Tickets still avialable to see Obama in Camden and Newark NJ Sun Now 1

[rocktivity]

More info on reserving tickets online here.

You're welcome.

:bounce:
rocktivity

[John Q. Citizen]

1. I'll let his friends in the insurance industry have my seat. I'm done.

[WI_DEM]

5. good. somebody who appreciates that this president will deliver on health care

more than any other president in history when all is said and done will get your seat.

[John Q. Citizen]

6. It 's certain. Obama has delivered for the health insurance industry big time.

A trillion a decade in tax revenue is huge for the industry. Add to that another trillion in unfunded mandates and he will go down as the greatest beneficiary of private insurance companies that the world has ever known.

Johnson delivered for people. Of course he was hated by the insurance companies. But 40 million seniors get great affordable care, without any BS from the insurance companies.

[ClarkUSA]

7. "certain"? There's no final bill yet. And unlike Hillarycare, Congress wrote this one... not Obama.

Funny how Howard Dean and union leaders have praised the House bill (which is virtually identical to the one out of Senator
Kennedy's desk) but "certain" folks at DU can't stop attacking and laying total blame on Obama, even though the healthcare bill
(which the President didn't write) hasn't even reached conference yet.

[John Q. Citizen]

8. So your opinion is Obama deserves no credit for the health care bill, it's congress' baby?

You do know who Obama' first nominated for HHS right? One of the biggest lobbiests for the health insurance companies there is alive.

That and the fact that the head of AHIP seems to have complete and full access to the President tells me that Obama is really bending over backwards to accommodate the heath insurance industry and their desires. Thyey certainly got many seats, and the best ones, at his table.

[ClarkUSA]

9. Since there isn't a final bill, why are you acting as if anything is "certain"?

And yes, so far, the bill is Congress' baby. This President, unlike past ones, understands that Congress is a co-equal branch of
government. The President deserves credit for shepherding the process along and getting his allies in Congress to get behind
the bill because without him, there would be no HCR effort at all. For that, he deserves credit for getting HCR farther than it
has in 60 years. But the bill itself has been written by Congress, as you should know.

Your comments re: AHIP are completely conflated. AHIP has been smackdowned since their recent biased "report" attacking HCR;
the White House and its Congressional allies are threatening to withdraw insurance industry's anti-trust exemption now. At present,
there's no love lost between the White House and its HCR allies on one side and the Chamber of Commerce and the insurance
companies on the other. Like Howard Dean and the heads of unions, I'm pleased with what has been accomplished thus far.

[John Q. Citizen]

10. AHIP didn't attack Obama HCR. They only attacked what Obama called "a sliver"

of HCR. That would be the public option, which Obama has said he would prefer, but it's not critical to HCR.

At Present, The insurance industry enjoys complete and total access to the president through one of their biggest and most effective lobbiests, friend of the President Tom Daschle.

AHIP is still on board solidly with getting a trillion a decade in tax dollars to cover the poor, and with the probably other trillion they will be getting form the unfunded mandates, they are going to make out like bandits. Check the stock prices of the health insurance industry. Investors are confident that the Obama reforms will be a bonanza for the private insurance industry.

Dr. Dean is a center-right politician who would back this bill no matter what almost, because he has to much political capital invested to back out now. It wasn't long ago he was describing the PO as 'like Medicare.' Well, he's a politician and sometimes he gets carries away. I like him, but I won't base my judgment of the reform effort on his analysis. The PO in the merged House bill and in the Senate Help Bill are nothing even closely resembling Medicare. Sorry, it just ain't so.

I haven't acted like there is a final bill, but the House is scheduled to begin debate on their final product next Thursday. Have you read it yet? Or do you let Howard Dean do your reading and form your opinions for you?

[ClarkUSA]

12. You're splitting hairs. It was a very public PR assault on the PO by AHIP that backfired.

The White House and their Democratic allies in the Senate and House were and are furious at AHIP and are moving to
strip the insurance industry of their anti-trust exemption. AHIP didn't succeed which is why the PO is now part of the
House bill. Also, I'm not sure why you keep bringing up Tom Daschle, because he's irrelevant to the processs and has
been from the beginning, unless you're trying to conflate something out of nothing.

Glad you're backing off on calling the anything-but-final bill "certain"; I am very happy with the process so far. I'm
looking forward to what conference will bring because unlike you, I don't have any preconceived ideas of blame to offer
since I believe the White and its allies have worked damned hard to get to this point in the face of opposition from the
GOP, Blue Dogs, and the insurance industry as well as the Chamber of Commerce.

Having family and friends who are on COBRA and Medicare makes me hopeful for a change in our present system that
I haven't ever had until this year. For me, the perfect is not the enemy of the good. You obviously feel differently.

