Jan 3rd and the college student vote

[cyberswede]

Hi-
I've seen a few posts (and maybe even a Des Moines Register article) suggesting that having the caucus on January 3rd will prevent college students from caucusing. What do y'all think about that?

I think it's malarkey for several reasons, but the most obvious one, at least for Iowa City, is that classes don't even start until after MLK day. The dorms open on January 21st, and classes start on the 22nd.

So, even if the caucuses were held on the original January 14th date, the students still wouldn't be here.

Finally, it's too bad they couldn't have had the 21-only vote at the same time as the caucus - THAT would guarantee student participation! :)

thx - cs

[Debi]

1. CS I have a question about colleges and caucuses

I read in a DMR article last week that UNI (go Panthers!) and ISU were openning up space for caucus attendees to stay if they planned on returning to school earlier than planned to participate. HOWEVER neither Iowa nor Drake were planning on doing the same. WTF???

Here's the article:

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2007711150391

<snip>

Wilson, from Appleton, Wis., has also backed off of recruiting out-of-state students from Drake to caucus, because most of them will be gone over winter break. A Drake adviser has told Wilson it would be really expensive to open campus during the caucuses, she said. "I've not heard anything back," she said.

Drake officials said this week they have recently decided to study how they would accommodate the housing needs of students who want to come back and caucus when campus is closed.

Officials at Iowa State University and the University of Northern Iowa said they would make space available for dorm-dwellers who want to come back, stay the night and caucus. Grinnell College also has plans to open a campus building, equipped with showers, for the 24-hour time period surrounding the caucuses, where students can camp out in sleeping bags.

University of Iowa staff said they will not open any campus housing for caucusgoers, because it would be difficult to provide staff for a building with so few people.

"We wouldn't open the building and man that for one person," said Carrie Kiser-Wacker, U of I assistant to the director of university housing. She added, "If we had empty space like Iowa State and UNI, and could consolidate them in one building, that would be terrific, but we just don't have that."

<snip>

[cyberswede]

2. Most students live off-campus

According to the uiowa.edu website, the housing capacity on campus is 5,578 - a fraction of the student body.

I can't write intelligently about the percentage of students who typically caucus in Iowa City - but I bet it isn't very high. I think the UI position makes sense in that regard - they have 10 residence halls - would they open all of them? Just one? Would students be staying in dorm rooms belonging to other students? Remember - students don't empty out their rooms over x-mas break - how would you make sure nobody's belongings are disturbed?

My point in the OP is that the dorms wouldn't have been open on Jauary 14th, either, so the January 3rd problem really isn't a novel one.

thx - cs

[Debi]

5. I hear you

I don't know why they couldn't open up Carver Hawkeye Arena for folks w/sleeping bags to hang out (probably a logistical nightmare).

I just hate to think of Iowa NOT welcoming any Iowan (even if they're only an Iowan for college purposes) to participate in the caucuses. Seems to go against our nature.

[Counciltucky]

20. The basketball teams will probably be practicing there.

Though I don't know the schedule so I could be wrong...

This all said, the earlier date will have an effect on the student population, because more people will be likely to be back near school by the 14th than by the 3rd. My two years at Iowa, I was back at IC before the 14th but after the 3rd.

[Debi]

21. You should have seen Carver Hawkeye during the first home game

There were about 200 people there x(

Having games before Thanksgiving is silliness!

On edit:

(I'm talking about January 3rd PM to January 4th AM - I think the BB team could wait for a day or practice in the afternoon.)

[Counciltucky]

22. Yeah true, they could.

Or the teams could practice in the Fieldhouse. Or the sleepover could happen there, one or the other.

[Debi]

23. Yup. n/t

[CornField]

4. I find the whole idea of dorms closing over the holiday to be weird

Ours never closed and I would have been pretty upset if they had -- after all, you pay to live there throughout the year. We had many students (me being one of them) who only went home a few days before and after Christmas and then returned to the dorm. We also had students who didn't leave at all for the holiday because they either didn't have family or didn't have enough money to travel a long distance back home.

[Debi]

7. Where I grew up most students were there for the duration from August to June

(Of course living near two ski resorts in Montana, most students didn't WANT to go home during the winter break!)

[cyberswede]

11. Townie here

I grew up in Iowa City, so I never lived in a dorm. (Lived with the 'rents, then a series of apartments).
I also worked full time over x-mas break, so I never left town. I find the whole idea of living out of one room for an entire school year to be horrifying!

