Capito - Who is the Dems going to running?

[Ioo]

Grrr, I just do not care for her at all, a total waste of a seat. So I was wondering is the Dems have place someone on the ballot?

By they way, Hello WV Dems, I am in the Harpers Ferry Area :)

[Hubert Flottz]

1. Hello Ioo and welcome to DU!

After the things Shelly's Outlaw Daddy did to the state you'd think a danged skunk could take that seat from her! I think that if she runs against Senator Byrd she's toast!

Harper's Ferry is a beautiful part of West Virginia! I love it up there! The Eastern Panhandle of WV and the Valley of Virginia is some awesome country!

[Lasher]

5. Shelly's Outlaw Family

You're right, her infamous daddy was convicted and did time. I think the worst thing he did was to sell us out concerning the Buffalo Creek disaster.

http://www.wvculture.org/history/arcmoore.html

But did you know that Shelly's sister, Lucy Durbin, and Lucy's husband were busted for selling cocaine?

http://library.cnpapers.com/cgi-bin/texis/search?uquery=john%20durbin&pub=gz

The acorn never falls far from the tree.

[Hubert Flottz]

6. Yes I knew about it!

A movie star and the mayor of Charleston were also involved in the drug ring I've been told! Even some local law enforcement officers and a school principal were in on it too, was the word around here at the time. This whole county was buzzing about the "Drug Ring" for months! The Mayor not only resigned, but he got the hell out of the state ASAP!

When I first heard Shelly was going to run for office I thought she was the one with the bad record, but I found out differently! Still, she comes from a hell of a crew where anything in the world is legal as long as you don't get caught! That's Republican "Morality", "Family Values" and $HIT!

You're right though, the bad fruit don't fall far from the tree! Looks like the Moore KKKlan are a whole barrel of "BAD APPLES"! If I were Robert Byrd and Shelly ran those TV hit pieces about him like the GOPers have run against everyone they campaign against, I'd bring up the crime family ties Shelly has right off the bat!

I think the Fred Zane State police lab thing happened under Governor Moore's watch too! Fred's putting folks in jail for years with fake evidence, ended up costing the taxpayers millions in law suits and retrials. The bad thing about that deal was, that those poor people who were jailed on the bogus evidence, were cheated out of years of their lives and they had committed no crimes whatsoever! Then the Repig who was running the State Police when the Zany Zane was faking evidence, ran for governor on the Repig ticket not long afterward! I guess Unmitigated GALL is what the G in GOP stands for!

Anyone who faces Shelly "Moore" Capito needs to remember all that seedy stuff about her crooked crime family, when she starts the next nasty campaign! And she will, because the GOP in this state always fights as dirty as hell!

[Lasher]

8. Senate Campaign

Hubert,

That's interesting, didn't know that.

It is very clear, that if Capito does run against Byrd, there will be an 'independent', well financed smear campaign against Byrd. Shelly, meanwhile, will remain above all this. I have been sadened to see that this Republican tactic works.

The thing to do is, have an 'independent' smear campaign ready and waiting for Shelley, and every other Republican candidate. Like I said, I hate to see it, but this is political reality today.

[Hubert Flottz]

9. I checked out the Waters webpage!

Welcome to DU!!!

That radio FReeper guy is an idiot! Jumping off the Gorge Bridge is not a very bright thing to do! I worked on top of that bridge in 76-77 welding on the steel that the deck pans are bolted onto and then the concrete deck was poured over! His bridge pictures brought back many old memories!

Mr. Waters wouldn't think it was so funny out on that outside stringer beam if he'd have been dragging 150 feet of welding lead, or a bundle of 10 foot angle irons behind him! There was no net under those outside stringers! Nothing between that beam and New River, but about 875 feet of hot, humid, air!(icy freezing cold air in the winter) Needless to say "The Weather Outside Was(always)Frightful" winter or summer on that puppy!

Maybe Mr. Waters, will end up splattered on one of those large river boulders next jump and make the world a far better place! I'll call him up on his radio freak show someday and see if I can splain things VERY slowly, so that even a FReeper drone can understand!

