Specter: "I Did Not Say I Would Be A Loyal Democrat"

[freddie mertz]

OK Folks.

Maybe most of you have seen or heard about this.

(The video is on the front page, with only a few replies.)

My question is: WTF is going on here?

Is this the sort of "Democrat" that our president has apparently agreed to endorse and campaign for in my state's Sen. primary?

Personally, I'd rather vote for a duck than for this two-timing sleazeball.

What on earth is White House thinking here?



Democrats eager to see what kind of Senator Arlen Specter would be now that he has left the Republican Party likely weren't counting their blessings after watching his appearance on "Meet the Press" this Sunday.

The Pennsylvanian, while insisting that his switch in party affiliation was driven as much by values as politics, nevertheless came out forcefully against two of progressives' most cherished policies.

On the Employee Free Choice Act, which would allow for easier unionization, Specter strongly suggested -- as he did during the speech announcing his party switch -- that he would support a filibuster of the legislation. "I'm still against that bill," he said. "Democrats are all for it. Republicans are all against it. I'm the critical vote. If I see that there are other issues where I feel a matter of conscience, I will continue a filibuster against legislation."

On a public option for health insurance -- which conservatives claim will end the private market, but most observers say could bring down the costs of coverage for millions of Americans -- Specter said he would be in opposition. "That's what I said and that's what I meant," he added later, when asked if he would vote "no" on public health care.

At several other points, Specter did lay out areas in which he had "diverged materially from the Republican line," including raising the minimum wage, the stimulus package and abortion rights. But he went to great lengths to insist that he did not, as reported, tell Democratic leadership or the White House that he would be a loyal party member.

"I did not say," he told host David Gregory, "I would be a loyal Democrat. I did not say that."

Perhaps the strongest evidence of where Specter's sentiments currently lie came when he lamented the fact that, because the GOP lacked a Senate majority from 2006 through 2008, "34 Republican judges" were "left on the table unconfirmed."

{More plus Video]...http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/03/specter-wont-back-public_n_195325.html

[GOPNotForMe]

1. F*** you, Arlen! No one is impressed by your "virtuous" display of independence!

Now I understand why the GOP couldn't stand him...

[freddie mertz]

3. We would have been rid of him in 2010. For sure.

Now if Ridge runs against Toomey in the primary, HE could be the Repub nominee and beat Specter, thus losing the seat.

Great strategy here.

[AlinPA]

44. That will happen unless Joe Sestak runs against Specter. If Joe runs, he beats Ridge.

[depakid]

2. And this surprises anyone?

:shrug:

Cats don't up change their stripes....

[freddie mertz]

4. I'm not surprised by Specter

Though his brazen disregard for even the appearance of cooperation is singular, to ay the least.

What surprises me ( a little anyway) is the apparent indifference of the White house to his "in name only," fake conversion.

If true, it's beyond cynical.

[AtomicKitten]

5. I just watched MtP and Specter is a horse's ass.

He said EFCA eliminates the secret ballot, he will not vote for cloture on Dawn Johnson, and he opposes the public healthcare option.

I am INSULTED that he was promised the Democratic Party machine in his bid for re-election. I'm calling bullshit on that and will support a primary challenge against him. The Democrats are already hamstrung by the Blue Dogs and so-called ConservaDems. No more.

:mad:

[depakid]

13. This is why Greenwald and Nate Silver (among others) rolled their eyes at this development

On the one hand, it was a tweak of the Republican nose- but on the other, it's not going to translate into many substantive differences- and actually hurts the Dems in the long run if the guy's re-elected.

[AtomicKitten]

19. I see no upside on this for the Democrats.

I thought they had secured his vote on healthcare ----> nope. He said he voted against the budget because there was a provision in it to use Reconciliation (aka "Nuclear Option") for healthcare.

He needs to be taken out in the primary because otherwise we are ceding a Senate seat to the wingnuts.

[depakid]

21. Aside from some petty procedural matters, all this does strengthen the Republicrats

Who are BIGGER enemies (and over the longer term hurt the Democratic party and the nation more) than whack Republicans- who everyone now sees for what they are.