[rurallib]

3. Talked with Johnson county chair about this a few weeks back

Students can caucus where they live if they live in Iowa. Since this is expected to be a major group for Obama, he just expects this to spread the Obama support out rather than have it concentrated in Johnson, Blackhawk and Story counties. He expects Obama to do well anyway in those counties.

[Debi]

6. But what about the kids from Nebraska, Illinois, Wisconsin or Minnesota

who will be going home for the holiday break but do want to caucus?

Maybe the campaigns are gathering volunteers to open their homes to these folks?

[rurallib]

8. I was wondering about that also.

Not sure how many that may be. I know Iowa has a big contingent from Chicago.
On another note, I was asked yesterday if campaign staffers can vote in in the caucus? Some of these kids have been here six months or more, have apartments and I believe would be eligible to vote based on residency.

[Debi]

12. although that is the word of the law it is not the meaning of the law

If they're moving out of Iowa on January 4th then their intent was to never be a resident of Iowa. It may be legal per se, but not very ethical. And I'd hate for a campaign to get caught having staffers who aren't Iowans caucus. It would be bad for Iowa (since we pride ourselves on a 'clean and fair' process) and bad for the campaign b/c that would be the only news coming out of Iowa heading into New Hampshire (not how the candidate performed in Iowa).

[cyberswede]

9. Residency?

I may be wrong about this, but most dorm students from out of state (it's mostly Freshmen who live in the dorms) don't qualify as residents for tuition purposes, so maybe they don't qualify as residents for voting purposes, either.
Does anyone know the rules about out-of-state "permanent" addresses vs. local student addresses for voter registration?

And I still say that we're not talking about very many people - if half the dorm residents are from out of state (a completely baseless figure on my part :) ), that's only about 2800 students - many of which I'm sure have no interest at all in the Iowa Caucus.

The number of students who live in the dorms is what - about 16% of all the students? Thre are plenty of students who live in apartments off-campus or who could stayt with friends who live off-campus.

[Debi]

13. I'm gonna let 'Mr. Iowa Caucus' explain this for me...

From a memo he wrote in 2003...

<snip>

Iowa Code Section 43.91 provides that only eligible Iowa voters may participate in the caucus. The only expansion upon that right is the additional factor is that if they are not an eligible voter on the evening of the caucus they will become one by the date of the next general election.

To become a voter in Iowa one must have a residence in the State. To have a residence in Iowa, one must have a home in the precinct "with the intent to remain there permanently or for a definite or indefinite or indeterminable length of time." (Iowa Code Section 48.5A). Further, a non-resident, with a voting registration in another state is not eligible to register in Iowa (i.e. "not claim the right to vote in more than one place." See Section 48A.5(1)(d).

Additionally, there is a limitation on what can be established as a residence. Under Code Section 48A.5A Determination of Residence (2) provides that "a residence for purposes of this chapter cannot be established in a commercial or industrial building that is not normally used for residential purposes", i.e. which I think we can reasonably take to mean not a hotel or a campaign headquarters.

(Note: if this discussion continues, there is a specific exception for students, who may declare either their campus residence or their hometown as their residence, but not both. See 48A.5 (5)).

<snip>

++++

[cyberswede]

15. Thank you!

That's about as clear as it can be! :)

[Debi]

16. I love him....

:loveya:

I'll give him a :hug: for ya!

[cyberswede]

10. More stats

...just because I'm curuous, too.

Here's some info on 1st-year students (Freshmen) for Fall 2007 at Iowa. So, clearly, we're not talking about that many students who live in the dorms who are from other states. I really don't think this will be a factor.

out-of-state top feeder states:
Illinois 1,349 students
Minnesota 137 students
Wisconsin 106 students
Missouri 22 students
Texas 17 students
Nebraska 16 students
California 15 students
Colorado 13 students
Ohio 13 students
Indiana 13 students
Pennsylvania 12 students
and kids from 29 more states with fewer than 12 students each

[Debi]

14. Awesome cyberswede, thanks!

That Illinois # does have me wondering though. I'm sure Obama would LOVE to have each of them in Iowa on the night of the Caucuses AND standing for him.

I bet the campaigns are already looking for overnight places for the people who do want to come back to Iowa to caucus.

[liberal N proud]

18. How many of them are registered to vote in Iowa?

[Debi]

19. They can register on caucus night

read up-thread.

[progressoid]

17. Yep, they brought it up on Iowa Press yesterday.

But they didn't come to any conclusions about it's potential effect. :shrug: