TakeAction Minnesota just stopped by

[GAspnes]

They're canvassing the neighborhood for signatures. On first blush, their current push is to get progressives elected to support an MN single-payer bill to Margaret Kelleher (once elected gov) for a signature.

Does anyone have more info about this organization?

[Minnesota Raindog]

1. Kelliher is already hedging on her support for single-payer

I, for one, have had enough of these waffling, backpeddling politicians, endorsed candidate or not.

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2010/06/21/kelliher-single-payer-pledge/

St. Paul, Minn. — The new national health care law is expected to be a big issue this year's election, but the DFL's endorsed candidate for governor has been promising to go one step further.

Minnesota House Speaker Margaret Anderson Kelliher pledged to DFL delegates this spring that she would enact a single-payer health plan in Minnesota, but now she says she wants to study the cost first.

Kelliher announced during the DFL Convention in April that she's committed to passing a single-payer health system. She sent a letter to the plan's biggest supporter, DFL Sen. John Marty saying she would sign it within two years of becoming governor.

It helped convince Marty to throw his support to her at the convention as he dropped his own run for governor.

"I have received a personal commitment from Margaret Anderson Kelliher from her that she will do all that she can as governor to ensure its passage and sign the Minnesota Health Plan into law within two years," Marty said.

[Shoush]

2. Kelliher's FIRST run for Gov...

She's been an amazing Speaker of the House and is now running for Governor. And if you read further into the MPR article, Margaret isn't walking back her position on single payer: "We need to have the cost study done to fully understand how we get it done and how quickly we get it done.... neither she nor other supporters know the price-tag of a single-payer system, but Kelliher says she's still committed to it."

Check her out, decide for yourself: http://www.margaretforgovernor.com/

[Spike from MN]

3. I've already decided. She's not getting my vote.

And I think she's been a crappy Speaker of the House. As always, YMMV.

[Shoush]

5. Don't get how an override of a Pawlenty veto...

makes Kelliher a "crappy" Speaker: http://www.startribune.com/politics/state/15942557.html

[Spike from MN]

6. That's all you got?

You had to dig up something from 2008? An override of a veto on a transportation plan to provide "better roads and bridges." Uh, hello? Here in MN, we had a bridge collapse in 2007. A bridge collapse that killed 13 people and injured 145. Does that ring a bell? And somehow, Kelliher is an "amazing" Speaker for managing to override that veto by one vote? Maybe for you, but her performance as Speaker is and always will be in the craptastic category as far as I'm concerned.

[Shoush]

8. "Um, hello" - the bridge collapse is why the OVERRIDE happened (2 + 2 = 4 btw)

And if you READ the article you would learn that "...since 1939, only 14 of 447 gubernatorial vetoes have been overridden". Kind of a big deal. That takes leadership.

She's also ethical and fair:

"House Speaker Margaret Anderson Kelliher, DFL-Minneapolis, said she would not permit punishing dissident Republican members. "If there gets to be a situation where minority members of the House are stripped of services to serve their constituents, I will not stand for that," she said."

Need more? How about a ringing endorsement from Sen. Al Franken - he's hosting a DFL fundraiser for her campaign this Saturday: http://politicsinminnesota.com/blog/2010/06/franken-will-host-kelliher-fundraiser-on-saturday/

Also, I'd like to see some EVIDENCE of why you so eloquently define her as "craptastic".

[Spike from MN]

24. Um, that was the whole point.

You cited the override of a veto of the transportation plan bill as the reason that Kelliher was somehow a less-than-crappy Speaker. The entire reason for the override was, as you stated yourself, due to the the fact that we had a bridge collapse here in MN in 2007. It had nothing to do with her "leadership" and everything to do with the fact that the bridge collapsed. You see, even people in Republican districts drive on the roads here and you can be sure they let their Reps. know what they thought of the current state of the roads here. Everyone that lives in MN knows that the roads have steadily deteriorated in the past few years and have been in need of repair for some time now. It didn't take "leadership" to override the veto. What's sad is that it took a bridge collapse and the deaths of 13 people to do it.

