"Most socialist state in the country"

[69KV]

I've read that before about North Dakota and it seems to go back to the old agrarian populist and progressive movements at the turn of the last century.

They're why Minnesota, Wisconsin, Washington, and Oregon are still in our column - people in Wisconsin still revere the LaFollette name and anyone who runs on a LaFollette-like platform like Russ Feingold. Minnesota's Iron Range still gives 70% of its votes to Dems in federal elections and is one of the few mostly-white rural areas that the R's haven't been able to make inroads into.

But prairie populism was also big in North Dakota and Montana and I'm not sure why they aren't in our column too. That whole northern tier of western states from Wisconsin to Washington used to be the source of strongest support for the old Progressive Party, Farmer-Labor Party, and Non-Partisan League as well as the Socialist Party and the short-lived Union Party. The Grange, the farmers' organization, was a big supporter of progressive issues a century ago although today they are mostly just a fraternal group. North Dakota's congressman during the Depression broke with FDR because he didn't think the New Deal went far enough to the left.

And North Dakota as I understand has the most socialist setup of any state in the union, with state-run farmers co-ops and mutual banks, the strongest laws protecting family farms and restricting the ability of big agribusiness to move in, the only state with state-run grain mills, and the like. So I really don't get it. Why does that state vote so strongly in the R column in presidential elections? Is this a case of "we've already got ours, the rest of you can go to hell?"

[aquart]

1. Do they know they're socialists?

They may be calling it something else altogether.

[69KV]

4. That's a good question

I've been doing some googling...

North Dakota's state-run co-ops and bank were established during the Lynn Frazier era. He was the 3-term Non Partisan League governor (then a left-wing third party, since merged with the Democrats.) He was governor from 1916 to 1921, before FDR and the New Deal came along.

The same thing could apply to Tennessee. TVA was (maybe still is) the only major industry run by the U.S. government. That's another state that votes R in federal elections, not as lopsidedly as North Dakota does, but still...

A lot has been made this election of social issues and the religious right especially in rural areas.

Upon some thought, I really don't think people in North Dakota or Tennessee think of what they have there as socialism. Even though that's really what it is. The people who were alive when the NPL was a big force in North Dakota politics, when the state co-ops were set up, when TVA was established, have long since passed away, and the people there now just think of it as "the way things are" and don't make the connection to left-wing economic policies. They're voting on social issues.

If that's the case though, why doesn't this rural infatuation with social issues extend to mostly rural states like Vermont, Wisconsin, Maine, New Hampshire, or Minnesota's Iron Range?

I think I'm really going to have to get a copy of "What's the Matter With Kansas?" to figure this out. And we Dems probably need to also ask ourselves, "what's right about Vermont, Wisconsin, Maine, New Hampshire, and Minnesota?" Whatever we're doing right there, we need to take to the other rural states. Maybe the religious right hasn't made big inroads into some states, but has into others? I don't know.

[ret5hd]

2. this is very interesting info and question...

my wife's parents are from ND. i will have to ask this question.

[sandnsea]

3. Montana

Invasion of Californians, who natives think are all liberals, but they aren't. So the native votes R against the Californian, but the Californian is really an Orange County Republican and votes R too. That and loss of logging and mining jobs, and farming and ranching problems, and anger at environmentalists. Hopefully Schweitzer will bring some balance back and figure out how to improve the economy while working with environmentalists so the people will know it can be done.

[Qanisqineq]

5. the editor of the LaMoure Chronicle

said that ND is the most socialist state in the country in a recent editorial. (Don't ask for a link. LaMoure is an itsy-bitsy town with a weekly paper that only covers LaMoure County news. I get the paper because it is my hometown.)

[AimeeMM]

6. I need to show this to my family..

I moved from ND to FL when I was 12 but my entire family sans my mom still lives up there. They all vote Republican, but I know that if they ever really compared the two they'd start voting with the Dems.

My mom once said to me, "I'm from North Dakota, I'm supposed to be a Republican." I nearly lost it - didn't know if I should laugh or cry. She didn't have a good reason beyond that, so I figure there's hope for her, yet.

[69KV]

7. Did more googling on this

In North Dakota (and also Nebraska) when the Progressive movement really started to take off, it was a faction within those states Republican parties. North Dakota's William Lemke and Nebraska's George Norris were very left-wing - and they were Republicans. In North Dakota, the competing major parties were the Non-Partisan League (left-wing party also strong in Washington State, later merged with the Democrats) and the Republicans (controlled by their Progressive wing.) In other states by contrast, the Progressives (or their equivalents like the Farmer-Labor Party) wound up merging with the Democrats.

In North Dakota the end of the NPL as a political force came during the 1921 recall of Gov. Lynn Frazier. From that point on, progressive politics in North Dakota fell under the Republicans, such as the aforementioned William Lemke, who held a seat in Congress until 1950. As the Republicans swung hard right from Nixon on, progressive politics in states like North Dakota and Nebraska gradually disappeared, but the states continue to vote Republican. Probably out of tradition. (Interesting though that both of N.D.'s Senators are Democrats.)

I see it as sort of the equivalent of the Deep South continuing to vote Democratic a century after the Civil War had ended. Only difference, the Repugs made a big push for Southern votes after Civil Rights passed. We never made a similar push for those states which had a strong Progressive tradition but were traditionally Republican. We wound up winning over Vermont, Maine, and Oregon, all traditionally R - probably by accident, I'll go into that another time in another post. But North Dakota, Montana, and Nebraska should by all rights be ours too.

[CatholicEdHead]

9. Sounds similar to the south

They have a Democratic Party heritiage, and before the parties switched in the 1960's they were right at home. It must also be because of habit because a good number of southern votes has been becuase someone's father, grandfather, great-grandfather, etc... voted Democratic and they should too, regardless of issues.

(D)'s and (R)'s on the ballot behind names do intresting things during the election.

[Hippo_Tron]

8. Dem Presidential Candidates don't campaign in North Dakota or Montana

Because each state only has three electoral votes.

[Siyahamba]

10. North Dakota used to be much like neighboring Saskatchewan and Manitoba

Which are still very much progressive.

[CatholicEdHead]

11. Canada is relitive anyway

but all I hear is that many in the plains of Canada are more like Americans in the SE, rather than Toronto or Winnipeg proper.

Of course, most Canadian "conservatives" are considered "liberal" here.

[sd_UDO]

13. What's the difference--both Parties want to kill prairie dogs?

I don't think a prairie dog cares
whether someone shooting at it
is a Democrat or Republican.

Just the Enfangered Species Act
keeps the p-dog colonies at
over 100,000 acres in South Dakota.

Which means the "little minded"
ranchers get to shoot and poison
to their heart's content until
the P-Dog population is
"managed" down to 144,000 acres
or so...

Pretty ominous, huh?

Like mankind has enough brains to kill and
thus "manage" animals?

A holocaust against humans or animals is
still a holocaust.

[RICEQUEEN]

14. 51st state

and the liberals in canada would be considered conservatives in germany

[tiptoe]

15. . nt

[tiptoe]

16. .nt

[dem3550]

17. +1

[sandnsea]

12. They're Lincoln Republicans

Which is about as removed from modern day Republicans as you can get. Between the Civil War and FDR, nobody voted for a Rebel Dem. If it weren't for the Populist movement, I doubt we'd have had a Dem party. The Republican Party had enough progressives, like Teddy, in it that many Republicans never felt the need to move. They still don't get that the parties have flipped in many regards over the last 30-40 years.