool.

[Captain Hilts]

55. Oh, it consumes him all right...

going from state legislature, to senate to presidency in 5 years? Oh yeah.

But it's not a bad thing. The thing that I liked about Obama and Clinton in the primaries was that they wanted it. Bad. Neither one of them would have let Florida '00 happen to them. They would have fought. People would have fought for them. And if they weren't going to win, they'd uh cheated. THAT's how you win. That's what I liked about them. Still do. Gore and Kerry and Dukakis - whom I still adore - generated none of that heat or intensity.

[dkf]

60. He didn't look like a barracuda doing it though. He was Mr. Nice Guy

and it was driving me nuts during the campaign, but he did good.

[Captain Hilts]

61. He had the wind at his back the whole way.

But he threw some rough punches.

That's how the game is played. Hard.

[dkf]

63. You saw rough punches? Where was I?

The only thing I saw that was half way hardball was when he disqualified that woman who used fake signatures.

Other than that, I can't think of any.

He was more than fair to Hillary and to McCain.

[Zhade]

66. And what rough punches would those be? Imaginary ones?

NT!

[dkf]

56. Blagojevich seems rather Tracy Flickish to me...

Also Rahm Emanuel.

[Zhade]

65. Which is why Obama is our president, and Clinton takes his orders.

NT!

[salguine]

40. Sometimes, it IS a bad thing.

[TheWraith]

28. AK, I wouldn't buy too much of the narrative some people are spinning.

The "ambition" tag came from anonymous comments attributed to other members of the NY congressional delegation: in other words, people who were being passed over in favor of her selection for the Senate.

Admittedly I don't know the lady personally, at least not yet, but her record doesn't strike me as the type you would adopt if you really were looking for political expediency. The gun thing puts her on the wrong side of the left, and pretty much everything else puts her on the wrong side of the right. Normally there's political capital from straddling the middle, but between guns and gay marriage she's in a position to be shot at by both flanks.

[AtomicKitten]

49. I'm beginning to see that NY politics isn't for the feint of heart. Ha, ha.

As I posted below in response to an accusation, this isn't about ambition per se but rather what some NY congressfolk feel is her big-footing her way to get ahead. I'm rather shocked by the gossipy tone of the politics in NY. Nastiness abounds!

I have a HUGE problem with Gillibrand's 100% NRA rating for a job well done supporting their radical causes. Her position on immigration is something I also vehemently disagree with. That's her Blue Dogginess running up against my oh no you didn't threshold.

No worries. First she's not from my state although I'm equally as put off by my Blue Dog Senator, Diane Feinstein, and second she's on deck in 2010 to fend off challengers to the seat. Yeah democracy!

Are we having fun yet? :hi:

[Maven]

36. I think you have a real problem with ambitious women, period.

[AtomicKitten]

47. This isn't about ambition per se, it's about what is perceived as big-footing one's way in politics.

It's in the article.

[Zhade]

64. LOL!

Indeed.

[SoCalDem]

69. people can dream

:rofl:

[asdjrocky]

2. You ol' Snake.

Snake does likeie the ladies don't he? :smoke: Take a walk with me over the line?

[mtnsnake]

5. Hey there good buddy rocky

Dam right I'll walk with you over the line so long as I can jump back to the other side in case something out of the ordinary occurs. ;)

[asdjrocky]

13. Maybe what you were looking for was-

I'll say what I want about my sister, but don't you talk about my sister. It's the best I can do.

[mtnsnake]

14. I think that's pretty close to what you said

Thanks. Someday if you or I ever get the time we'll have to do a search on your post to see if that was the exact wording. Thanks again, rocky. :)

[asdjrocky]

16. NP-

Now I'm going to start doing some research on Gillibrand so we have something to fight about again.

[mtnsnake]

17. Find it quick, though

before you're smitten by her, rocky. ;)

[Jackpine Radical]

3. The only thing worse than a DINO is a smart DINO.

Everybody is upset about her gun control stance. That's about the only thing about her that DOESN'T bother me.