And what makes you think I didn't read the article? Actually, I even read it back in 2008 when it came out, what with it being an article in the LOCAL paper and all. You see, the bridge collapse and the subsequent transportation bill was kind of a big deal here in MN. And I also noticed your selective choice citing. You conveniently left out this part:

"A report by the Humphrey Institute at the University of Minnesota showed that, over the past 70 years, only two governors have made as many vetoes as Pawlenty's 37."

37 vetoes and only one override? And that's only the total up to Feb. of 2008. How many vetoes have been added since? Far too many. Where was Kelliher's leadership on those?

As for the "ringing endorsement from Sen. Al Franken", first off, there's no statement from Al. He's just holding a fundraiser for her which is something that the party expects DFL leaders to do. Kelliher is the DFL endorsed candidate for governor and the DFL leaders are expected to rally around her. If Rybak or someone else had won, they'd be doing the exact same thing.

Further, even if Al, every single DFL leader and a bunch of Hollywood celebrities came out with "ringing endorsements" of Kelliher, it wouldn't matter to me one bit. You see, I prefer to look at the candidate's stand on various issues, past voting records, etc. and make up my OWN MIND regarding who I will or won't support. Apparently, that's a rather novel concept to some.

You want craptistic. Kelliher's inability to protect GAMC is but one in a long list of her failures as Speaker. The handling of Pawlenty's unallottment is another. Instead of using the MNSC ruling to their advantage, they pretty much folded and gave Pawlenty everything he asked for. They have done that far too many times as long as Pawlenty has been governor. That's not leadership. That's caving.

Lastly, I'd like to apologize to GAspnes for the hijacking of this thread. I had no idea my one post stating that I wouldn't vote for Kelliher would cause the thread to be hijacked like it has. I thought my post was simple and straightforward and that it would end there but unfortunately, that's not how it turned out and for that, I sincerely apologize. I've been kind of hoping that Lydia would chime in with info on TakeAction MN because I figured if anyone knew anything about them, it would be either her or DFLPrincess. We've heard from DFLPrincess already (good info, BTW). Maybe Lydia will chime in here eventually.

[dflprincess]

25. Spike is correct

The transportation override would not have happened without a few Republicans who were willing to buck their party and actually do what was right for the state and I don't know how much credit Kelliher can take for that. The image of collapsed bridge was what convinced those few Republicans voting the right way (for that matter it had a lot to do with the DFL hanging together for the override vote).

I know some of them were risking their seats by doing so and at least one, Neil Peterson (represented parts of Bloomington & Edina), did lose in the Republican primary largely because of this vote. The good news there was that the DFL took the seat in November & that would not have happened if Peterson had been the candidate.

[GAspnes]

26. no problem

this isn't my first hijacked thread.

[trotsky]

30. "Instead of using the MNSC ruling to their advantage, they pretty much folded...

... and gave Pawlenty everything he asked for."

Yup. One sentence right there pretty much sums up why I can't support Kelliher. And in addition to Entenza's slimy ways, he did the exact same thing with Pawlenty when he was the DFL leader in the House.

[becxx]

10. Kelliher is one big phony

Kelliher is certainly not getting my vote. In my view, she did nothing forward thinking at all when Speaker. It was the same old protect the monied interests from her. She did not even manage to protect GAMC.

Also, I think she makes an extremely poor role model and should not be governor for that reason alone. Anyone who eats twice as much as needed when about 1/6 of the world's popular faces hunger and often starvation leaves a lot to be desired morally in my view. Her selfish behavior is reprehensible in my view.

[dflprincess]

11. I'm not a big fan of Kelliher but I find comments about her weight offensive.

A lot of women, myself included, develop problems with weight as we age and it has nothing to do with "eating twice as much as needed".

