Gun carrier claims rights violated - Woman files suit against Lebanon sheriff over revocation

[HopeHoops]

Source: Harrisburg, PA - Patriot-News

LEBANON - A woman whose concealed-weapons permit was revoked by the Lebanon County sheriff after openly carrying a handgun to her daughter's soccer game is suing the sheriff in federal court for more than $1 million.
...
The lawsuit, filed Monday in U.S. Middle District Court, seeks reimbursement of attorneys' fees and costs, emotional distress and lost wages -- money lost, her attorney said, because Hain's baby-sitting business has declined from full time to one day a week because of the controversy.



Read more: http://www.pennlive.com/news/patriotnews/index.ssf?/base/news/1227575414259430.xml&coll=1

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This is definitely a case of "You can't fix stupid". What she did may be legal in PA, and she does have a right, but it is certainly not 'right'.

They don't show the picture in this article, but the one that ran in the paper originally showed her at a game with loaded gun in a holster on her hip and her kid hugging her WITH HIS HAND ON THE GUN!

What parent would allow a person with such bad judgment to baby-sit their child?

The irony is that she claims to carry the gun for her personal safety, yet one snap on a holster in reach of a child is all it would take to be reading something horrifying in the next day's paper.

Edited to add:

Just for clarification if you are not familiar with gun laws in PA, these are the facts as I understand them:
Other than in Philadelphia, as far as I understand it you can carry an open weapon pretty much anywhere as long as you aren't prohibited from handling one. You can even check them at the door when you enter a government building. Concealed weapon permits are not terribly difficult to obtain.

The following is my personal recollection of how this unfolded - I read pretty much everything in the paper every day (except the sports section):

The base history to this story is that she had it "concealed" but quite visible at a soccer game and some of the other parents found this alarming. When confronted about it she made a scene, which if you think about it, an angry parent with a gun is even more reason for concern. Based on her behavior, her permit was suspended pending review which meant she had to carry it in plain view for a while. This entire episode would have likely faded away if she hadn't continued to push the issue and made a point of prominently displaying her gun. At the time I think it was clear she was enjoying her 15 minutes. The courts will have to decide the merit or lack thereof of the lawsuit, but having followed the story closely since the beginning, I personally believe any damage was self-inflicted.

Another interesting component is the editorials this story generated. Obviously there were the expected anti-gun pieces, but what struck me were the ones from 2nd Amendment advocates, hunters, and others who carry concealed weapons - they were overwhelmingly against this woman.

[Cal Carpenter]

1. self-delete

self-delete

[HopeHoops]

2. Point taken - edit made

[Cal Carpenter]

3. Cool - I edited too...

This thread will probably be controversial enough as it is :)

[baldguy]

4. Just what we need - another fool with a gun.

[SpiralHawk]

5. "Happiness is a warm gun." - Paranoid Personages

[melm00se]

6. the question is:

did the sheriff act within the law when he revoked her lawfully obtained permit?

the fact that the license was "reinstated by Lebanon County Judge Robert Eby Oct. 14" seems to indicate that the sheriff was operating extra-legally in revoking her permit.

a good test for this is to substitute "protest sign" for "firearm" and gauge your reaction. Both of these items are Constitutionally protected activities and as such the sheriff can not, unilaterally and extra-legally deprive someone from those rights.

(yes, I understand the difference between carrying a firearm and a protest sign - one can kill and one can't BUT that does not alter the fact that both are Constitutionally protected rights and that the woman in question obtained, thru the proper and defined process, a permit and, other than offending people, did nothing in violation of existing laws).

[HopeHoops]

8. Yes, it is a common response to complaints of that nature, quite appropriate

[-..__...]

7. LOOK MOMMY!!! THAT LADY HAS A GUN!!!

:scared: :scared: :scared:

You acknowledge that it was the womans right (as does PA law), to openly carry a handgun, but then conclude that it's not "right"...
as if there's something inherently evil or offensive about a woman displaying a firearm in public... around children.

Whether you (or others), believe it's "right" or not is immaterial and is really not your place to judge. She had a legal right to do so
and the sheriff was out of place for revoking her permit. That's it... end of story.

I don't agree with the million dollar lawsuit. All to often these sort of things are concocted for personal gain rather than to seek justice or send a message. However... some punitive measure is in order.

Personally... I'm not a big advocate of "open carry" (although I fully support ones right to do so if permissible by law).

Broadcasting to the bad guys that you're armed is more advantageous to the perpetrator than it is to the armed citizen, and as we've learned from the article (and your post), it sends the sheeple into fits of childlike panic and terror.

[wartrace]

9. I find it "alarming" when I see an idiot trying to drive & talk on a cell phone.

Should their drivers license be revoked? Based on my being alarmed?

[Javaman]

10. yes, driving and talking on a phone causes a person to lose concentration.

thus leaving them open to an accident. Studies have show this to be true.

being an arrogant jerk, generally doesn't cause anyone harm, generally, however, the woman in the article is a moron plain and simple.

She gives responsible gun owners a bad name.

[wartrace]

11. The gun was in a holster.

It caused nobody harm. The fact that people were "alarmed" at the sight of a gun is humerous. Do they get alarmed when they see a police officer with a gun? If open carry is allowed in that state & she broke no laws why did she have her permit revoked?

[Javaman]

12. I know enough not to bring my weapon to a soccer game.

yes, she is an arrogant jerk.

[Bunny]

13. I don't get alarmed when I see a police officer carrying a gun in an official capacity.

I assume that said officer is trained in proper usage of the gun, and understands the laws regarding deadly force, etc. I have no such assumption when some goober decides to show up at a children's soccer match openly sporting a sidearm.

[wartrace]

14. Until someone draws the weapon why is it an issue?

You would prefer the Ostrich approach? Stick your head in the sand and imagine nobody is armed? BTW- To get a carry permit you have to pass an extensive background check, take a training class on the use of deadly force & qualify on the range. Frankly I believe you place too much trust in the police. Ask Sean Bell,oh wait a minute, you can't. He encountered "trained officers", not some goober who went out and qualified for a carry permit.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/11/26/national/main2208778.shtml

Thanks for your post though Bunny, I personally won't carry openly. I like to have the element of surprise on my side.

[Richard Steele]

15. She's an attention-seeking loon who used her pistol to get attention.

She's exactly the sort of person who shouldn't
be allowed to carry a firearm around in public.

Emotionally unstable & desperate for attention.
Not a good combination with firearms.