Guess who voted NO on health care reform.

[jefferson_dem]

Saint Kooch... :eyes:

[msallied]

1. Principle ahead of progress. It would seem many here would agree with him.

Funny how people can call themselves progressives while living the antithesis of it.

[Go2Peace]

68. Hell yes, Blue Dogs whose mostly vote corp are "misunderstood", but Kucinich, he's EVIL !

and an enemy! Right.

He votes more consistent for the people than half those who voted for this bill, and you all are ready to throw him under the table because he thinks this was the wrong move.

[Go2Peace]

76. I can't believe folks here. Incredible...

I can't believe folks here. So we have a bunch of pansy ass Dems who constantly watered down our interests and added giveaways to the corporations, even when THEY HAD THE MAJORITY and could well have done the RIGHT THING if they really wanted to, and you all are over Kucinich.

We want BARRABAS!!! Give us Barrabas!

[Truth2Tell]

78. It's not principle ahead of progress.

It's just principle. There is no progress in this bill. It moves us backwards.

[HughMoran]

85. He voted against progress

it's true (and ironic that he's finding so much support here.)

[boppers]

2. Really?

What was his rationale?

[Muttocracy]

5. I think his statement was just posted in another thread. nt

[Davis_X_Machina]

3. Matches his ACES vote. n/t

[msongs]

4. how dare he not kowtow to the center right democratic health care bill. sheesh nt

[jefferson_dem]

12. Ya!

How dare he NOT vote with all those Dems. He's much more comfortable snuggling up to Bachmann, Boner and the rest of the Repugscum. Hopefully, he'll drop by FauxNews to tell us all how bad the bill is.

Kooch is so dreamy... :loveya:

[ecstatic]

17. fyi: There are many people with pre-existing conditions who are waiting

with bated breath for this bill to pass. I wish some of you would get it through your heads that it's NOT all about YOU! :eyes:

[jefferson_dem]

32. And if it doesn't pass now...it will probably never pass.

At least not for the next decade or so.

Thankfully, Kucinich is but a lone annoying gadfly and the rest of the legit Dems have enough sense to push reform while they have a chance.

[saltpoint]

6. Kucinich wanted health care reform to fail under Obama to generate

the rationale for his challenge of same for the 2012 primaries.

Grandstanding little twerp.

[davidpdx]

30. Yep, so he and his other buddy (not going to mention the name)

can run in 2012. It won't be much of a primary. Politics does make for strange bedfellows.

[Cash_thatswhatiwant]

36. mention the name. who? nt

[saltpoint]

37. This was naked ego-strokamania, IMO. Kooch just lost it tonight with

this vote. He's all little man with a huge ego.

The legislation passed despite his ego-driven temper-tantrum.

He's more marginal now than ever.

To hell with 'im.

[Clio the Leo]

7. Well now "the enemy of the good" officially has a face! NT

[babylonsister]

8. Wow. And here's Jim Cooper, who wasn't thrilled with this bill either...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6953831&mesg_id=6953831

snip//

I will vote yes on H.R. 3962. My vote is not an endorsement of all the provisions of the bill because I find much of the bill to be deeply flawed. There is little chance that H.R. 3962 will become law due to the long legislative process.

My reason for voting yes is to advance the cause of health care reform by forcing the Senate to act. Without passage of this House bill, the Senate could delay reform indefinitely. That would be the worst possible outcome because our current health-care system is not sustainable. Congress needs to pass good health legislation in the next few months for the good of the country.

Passing legislation is a little like writing a term paper in school. The first draft is usually not very good. The second draft is better -- H.R. 3962 is the second draft. The bill that the Senate will vote on will be the third draft, which I expect to show major improvement. The final draft will be written next month when the House and the Senate vote on the same bill. I will continue to work hard to make sure that the final legislation helps all of our families get quality, affordable health care.