Making value judgements about a person based on their physical appearance is just wrong.

[CubFan7125]

12. You Have Serious Issues!!!

You are worse than any neo-con out there. Your previous attacks on Amy Klobuchar were mean and unnecessary but you didn't just cross the line this time, you shattered it. Are you fucking serious, you won't vote for someone because they are a fatty. Just answer me one question. What is it like to be perfect? The only real reprehensible behavior is on your part. I just hope one day I can be as good as you think you are.

I was tempted to launch into a personal attack and call you several names but then I realized I would be just as low as you are and I don't want that.

[becxx]

14. Yes, I do think over-consumption is immoral

Yes, I do think Kelliher's over-consumption is immoral. And no, I would not vote for someone as obviously selfish as Kelliher. Frankly, I think this type of over-consumption in the USA leads to all types of political and international problems too. You can call me "low" if you think that. The over-consumers have often called those who raise the issue of their over-consumption "low" or something similar--consider Rush Limbaugh. I recall, however, that mud thrown by selfish folks is a beauty treatment. So thanks for throwing some my way. LOLLOL In the meantime, the facts speak for themselves. While many children in Minnesota face hunger, Kelliher overeats.

As to Klobuchar, if you don't think there is something wrong about someone who worries about baggage fees when 20% of children in Minnesota live in poverty and many children face hunger, then we have different values. I wonder who has the mean spirit here.

[CubFan7125]

15. Let's See Facts

You are the only mean spirit here. You have no knowledge that Kelliher eats to much. There could be a million different medical conditions that she has that could account for her weight but you decided it must be because she eats to much. What exact knowledge do you have on her dietary condition? Thought so, you are just a judgmental as any neo-con..

The reason you are worse than the neo-con is that at least they don't pretend to be anything other than what is advertised. We know who and what they are. You make the same ignorant judgments they do but yet you claim to have compassion for the poor and down trodden. Not here and not now. Thank you for showing the world your true colors.

[becxx]

17. Mean spirited?

ClubFan, I just looked back at some of your conversations and I see that you seem to like to attack others on here. Here's one of your exchanges with others:

Mnpaul (487 posts) Sun Aug-10-08 04:04 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. I do too

Listening to him pick apart neocons like Podhoretz is music to my ears.
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HopeFor2006 (1000+ posts) Sun Aug-10-08 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Hartmann is great

After Stephanie Miller he is my favorite on Air America.
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AllHereTruth (351 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 02:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. Slow down there Bud.

Give me one reason why you hate on Hartmann?
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CubFan7125 (136 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 05:08 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Talking Points

All he does is spout talking points. There is nothing funny on his show and when he slices up a neocon it's like watching a retarded kid get beat up. There's 3 reasons. Also for about the 16th million time Stephanie Miller is not on Air America. Either are Bill Press or Ed.
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AllHereTruth (351 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 06:50 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Do you have any other reasons? or is that it

Nothing Funny

and

Hes too good at rebutting a neocon

How are those bad things? Are you fucking serious?
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CubFan7125 (136 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Yes I'm Fucking Serious

He's not funny. You think he actually put's every neocon who calls in on. Grow up. He only puts on the ones who he knows he can beat up on. It takes a real man to beat up on lesser minds. I'm not impressed. AM 950 locally thinks so much of this guy they don't even run him live. What does that tell you.
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AllHereTruth (351 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. You have nothing

What AM 950 chooses to do and not to do has no influence on what i think of someone.

If someone is funny or not has no influence on whether they are a good talk radio host.

Pointing out how good he is at rebutting neocon lies is in no way a put down.

