Will Obama Be Held Accountable for Things he Said During Election

[erpowers]

Will anyone hold Obama accountable for attacking both Hillary Clinton and John McCain for their ideas and then after getting elected moving to support those ideas? I guess I will be flamed, but I wanted to bring this up and I also thought it should be discussed. During the primary campaign Barack Obama criticized Hillary Clinton for wanting to have mandates as a part of her health care reform plan. After getting the nomination Obama criticized John McCain for wanting to eliminate the employer sponsored health care tax exemption. Now that he has been elected Obama supports mandates as a part of health care reform and has sent officials to Congress to inform them that they could raise fund by limiting the exemption on employer sponsored health care.

It is not so much that I am upset that Obama is supporting these ideas because I opposed; I actually opposed mandates, but always supported eliminating the employer sponsored health care tax exemption. I am upset in that I feel Obama at least mislead people and at worst outright lied to people in order to get elected. Obama was supposed to be the candidate that brought did not mislead people; however, it seems to me that Obama is turning out to be just as bad as previous politicans. So, although I did not expect much change from Obama even some of the things he has done during his time in office have surprised me. That is what upsets me. Obama was supposed to be different, but it seems to me that he was not really that different.

I am not saying that I wish John McCain has won the election. However, I think people should be able to hold Obama accountable for saying things during the campaign and then doing other things after being elected.


http://campaigndiaries.com/2009/02/25/health-care-reform/

"To finance health care reform, administration officials suggested to senior aides in Congress on Wednesday that revenues could be raised by ending the policy of excluding the value of employer-provided health insurance from income taxes. But the officials emphasized that the administration was not advocating that option, which not only is anathema to some in organized labor and business but also conflicts with Mr. Obama’s position in last fall’s presidential campaign."
To Pay for Health Care Obama Looks to Taxes on Affluent . New York Times. February 26, 2009.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/26/us/politics/26budget.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1&hp

[Avalux]

1. Why don't you let the President know how you feel?

http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/

He personally reads about 10 letters a day and maybe yours will make it through.

[MiniMe]

2. "Administration officials suggested to senior aides"

But the officials emphasized that the administration was not advocating that option


Who are these "officials". And they suggest it and then say that they aren't advocating the option? Seems like an opinion rather than facts.

By all means, write Obama and tell him you don't support that. But I don't think it is going to happen.

Edited to add:

The administration is proposing a number of other politically contentious ways of offsetting the costs of the health care initiative. Mr. Obama wants to require drug companies to give bigger discounts, or rebates, to Medicaid, the health program for low-income people.

from your source. I read some of it, and it was mentioned along with them talking to Boehner's office.

[dionysus]

3. oh FFS.... get the hell over it already...

:eyes:

[BeyondGeography]

4. Will you give him credit for exactly what he said he'd do during the campaign

like cutting taxes for 95% of Americans, repealing the Bush tax cuts for the wealthiest 2%, and fighting for massive investments in health care, education and energy?

[karynnj]

18. I wish I could recomment this post - he has very quickly moved to

do the big picture things he spoke of.

In the primaries, the policies of all the Democrats were VERY close to each other. All of them were also extremely close to John Kerry's 2004 positions, with Iraq adjusted to a variation of Kerry/Feingold. These were DEMOCRATIC positions. On Heathcare, the positions were not that far from the Gore or Bradley positions in 2000. As a result, the arguments in the primaries focused on details - that really would be resolved only as the Congress and administration wrangled with creating the actual bills.

[HughMoran]

5. "Will anyone hold Obama accountable "

Looks like you are - write him and tell him how you feel.

[Life Long Dem]

6. Yeah, we all should really be getting on Obama...

for his "bittergate" comment! :rofl:

[ejpoeta]

7. if i remember correctly.... i do believe that obama himself said that he wanted people to

hold him accountable. He wants us to give him hell if he doesn't do what he said he was going to do. Now, I am willing to give him time to do what he said he was going to do and to understand that he may not be able to get everything done that he wanted. He can't just do it all himself, he does have to deal with congress on some of it. I am upset at the idea of the health care companies having anything to do with a healthcare bill. i am very upset at the idea that the credit and banking industy could affect the housing stability program. i think the industries congress is trying to do something about should not be able to influence any bills or regulations. period!!

[firedupdem]

8. Not Fair....he stole their ideas. Damned shame

:eyes:

[dionysus]

11. he really is the worst. i wish we had mccain! NOT

[LiberalFighter]

9. Will Republicans and their mouthpieces be held accountable for what they say?

[Beacool]

10. Mandates were the one big difference between their health care plans.

Frankly, all politicians say a lot of B.S. during campaigns, he just happened to be better at it than most.

Without mandates it won't work, that's why she had the support of the AMA and the Nurse's Association. The problem now will be getting the money to finance this plan. Just taxing the rich will probably not be enough to do it. Besides, these are not the best of times even for the wealthy.

;)

[karynnj]

17. Which is why many of us pointed out that the plan for EITHER of them

In terms of what would come out of Congress would be the same. If it couldn't pass with mandates, either would sign such a plan. If mandates were needed - and it could get through Congress, they would be there.

[Beacool]

20. It is not feasible without mandates.

It would be akin to saying that only some people have to contribute to Social Security, but anybody will be able to collect benefits when they reach the appropriate age.

That's why I always thought that it was just political B.S., like all candidates spew at campaigns.

:eyes:

[Peacetrain]

12. Sweet Jesus, What part of the Presidents speech did you miss

"Will anyone hold Obama accountable for attacking both Hillary Clinton and John McCain for their ideas and then after getting elected moving to support those ideas?"


And the day that as a member of the Democratic party, that I have to hold my party "accountable" for attacking the ideas of the Republican party and their canidate during an election is the day

HELL FREEZES OVER

[DevonRex]

13. You sound like a child crying on the playground at recess.

[dionysus]

14. i think he needs one of these;

:rofl:

[DevonRex]

15. Do you have a pacifier picture? I think he needs one of those, too.

:hi:

[karynnj]

16. In both cases, you can make the case that there were things that changed

On taxing employer healthcare, I think this is a mistake. It makes the cost of offering that benefit more expensive. It could cause some companies to drop them which is a very bad result especially as it would likely occur before Obama's plan is in place. It also really penalizes the companies choosing to do right by their employees. It then has a bad societal effect as there are more uninsured people, which is not only bad for them, but it adds to costs for all when they need hospital care. I do see that it is essentially taxfree income to employees.

On mandates, people other than Obama expressed concern that it would be impossible to pass a bill that included mandates in 2009. (In fact the first plan for 2008 that included mandates - included them by 2012. That was Kerry's plan that he put out in July 2006. ( http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=273&topic_id=97587&mesg_id=97611 ) "Experts agree Kerry’s plan will cover all Americans. A mandate will go into effect in 2012 to cover any remaining uninsured. " During interviews at the time of his speech on this, Kerry said that mandates up front could not be passed, but were needed - and would become more politically possible as costs went down. Kerry as a surrogate for Obama said that mandates would make a plan unpassable - and at the time he said it -that was true. (As a good surrogate he played down his view that they might be needed - though when pushed he did say so.)

Three things happened:
- the business council backed mandates (Ivan Seidenberg, CEO of Verizon explained this at a Finance committee hearing. ( http://finance.senate.gov/sitepages/hearing111908.htm ) The degree of support there is extremely strong and important

- we did the best that could have been expected in gaining House and especially Senate seats - likely ending up with 59 Senators.

- the economy DRASTICALLY changed - which completely altered what could be done. Do you thing that FDR could have introduced social security if he were President in a period where the economy was like that Bill Clinton had throughout his terms? Though we were still recovering from a recession, there was not the same level of fear. The current situation has done 2 things - more people lost health insurance. From both those people and others who know them or fear losing their own job, there is more support for universal healthcare insurance. In addition, the costs for the companies insuring people likely go up as rates at hospitals go up to cover charges that have to be written off.

