Ohio lawmakers override gun veto

[deadparrot]

COLUMBUS, Ohio - Lawmakers voted Tuesday to override outgoing Gov. Bob Taft's veto of a bill that will wipe out local gun laws, the first time in 29 years that the Legislature has rejected a gubernatorial veto.

The move was all the more unusual because both chambers are dominated by Republicans — the governor's own party.

The Senate voted 21-12 on Tuesday to override, and the House voted last week. The bill will take effect in about three months.

Taft, who leaves office in a few weeks, has said the gun bill exceeded its goal of cleaning up Ohio's concealed weapons law because it pre-empts about 80 local gun laws, including assault-weapons bans in Cincinnati, Cleveland, Columbus, Dayton and Toledo.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061212/ap_on_re_us/ohio_guns_veto_override

[jody]

1. New Dem Gov Strickland said he would sign bill. See DU's Guns links below.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x132680

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x132654

[-..__...]

2. Bravo!

:bounce: :applause:

And I don't even live in Ohio. :smoke:

[Kolesar]

3. Those small-town hayseed legislators could have just stayed out of "the big cities"

...if they were so scared and needed a gun just to drive around there.

This is just another in a long series of cases where Ohio's legislators demonstrated how out of touch they are with the people of Ohio. Our state is being run by a bunch of provincial, small town conservatives who have nothing but hatred for the residents of our urban areas.

[jody]

4. The new Dem Ohio Governor said he would sign the bill. Looks like small-town hayseed voters are

the majority in Ohio.

[Kolesar]

5. Not according to the Toledo Blade article in this thread you have already been posting to

So quit playing games with words

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x132680

A majority of respondents to an Ohio survey said overriding local gun laws was a bad idea, according to a poll released today by the Hamden, Conn.-Quinnipiac University Polling Institute.

[jody]

6. Sorry but you're wrong about Strickland's promise. See it at the DU link below.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x132654#132661

[Kolesar]

7. I was not talking about Stricklands promise. I was showing the legislators were out of touch

I suppose that, by extension, you could say that includes Strickland

[jody]

8. My point is that Strickland made his position known before the election so one would

could conclude that those who voted for him accepted his position on CCW.

[Kolesar]

9. You are avoiding speaking to my point because you cannot counter it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2650172&mesg_id=2650250

Strickland did not even enter into what happened with the veto override, in case you need a reminder about civics in a state that you don't even live in.

[jody]

13. I rebutted your point showing that voters put Strickland in office for his promise to sign the

bill for which the Ohio legislature just overrode a veto.

I'll take votes that put a Democrat in the governor's seat, a simple fact, over any spurious poll you cite.

[Kolesar]

14. where in that post did I say anything about Strickland?

Those small-town hayseed legislators could have just stayed out of "the big cities"
...if they were so scared and needed a gun just to drive around there.

This is just another in a long series of cases where Ohio's legislators demonstrated how out of touch they are with the people of Ohio. Our state is being run by a bunch of provincial, small town conservatives who have nothing but hatred for the residents of our urban areas.

I think your new found confidence is starting to interfere with your comprehension.

[jody]

18. You responded to my post #4 which was about Strickland. Note that the

bill in question was CCW and the Quinnipiac University Poll upon which you rely did not ask that question. Instead, it asked.

8. In general do you think that gun control laws in Ohio should be more strict, less strict, or are they about right?
More strict 35%
Less strict 12%
About right 46%
DK/NA 6%

9. Some have suggested that the state should have the power to override gun control laws passed by towns and cities. Do you think this is a good idea or a bad idea?
Good idea 35%
Bad idea 54%
DK/NA 10%

Ohio's constitution clearly says citizens have an inalienable right to defend self and also speaks to the right to keep and bear arms.

That means it's state government, not local government that is responsible for protecting that right and the best way for legislators to do that job is by reserving unto themselves the entire role of protecting that right.

Ohio's legislators did that task when they passed the bill in question and then over rode a veto.

[Kolesar]

19. I was responding about the poll, Alabama

That's why I ... uh ... put in a quote about the poll:think:. Which, by the way, makes a good case that the Ohio legislature is run by out-of-touch small town hayseeds who hate urban Ohio

[jody]

20. The bill summary in question begins as follows.

Sub. H.B. 347

Provides that the individual right to keep and bear arms, being a fundamental individual right that predates the U.S. Constitution and Ohio Constitution and being constitutionally protected in every part of Ohio, the General Assembly finds the need to provide uniform laws throughout the state regulating the ownership, possession, purchase, other acquisition, transport, storage, carrying, sale, or other transfer of firearms, their components, and their ammunition, and that, except as specifically provided by the U.S. Constitution, Ohio Constitution, or that state or federal law, a person may, without further license, permission, restriction, delay, or process own, possess, purchase, sell, transfer, transport, or keep any firearm, part of a firearm, its components, and its ammunition.

That objective and the new law seems perfectly consistent with the duty of Ohio's legislature.

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jody]

23. I see my statements were more than adequate to rebut your assertions.

A :toast: to those Ohio legislators from both parties who voted for H.B. 347 and its new Democratic Governor who have the integrity to honor their oath of office "to support the Constitution of the United States, and of this state".

Any Ohio legislator who supported home rule with the intent of allowing local governments to enact laws preventing law-abiding citizens from exercising their inalienable rights under Ohio's Constitution as shown below betray their office and the citizens of Ohio.

§ 1.01 Inalienable Rights (1851)
All men are, by nature, free and independent, and have certain inalienable rights, among which are those of enjoying and defending life and liberty, acquiring, possessing, and protecting property, and seeking and obtaining happiness and safety.

§ 1.04 Bearing arms; standing armies; military powers (1851)
The people have the right to bear arms for their defense and security; but standing armies, in time of peace, are dangerous to liberty, and shall not be kept up; and the military shall be in strict subordination to the civil power.

[seriousstan]

10. The poll you quote was vague in it's scope whereas this issue was specific.

Should the concealed carry law be uniformly enforced throughout the state. I would say most people responded to the poll with the thought that the state might pass a MORE restrictive law.

[Kolesar]

11. The Toledo Blade quote of the poll does not say ANYTHING like that

"MORE restrictive"

[seriousstan]

12. I never said it did. I said people who responded probably had that in mind.

The question, according to your link and post, was...

9. Some have suggested that the state should have the power to override gun control laws passed by towns and cities. Do you think this is a good idea or a bad idea?

[Kolesar]

15. You are projecting. You made up the "MORE restrictive" poll result

[seriousstan]

16. Was I projecting when the concealed carry law was passed in Ohio?

I am simply telling you how I read the poll question and reacted.

[Kolesar]

17. Umm...that's the definition of "projecting" ... eom

[mosin]

22. Poll language

A majority of respondents to an Ohio survey said overriding local gun laws was a bad idea, according to a poll released today by the Hamden, Conn.-Quinnipiac University Polling Institute.

It's all about how you word the poll question.

Change this:

9. Some have suggested that the state should have the power to override gun control laws passed by towns and cities. Do you think this is a good idea or a bad idea?

To this:

9. The legislature is considering a bill that would provide for one set of rules for gun owners to know and obey as they travel across Ohio. Do you support or oppose having one set of rules?

I think the results would change substantially.

This has been seen repeatedly in previous "contradictory" opinion polls on concealed carry reform in Ohio. If a pollster asks if it should be easier to get a license or if most people should be able to get a license, 2/3 say no. If you ask if any Ohioan who completes a training course and passes a background check should be able to get a license from the county sheriff, 2/3 say yes.

Most people simply don't have strongly-formed opinions on the issue, so they flip and flop based on the slant of the question. The reality is that there are very few vocal gun rights opponents in Ohio (Toby Hoover excepted), whereas there are far more vocal gun rights supporters in Ohio. That's why we have a pro-gun (albeit Republican-controlled) legislature, and will soon have a pro-gun Democratic governor and pro-gun Democratic attorney general.