ClubFan7125. You have nothing.
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CubFan7125 (136 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 08:01 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Thanks

You admit the guy's not funny. Thanks. Discussion over. If you want to listen to someone who isn't going to entertain, God Bless. Have a nice day.
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Pierre.Suave (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-11-08 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. ...

scratches head and wonders where you came from...

troll... maybe?
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CubFan7125 (136 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Go To Hell

How can I be a troll. I said it should be a fun time. All this is because I think Thom Hartmann's an assclown. Everyone else on that list is great. Do I have to think just like you to be a good liberal. That kind of thinking is what neocon's do.
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Pierre.Suave (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-11-08 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Whatever you are

you sure have a lot of anger and aggression...
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CubFan7125 (136 posts) Mon Aug-11-08 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Your Right

I become angry when I got called a troll. Do I have to think like every other liberal or I'm not a liberal? Once again this is all because I think Thom Hartmann's a bore. I kinda thought this would be a fun event to go to but know I'm not so sure. I really don't an to go to an event where someone is called a troll because he doesn't agree with everything someone else thinks. If I wanted to do that I'd go down to the XCEL and cheer for Cheney, Norm, GWB and that Old White Haired Guy like the rest of the lemmings will be.
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Pierre.Suave (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-11-08 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. well

you seemed very angry long before I came into this thread.

So now whats your excuse?

[CubFan7125]

19. Thank You

I'm glad you brought that up. That post started me saying that an event sounded good but that Thom Hartmann is a bore. Then I was attacked for not liking Hartmann. If you reread that you will see that I was on the defensive and was attacked. I was called a troll because of my belief that Thom Hartmann should not have a show in Eagle River Wi, much less a national show. I never launched an unprovoked personal attack like you did. Like I said before, I just hope some day I can be as good as you think you are. This is my last post ever on this board. I'm out. Unfortunately there is no room for moderate demorcrats here.

[dflprincess]

16. I have a friend who is morbidly obese

and has started working with a dietician to do something about her weight.

As it turns out, besides being over 50 and menopausal, she's done a real number on her metablolism by eating less and less as she put the pounds on. She managed to throw her body into "famine mode" and it burns as few calories as it can. This is a fairly common occurance though not always as extreme as my friend's situation (the dietician says she had her body so confused she could practically gain weight drinking water). She's worked with the dietician to get her calorie consumption UP to between 1,800 and 2,000 a day.

As Cubfan7125 said, there are a lot of reasons people gain weight and very few of them have anything to do with mere over indulgence or being selfish.

Using your reasoning, skinny little Tim Pawlenty must be a wonderful person because he's not "over consuming".

[becxx]

18. Over consuming

DFL Princess, I appreciate your defense of those who gain weight through no fault of their own. That does happen. I do not think that is true in Kelliher's case, however. I think Kelliher is just plain greedy and I have not seen her stand up for ordinary Minnesotans. I think Kelliher's quest for the governor's office has more to do with her greed and feeding herself and her ego than any genuine concern for ordinary Minnesotans.

Also, Tim Pawlenty has his own problems with over consumption and greed. It is not merely food that is used to over-consumption. I'm not so impressed with those who drive big gas guzzlers, live in too big houses, etc. All of this over consumption has a serious negative impact on the world.

[dflprincess]

20. I am leaning toward Dayton in the primary because he really is the only real liberal in the race

My problems with Kelliher is that she only got the endorsement because of the super delegates and I fear she is just another "pragmatic" politician which is probably the reason for the half hearted attempts to override Pawlenty's vetos of GAMC & income tax increases. However, I don't think she is near the monster you're trying to make her out to be and she would certainly be 1000x better than Emmer.

But you'll have to come up with reasons other than her weight for calling her greedy. And ego isn't enough - all politicians have egos (though in today's paper someone was quoted as calling Dayton the "least ego driven politician" they've ever met).

Again, I find attacking someone's physical appearance & making judgements about their character based on appearance offensive. You make very good points about Pawlenty's over consumption - but you base those points on his actions, not his looks.