It is increasingly obvious to people, who were previously comfortable, that the current "system" where some are lucky enough to get employer subsidized heathcare insurance is not working and there is a risk that they could simultaneously lose their job and their insurance - and for the most comfortable this comes after seeing their savings rapidly become worth half or less what they were a year ago. People have always said that Americans identify with people wealthier than they - thinking that if they work hard that is the group they will be part of. I suspect that this has changed gradually and in the last year rapidly. People now fear they will move down.

This likely impacts even the upper middle class, which is still far better off than most- there is a difference between being pretty certain of having the well paying job you have and knowing that you have the contacts to get a similar job if necessary and having a stock portfolio that all the nifty economic models showed was more than enough to sustain you through a very comfortable retirement and seeing that all these things are no longer true. If the "winners" of the economic lottery (as of last year) have economic fears for likely the first time in decades, the good side is that those not already inclined to by ideology, religion etc now see the value of safety net programs because of potential fear for themselves.

I suspect that increased perception of vulnerablity was why FDR was able to get his programs through. Obama now is in a similar situation. An incredibly tough time to be President, but a time that demands you be a great President.

[Uzybone]

19. you can hold him accountable in 2012.

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dionysus]

23. enjoy your brief stay PUMA

:hi:

[AtomicKitten]

24. Did you order pizza?

[TTUBatfan2008]

25. I don't think you want to complain about triangulation when you support the Clintons...

they are the MASTERS of political triangulation. Obama is very good at it too and has learned well from them.

[DevonRex]

26. So Mr. Potato Head, you're supposed to be under a bridge.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

41. Haha, SOMEONE is steamed!

[TTUBatfan2008]

22. Here's the problem with your complaint...

You are not understanding political reality. It's called triangulation and it has been going on since the dawn of time in politics. Politicians make promises and break them, as well as taking on the ideas of their opponents after they beat them. It's the way it works. It sucks, but it's not like Obama's the first one to do it.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dionysus]

29. hey troll, go play in traffic

[DevonRex]

30. Ooh, troll post #3.

[dionysus]

32. let's poke it with a stick and see what it does!

:hi:

[DevonRex]

33. Heh.

:hi:

[DevonRex]

35. Ah, the "paper-thin resume" argument. You're really hard up for new material

huh?

Are you gonna bring up his middle name next?

[firedupdem]

36. Go kick rocks loser. You need to get over it. Hillary did. n/t

[TTUBatfan2008]

39. So now the truth comes out...

Don't get me started on the experience issue. Obama had more experience than Clinton as a legislator. But I'm sure you don't want to hear the truth about this. Being First Lady isn't what most people consider valid experience for the Presidency.

And no, he's not different. I've known that for a long time. He's a triangulator just like the Clintons. Welcome to reality. Deal with it and get over the fucking primaries.

[DevonRex]

27. I'm not gonna complain about any move toward single-payer health care.

And my sources say this is where he wants to go. He'll start with a madate and move further to the left if he can.

You got a problem with that?

[flaminbats]

31. Obama supports mandates?

Is this an employer mandate, an individual mandate, or a mandate that insurance companies can no longer deny coverage or charge higher premiums because of a preexisting condition?

What is Obama's plan, who does it cover, and when will it be presented to Congress? :shrug:

Where are you getting your information?

[Rosa Luxemburg]

34. did you ask your former leader Bush?

[DevonRex]

43. Or is this a looney Naderite? Hard to tell when they just wanna use

old primary garbage to stir things up.

[FrenchieCat]

37. Barack Obama is not calling for mandates in health care, nor

is he suggesting that employer paid health Insurance benefits be taxed (which is what McCain supported).

In otherwords, :wtf: are you and the New York Times talking about? :shrug:

[DevonRex]

38. This post has attracted another bridge dweller. This should be fun.

[firedupdem]

40. President Obama's kick ass approval ratings and that wonderful

speech he gave his these fuckers scrambling! :rofl:

[DevonRex]

42. Yep. It makes me really happy to see their desperation.

And it's just SO much fun to kick 'em around. :hi: