I am sorry for my fellow DUers from California, but I am glad to see Arnold FAIL!!!

[KansasVoter]

I was so sick of the media loving him that I cannot help but be happy CA is going broke under his leadership!

More Republican Fiscal Responsibility on display!!

[avaistheone1]

1. I can't stand Arnold, but the price tag of having him fail for the poor

and disabled is unconscionable. Did you know that families on welfare are no longer going to get their checks, nor will the disabled. They can just pound dirt to survive.

I take no pleasure in these people's pain.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

2. He is presiding over a hidious financial debacle

that undermines his Republican talking points about how government is just a business and a businessman can run it - just like Mr. MBA Bush.

No, the functions of government far surpass business and that's why it is called GOVERNMENT. I don't want anyone to suffer, but perhaps we can finally start to put some of the Republican mythology about economics and the role of governance in the dustbin of history.

[AtomicKitten]

3. We voters smacked down several ballot initiatives he arrogantly put out there a few years ago

Considering the way he swooped into office on the back of Enron's rape of California's economy, Schwarzenegger has gradually become more and more impotent. Rumor has it Diane Feinstein is thinking of running for governor next, and ironically Schwarzenegger is the more liberal of the two.

[Lucinda]

4. I don't want to see any politician fail. Regardless of party.

There is just too much at stake.
But I do get your point.

[alwysdrunk]

42. Yeah, really. This shit is supposed to be PUBLIC SERVICE not a popularity contest

I want Republicans to succeed to their highest potential. If they're doing what they're supposed to do and they succed then we succeed with them. Partisanship can go to far sometimes.

[Dreamer Tatum]

5. Glad he could sate your desire for shameful joy

The millions of unemployed and hungry people in California are bowing in your direction; feel free to throw roses
for their performance on your behalf.

Jerk.

[ronnykmarshall]

28. I'll second that!

[Yes We Did]

6. Then I equate you to Rush Limpballs.

Same premise. Very Un-American. You should not wish for any public official to fail as he has. Their failure only hurts your fellow citizens.

[mtnsnake]

10. Oh come on

The OP worded it to the effect that he didn't want to see California fail, but was glad that IF it failed, it was under a Repuke and not a Democrat. I just don't think he made that clear enough.

Besides, I'll bet there are very few people on this forum who want to see Schartzenager succeed.

[Yes We Did]

12. "I am sorry for my fellow DUers from California, but I am glad to see Arnold FAIL!!!"

No... the OP didn't.

OP said "sorry"

That doesn't cut it.

Limpballs is out there every day saying he hopes Obama fails for political expediency. That is exactly what the OP is saying about the Govenator.

She is glad he failed... for political expediency.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

13. Also....

This debacle can not be laid totally at the feet of Arnold. He has had lots of help fucking the place up. I would like to see Diane Feinstein go away. She is no better than the money grubbing Republicans. She started out, years and years ago as a social liberal and has become a corporatist. I will not vote for her again.

[Harry Monroe]

19. I would like to see California succeed

And if Arnold has to succeed to do so, so be it. Don't be hypocritical. Rush wants to see Obama fail, ergo America fails. I believe that to be very selfish, short-sighted, and vaguely treasonous.

BTW, most Republicans, if they follow the governing model of Bush, are bound to fail anyway. It has nothing to do with us wishing this upon them; if they use Bush as a model, they are setting themselves up as failures. Fortunately for California, Schwartzenegger does not follow Bush's failed governing model.

[NYC_SKP]

27. I want to see Schwarzenegger succeed.

I live here, whoever is governor I want to succeed.

Davis was monumentally weak, Wilson and Deukmejian were typical Republicans.

Schwarzenegger has not been all bad, I support for example his clear action on climate change and support for renewables and green technologies.

:patriot:

[Johonny]

35. He's been all bad

The single thing Californians place him in office to do was fix the economics of the state. He hasn't done it. Worse he has failed to get his own parties support for anything. Even when he had his "good" first year he failed to pressure his party to make changes. He was so popular he probably could have defeated the super majority road block. But instead decided to spend his capital pushing through more bonds to pay for stuff. Just delaying the debt down the road. He's been a total failure on same sex marriage as well. His mythical hydrogen highway was nothing but a pipe dream. And he passed a lot of nice liberal programs that did nothing but jack up the state debt because he never backed the funding for them. Many of these things getting passed through props anyways with only token support from him. His biggest test as governor he back Bush twice and McCain. The only hope for fixing the economy was a good national economy and he backed the men that drove the country into the ground. The man has been horrible and needs to go.

[nichomachus]

7. I beg to differ, but Arnold is NOT failing

The goal of Grover Norquist and the neo-liberals has always been to bankrupt governments at all levels, so that they would be forced to do away with public services, entitlement programs, public education, public health, you name it. Their ultimate goal is the dismantling of Medicare and Social Security. Once that's complete, they will have destroyed America as we know it -- and that's what the traitors have always wanted.

What's happening in CA is happening all across the country -- and it was all planned. In the eyes of the neo-liberals, Arnold has been a smashing success.

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

17. Your post

should come with a warning.

[riqster]

21. Apologies for the phraseology

Being an advocate for the homeless all these years has shortened my fuse when it comes to heartless bastards like Arnie and Grover, who smile so sweetly as they destroy the lives of so many innocents. I will endeavor to be less gratuitously profane in the future.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

22. It is just that

I got the actual, mental image of what you suggested... I can not un-ring the bell. :)

[riqster]

24. That would be a horrible visual, at that.

:beer: might help to cleanse the grey matter.

[SoCalDem]

45. Started with Ronnie.. before Ronnie, things were pretty good in CA

since then we've been like a pinball machine ball, careening from one bad "bumper" to another...and it's now gone "TILT!" on us :(

[ContinentalOp]

56. Thank you, it drives me crazy that people can't see this.

Bush played this "oops I screwed up" card a lot to obscure the fact that 9/11, Katrina, the economic meltdown, ALL WENT ACCORDING TO PLAN!

[GentryDixon]

8. This is no different than Limbaugh wanting Obama to fail.

Is it?

[Kahuna]

9. Rut roh...

:popcorn:

[QueenOfCalifornia]

11. Not me

I do not like seeing what is happening.

Several schools in the SDUSD (San Diego Unified School District) are slated for closure. What this means is the smaller, neighborhood schools close, teachers and other school workers lose their jobs, kids are bussed to big schools with more gang problems, larger classroom size and less and less interaction with the parents of the kids - We just went to bat for our small school where our 2 elementary age kids go. We are very involved with our school and know most of the kids by site. Our children know all of the names of the administration and they feel comfortable and safe there. Even though it is rated as one of the best public schools in the district academically - it was going to be shut down. We hung on by the skin of our teeth but they could still decide to close it down.

The huge lay offs across the state are causing the most home foreclosures ever in the history of The State. People are crowding the shelters and families are hitting the streets and can look forward to absolutely no help from this once prosperous State.

Arnold is not as far to the right as most people may think but he underestimated the difficulty in running our State - Natural disasters and the Bush administration has taken its toll.

For you to be happy is unrcontionable. I would much rather have Arnold be a success and have our State be as great as I know it can.

For example, Arnold is pro-choice & pro stem cell research --- Not too many Republicans can make those claims - I am no fan of the governator but I am not the kind of person who willingly hopes for failure just so I can revel in my own "I told you so" moment.

[YvonneCa]

15. What a lousy thing...

...to say.

[tishaLA]

16. Thanks Rush!

Should we take solace in the fact that Brownbeck and Roberts represent you, too?

[traxster]

18. I thought he was trying to show

how obscene what Rush said was by applying that same logic to Arnold. I don't think he actually meant that he hopes Arnold fails. Atleast I hope that is what he was trying to do...otherwise that is a pretty crappy thing to say.

[Harry Monroe]

20. Then a sarcasm tag should have been used. Otherwise I take the OP writer as being serious.

[nini]

23. Again.. a Black/White view of a situation

It's not just Arnold.. it's mostly the evil repuke members of the legislature who view Arnold as far too liberal so they have no interest in working with him. Arnold is 'failing' mostly because of them.

I'm no huge fan of him, but most of the blame lies at the feet of the republican representatives who want more tax cuts for their wealthy friends, and the aftermath of Prop 13 coming to an ugly head.

On another note - finding happiness in millions of people on the verge of losing jobs, homes etc.. is hardly a Democratic view.

How would it sound to you if someone hopes a nice tornado comes through Kansas and wipes out the state completely since it's a red state?

[rvablue]

25. In the future, any Governor of California, Republican or Democrat will fail

until the legislators get the political backbone to overturn Prop. 13 because the people of California sure aren't going to do it themselves through a ballot initiative.

Prop. 13 has destroyed the municipal tax base in CA.

Enron didn't help, either.

[jberryhill]

44. Nailed it - the job of Governor of CA is unwinnable

The people of California fascinate me.

They have made the state impossible to run, and then blame the governor time and time again.

[Zorro]

60. How has Prop 13 destroyed the municipal tax base?

Seems to me Prop 13 provides a foundation that the municipalities can use to accurately forecast tax revenues and estimate budgets.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

61. Well you see...

we are apparently supposed to pay even more tax on our property - even though it is insanely high now... Don't you get it? :shrug:

Look - I am no expert on how the prop-13 thing worked out - I do know that it has helped to keep our property taxes lower - THANK GAWD. If we paid any more in property tax we would be out of our house... How much is fair? We pay a huge fee to live here and we never whine or moan about it because it is part of the deal - But come on, we are drowning in taxes as it is... I swear, something will give out and it may be us before this is over.

Our tax is over a thousand dollars a month. How can we afford to pay that? I dunno.... Our mortgage is crazy... More than double the tax but guess what? We bought our house before the giant housing bubble went mad - We can not really afford to pay over a grand a month in tax for this place but the option is to move to someplace where we will not have a job or retire to someplace in the middle of the country where none of us are from... This is home for us.

I have read about prop-13 and why it came about - I see the issue as saving us from taxing us out of existence.

Let me know if you have some insight... I'd be happy to know.

[Zorro]

66. Prop 13 seems eminently reasonable to me

Paying property tax on the purchase price of the home, with a max 2% increase in assessed value per annum, means that municipalities should be able to use that information and statistical trends to estimate their future revenues.

Eliminating the 2% cap would lead to arbitrary and wide-ranging valuations that would really screw up budget calculations, in addition to causing the personal financial challenges you mention. There's the additional Mello-Roos tax on new developments that was created to pay for new infrastructure and lasts for 15 years, so Prop 13 doesn't strictly limit the amount California homeowners pay for their properties every year.

I agree with Prop 13, and was wondering why those who apparently aren't California homeowners think it's some whacked-out policy.

[rvablue]

69. If you can, get your hands on a copy of

"Paradise Lost" by Peter Schrag.

You live in CA, so your local library should have a couple of copies.

It is a must read and is so well written.

I was the poster who wrote that all CA guvs are screwed (budget wise) until Prop. 13 is overturned.

With that said, I totally understand your situation. I lived in CA for almost a decade. It was an eye opener to move here to VA and pay less for essentially everything.

So, I don't make my pronouncement easily or with a hard heart.

But because of the freeze and slight annual increases on property taxes, per 13, the state has had to use a huge percentage of it's budget on public schools. Prop. 40, I think it is (??), was ALSO passed by CA voters and requires, I think, that 40% of the state budget must go to pay for schools.

And another thing that is coming your way in regards to Prop. 13 has to do with the crashing housing market in the central valley. In a year or two, people will come back and be buying up those abandoned/foreclosed houses for a a song. And their property taxes will be frozen at that bargain basement price, further eroding the tax base.

Anyway, I'm no expert on this and hope that my response doesn't come off as a lecture. It wasn't meant to be. But please go check out "Paradise Lost" -- it's an eye-opener.

[NYC_SKP]

26. How very Rush Limbaugh of you.

It really is quite the same as wanting to see Obama fail.

That you are taking any joy in our fiscal misery is really disgusting.

If you knew anything about California's politics you'd understand that this can't be laid at Arnold's feet

:wtf:

AND, for the record, I hope things are always good in Kansas, regardless of your governor's party affiliation.

:eyes:

[KansasVoter]

29. All of you whiners.........

I am not glad CA is failing, just like I am sad the national economy is failing. But the fact that the nation crisis makes Bush look like the idiot that he is does not make me sad!

Arnold is an arrogant jerk! It could not have happened to a nicer guy!

[traxster]

30. Dude...seriously...

Look at the bigger picture! We do want to be on top as democrats, but damned if I want it to be on the backs of people who are suffering. We can't even begin to stoop to their level with such logic. We should never want anyone to fail for political gain especially when there is so much in stake.

[KansasVoter]

32. Dude......

If I had said 6 months ago I want CA to be 47 billion in debt so Arnold looks bad then that would be different!

If Arnold had saved the economy in CA, I would not have been upset about him saving it. I would have been happy!

What I am glad to point out is how Arnold and all of the GOP said they were "Fiscal" experts and the dems were tax and spend liberals who know nothing about the economy. Since CA is already 47 billion in debt then I am glad to put part of the blame on the guy running the show who also has been an arrogant jerk for the last few years!

If Arnold turns around the CA economy I will be happy! But I think it will take Obama to do it!

[YvonneCa]

36. California's debt is because of Enron...

...AND because Arnold had our duly elected Governor, Gray Davis (who would have fixed it by raising car registration fees before things got out of control) recalled. Now HE'S talking about fixing things by raising the same taxes...years later.

If California's economy improves, Arnold will have NOTHING to do with it...it will be because Obama's decisions reflect his understanding of what ALL the Repubs fiscal policies have done to hurt the economy at all levels...state, federal, municipal, county,international, etc.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

33. Name calling....? That isn't at all appreciated.

You posted a mean spirited OP and now you call those who disagree with you "whiners." Excuse the fuck out of me but I live here and I want to see whoever is running the shop to do well.

Do you know our governor? You are acting like this is personal between you and him.

Just for laughs - On a personal level, I have met Arnold... twice. Once prior to him being the governor, once after. He came across as intelligent and did not come across as arrogant. I may not agree with all of his politics but I did not find him to be "an arrogant jerk!" Now if you want to talk about arrogant jerks who have power and live in CA, let's agree that Duncan Hunter and his newly elected moron of a son qualify. We have some problems but honestly, our governor is less harmful than most of them... We had the pleasure of having Ronald Reagan serve out 2 lovely terms - That was a catastrophe. There is a long line of Republicans and Democrats alike who have set out to "fix" our state and who have only made the wound deeper and stinking of infection... It isn't funny at all and I am not known as a "whiner."

I think you should reconsider the whiner label and understand where those of us who live here are coming from.

[YvonneCa]

34. Well you didn't say that...

...very well: "I was so sick of the media loving him that I cannot help but be happy CA is going broke under his leadership!"


I don't like Arnold, either...and I'm not whining.

[Shakespeare]

46. Your words: "I cannot help but be happy CA is going broke under his leadership!"

A bit late to change your story. Those of us suffering actual pain under the current state budget crisis are so happy we can entertain you. :sarcasm:

[cboy4]

65. You're disgusting.

:puke:

[Igel]

31. Nope.

I read a little op-ed piece recently about those who want various politicians to fail, and whether or not they were "patriotic".

Its big point: "Fail" implies some achievement that they're trying for, and hoping they don't achieve it. Hoping that a politician fails obligatorily includes the achievement; however, usually those saying it are too unaware of what they mean or don't want to say what they mean.

You can want a politician to fail at his goals, or you can want him to fail at governing. There's a marked difference between the two, and it's always good to consider one thing: Are your political goals to have a free, happy, prosperous citizenry, or are your political goals to make sure your party is in charge? For some, they can't see that there's any possibility that these are different things; they don't have politics, they have beliefs. Their politics are necessarily the One True Way, built into the nature of things, and not just what they consider to be the methods most likely to lead to their real goals (a free, happy, prosperous citizenry). Others think that the two goals can be different; some still want power over patriotism; others want the citizenry to be free, happy, and prosperous, even if it means accepting politics they thought flawed and rejecting politics they thought good.