[Jennicut]

9. Eh, if we had enough votes to pass who cares? If he helped actually defeat it I would

be pissed at him. Most likely, Pelosi knew. He is not exactly known for voting with the party.
Sorry DK, but you can sit around and wait for a perfect bill. My preexisting condition is not going away any time soon.

[msallied]

13. No, he doesn't vote with the party. I don't know who he votes with or why.

To me it's just proof positive that he will happily block the road to progress if it doesn't meet his specific demands. Sigh. But I'm glad it passed either way.

[Jennicut]

21. DK seems to want to wait around for perfect bills. I am glad he has principles

but he seems to defeat what he actually wants to get done. Compromise is part of being in Congress. Of course, some compromise too much while others like DK refuse to give in at all.

[mvd]

15. True, if he was the vote to defeat, then..

even I would be unhappy. But as is, I'm a Kucinich supporter who won't get mad. :hi:

[Jennicut]

27. DK marches to the beat of his own drummer.

Sometimes I think he has his head in the clouds though he means well.

[mvd]

33. Yeah, I like him despite what will be posted in this thread

I'm fine with him making points. I can't remember him causing a major bill to fail. I'm unhappy that progressives got no amendments. But I disagree with Kuch that this isn't a little progress (as long as the PO is expanded).

[babylonsister]

38. See post #8. Too bad he couldn't take the high road. nt

[mvd]

40. Different approaches, neither of which led to the bill failing

I'm making up my own mind here. I still support him.

[babylonsister]

44. That's your right. nt

[mvd]

47. Don't get me wrong, though

I don't agree with his vote. But I don't agree with Obama sometimes and I also still give him my support. :hi:

[babylonsister]

56. OK, you are true 'blue'!

:thumbsup:

I don't agree with DK here either, but I usually do like his morals, intelligence, and tenacity in the face of usually overwhelming odds.

[Hutzpa]

67. Please tell me you're not saying

you will still be fine with him having his head in the cloud or sand.

[Jennicut]

69. Dennis is not ever going to change. He is who he is.

I am neither surprised nor upset but he is no hero of mine as he is for some others here.

[mvd]

70. As far as him striving for the best, I want..

him to be that way.

[Hutzpa]

79. Really

no compromise. :shrug:

[mvd]

81. I'm more pragmatic than Dennis here and think there can be compromise

But I also think there's a place for Dennis.

[Clio the Leo]

24. He's no different than Lieberman at this point. NT

[Go2Peace]

71. I'd be a little embarrassed to make such a statement.

Since anyone who pays a whits attention knows it is not the case.

[HughMoran]

86. It's called "principal"

sound familiar?

[ecstatic]

10. He was also one of the few democrats against censuring Joe Wilson

He's a self centered snake oil salesman. Thank God some adults are in charge (for a change) or else nothing would get done.

[CakeGrrl]

11. And if this bill hadn't passed, HOW long would it have taken for another

crack at it?

And why would we expect that it would be more to Kucinich's liking that next time, when the Dems already have majorities in both houses and the WH?

[ej510]

16. He voted against a horrible bill!

[CakeGrrl]

51. And WHEN do you think it would be made better?

As I pointed out, Dems already have numeric majorities in both houses of Congress and the WH.

Do you think it would get any better if they were to lose any one of the three?

[ej510]

62. In 30yrs, we will get our asses kicked by this bill until they fix it.

[Aramchek]

14. what a complete douchebag!

just goes to show that 'Single Payer or Bust' is a losing man's game.

[Davis_X_Machina]

19. Oh dear...

...perhaps you're relatively new to DU. The answer on DU is "Kucinich", pretty much regardless of what the question is.

[Aramchek]

23. he voted against the future. he failed his constituents.

[ecstatic]

20. He's no better than Lieberman, at the end of the day

[Aramchek]

25. you want to like him, but he just keeps making shit votes

[Go2Peace]

72. A perfectly rational conclusion? Not really

See my post 71.

[4dsc]

18. Good for him

This bill wasn't worth voting YES by any means.. Its a SHAM!! This is not reform..

[msallied]

22. There will never BE reform if you refuse to vote on progress.

So he sided with the corrupt, delusional do-nothings. Hooray for him.

[ej510]

28. If this bill is progress this country is trouble.

[msallied]

31. I just lost my insurance and I have a pre-existing condition.

You bet your fucking ass it's progress to me and millions of others. The final bill, once it gets through the Senate is going to be progress by and large over what we have now, which your boy just voted to keep. But you can keep resting on your principles and be a part of the problem while the rest of the world actually tries to get shit done.

[mvd]

46. I am glad that the changes will help you

:thumbsup:

One vote does not make someone not a supporter, though. I understand him perfectly even when I disagree on approach. If he caused the bill to fail, I would let him know I wasn't happy.

[sandnsea]

48. Funny how that changes perspective

Not that I can remember every single person's perspective - but nobody can ever tell me that a subsidy for health care isn't help because I have it, and have pre-existing conditions so my health costs might go down and I might even qualify for a plan with dental now. That would be incredible!

[msallied]

52. My views on this have always been on the pragmatic end. I keep my expectations low. lol

I would love nothing more than single-payer, but I know that in this country, things do not get done that way. I'm all for incremental steps forward if that's what it's going to take so that my kids never have to worry the way I and the generations before me have. That anyone who calls themselves a progressive would vote this bill down is just mind-boggling to me. If you don't ACT like a progressive, then you're being a regressive. Dennis might not see it that way, but that's what his actions said tonight.

It would also be wonderful to have dental as part of a public plan. :)

[vaberella]

50. i have a preexisting genetic condition too...and it actually gives me the PO option. n/t

[msallied]

53. I'm happy about this giant leap forward tonight!

And I just got a little less frightened about my own situation. :)

[babylonsister]

60. +1. I'm in the same boat in about 6 months. This IS progress DK didn't

vote for.

[brentspeak]

59. Exactly

Somehow, forking over $1 trillion of taxpayer monies over to the very cartel which has killed health care reform is now considered "reform".

[kath]

83. yeah - really interesting concept, isn't it?

:puke: :puke:

[vaberella]

26. Thanks Kucinich...ugh! Whatever... n/t

[geek tragedy]

29. St. Narcissist the Ineffectual. nt

[zulchzulu]

34. Frankly, who cares...

Kucinich can't get anything passed that's worthy. It's a careless vote against trying to at least be incrementally moving to Single Payer. There are actually some good things in the bill that would greatly improve health care in this country.

It's like walking out of a concert because the orchestra flutist plays a bum note. Some people like that kind of attention.

[jefferson_dem]

41. Perhaps.

But if we are going to single out and target the anti-reform Dems who voted against, Kucinich should not be spared.

[GreenArrow]

55. more like a walking out of a concert

because the orchestra is only pretending to play.

[BeyondGeography]

35. What a petty little shit he is sometimes

His supporters can take their protestations of high-minded principle and stuff them.

[brentspeak]

61. Can we take our tax dollars away from the insurance companies, too?

Oops, too late -- the new bill is like a direct deposit into insurance CEOs' 3rd yacht funds.

[RBInMaine]

39. STUPID STUPID STUPID AND F-ING STUPID !! This is an ADVANCE, not the whole WAR ! Shameful !

The Kucinich crowd needs to get this through their out-of-reality heads once and for all - Politics Is The Art Of The Possible At A Given Point In Time ! It is almost never, ever, ever all or nothing. Think like that, and you might as well jump into quicksand because you will never get anywhere in politics or life. This health bill is a START. It is a foot in the door of what is POSSIBLE at this moment. OF COURSE there MUST be compromise, even if it stings a bit. You do the best you can under the circumstances. This is a good START ! We need to now PUSH like hell in the Senate and get an ADVANCE in healthcare so we can fight again for more another day. But to say "all or nothing" is as STUPID as a TeaBagger and only helps THEM ! WAY TO GO PELOSI AND DEMS ! I AM PROUD OF YOU TODAY! I LOVED THE WAY YOU SLAMMED THAT JOKE OF A REPUKE BILL ! AND EVERYONE on DU needs to train their fire on the horrid rotten right wing scumbag facist RePUKES and stop attacking our own because you didn't get your ideal. STOP IT ! We made history today ! And we need to finish the job, even if means some compromise at the moment. I am speaking REALITY to NON-REALITY !

[fugop]

43. But ... but ... but ....

"Gore and Bush are the same! Why not vote Nader? Bush/Gore. Same guy! Don't you see??? Vote Nader! It's only four years, right?"

I have no patience for purists when it comes to politics. None at all.

[Go2Peace]

73. Amazing. So Europeans, who have the real deal, are purists. Maybe we are too wishy washy?

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

42. .

[PopSixSquish]

45. Too Busy Being the Pretty Perfect Princess Again

too bad he's now on the wrong side of history...

[GreenArrow]

49. Good for him!

I would have voted NO on this piece of shit myself. But, as the saying goes, a prophet is not without honor, expect in his own country.

[msallied]

54. Then you shouldn't be a politician. And neither should he.

You want to stand in your ivory tower, do it where it isn't blocking the fucking road.

[GreenArrow]

57. Well, the road's going over the cliff.

Have a nice trip.

[msallied]

58. Funny how all you whiners have crystal balls too.

[GreenArrow]

64. I guess I better get one of those

rose colored crystal balls then.

[Go2Peace]

75. Only in America do we expect our politicians to be experts at compromising the public good

[Clio the Leo]

66. Esp. one who stands in the way of actual progress. NT

[HughMoran]

87. Glad you admitted that

:hi:

[ind_thinker2]

63. Peice of crap RALPH NADER in dems, we donot need him here, BACK STABBER

[DRoseDARs]

65. Imagine that, someone voting on principles instead of "Crap is better than nothing."

To bad we never had the chance to have Rep. Kucinich's health care reform. It was always going to be this piecemeal, center-right-of-the-road manure. We're just going to have to hope that something good get fertilized by this shit.

[Odin2005]

74. Attention-seeking, grandstanding nitwit.

His "progressivism" is an act. He was anti-choice before 2003.

[Go2Peace]

77. ah yes, and the rest of the dems really are pure and represented the public good with this bill?

It may be better than not doing anything. But when did we start to think that these Dems that were in the majority and sold out to the corporations were actually the better representatives? You going to give them a pass after many of them sold you under the bus in order to keep their own asses rich and in power? I just don't get it.

I support Democrats, but I am not so blinded to think they are "white hats" at this point. This may be a desirable bill, but they failed us big time, they should have given us MUCH better!

[Hutzpa]

80. Why would Congressman Weiner

voted for this bill even though he wanted Single Payer?

I'm just curious...

[cleveramerican]

82. Was it the starshine or the moonbeams.....

that made him do it?

He is a dope who I once admired.
Add him to THAT long list.

[Phx_Dem]

84. He just threw millions of people who are denied coverage because of pre-existing conditions,

under the "progressive bus."

Selfish piece of shit.

[Generator]

88. And how much can they charge if you do have

a pre-existing condition? Is there any limit on that? If they charge 2x as much-many won't be able to afford that. If it's $500 a month now-will it be $1000 if you have a condition the insurance company doesn't like?

Also-how will it be enforced? Am I going to have to sue an insurance company and wait for years for a settlement meanwhile not having coverage I can afford.

This are questions I would like answers to. Otherwise-it's meaningless-if you can't afford it-it doesn't matter that it's now offered to you.

[Phx_Dem]

89. The public option is supposed to bring costs down. Remember that?

Frankly, I don't know every single thing that is in the House bill. There may be cost containments. Do you know there aren't?

But if you're Dennis Kuchinich and you have insurance, it's better to vote no so others don't even have the option of getting covered even if they can afford the premiums. That's what his no vote says.

Great argument.