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"End The Honeymoon" - why the left needs to start pushing Obama like the GOP & centrists do

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camera obscura Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:19 PM
Original message
"End The Honeymoon" - why the left needs to start pushing Obama like the GOP & centrists do
There are many good things to say about the stimulus bill. But all in all, it wasn't as good as it could be: It's probably too small and too skewed toward tax cuts, and particularly cuts for upper-income people who won't necessarily spend them. The bank bailout is, well, a mystery, but at best a political fiasco. What's the problem here?

I'll give the three obvious answers before saying what I think is the fundamental problem: First, as for the administration, Obama didn't get out on the stump soon enough to explain why government spending is essential, and his Treasury Secretary doesn't at this point appear up to the job. Secondly, the Congressional Republicans either don't know any economics or are willing to put the country at risk to advance their own party's fortune. Third, Senate Majority leader Harry Reid failed again--the previous instance was over the auto bailout--to use the power of his position to win support for Democratic initiatives.

But I think the main reason that Obama is having trouble is that there is not a popular left movement that is agitating for him to go well beyond where he would even ideally like to go. Sure, there are leftwing intellectuals like Paul Krugman who are beating the drums for nationalizing the banks and for a $1 trillion-plus stimulus. But I am not referring to intellectuals, but to movements that stir up trouble among voters and get people really angry. Instead, what exists of a popular left is either incapable of action or in Obama's pocket.

The labor movement, for instance, has not recovered from the split between the AFL-CIO and Change To Win. To make matters worse, the unions themselves--in particularly, SEIU and Unite Here--are rent by division. As a result, the unions have either been on the sidelines during the debate over the stimulus and bank bailout or uncritically backing Obama and Reid. One labor group, Americans United for Change, which is backed by the American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees (AFSCME), even ran ads thanking Susan Collins, Olympia Snowe, Ben Nelson, and Arlen Specter for agreeing to back the stimulus bill that they had significantly weakened.

A member of one liberal group, Campaign for America's Future, pronounced the stimulus bill "a darn good first step." MoveOn--as far as I can tell--has attacked conservative Republicans for opposing the bill, while lamely urging Democrats to back it. Of course, all these groups may have thought the stimulus bill and the bailout were ideal, but I doubt it. I bet they had the same criticisms of these measures that Krugman or The American Prospect's Ezra Klein or my own colleagues had, but they made the mistake that political groups often make: subordinating their concern about issues to their support for the party and its leading politician.

What, you might ask, would have been the result if these groups had gone after Obama and Reid--and in the case of the so-called Americans United for Change--the self-appointed centrists? They would have certainly incurred the wrath of the Obama administration. I know this myself. One Obama press person recently asked a mutual acquaintance, "Why does John Judis hate us?"

But they would have also moved the political debate to the left, so that the center no longer resided somewhere in Susan Collins or Ben Nelson's heads, but considerably to their left. Suddenly, a $900 billion bill without the AMT and with expanded health insurance for the unemployed would have looked like a compromise. These angry leftists would have actually done the Obama administration an enormous favor.

MORE: http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=5bff5e94-6fa6-4a69-9ff2-8f08cb437ccc
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R! nt
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:22 PM
Response to Original message
2. It is unfortunate when reporters like this one exclude Media Manipulation in their analysis.....
as this renders their analysis short of the actual reality as to why President Obama cannot get EXACTLY what he wants when he wants it.
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. not about Obama
The world does not revolve around Obama, and all opinions are not primarily about either loving or not loving Obama. The writer is talking about the absence of pressure on the politicians from the political Left, not about "what Obama wants" nor about the media.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. And, thank goodness the world doesn't revolve
about your shit analysis of Obama.
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. hah
Well I agree with that.

I didn't express any analysis of Obama.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. The title of this thread has "Pushing Obama" in it........
as it reads....."End The Honeymoon" - why the left needs to start pushing Obama like the GOP & centrists do.

Either you are in the wrong thread, or you ran out of things to say.
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. pretty hard to avoid that
Edited on Fri Feb-13-09 03:38 PM by Two Americas
The article is about pushing the Democrats to the Left. Pretty hard to do that without mentioning the Democratic president.

It is not primarily about Obama - his career, his personality, who loves him and who doesn't.

I understand that some here scan everything, and when they see any mention of the president immediately assess whether it is sufficiently flattering or not, and then respond solely upon that basis. That is the problem I am trying to point out here. It is making it difficult to discuss anything.

Can we talk about pushing the party to the Left, and any other political subject, providing we never mention the president or use the word "Obama?" Would we then escape your wrath?
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. The problem with having a discussion with you is how you commented on my post.....
I mention the media's role in shaping public opinion and how they are part of the problem not mentioned in this article, and you come back with "this isn't about Obama".

In otherwords, you are responding with a non response to my comment....and I'm not into those kinds of debates.

It's one thing to have a discussion, it is quite another when someone decides to respond without addressing your point.
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. we agree about the media
Edited on Fri Feb-13-09 04:39 PM by Two Americas
We disagree about how we are to best support the new administration. I think your approach is a threat to the success of the new administration. You think mine is.

You said "President Obama cannot get EXACTLY what he wants when he wants it" because of the media. I am saying that Obama getting what he wants when he wants it is not the primary issue here. He is an office holder in a representative democracy, is a Democrat, and works for us. The issue of pressuring the party from the Left does not revolve around the career of any one politician or office holder. We elect politicians to provide for what the people need, not for what the politician wants.


...
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. We agree about the media, and so you could have stated that.....
but instead you decided to disagree with me about something I had not even mentioned.

And Obama getting what he wants is in response to the article stating that somehow he should be able to get it, and my point was why he wasn't; the media working hand in hand with the GOP.

In the end, I'm noticing that whatever I say, whether you disagree or not, you'll focus on the disagreement (even if you are disagreeing with something not apparent from my post) without acknowledging any agreement. I dislike this approach of yours...as I don't feel like being forced in defending posts that you agree with, for the most part.
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RepublicanElephant Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. "the media working hand in hand with the GOP."
BINGO!!!
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. sure
But what does that have to do with "why the left needs to start pushing Obama like the GOP & centrists do?" Not saying there isn't a connection, but what is the connection?
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. I am trying
I am trying to find areas of agreement and talk about those. I don't get a very good response when I do, as on your thread about how fortunate we are to have Obama in the White House the other day.

You jump all over anything anyone posts that you deem critical of Obama. Why can I not respond to ideas that I think are destructive to the future success of the new administration? You post when you disagree with someone. Why can I not do the same?
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. Why you are mentioning some other thread here, I'll never know.....but
On that other thread that you are mentioning....your initial post was not rebuffed by me...and in fact, I encouraged your post. Remember? But what did happen following those posts is, if you would recall, that your friend came in and decided to berate me out of the blue without being provoked in that thread.....and you decided to side with him on the merit of his argument against my character.

But now we are here in this thread, and yet here you are accusing me of jumping "all over anything anyone posts that you deem critical of Obama." It is as though the substance as to what I state takes 2nd place to the fact that I often agree with Barack Obama....which appears to make me your automatic enemy, which in itself is just plain weird! Just so you notice, this thread here wasn't about me, my post wasn't about me, and yet, here we are.....discussing what I'm alleged to have done elsewhere.

What's that about? :shrug:


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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. not at all
Edited on Fri Feb-13-09 06:20 PM by Two Americas
I always look for the "substance as to what you state," and that "never takes 2nd place to the fact that you often agree with Barack Obama." I don't even care if you always agree with Obama. My objection has always been to you attacking others for not being sufficiently loyal to Obama, as you define it.

In this case, as I said, I do not think that this subject is primarily about how it might affect Obama's career or image. You posted that Obama couldn't get what he wanted because of the media. That is the substance of your remarks, and that is what I addressed.

I don't think of you as an enemy.

FC, you are the one who posted links to 8 threads or so of mine from months ago. You are hardly one to complain about someone mentioning another thread. I mentioned the other thread in response to your claim that I never mention areas where we might agree.

Over the months when you have posted about race and racism, and how that impacted the election, I agreed with you - always, I think.

You are not the enemy. We disagree about how to best support the new administration, that's all.



...
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Exactly!
It's conveniently forgotten or they just don't think of it.
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. really?
Commentators from the Left are unaware of and never talk about the control of the media by right wing propagandists? Are you serious?
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #12
27. Buzz off..you have nothing to
offer.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
3. Bill Clinton got fucked because his "honeymoon" was truncated.
I say the honeymoon doesn't end until the cabinet is filled out. And it ain't filled out yet.
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
4. this is called a start
people are always pointing fingers but at the present moment I don't there is anyone more qualified than Obama's team! However, in the coming days things can be tweaked. This is just the start. We are all faced with a huge problem.
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Egnever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #4
16. too many lose sight of that
Everything for them must be perfect and immediate.

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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. It isn't about being perfect and immediate...
it's about being steadfast, organized, and keeping one's eye on the prize.
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #16
28. Rome wasn't built in a day
we are dealing with something colossal here
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tpi10d Donating Member (291 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:35 PM
Response to Original message
5. Senate elections 2010
IMO the most beneficial move would be to pick up a couple more D senators in 2 years. I think the stimulus bill illustrated the bottleneck quite clearly.

Tossup states FL, NH, OH, PA, and MO could elect Democrats liberal enough to make a significant difference.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_elections,_2010

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mountainvue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:39 PM
Response to Original message
7. The guy has been president for less than a month.
I think anyone would agree that he is doing a far better job than his predecessor at this point, given his 76% approval rating. Things are tough but this writer needs to get a grip.
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
9. The 'left' has been on stun
Obama's Hope and Change campaign was intoxicating.

Time for the left to sober up, regroup and start holding this administration accountable. That's what happens in interventions.
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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. Oh Bull Roar... Seriously.. Bull Roar..
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-13-09 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Is that a Wall Street rallying cry?
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Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-09 03:10 AM
Response to Original message
29. He had a honeymoon?
Who knew??
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