I'm firmly in the latter camp.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

37. We're all "ECONOMIC GIRLIE MEN," didn't you know?

How Maria can fuck that man, I don't know. He's a racist. A Nazi, and a washed-up, drug-addled has-been who vilified Gray Davis and got lucky.

[SidneyCarton]

38. Arnolds failure will be cold comfort

To those Californians who spend the next year as connoisseurs of life under freeway overpasses.

[Xolodno]

39. Excuse me, your intelligence is showing.

To sit there and say the economic mess is all Arnolds fault is...well, ludicrous. And to be happy about his failure...well, that's just psychopathic. Plus, it shows how much knowledge of the governors power you know about, believe it or not, he's not a dictator.

If you lived in CA and payed attention you would know that. The current issues are heavily related to the current economic crises, you could have Obama as governor and still have much of the same mess.

And yes, because of Prop 13 revenue streams are not stabilized which makes it even more difficult and of course when Arnold put up his Propositions....was kind of sad to see the redistricting fail. You have districts gerrymandered to be solid Republican and Democrat. And NO Republican is going to vote for a tax increase because they'll be thrown out by another Republican (OMG He's a RINO!). And you won't see any Democrat vote to cut spending that benefits there district for the same reason (OMG He's a DINO!). Plus a budget that needs a 2/3rds majority to pass = Persistent Deadlock even the governor can't do anything about. Except maybe get the National Guard to surround the legislature and not allow them to leave until they agree on a budget.

California needs better political districts that encourage competition between the political parties (something he wanted and many republicans and some democrats didn't). And a way to reform Prop 13 that allows stable revenue flows to the state but at the same time still protects people from being taxed out their own homes.

Oh and hate to break it to you, but Arnold does have some success under his belt, he's (with the help of many others) made enough investments to place California in a good position for renewable energy markets and job industry. Eventually, they should pay off (particularly since Bush is no longer in office). If he was a Bush cronie he'd be screaming "Driell hyar and driell now! Hasta va lista!"

But, his term ends soon enough and there is a very good chance we may get governor that is considered by many more conservative that Arnold...by name of Diane Fienstien, go figure.

[kiva]

40. I've read some nasty OPs on DU, but this may be the worst.

"Happy" that millions of Californians are suffering?

OK, to make your day complete we in Nevada are also under financial siege from our Republican governor. His current budget calls for cuts that will shut down the state's university and college system (cuts ranging from 35% to 52% per institution), a 6% cut for all state employees, and slash and burn for the majority of state funded programs. Since our governor is also a Republican, this should make you ecstatic.

[Shakespeare]

47. Yep. That is supremely fucked up.

Among other problems, we're dealing with a 10% unemployment rate here in Los Angeles county, and foreclosures are skyrocketing. I'm sure all those families tossed out of their homes find it HILARIOUS that Arnold is getting bad press.

:puke:

[Beacool]

41. Rush, is that you?

:eyes:

[Born_A_Truman]

43. IOUs

When my teacher-husband gets an IOU instead of a paycheck, we won't be smiling. One of the "solutions" is to cut 5 days off the school year to save money. The teachers will have to still cover the entire year's course, just 5 days short. NCLB testing has already messed things up because the tests have things on them that teachers now have to jump ahead to cover so their students won't fail the testing. And, since the testing doesn't affect their grade, many students don't care if the pass it. What a mess.

My grandchilden will lose their after school program if the budget doesn't pass. My daughter is a single mother and she works until 5:30pm. With no after school program the kids will be on a dark playground unless she can find/afford an alternative. She can barely pay the mortgage and buy food as it is.

I understand how Prop 13 has put a limit on raising taxes but I also remember back pre-Prop 13 when propterty taxes went up year after year until people couldn't afford to keep their homes because they couldn't afford their taxes. There has to be a reasonable solution so this doesn't happen either.