[becxx]

22. Appearance is not the issue with Kelliher

My issue with Kelliher has nothing to do with her appearance. She could be as ugly as could be if her behavior and character were worth emulating. Take Paul Wellstone, for example. A lot of folks said he was ugly but I personally found him to be quite adorable probably because he was so worthy of emulation. If you look at his life, he lived modestly and did not over-consume in any way. The same cannot be said of Kelliher. It has to do with her behavior. First, her overeating certainly is not something anyone should emulate and provides an extremely poor model. There are significant costs associated with this type of behavior as I know full well from working in health care. I just do not want to see someone so out of control in the Governor's office -- I don't care if the problem is over-consumption of alcohol, of material possessions or of food. I simply do not want someone of her caliber in the Governor's office. Moreover, just as alcholics and gamblers miss a lot of work, the research shows that those who are obese also miss a lot of work. I think there is a character issue with Kelliher that should not be ignored.

Also, I notice that Kelliher consistently fails to protect those most vulnerable while, at the same, participates in funding of luxuries such as the arts.. I am deeply troubled by this, good Methodist that I was raised to be. I believe that first we take care of the basics and then we fund luxuries such as the arts.

[hermetic]

27. "luxuries such as the arts"

:eyes:

Do you have A CLUE as to the value of the arts to MN? No, obviously you don't. Here, try this on:
http://www.mncitizensforthearts.org/learn/artsresearch/artists-count-2/

"The Findings of a 2007 study documented in unprecedented scope and detail the annual economic impact of Minnesota’s individual artists.

By All Measures, the results were impressive:
Number of artists surveyed in the state: 19,676
Economic Impact of Artist Spending: $295M
Full-Time Equivalent Jobs Supported: 5,937
State and Local Government Revenue Generated: $24M
Artists are also very engaged with their communities, volunteering and voting to a higher degree than the rest of the population. Our communities would be diminished without the many and varied contributions of our artists. Just as we look for ways to insure that our communities are “hospitable” places for businesses to locate and thrive, we must make certain that our artistic resources are nurtured as well."

And, http://www.mncitizensforthearts.org/learn/artsresearch/mn-arts-facts-/?phpMyAdmin=rcNJ4aTZI8ZeXmtgwRuSUkMr5id

"STRONG INTEREST AND SUPPORT OF THE PUBLIC:
When a 2004 University of Minnesota study asked residents: “Do you believe that the arts and cultural activities help make Minnesota an attractive place to live and work?”, 94% of survey respondents said “yes”. 95.8% of Democrats, 94.1% of Independents and 91.6% of Republicans all answered “yes” to this question.

According to a poll by the Minnesota Center for Survey Research at the University of Minnesota (1998):

* 95% of Minnesotans believe that arts education is essential or important to the overall education of Minnesota’s children.
* 94% of Minnesotans believe that arts and cultural activities help to make Minnesota an attractive place to live and work.
* 92% of Minnesotans believe that the arts are crucial to their quality of life.
* 82% of Minnesotans believe that public funding for arts and cultural activities help to make them affordable and accessible to all Minnesotans.
* 67% of Minnesotans attended an arts activity (at a theater, auditorium, concert hall, museum, gallery) within the last year.
* 60% of Minnesotans are involved in the arts by engaging in some creative activity in their everyday lives, (like singing in a choir, doing woodworking or needlepoint, writing poetry, or painting), exceeding the national average for arts participation.

HIGH PUBLIC PARTICIPATION:
According to the St. Paul Pioneer Press (1/17/99) and Minnesota State Arts Board, almost 9 million people attended nonprofit arts events in Minnesota in 1998, outnumbering the people who attended sports events."




(Sorry, GAspnes :hi: )

[becxx]

28. Tell that to the homeless and without health insurance

I disagree. I think feeding the hungry and taking care of those without insurance are a lot more important than the arts and trinkets. It comes down to a question of what do you value. Trinkets or people?

[dflprincess]

29. Arts are one of the things that contrbute to an area's quality

and actually do attract people to the area (as the hermetic pointed out, more so than sports). And, unlike Target Field, the Gutherie isn't owned by anyone getting rich off it and still asking for tax dollars.

You'll notice that, despite the lower taxes we hear so much about, the corporate wheels aren't moving to Sioux Falls. No, they stay here and spend their money here and one of the reasons they stay are the "trinkets".

More people can translate to more tax payers. More tax payers means more money to spend on everything.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

21. You won't vote for her because she's *FAT*??

No overweight person should ever be elected to public office because they eat too much and therefore are poor role models? WTF?

'Scuse me, but that's about the dumbest reason I've ever heard for not voting for somebody. If I decide to support Kelliher, or not, it will be because of her positions on important issues, not her looks.

And now I guess I'll go drown myself in the river because, being a bit on the portly side myself, I guess I must be too selfish and worthless to live.

:eyes:

[Spike from MN]

4. I don't know anything about them personally but a quick

perusal of their website shows they think the Insurance Profit Protection Plan (aka HCR) is a "victory for our democracy." No criticism of the plan. No "It's not perfect by any means but at least it's a start." And, more importantly, no mention of a single-payer bill for MN. Apparently they think the bill that was passed is perfect just the way it is. Here's their take on it:

"Last night the United States House of Representatives passed a landmark piece of legislation in the history of our country. This is a victory for every American, and for every Minnesotan, who has wondered whether the United States can truly be a land of opportunity and justice. As a result of this legislation, 32 million Americans will have the access to health care they so desperately need. Our health will no longer be held hostage by big insurance companies, and instead will be more accountable to the people of this country."

You can read the full statement here:

http://takeactionminnesota.org/index.asp?Type=B_PR&SEC={B67776A5-FF79-4F38-A5CC-73D2A428E13F}&DE={F728749F-1250-4020-92B4-71BDE0AEE73F}

If you look at their "Electing a Progressive Governor in 2010" page, you'll see a link to renew.mn. From the renew.mn page:

"TakeAction Minnesota is committed to doing the grassroots work it takes to help Margaret win the August 10th primary."

So, I guess they figure that calling Kelliher a progressive makes her one, or something like that.

So, to sum it up, if you liked the Insurance Profit Protection Plan, you'll probably love TakeAction Minnesota. If you think Kelliher is a progressive, same thing. As for me, I already know as much as I need to about TakeAction MN and renew.mn. I get really tired of front groups and so-called "grassroots organizations" doing nothing more than supporting our current one-party-system-masquerading-as-a-two-party-system and reinforcing the status quo. The DFL and Republicans already have their own party machines but apparently that's not enough. They need these front groups and "grassroots" organizations to make them seem like they're down-to-earth political organizations that are in touch with the needs of the "common man" instead of the elitist organizations they really are, serving the interests of the top 1% at the expense of all the rest.

At least, that's my take on it anyway. But then again, you know me. I'm not exactly what you would call a party wonk. ;)

:hi:

[dflprincess]

7. I went to a forum they had last summer about the "health care" bill

and was not impressed.

They were pretty much following the Obama line and were not really even willing to discuss single payer or Medicare for All. John Marty as there and they didn't have much choice but to let him speak about his plan for Minnesota but there wasn't much follow. At the time they were still discussing the possibilty of the never defined "public option" but that was as close to pushing real reform as they got.

I recently ran into someone who was quite active with them at the time. She has not had insurance for over 4 years and has given up on Take Action because they were just too willing to roll over and preten the insurance bailout was actual reform.

[GAspnes]

9. ahhh, actual information

Thanks DFL.

[mascarax]

13. And how could John Marty come In 4th

In their RenewMN voting?
Granted, I don't have a ton of knowledge on all players, but I certainly would've put John in the top 3.

[DakotaBlue75]

23. M vs. R

RT Rybak, mayor of Minneapolis, would have been a better candidate. Nothing agains Margaret. She will be fine.