[mtnsnake]

9. Her gun control stance is a thing of the past, now that she represents ALL of New York

She was so cool how she explained her positions. The district she used to represent in NY was pretty conservative, so no doubt that's what prompted a oouple of her positions that aren't too popular on this forum. That's all about to change.

[Jackpine Radical]

19. So she's a political chameleon, taking on the coloration of the electorate

as expediency demands?

[mtnsnake]

20. Do you know any politicians who aren't?

Why do you think they call them politicians? :shrug:

[Jackpine Radical]

23. Russ Feingold.

I know wingnuts who vote for Russ because, although they hate his positions, they idolize his integrity.

[TheWraith]

30. For the current legislative session, she's got a more progressive record than Feingold.

He's rated at 84%, she's at 93. For lifetime ratings, he's got an 89% rating, she's at 87.

http://www.progressivepunch.org/

[tomp]

73. dennis kucinich. nt

[chascarrillo]

75. You mean the guy who was anti-choice before he started running for president???

Holy crap, that is funny.

[tomp]

77. so, any change of position=chameleon?

can you name a politician who has never changed an opinion? all politicians are chameleons?

[chascarrillo]

74. Representatives are supposed to, like, represent their electorate.

Some of y'all need some rudimentary lessons in civics.

[TheWraith]

29. What other part of her record bothers you?

Pro gay marriage, pro-Medicare-for-all, against the war... I know a lot of people are peeved about telecom immunity, but that's water under the bridge at this point.

[Jackpine Radical]

31. OK, I'll come clean. I was shooting from the hip. When she was first announced,

it seemed that the posts I was reading around here were portraying her as a DINO. If they were wrong, then I'm wrong. I had no idea who she even was 2 weeks ago, and I confess that I don't know her voting record.

[TheWraith]

32. A lot of people around here were spewing nonsense.

Mostly they saw that she's a member of the "Blue Dog" caucus, and went off at the mouth without knowing more. There's also been a lot of information circulating that's simply outright lies, like that she opposed Medicaid for low-income AIDS patients (she supported it), that her father is a Republican lobbyist (He's a Democrat), etcetera. The fact is that she's incredibly liberal for her district. She's to the left of both Clinton and Schumer, and comparable on a lot of social stuff to Feingold. The main places where people would disagree with her are guns and immigration, both of which are fairly understandable positions for her to take representing as much rural and farm-based territory as she does. (Not guaranteeing that she'll change positions in the Senate--she still represents a lot of open land.)

Here's a great interview with her, that shows off some of her policy and ideas. Judging from the mention of the auto bailout, I'm pretty sure it was conducted some time in November or early December. Admittedly she was my second choice for the seat, but the more I see the more I like her. She's obviously very smart and savvy.

http://www.insideouthv.com/Features/gillibrand.html

[AtomicKitten]

62. She IS a pro-gun Blue Dog Democrat.

That's a fact. 100% NRA rating. She has other attributes that you apparently deemed worthy of overlooking this, but it is not correct for you to deny she is a Blue Dog democrat.

Patterson to Choose Blue Dog Democrat:
http://guerillawomentn.blogspot.com/2009/01/paterson-to-choose-bluedog-democrat.html

Blue Dog Democrat to Replace Clinton:
http://www.delawareliberal.net/2009/01/22/ny-senate-blue-do-democrat-kirsten/

Blue Dog Democrat Named to Clinton's Seat:
http://www.thenation.com/blogs/state_of_change/401083

Gillibrand's Record shows she is true to the Blue Dog Creed:
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/01/gillibrands-record-shows-shes-true-to-the-blue-dog-creed.php

Gillibrand is both praised and criticized
January 24, 2009
http://www.newsday.com/services/newspaper/printedition/saturday/longisland/ny-polines246010659jan24,0,7659189.story

Battle lines were swiftly drawn Friday over the appointment of Kirsten Gillibrand, the pro-abortion rights, pro-Hillary, pro-gay marriage, pro-gun Blue Dog Democrat.

* snip *

But a new Web site was already mobilizing to organize the party's left wing behind a 2010 primary challenge to Gillibrand, organized by Jonathan Tasini, who opposed Clinton in the 2006 primary.

Gillibrand's positions on immigration were deemed "deeply troubling" in a statement issued by the Immigrant Coalition, an umbrella group that estimates it represents one of every five New York residents. The coalition said she backed requiring local police to take on immigration enforcement duties and spending more on border security but appeared to oppose any path to citizenship for undocumented immigrants - "positions that put her at odds with the majority of New Yorkers."

Gillibrand's gun positions have already drawn fire from Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-Mineola), a danger that Democratic strategists said should be taken seriously.

"If she has a primary, she could lose, because the initials 'NRA' are not things that people in New York City and the suburbs wear on chains around their necks," said Democratic strategist Hank Sheinkopf.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who had been a strong supporter of Caroline Kennedy's bid for the Senate, Friday issued a statement noting his "strong disagreement" with Gillibrand on gun control.

"She has voted to keep critical data needed to track illegal gun traffickers from law enforcement, has voted to tie the hands of the ATF, and has also voted to protect dealers who sell guns illegally," Bloomberg said.

[TheWraith]

67. Yeah, she's a Blue Dog. But her record doesn't reflect what people claim it does.

You're not going to find a lot of pro-gay-marriage Blue Dogs, or ones that support needle exchange.When it comes down to it, the "Blue Dogs" are just a club like any other--they don't make you swear a loyalty oath or surrender your spine when you join up. Some members are going to be exactly what we imagine, some aren't. She's clearly one of the latter.

[babylonsister]

8. Aw, jeeze...

[mtnsnake]

12. LOL!!

Good one! :evilgrin:

[ProSense]

15. I thought you were talking about someone truly impressive

Susan Rice:

The Senate by voice vote Thursday confirmed Susan E. Rice as U.S. ambassador to the United Nations.

Rice, 44, one of President Obama's top foreign policy advisers during the presidential campaign, is the second-youngest U.S. ambassador to the United Nations and the first African-American woman to hold the post.

Obama has signaled a desire to develop a closer U.S. relationship with the United Nations, including the elevation of the ambassador job to Cabinet-level status after it was downgraded under President George W. Bush.

Rice earned a doctorate in international relations at Oxford University, where she was a Rhodes scholar. After working as a management consultant at McKinsey and Co., she joined President Bill Clinton's National Security Council staff in 1993 and was involved with issues related to the 1994 genocide in Rwanda, including Clinton's widely criticized decision not to intervene. Rice has said she regretted not doing more to stop the killing in Rwanda.

A protege of former Secretary of State Madeleine K. Albright, Rice was promoted in 1997 to assistant secretary of State for African affairs at age 32, leapfrogging more veteran officials. In that position, which she held until 2001, she was the top African diplomat during the 1998 bombing of U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania by the Islamist militant group al Qaeda.

[mtnsnake]

18. Susan Rice is one of my all time favorites

I've started more than one thread about her. Yeah, she is one of the most competent people on Obama's team, quick, highly intelligent, beautiful, and her voice just blows me away the second she starts talking. She's got it all, too.

[hlthe2b]

37. Susan RIce would be worthy of a future Presidential contention...

Gillibrand's potential remains to be seen... It is hardly sexist to argue for women with demonstrable capabilities and accomplishments to be considered over a relative newcomer, whose potential is long from being clear. What makes her so ripe for consideration now? Her looks? Seems to be a reverse Sara Palin thing going with some men on the "Left." :eyes:

[enough]

41. Yep, that was who came to my mind immediately.

[Captain Hilts]

52. I agree. Let's see how she handles the bright lights. nt

[karynnj]

72. Dr Susan Rice is incredible

Here is a link to her hearing - http://foreign.senate.gov/hearings/2009/hrg090115p.html Just click on the word nominations. In addition to her incredible fluency on any issue brought up - including very broad, almost conceptual questions, it was amazing how she utterly charmed all the Republican members. If you remember, she was an unflappable surrogate for both Kerry and Obama.

I am WAY more impressed by her than KG, who MIGHT become impressive - though for now, she is on track to being something like the second most junior Senator - also Schumer will fight her from getting much limelight.

[Captain Hilts]

21. No friend of Alfonse D'Amato is a president of mine. nt

[Aviation Pro]

22. Ms. Gillibrand may well become President one day.....

...but that day is 20 years downstream. Unfortunately, politics has morphed into American Idol where we have to weather the pretty to get to the substance. This holds true for every candidate (with the exception of John McCain) that I saw last year. It's not that they want to go Hollywood, its that they have to in order to appeal to the lowest common denominator (you know, the ones who salivate over the latest from Brangelina).

What President Obama will bring to the table for the next eight years is a reindoctrination to seriousness in our discourse. If he does, that will keep Ms. Gillibrand out of the running until she takes on the visage of the serious - much like her mentor, Madam Secretary Clinton.

Oh, and for the record, I believe Secretary Clinton will make a fine candidate in 2016.

[mtnsnake]

26. Good post

You might be right. The only thing that could keep Kirsten from the promised land is if the Goddess of Peace runs herself in 2016. We'll have to see what happens.

:thumbsup:

[girl_interrupted]

33. Did you see her in Harlem yesterday?

She has a very natural way with people, very warm, very open. Very pleasant speaking voice, very intelligent, you have to be impressed with her knowledge of the issues. She reminds me of Hillary Clinton, in that respect, but I think she looks like Tipper Gore! She's very pretty!


Her educational background is very impressive too..graduated magna cum laude from Dartmouth, majored in Asian studies and spent a semester in China, speaks Chinese. Don't tell me that isn't going to go over big in Chinatown!

Just found out about her grandmother Polly Noonan, didn't know they were related, she was key player in Democratic politics, founded the Albany Democratic Women's Club.

She wasn't my choice, but I'm willing to give her a chance. If President Obama can change his mind about same sex marriage and FISA and Dennis Kucinich on the Bailout: "I'm not just gonna vote no, I'm gonna vote ...hell no!" I think there may be room for Kirsten to change her views on gun control.

[mtnsnake]

44. No I didn't, but what a nice post. Thank you for being so open minded!

:thumbsup:

[Grateful for Hope]

45. Really!

:rofl:

[Autumn]

46. I listened to her and looked up

some information on her. I like her.

[yourguide]

48. Ugh

Mtn, love you but I must respectfully disagree.

Besides not liking some of her more right leaning stances, this scares the hell out of me:

“Nobody really likes her,” sniped one New York City-area member, speaking on condition of anonymity.
“She's smart and capable, but she's rubbed people the wrong the way,” said another.

If she cant work with her members own party, no way she can work with the republicans either (not that I'm super concerned about the rethugs). Now is the time for everyone to pull together as a team.

[mtnsnake]

57. Yeah, but

a lot of people said the same things about the Goddess of Peace, and look where she is now. :shrug:

:hi:

[ClassWarrior]

59. Where IS Cindy Sheehan, now that you mention her?

NGU.

[biopowertoday]

68. doing very well for herself and for her country.

[Divine Discontent]

71. amen to that! EOM

[Sultana]

54. Hell NO!

[Pisces]

58. Don't hold your breath.

[nemo137]

70. Is there something magical about female senators from New York?

Clinton, obviously, but I saw posts about Kennedy being the first woman pres when her name was at the top of the list, now Gillibrand.

[baldguy]

76. Palin/Gillibrand 2012!