How are you voting on the propositions?

[Oerdin]

I'd like to get a feel for how people are going to be voting next month on the various local and state propositions. Being an educated voter is part of voting wisely so let's review the propositions on next month's ballot.

STATE PROPSITIONS

Proposition 1A. Safe, Reliable High-Speed Passenger Train -- State of California - Authorizes $9.95 billion in state bonds to pay for the construction of a new 300 mph train route between Anaheim and San Francisco with expansions planned for San Diego, Irvine, and Sacramento. We need this as an alternative to traveling by car especially since our state's infrastructure has been neglected for decades. As an added bonus this project will create tens of thousands of jobs at exactly the time we need them to help fight the recession. I'm voting yes.

Proposition 2. Standards for Confining Farm Animals -- State of California - Sounds nice on paper but in truth the proposed rules are so far out there that even pro-animal UC Davis's study admits that this proposition will put 95% of California's egg farmers/ranchers out of business. This will destroy jobs in rural areas which already have high unemployment and it will mean virtually all of our chicken and eggs will soon come from out of state instead of keeping local farmers in business. I'm voting no.

Proposition 3. Children's Hospital Bond Act. Grant Program -- State of California - We all love Children but just 4 years ago Children's Hospitals got a $10 billion gift from taxpayers and less then half of that has even been spent yet. Add in that these hospitals are privately owned instead of publicly owned and you have a compelling case that they should pay their own bills rather then relaying on handouts from the taxpayers. I'm voting no because they still have $5 billion on hand and shouldn't get more free money until they really need it.

Proposition 4. Waiting Period and Parental Notification Before Termination of Minor's Pregnancy -- State of California - this anti-abortion garbage has been voted down three times in the past but the crazies and zealots keep putting it on every ballot. Screw them, I'm voting no.

Proposition 5. Nonviolent Drug Offenses, Sentencing, Parole and Rehabilitation -- State of California - Our prisons are over crowded so let's get the nonviolent drug offenders into rehab instead of clogging up our prisons. This one is a no brainer, I'm voting yes.

Proposition 6. Police and Law Enforcement Funding. Criminal Penalties and Laws -- State of California - No, no, a million times no. This proposition would make yet another mandatory spending program which could never be cut. It is precisely the type of garbage which has caused our current structural budget deficit plus if you increase mandatory spending on this issue then you have to decrease spending on everything else or raise taxes. I'm voting no.

Proposition 7. Renewable Energy Generation -- State of California - Sounds nice doesn't? 50% of all our power coming from solar and wind. To bad this proposition is so poorly written that it will result in the exact opposite and even the Solar and Wind power industries are telling voters to vote against it. It's heart is in the right place but it's written by a moron. I'm voting no.

Proposition 8. Eliminates Right of Same-Sex Couples to Marry -- State of California - The type of proposition only a bigot could vote for. Gay couples deserve the same legal protections as other couples and we don't need every pet issue from every idiot becoming part of our constitution. I'm voting no.

Proposition 9. Criminal Justice System. Victims' Rights. Parole -- State of California - This proposition wants to remove civil rights (such as appeals etc) and the right to an attorney at state expense from people who have been convicted and are appealing their sentences. It's dumb and unAmerican, not to mention it would violate the US Constitution. I'm voting no especially since Federal courts would just toss it out anyway.

Proposition 10. Alternative Fuel Vehicles and Renewable Energy. Bonds -- State of California - Approves bonds which will be used to subsidize hybrid cars, fuel cell cars, and electric cars. We need this if we ever want to achieve energy independence so I'm voting yes.

Proposition 11. Redistricting -- State of California - I'm tired of politicians gerrymandering every district so that each election not a single incumbent ever loses. Both parties do it and the main reason we can't ever get budget compromises passed is because politicians in gerrymandered districts never feel any pressure from voters. Screw the politicians and let's take redistricting out of their hands. I'm voting yes.

Proposition 12. Veteran's Bond Act of 2008 -- State of California - I am a vet so I'm biased but the truth is we **** on our vets especially our wounded vets. We just don't care for them like they should be and they can't even get decent health care despite all those yellow ribbons people wear. So do we really honor our vets or do we keep throwing them away like yesterday's pizza box? I'm voting yes because our vets deserve it.

[Oerdin]

1. My local props and how I will vote.

LOCAL PROPOSITIONS

Proposition A. Regional Fire Protection Ballot Measure -- County of San Diego - Requires more money to be spent on fire preparedness with brush management, increased equipment purchases, etc. I'm voting Yes because I'm tired of us saving $1 million per year then having to spend $20 million every 3 years because a wild fire got out of control. A penny of prevention really is worth a pound of cure.

Proposition B. Marine Freight Preservation and Bayfront Redevelopment Initiative -- San Diego Port Authority - This proposal is absolutely retarded and it will help no one but 1 or 2 developers while killing San Diego's shipping port. The port is one of the big engines to our regions economy and it provides thousands of very high paying jobs and despite what the developer says every consultant has agreed this will effectively kill the Port of San Diego. I'm voting No because we only have one port and we need that port much more then we need yet another hotel.

Proposition C. Amends The Charter To Designate The Use Of Lease Revenue From Mission Bay Park -- City of San Diego - The city makes some $20-$25 million per year off of Mission Bay Park but the city has been neglecting the park and robbing these funds to pay for their pet projects. I'm tired of these nonsense and I want to keep park fund for the parks so I'm voting Yes.

Proposition D. Alcohol Consumption At City Beaches, Mission Bay Park, and Coastal Parks -- City of San Diego - A uniform ban on all alcohol at all beaches all the time. San Diego has around 70 miles of coast line so I have to believe there is room enough for everyone including a beach where adults can enjoy adult beverages. Not to mention the tourism industry brings in big money and this will harm tourism. I'm voting against this proposal being pushed by religious extremists.

Proposition F. through Q are propositions for small local cities in the county which I don't live in, can't vote on, and don't have any interest in so I won't bother listing them.

Proposition R. Classroom Repair and Job Training Measure -- Southwestern Community College District - Authorizing $389,000 worth of bonds to fund construction for local community colleges so they can expand vocational training programs (nurses, police, firemen, plumbers, computer techs, etc...). I'm supporting this as not everyone needs to go to college or can go to college but we should help them get a marketable skill at a local community college. If we help them get honest jobs then they stay employed and paying taxes. I'm voting Yes.

Proposition S. School Repair and Safety Measure -- San Diego Unified School District - Authorizes $2 billion in bonds to repair San Diego's crumbling schools. Maintenance has been deferred for 20-30 years in many cases and the fire department is threatening to condemn some schools because they're in such poor repair. This is disgraceful. Let's fix the schools before they fall over. I'm voting yes.

Propositions T through X are propositions for other local cities besides San Diego which I can't vote on so I'm not going to bother with.

[LeftyMom]

2. UC Davis isn't exactly pro-animal.

It's an ag school, they do shitpiles of animal testing, and they have a primate lab.

[bliss_eternal]

17. Shame on them.

I didn't know this, and am surprised to learn this of such a highly regarded university.
Primate labs, too...? Wow. :(

[AndyTiedye]

3. 11 Would Just Give the Repiglickins More Seats in California

[slackmaster]

5. I am not sure that 11 would necessarily result in more GOPers in office

It would, however, make life less safe for incumbents.

I agree with Pete Stahl's assessment:

...The November general election means nothing in such districts. The majority-party candidate is assured of victory. Instead, what's important is the primary contest. And how do you win a partisan primary? By appealing to activist and loyalist elements within your party--by retreating to your "ideological corner," to use Arnold's phrase. So candidates in primaries play up their party credentials, and loudly proclaim they will never compromise core party values like taxes or the environment. Typically, moderates lose these primaries to hardliners. The nominees are then rubber-stamped in November, even if there's significant independent and crossover vote for moderate minority-party nominees, because the district registration is so heavily tilted. The result is a Legislature (and Congress) full of extreme partisans, responsive only to their own parties, with no incentive to compromise or back down from obstructionist tactics....

Much more at http://www.peterates.com/props-1108.shtml#prop11

I believe I am going 100% with Pete this year.

Prop. 1A - YES
Prop. 2 - YES
Prop. 3 - NO
Prop. 4 - NO
Prop. 5 - YES
Prop. 6 - NO
Prop. 7 - NO
Prop. 8 - NO
Prop. 9 - NO
Prop. 10 - NO
Prop. 11 - YES
Prop. 12 - YES

[bananas]

4. This is how I'm voting on the state propositions

Yes on 1a,2,3,5,12
No on the rest.

1a - I was skeptical, but the more I read about it, the more I like it. It will form a high-speed backbone, and includes money for new feeder lines (including trolley) and upgrades to existing interconnecting lines. It's a long term project, voting for it now will encourage cities to start planning for increased passenger rail.

2 - "Pete Rates the Propositions" has a good explanation of why this is good.

3 - I haven't really looked at this, I have a lot of respect for the CNA and I'm following their endorsement.

7,10 - Groups like the Sierra Club and UCAN are at the front lines of these issues and have explained why these are bad.

11 - This favors Republicans, so I'm voting no, because we need as many dems as possible over the next ten years. I'm being strictly partisan.

I don't think the other props need any explanation.

Amazing coincidence, I'm voting the same way as most progressive and democratic organizations:

[bemildred]

6. You never go wrong by voting "no" on propositions that you don't understand

sponsored by groups you don't trust or never heard of.

[Retrograde]

7. Corallary: if the Howard Jarvis Taxpayers' Association is for it

vote against it.

[mitchtv]

8. No on 11 for me

It gives equal standing to the GOP they are nowhere near 50%. 11 is unilateral disarmament.

[roody]

9. Here are the ones I am sure of.

1A - yes
2 - yes, I love animals
3 - ?
4 - No, let a pregnant teen make her decision
5 -?
6 - I doubt it, we have enough prisons and police can make do with what they have
7 - no
8 - absolutely no, marriage rights and wrongs for all
9 - no
10 - no
11, 12 - ?

The renewable energy ones are not credible.

[Sirveri]

10. why not post my list too

1A, split leaning no
2, no. I don't want my food prices going up and I don't really care that much what they do with animals so long as they're not pumping them full of drugs that I'll later also eat by eating them.
3, no, I don't have kids and they have plenty of money
4, no
5, yes
6, abstain
7, no
8, NO
9, abstain
10, split leaning no. Almost certainly no.
11, No
12, Yes (and I'm a vet too, so it's self serving as well)

[LeftyMom]

11. "I don't really care that much what they do with animals"

Well that's pretty fucking selfish, isn't it?

You're not willing to pay a few cents more so that things like this aren't the norm?

[Kajsa]

13. I'm with you, LeftyMom.

that's how they spend their whole lives!

:(

Yes on 1

Yes on 2!
It does matter!

No on 4
Yes on 5
No on 6
No on 7
No on 8!

No on 11-
Redistricting is something they just don't give
up on do they?

Yes on 12

I'm still studying the rest.

[bliss_eternal]

18. Agreed...

...honestly, I'm surprised to learn so many progressives aren't more concerned about the treatment of animals, and aren't willing to pay a few cents more to protect them.

:shrug: What's up with that?

Thank you for the no on 4. I can't believe we have to vote on that one, rephrased and revamped yet again. :eyes:

[Kajsa]

19. You're welcome, Bliss Eternal.

Both Prop.4 and Prop.11 are deja vu Props on our ballot.

We keep voting them down and they keep popping up.
:eyes:

Teenagers should not have to place themselves in danger!

And ALL animals should be treated humanely!

Like you, I'm very surprised to see anyone here who doesn't
understand that.

Thank you for your votes,too.

:)

[Oerdin]

15. Except that's not the norm.

Not even close to the norm and in fact that would already violate animal cruelty laws. Look debate the merits but do it honestly instead of using unrepresentative pictures.

[LeftyMom]

16. That is absolutely representative of battery cages and 98% of CA poultry is raised in battery cages

There's no humane way to cram six hens in a cage the size of a file cabinet drawer for their entire lives.

[LeftyMom]

20. I should also point out that existing animal cruelty laws are almost never applied on factory farms.

The reason is that those laws have exemptions (when they apply to farmed animals at all) for "accepted industry practice" and it's almost impossible to find something sufficiently horrible that it's not accepted industry practice.

For example several battery egg farms in SoCal were caught stuffing live "spent" hens (those who, at a year old, are sufficiently malnourished that their egg production has decreased) into a wood chipper in order to dispose of them. No animal cruelty charges were filed. http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/northcounty/20030411-9999_1mi11chip.html

[roody]

14. Your tortured meat is full of drugs and other chemicals.

[tjwash]

12. We are pretty eye to eye on everything but PROP 10 and 11. 10's a disaster.

Prop 10 sounds good in 30 second commercial bites, but studying it in any detail makes one gag.

Don't drink the Pickens kool-aid on that one. That bill gives him 200 million dollars so he can corner the natural gas market, and price gouge us all later as he sees fit. It's essentially a special interest give-away to the natural gas industry that promises no environmental benefits, and really has no clear cut plan on getting us off of fossil fuels...hell we already end up importing about 15 percent of our natural gas from the very same foreign sources that he rails about in the context of oil. This will make it necessary to bump up the amount of NG imports if it passes and gets implemented, and we all know how THAT's working for us already.

The first clue you get about Prop 11, is that the state GOP is funneling HUGE amounts of money to get this pushed through and passed. It creates redistricting boards that are composed of 5 DEM, 5 Rebub, and 4 Ind. It flat out logistically ignores the political breakdowns of the individual districts, and gives equal standing to the GOP even though they are nowhere near what would be represented.