[AtomicKitten]

23. Agreed. The 12 that voted against the cramdown amendment proved that.

What surprised me is that they were so up-front about protecting the private sector over the public greater good. How did that mindset permeate the party the way it has? That Third-Way bullshit is GOP mindset in Dem clothing.

[depakid]

25. It's one of the main reasons (if not THE main reason) Dems lost power for so many years

they were perceived to stand for nothing. Unlike Republicans (who did seem to stand up for what they "believed in").

A sizeabl number of Americans- often in key districts have time and again shown that they favor candidates who are willing to stand up and fight for what they believe (even, oddly enough when they don't share the candidates stance on the issue).

That blurring of the contrast- and repeatedly enabling, legitimizing and voting for far right policies was a DOUBLE WHAMMY lose/lose for the Dems- and for the rest of us.

A lesson that's apparently still lost on the likes of Harry Reid.

[TankLV]

57. Yep and the DINOS FORCED anybody to ABANDON any primiary challenges...

I hope a TRUE DEMOCRAT ignores their "gag rule" and steps up NOW so we can run an effective campaign AGAINST that fucking LIEberman wannabe...

[Fire1]

33. This is the problem I have with the BIG tent. The hamstringing

and the one trick ponies.

[TheBigotBasher]

48. I agree.

Significant change does not come about if the Party in Congress remains divided and if it continues to vote against the programme of the President.

President Obama took the NEoCon programme and slammed it into their face.

Capitalism is great if everyone feels that they have a fair opportunity to participate in it. Something denied to them by Bush Republicans.

That means not bankrupting people for health.
It means ending poverty pay.
It means that Republican voting Democrats should have been ashamed of themselves for cutting back on make work pay.

The Democratic Party does not need a Senator with an unreliable vote. If he is not reliable get someone who is. Party loyalty delivers continued political and economic success. No wonder Freepers are happy this fool left them.

[rhett o rick]

70. The Democratic Party machine is clearly in the hands of the DLC/Bayh's Blue Dogs. We need an

organization dedicated to unseating DINO's.

DINO'S MUST GO.

[Uzybone]

6. If he votes against us he will be primaried

its that simple. Its not like there was a contract signed. He was a repub last week.

[LynneSin]

69. I have to agree - there will be some limits to an 'independant Specter'

I think when the vote is on the line for Obama to get the job done (like the Stimulus Bill) you'll see Specter siding with us. But I think there will be some leeway to allow Specter to vote the way he normally would if he was a republican.

[jefferson_dem]

7. He's right. They've said this from the beginning.

Here's an article from the April 30. No rubber stamp...independence...

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-obama-specter30-2009apr30,0,7095273,print.story

Many more -

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGLL_enUS319US319&q=specter+independence

Anyway, thanks for the OP and welcome to DU. :hi:

[freddie mertz]

38. Thanks to you too

I have read the forums for a while, but am a somewhat reluctant poster (plus, I'm always busy).

The hospitality is much appreciated.

[mmonk]

8. Don't worry. We have a dozen or so that aren't Mr. Specter.

In fact, some seem like a loyal opposition on big issues.

[AllentownJake]

9. Great....

Another bitter primary in PA with the PA democratic machine and a grassroots candidate....just what the fuck I wanted next year, like the Governor's race wasn't going to be a head ache enough for me.

[freddie mertz]

39. I moved to PA about 12 years ago from New England

I thought WE had machine politics in my OLD state.

But PA, wow...




:( :crazy: :wtf: :hurts: :cry:

[AllentownJake]

49. Tommorow I'm up for election in the County Party as an officer

That means in 2010, I get to be a tiny pawn in this fucking battle.

[freddie mertz]

53. Well, good luck in your effort.

:hi: :thumbsup: :dem: :fistbump: :patriot:

I'm out in Centre and they just handed the district to the Repubs after the old goat (Peterson) retired.

Rahm's DCCC sent us not a dime.

[Skidmore]

10. I'm sorry, but Biden and Reid did us know favors by sticking us

with Arlen. We could have put a new person out front there and started with a fresh face and perhaps less corruption.

[AllentownJake]

12. This was about Biden and Rendell saving their friend

I'm beginning to see that this had little to do about policy.

[msongs]

11. Dems blow Specter - and what do they get in return? ha ha nta

[stray cat]

14. I've had enough with ideological lemmings in the last 8 years

How about loyal Americans who try to do whats right and display courage instead of lockstep democrats or republicans.