[Raine]

48. You and Rush

are two of a kind, how very unAmerican of you, take your phoney "sorry for fellow DUer's from California" and shove it!!! :grr:

[RFKHumphreyObama]

49. I can take no pleasure in Republicans failing

Because when they fail/screw up, we suffer and pay the price for generations to come. That was true with Raygun, it will likely be true with Chimpy and is probably the case with Ah-nuld.

That's all the more incentive to keep them out of office in the first place

[Starry Messenger]

50. Weak.

[Lilith Velkor]

51. Happy to see you

[Piperay]

52. You make me sick

take your phoney sympathy and rotate on it!

[Skittles]

53. not able to take any pleasure in it

that bastard will be just fine - it's the little people who pay the price

[OhioBlue]

54. not me. this isn't a game. it is people's lives.

I'm not happy that CA is going broke.
I'm not happy that our Country went to shit under *
and I am not happy that Ohio is also broke.
so is the County
so is the City.
laying off firefighters, police officers, closing the county home, gutting the extension office, etc. the Department of Job and Family services doesn't have enough people to handle the case load and their computer system keeps crashing. oh - and we have a Dem Gov, a Republican Legislature, a Republican Board of county Commissioners and a Republican Mayor. It all sucks. I don't want any of them to fail because it harms people.

[Odin2005]

55. California is degenerating into a sad joke.

You guys need to get rid of Prop-13 and that BS rule that says you need a 2/3 majority to raise taxes. Anti-Tax BS is destroying your state.

[YvonneCa]

57. Here's the deal. I'll stop making fun of your state...

...if you stop making fun of mine. ;)

[ContinentalOp]

58. Yeah, or maybe it's ENRON and fucking ARNOLD!

You ever think about that? How come CA always gets shit on because of our property tax rules (I pay $8000 a year in property taxes thank you very much!) but people ignore all of those other states who don't have any sales or income taxes. We got fucked by REPUBLICANS PERIOD.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

62. Anti tax?

are you sure?

We pay a fortune in property tax, sales tax, state income tax.... I must have not found the low-tax loophole. Jeesh. Someone clue me in.

We had to pay over $12.000 in property tax in December... Merry fucking Christmas. I swear, it is insane... Our sales tax is crazy... the cost of gas, electricity every-fucking-thing...

But if you say so... add some more shit on just for fun. More taxing is just what we need here. We can barely afford to keep just the one car we have that is 10 years old... the list is long and I will not belabor the point but I take exception to someone telling me we do not pay our fair share... that can't be right. Not for us middle Americans anyway... Perhaps the very wealthy but not us normal working stiffs.

As a social liberal I want to pay my "FAIR SHARE." BUT... I do not want to be impoverished by the time we get our paycheck.

[Hekate]

63. What Queen said. All that and the lingering effects of the rape by Enron. We're taking a pay cut too

Mr. H is several years from retirement as a community college prof. Our savings -- mutual funds, IRAs, you-name-it, have tanked in the worst possible way. That pension means something to us, and he's about to take a 2% pay cut -- that is, if there's anything to cut in the first place. He could be teaching for free in February. The 2% has it's own ripple effect -- the retirement pension is calculated on the last 3 years of work, so the pension will go down proportionately.

We Californians pay our fair share and then some. Unlike Alaska, California is a donor state, giving more in federal taxes than we ever get back.

Hekate
:argh:

[ContinentalOp]

59. The problem is that nobody will ever blame him. They'll all forget, the media will do their job...

and we'll elect another Enron-connected Republican criminal to replace him.

[cboy4]

64. You're a sick fuck.

[Still Sensible]

67. I know Arnold is hated by some

but that California governor's job is nearly impossible. Between the anti-any-tax folks that rammed through unworkable models in the 80s to the government-by-referendum that has crippled real progress since the 90s, he's up against the wall.

Yes, he absolutely screwed up when he tried to cram those referenda down voters' throats--the position against the nursing profession among others. But, as an outsider looking in, it appears he has governed more like a moderate democrat than a real republican, much to the chagrin of the Orange county type thinkers.

And I think it is in poor taste and callous to the people hurting in California to wish failure on the governor.

[AlCzervik]

68. you suck.