[John Q. Citizen]

13. Ahh, you are young. Yes, that would explain a lot.. You lack the bigger picture

Here read this and tell me how it square with your mythology?
http://leahy.senate.gov/press/200909/091709a.html

Leahy introduced that bill in September.
AHIP made their report and their push to get rid of the PO in OCT.

So you think Leahy has supernatural powers to predict the future?


See, google is your friend. If you google you can find pictures of the Director of AHIP doing photo ops with Obama, the Unions, and big pharma, all one big happy family working together to get the insurance industry a trillion a decade from the tax payers and another trillion a decade by forcing people to buy their product through unfunded mandates.

You can google and find where Obama says that in order to secure the cooperation of the insurance companies, that we need to put in mandates that will bring the insurance industry another 40 million customers.

You can check the stock prices of the health insurance companies and you can see that investors believe that the reforms as written as written are going to be a big bonanza for health insurance companies. You seem to think that the companies don't want a big bonanza. I assure they love it, Do they want more? Sure. They will push for as much as they can get.

The Dems are getting far more in contributions from the health care industrial complex, including health insurance companies than the Repos are. Go tpo open secrets or to vote smart and look for yourself.

And read the bill your self. You haven't have you? You haven't read the house bill. It's got some good things in it, but their are some really really bad things in it too.

The facts are out their. You don't have to just parrot the meme of the day from the the politicians staffers. You can actually find out for yourself!

And don't let the myth be the enemy of the truth!

Good luck!

[ClarkUSA]

14. Spare me your condescension. It is misplaced.

Leahy's bill had zero support until AHIP's stunt backfired and pissed off the White House and their allies in the Senate
and Congress. That's a fact -- as opposed to reading too much evildoing into White House photo-ops featuring the
disparate players in the HCR debate.

I'm waiting to see the final bill before making all-knowing, all-seeing pronouncements as to the outcome. I could
care less about stock prices and campaign contributions. I didn't falloff the turnip truck yesterday: I don't expect
insurance companies to go out of business or be shut out of the negotiations nor do I waste time railing against
pols who accept monies from big business because I believe red state/blue state regional differences and electoral
considerations weigh more heavily than lobbyist monies when it comes to Democratic Congressional votes for HCR.
Nonetheless, I do believe that President Obama will do his best to hold the Democratic caucus in line in the end.

What I see right now is the best start to healthcare reform in 60 years and I'm 100% behind the process. You can
keep railing against President Obama but the rest of us are working to support him and his Democratic allies in this
endeavor. I'm sure you would have attacked FDR over his initial creation of Social Security and excoriated LBJ over
the compromises he made to secure Medicare. Who knows, since you seem to be so much older than I am,
maybe you actually did. But it's easy to critique from the comfort of a keyboard. It's much harder to actually get
things done in Washington. President Obama deserves my support on this effort while you need to get out of the
way if all you're going to do to enact HCR is whine about process on a discussion forum.

Have a nice day. I'm spending the rest of the afternoon GOTVing for Corzine with my OFA group.

[John Q. Citizen]

15. It's a Republican Bill. It's a "market based solution" bill. If it were a Democratic

Bill it would look like Medicare.

This bill looks like the Bush Social Security "reform"

You know, a "market based solution."

This health care bill is a Republican Bill.

It was written by the insurance industry for the most part.

You probably work for an insurance company.

[ClarkUSA]

19. LOL! The Republicans would disagree, I assure you.

You're obviously an unpublished fiction writer whose only outlet is DU.

[joeycola]

11. Nicely said. Thanks

[Cha]

2. Thanks Rocktivity~ Is

Jon Bon Jovi going to be there?:D

[rocktivity]

20. The DJ got away from hip hop, salsa and Motown long enough

to get in a few bars of Living on a Prayer!

:rofl:
rocktivity

[tabbycat31]

3. I have tickets to Newark

may or may not go. My family threw me a curveball by visiting this weekend.

[WI_DEM]

4. looks like the president is going all out for Corzine. Good he may be Corzine's best chance

if he can rally the democratic vote.

[tabbycat31]

16. they're starting to get excited

I canvassed today, and we did all we could to link Obama to Corzine in Asbury and it got some of the people excited. We said "a vote for Corzine is a vote for Obama" and they ilked it.

[Cha]

17. Thanks for canvassing for the Dem Gov

in New Jersey, tabby.

[tabbycat31]

18. anytime

I have issues with how his (and the assembly) races are run, but I think next Assembly race, I am going to get involved more with the campaign.

I also need to get the county Dems to communicate with the local Dems.