[jefferson_dem]

16. Agreed.

If we demand all Democrats march in lock-step unison, we can't complain when Repugs do the exact same thing. Besides, Obama ran as a post-partisan pragmatist. We should expect he would govern as one as well.

[mmonk]

17. I'll take a lock step real Democratic party any day of the week,

month, or year. This part rightwing one sucks.

[jefferson_dem]

24. When you discover exactly what a "real" Democratic Party is...

please let us know.

I don't mean to be argumentative but what sets us apart (hopefully) is that we are not a Party comprised of Fascistic lock-step unquestioning loyalists but an amalgamation - a cross-section - of America with somewhat diverse political goals and methods.

[mmonk]

26. Pardon me for my snippy attitude. No harm intended.

Since 2000, I've seen only one party be pragmatic and compromising and therefore don't like it much. Under such a construct, I've found low expectations.

[jefferson_dem]

28. Point taken.

I agree that our congressional leaders have been lame as lame can be since 2006. There's really no excuse now. Must see major progress... If all Specter does is get the fuck out the way and help shut down Repug filibusters, I'll be happy.

[Fire1]

36. Which may be to our detriment in the long run. We don't have

to be a cult or lock step fascists but we certainly need to narrow the field.

[Fire1]

34. totally agree.

[rhett o rick]

72. I think there is a long way between "lock-step" and asking that Democrats be true to

our party's platform. Sen Specter doesn't believe in the principles of the Democratic Party and he would be the first one to say so. I believe in having a big tent but republiCons like Specter are not welcome.

[bread_and_roses]

37. But you're OK with dribbling Repub lemming shit while calling yourself a Dem a la Specter?

This has nothing to do with what is "right." Specter knows damn well that Employee Free Choice Act does not eliminate the "secret ballot" and if he still has a functioning brain knows that health care "reform" without at LEAST a public option is no reform at all. This is about answering to his corporate paymasters, who are his real constituents.

I can only hope that Obama has an ace up his sleeve on this one.

[rhett o rick]

71. By your criteria, you would welcome George W. Bush into the party. nm

[LittleBlue]

15. Fine with me. Obama can then reneg on his promise to campaign for him

and support an opponent.

Arlen needs to realize the political realities here, and that he does not really possess a choice in the matter.

[Fire1]

31. He certainly won't do that. n/t

[BlooInBloo]

32. It's not reneging, if one side fails to hold up their end of the deal *first*....

It's a common practice, to make a deal that's hard, but you can live with, with the full expectation that the OTHER guy won't come through, thus freeing you of your obligation, and (hopefully) thereby putting you into a position to pull off a dramatic victory of some kind.

It would be cool if that's what is going on here. Time will tell.

[Vinca]

18. I wish he'd go back where he came from.

But I guess they don't want him either. Vote Sestak.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

20. "I Did Not Say I Would Be A Loyal Democrat"

Well then, why didn't you just declare yourself to be an INDEPENDENT, Arlen? Oh right, you need the money? Well then, show us WHY we should give you the money and clear the field for you? What do YOU bring to the table as a Democrat? We're not lemmings like the GOP is but for crissakes, WHAT are you going to vote with us on?????

[Vinnie From Indy]

22. Specter, like Lieberman, feels ENTITLED to be a Senator

Any politician that feels entitled to their office is not worthy of it.

[rvablue]

35. While it shouldn't have been a surprise, when he said this this morning

I could not believe the unabashed hubris and arrogance of it.

And the way he talks about how he's not going to have his 30 year record "raked over the coals" or whatever he said, all I could think was "Uh, Arlen, we live in a democracy. You are running for office. Your record is always open to criticism, no matter how long you've been there.

I hope Sestek decides to primary him. I can already see that he isn't going to be helpful and doesn't want all Americans to have access to the health care plan that saved his life.



ed: ms. wd.

[freddie mertz]

40. I too was shocked by the depth of his arrogance

Also by the weirdness of his nostalgia for the 1980s, when he "served" (himself, mostly) with other GOP "moderates" like Danforth et al....

Yes, let's all remember his wonderful performance in the Clarence Thomas-Anita Hill hearings...jeez...

[flyarm]

64. why could You " not believe the unabashed hubris and arrogance of it?? "

..this is the same asshole and crook who lied about the death of Kennedy to stop the investigation into the Murder of Kennedy..why would anything he does surprise you or anyone??

Look into MK ULTRA and Specter..and who he is tied to with the dem party and you will find all the answers you need to what is going on!!

How about the bashing of Anita Hill??

[Raineyb]

55. Which is what he said in his speech for the switch

This is exactly what I said to those celebrating. Senator Specter is only interested in getting Senator Specter reelected. He's an opportunist. And the told us he's an opportunist. When people tell you what they are it behooves you to believe them. (Until they prove otherwise)

Regards

[newfie11]

27. I hope he looses his ass on reelection

and takes that trader Ben Nelson(NE) with him, fake democrat that he is.

[Raine1967]

29. Loses, not looses, and I would like to know...

to whom?

We have a serious debate on our hands. Arlen is far less conservative than some of the Blue dog senators.

What we have with him is a simple Blue dog Dem.. Sen style.

The deal is done, It up to us what happens next. Time to really pay attention to Pa.

[Bluenorthwest]

61. Hey Grammer Cop!

Why is it that you capitalize the 'blue' in Blue Dog but not the 'dog'? Have a nice rule book!

[freddie mertz]

66. Don't you mean "grammar" cop?

Grammer is the guy who does the voice of Sideshow Bob.:patriot:

[Beacool]

30. I do not trust Specter.

He's a weasel. He didn't change parties on principle. He switched because he knew that the Republicans were going to run someone against him and his internals showed that he was about to have his butt handed to him on a tray. He went from Democrat to Republican and now back to Democrat for one reason only: to ensure that his sorry backside remained in the senate.

x(

[whopis01]

76. I don't know - I think he can be pretty honest and straightforward

Regarding his decision to switch parties:
"it became apparent to me that my chances to be elected on the Republican ticket were, were bleak. And I'm simply not going to subject my 29-year record in the United States Senate to that Republican primary electorate. I'm not going to do that."

When asked if retaining his seniority after switching parties was an inducement, he responded:
"Well, no, that's an entitlement."

When talking about the upcoming election:
"But I don't want to run against a stacked deck like I would have had to against the Republican primary electorate."

When he was callously accused of claiming that he would be a loyal Democrat, he defended his honor responding:
"No. And you misquote me, David. I did not say I would be a loyal Democrat. I did not say that."

When pressed on that issue, he continued and added in some clarification from other sources:
"I did not say I'm a loyal Democrat. You know, I read once another mistake in the newspaper, some newspaper."

All in all he was pretty honest and straightforward about changing parties to further his own career rather than face a challenge during an election, his view of being entitled to his positions within the Senate, and his steadfast conviction not to be a loyal Democrat.

And on top of all that, his mind must be as sharp as a tack to be able to recall, on the spot, mistakes that he read in the newspaper, some newspaper.

[tucsonlib]

41. Taken Out Of Context

The FULL quote was: "I did not say I would be a loyal Democrat. I'll continue to do whatever it takes to keep my Senate seat. I've never allowed ethics, morality, truth or loyalty to influence the way I vote, and I won't start now. So screw the Democrats, screw the Republicans, screw my constituents....and for that matter, screw you all!"

"thanks for yer support and contributions. god bless ya. god bless the u.s.a.
and remember - a vote for Specter is a vote for ME!"

[tigereye]

42. Arlen will be Arlen.

:shrug:

[JayMusgrove]

43. Arlen Spector, is our "insurance policy" that's all he is......

until 2010, when at least 2 and as many as 5 states more elect a Democratic Senator.....

I predict another 6 months to get Al Franken in the US Senate.....but by December 2009....Obama will have a health care plan, prevented from filabuster, by Spector, and in place for 2010 implementation, solidified and in place for 96% of Americans by November.....2010......99% by 2012.

This will be the way Democrats win 2-5 Senate seats in 2010.......lose one or two at the most..worst case.in 2011 we only have 60 Dem Senators in the US Senate..........and Joe Biden to over-ride simple 50-50 splits.

So 2011, and 2012, unlike the last 2 years of previous Presidents, will look like this.

Gay marriage legalized in 50 states by federal legislation
No pensions for anyone involved in the Bush administration
No health care insurance for any congressperson who does not support 100% coverage for his district by doing work to make those people insured.

A bill to legalize illegals who have been here for 10 years and have not broken laws, a fine for those that never paid taxes or insurance for hiring them, except the small farmers in VT and ME, and MN who hired illegals because no one else would get up and milk cows at 5 AM............ this is where the "illegals" are working, doing jobs we wouldn't do for those wages and living conditions....on dairy farms in Maine, chicken farms in Arkansas, cattle ranches in TX, OK, KS, NM, CO, hidden workers, paid under the table, no tax, no FICA, nothing accountable to our economy...but we drink their milk, eat their beef.

Stuff like this...

Oh yes, women who can conceive and carry a child, no government can interfere with her choice of options as to what to do with her body, no matter what age, and all legal medical options available to her, including carrying the child to term, keeping the child, arranging for legal adoptions, whatever, and the child covered to age 19 no matter what.

[WestSeattle2]

51. With all due respect, illegals

are a substantial part of the residential home construction industry in Western Washington. Jobs that used to be well-paid union positions gave way to illegals willing to work for one half, and even one third of the going union rate. Carpenters, plumbers, roofers, sheet-rock crews, right on down to carpet installers, have seen their incomes slashed due to illegal labor. Many legit companies simply folded because they could not compete/bid against companies who hired illegals. Paying under the table, avoiding FICA, avoiding unemployment insurance taxes, avoiding paying health benefits, is a huge temptation for too many employers. There will never be agreement on the illegal immigrant issue because the impact of their presence in job markets varies from region to region. Trust me, the guys who lost their $25-30/hour jobs to illegals willing to do the same work, (often sub-standard) for $10/hour, just aren't feeling the love. And believe me, there are some well-known home builders who contract with illegals.

I don't blame the illegals, hell if I'd been born in Mexico rather than the US, I'd try to escape that rat hole too. My beef is with the employers. We need to start arresting them and imposing prison sentences. A few well-publicized cases of employers going away for 3-5 years in state prisons, and the illegal immigrant issue will cease to exist.

[flyarm]

67. with all due respect ..with insurance like Specter who needs enemy's? Magic bullet and all

the sob who covered up the true murderers of Kennedy we are now told will be our "insurance"..please leave me to puke my guts up..I don't want this fucking kind of insurance! It makes me too ill!

Wow how low we have arrived at as being democrats!..well you may want him as insurance but I sure as fu#@# don't!

Seems some here have stooped to the lowest common denominators!

[Hansel]

45. Being from Minnesota, I find this whole thing particularly obnoxious

Here you have the DC Democratic leadership accepting this wishy-washy finger-in-the air old fool and claiming the right to guarantee that he will be the PA Democratic senate candidate in the next election. What!?!?! PA Democrats only get one vote, Bob Casey? What about the rest of the Dems in PA? They have absolutely no right to make these promises.

Then you have the duly elected Al Franken who is still sitting in MN because the DC Democratic leadership refuses to seat him while Coleman and his Washington cronies endlessly obstruct him with frivolous court appeals. So DC Dems wince at the idea of respecting the voters and the court's decision out of respect for what? What about PA citizens? Where is the respect for them?

The DC Senate does not get to decide who the senators are from the various states. However, if they are going to pick the primary candidate from one state when the voters haven't spoken, they need to put a duly elected MN Senator in his seat.
Personally I think they, including President Obama, need to keep their noses out of state politics. Pennsylvanians will elect their own Democratic candidate. It is idiotic that Specter has been accepted into the party without having to earn it. And it is just is idiotic for Cornyn, from the "great state" of we-are-leaving-the-Union-because-WA-DC-doesn't-respect-our-state-rights to be butting his nose in MN politics.

End of mindless rant.

[DRoseDARs]

46. "I'm a loyal Democrat. I support your agenda." - Sen. Arlen Spector to Pres. Obama, April 28th, 2009

'Nuff said.

[Fire1]

50. Then he contradicted himself. Flip flop. Typical repug.

[CTLawGuy]

47. yeah he sux BUT

1. He's not going to be looking out for the best interest of the R party, so at least he will negotiate with us.
2. He's not going to be pushed farther to the right out of fear of Pat Toomey, if anything he will be pushed more to the left if the left in PA organizes a primary challenger.
3. He's not going to be a puppet of Mitch McConnell.
4. the 2006 CT Dem primary against Lieberman proves that even a state dem party can't beat well-organized grassroots.

[ShadowLiberal]

52. Yeah, his interview was surprisingly disappointing to me as a PAer

Up until now I've been fairly optimistic that Specter will move to the left enough to be an acceptable senator for me, but this interview certainly wasn't a confidence builder.

I was most surprised by how little of an effort Specter seemed to be making to show that he would change to somewhat more liberal positions. All he really seemed to do to try to appeal to democrats was remind them of a few things like him being pro choice, and talk about reforming medicare/medicaid (I forget which one it was) and having tougher penalties for defrauding it.

The part of the interview where he refused to say he regretted voting for Alito/Roberts struck me as a primary challenge attack gold nugget.

At the same though as a PAer I'm starting to get kind of nervous about our chances of holding this senate seat without Specter running for us if we're facing someone like Ridge or Gerlach in the general election. I don't think Gerlach will too difficult for Specter to defeat, but against a nonincumbent democrat that's a different story, that could make the race more of a toss up. Then there's Ridge, the thought of running against him, even with Specter on the ticket, makes me nervous. I'm not sure if many democrats who seem interested in running for the seat can beat Ridge.

[SeaLyons]

54. How does this ass think he's going to be elected as

a democrat, but NOT a loyal democrat. What an idiot.

[freddie mertz]

56. Kicking to keep this open...

Lord knows what idiocy will emerge from Arlen today....

[high density]

58. I just don't like the guy's reasoning

It's nice he's being honest about it, but I don't think the prospect of losing a primary is a valid reason to change parties. It would have more meaning if he had done it four years ago during the dark days of the Bush admin. Instead of fighting the extremists in his party, he cowered to them and ran away. If anything, it seems his decision has made the entities like Club for Growth that he (and we) hate even stronger in the party.

[Cha]

74. And, besides all that..Arlen was quoted as

saying "I'm a loyal Democrat" on the phone to P Obama when he told him he Switched..so either his memory is fuzzy, he's lying, or the quote was wrong in the first place.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x307112#307264

[nichomachus]

59. He didn't jump ship until

the GOP was out of power and he was in election trouble. He's a crass opportunist. He's not a reliable vote to end a filibuster. This is what I've been trying to tell every who was so giddy about his leaving the GOP.

[progressoid]

60. Vote for a duck??

I'd rather fuck a duck than vote for him.

[freddie mertz]

80. You can write in names on PA ballots.

If the primary ballot is limited to an unopposed Specter, I'll probably write in Donald Duck.

[Captain Hilts]

62. He'll get along great with "I don't work for him" Reid. nt

[Occam Bandage]

63. I don't care if he votes no on health care. It's how he votes on cloture that I care about. nt

[freddie mertz]

65. He said he did not like the anti-cloture provision...

Regarding health care in the budget.

I may be wrong (often am), but I think that means cloture is off the table for the health care vote, and Arlen disagrees with that because he is open to blocking it.

[moondust]

68. Then he should not expect the support of loyal Democrats.

The door swings both ways, Arlen darlin'.

[polichick]

73. That's right - I hope he's challenged in the primary. I want to vote for a...

REAL Democrat.

[MasonJar]

75. He is nuts! Even if the dems gave him the okay that they would not

oppose him in the primary, they can change their mind. I wouldn't put it past the old cadger to get elected a dem and then return to the pugs. We need to oust the loser dems and put so many liberal dems in that no one can counter us for at least 4 years.

[freddie mertz]

77. Sestak sounded ready for the fight today on the "Ed Show"

I was more than a little impressed, personally.

[polichick]

78. That quote would make a great ad for his primary challenger!

[freddie mertz]

79. That's what I was thinking...

Add a little "ominous" music and dark, indistinct backgrounds, maybe a few samples from his log and undistinguished past (accusing Anita Hill of perjury, etc).

Arlen is just a weak, lousy excuse for a "Democrat."