[Hubert Flottz]

7. Hey, thanks for the links.

The state police lab chemist I was writing about on another post on this thread, is Fred Zain, not Fred Zane, as I had thought!

Here's what I found about Zain at the link to the newspaper you gave me!

http://library.cnpapers.com/cgi-bin/texis/search/+Uxe9jWQeqxwwwwxFqE-GnmaYwoDa5BwBnapdcoqnacwxq7mwwwwwwwwmFqmwcc/

[Staph]

2. Potential Candidates

Assuming that Ms. Capito decides to run again for her Congressional seat (and not against Senator Byrd, a big assumption), who has the name recognition, experience, and chutzpah to run against her? Jim Humphreys has no support. Peggy Workman has a name, but only judicial experience. Eric Wells is a newcomer. What about Bob Wise? Do you think he might be persuaded to run again?

[Hubert Flottz]

3. I wish Bob Wise would run again!

I think the Repig dirty tricks machine helped do a number on him! I hope he has the guts to want some payback!

[Yastreb]

10. Interesting..

Hubert, why do you end every single sentence with an exclamation point?

[Hubert Flottz]

12. I'm a Serious Kind Of Dude, Dude!

What do you want good grammar, or the straight skinny?!

[newyawker99]

17. Hi Yastreb!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Ioo]

4. So who...

We have any worth while mayors? Any of you guys?

I detest her, and want her out... Any contact at the DNC who is on the quest?

[JeremyL]

11. Ousting Capito Crime Family

Capito will most likely run for Representative again (judging from her actions and concerns) and if so, then don't count Wells out.

[Lasher]

13. Dump Capito

I don't think it would be good to run Wise, because WV voters will punish him for his indescretion. Wish I were wrong about this, but don't think so. I'm starting to think that she is just too weak to stand up to Byrd, so maybe that matchup won't occur.

We have got to win the Senate in the midterms. Then Jay would be the Chairman of the Select Committee on Intelligence. At that point, I would certainly expect him to launch a full scale investigation to see exactly how Bush lied us into the Iraq war, which I believe was an act of treason.

Wouldn't hurt to have a REAL investigation to put some faces on the failure to detect and prevent the 9/11 attacks.

This administration is so crooked, they could never survive the light of day.

[Hubert Flottz]

14. Re: "Wouldn't hurt to have a REAL investigation "

I hope your dream comes true! Wouldn't it be fun to watch Bush go through the kind of shit that Clinton had to live through! I think the GOPers in Washington who's seats are up next time are scared shitless of the backlash. If we can just see that the election is FAIR in 2006 nationwide, I think your dream has a REAL shot. Bush would be crying like a tiny little spoiled baby, if he ever had to face the music.

[Staph]

15. Fair Election in '06

So how fair can we expect the 2006 election to be in West Virginia? I'm in Kanawha County, and have been voting with punch cards for years. I always punch carefully and then look at the holes before I turn in the ballot, but I wonder how accurately my ballot has been counted.

How are the rest of you voting? What sort of voting machines do they use in your neck of the woods?

[Hubert Flottz]

16. Here's clue number one!

I had zero hanging chads or dimpled chads. I always check mine too and I always wonder the same thing you do about the fairness of the tabulation. I wonder a heck of a lot more since 2000!

I'm in the same county as you and I don't know if the same system is used county wide. I'm betting that the GOPers rig it so that the least reliable systems are used in the areas of the state where the GOP is likely to get less votes than the democrat! I believe the tabulation "fixing" is a nationwide operation!(conspiracy)

[Lasher]

18. There's Lots of Ways to Cheat

The 2004 election in Ohio, and therefore the presidency, went for Bush. In districts where people could be expected to vote Republican, there were plenty of voting machines, and waiting in line was minimal. In districts where people could be excpected to vote Democratic, there were pathetically few voter machines, and the waiting times were extreme. I don't believe this was an accident.

For this reason alone, there should have been a re-vote in Ohio, and Kerry would have been president right now.

[Hubert Flottz]

19. I STILL, can't believe, that Kerry just threw in the towel!

I thought John Kerry was a fighter! I was shocked that with all the reports of the irregularities in the election in Ohio and Florida, that our guys once again tucked their tails between their legs and let it slide! The entire campaign Kerry kept repeating, "This Is THE Most Important Election Of Our Lifetime!" Kerry didn't think it was important enough to fight for his country to the end this time! Maybe he didn't think it was important any more after the votes were cast? Was it all just a super expensive chimp and donkey show?

[JeremyL]

20. We lost fair and square.

Reports showed that in Ohio, Kerry lost by a considerable amount of votes. It would be very difficult to hinder the legitimacy of those votes. Even if "fraud" and conspiracies did take place, Kerry still lost.

Plain and simple, there was no rigging of the election. We lost "fair and square". Well, we lost because they "out-played" us in strategy.

[Hubert Flottz]

21. Reports on FOX showed?

REPORTS ON CNN OR SOME OTHER REICH WING PROPAGANDA ORGAN SHOWED!

But I don't buy it!

EDIT} how about some links to those "REPORTS"!

[JeremyL]

24. REPORTS Mr. Flottz?

"REPORTS"?

They are every where. They are called voter statistics. The difference in the votes speak for itself. Don't drive yourself crazy with conspiracy theories, no matter how fun they are.

[Hubert Flottz]

25. Show me some REAL numbers!

Something that is in black and white! Faithbased Bullshit without the real figures here to look at! "They Are EVERYWHERE!" You're the one who sounds like a conspiracy nut! Why do Republicans HATE AMERICA?

[JeremyL]

28. Flottz...

Why do Republicans hate America? Sounds like you set up all night long watching Ann Coulter, gripping a can of coffee beans, and wondering why many assassins go by 3 names.

You need to look at the vote statistics of Ohio and then read the thousands of articles from Democrats and Republicans about the statistics and then get an opinion of your own.

"Oh Mr. Kerry abandoned us! He is in on it! The GOP paid him off! He is really a neoconservative! Why, oh why has he forsakened us!" Things like that harm us, not help.

PM me if you would like to further this conversation to keep it off the forum.

[Hubert Flottz]

31. Go back to freepville laddie!

And you're the one gettin' excited! You're the one who needs to take a deep breath! Don't get mad at me because you voted for an Idiot!

[Hubert Flottz]

32. I have ZERO to say to you in private!

You are starting to really show your colors after less than a dozen posts because you are unskilled!

[WildClarySage]

22. Bullshit.

[Hubert Flottz]

26. Exactly!

FaithBased Bullshit! Blind FAITH for the KING of Bullshitters!

Why do they want democracy to fail in their own country?

[Lasher]

34. Fraud Proved

JeremyL,

A relatively recent, and largely ignored, statistical analysis proved there were voter discrepancies in Ohio.

http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/news/11284237.htm

Exit polls showed Kerry winning by 3.0 percent, but Bush won the vote by 2.5 percent. The report concluded that the one hypothesis that can't be ruled out is inaccurate election results. Taken at face value, the analysis shows Kerry would have won by about 3.0 percent, if the election would have been "fair and square" as you say.

The separate issue that I raised previously is one of voting machine distribution. Comparatively sepaking, there were plenty of them at predominately Republican polling places, and not enough in precints that could have been expected to vote Democratic. The resulting long lines, many hours in the rain in some cases, caused some to give up and go to home or work.

Kerry lost votes because of this, but who could know how many? Their numbers are not reflected in exit polls, the statistical analysis that I have just shared, or in any other study of which I am aware. But one thing is certain; this had an impact on the election, in Bush's favor.

[JeremyL]

35. Not in that article.

Fraud happens in almost every county of every state during these elections. Some fraud is minor, some is major. The link you provided does not prove that a massive action of fraud had taken place. Maybe Kerry voters were kind enough to be involved in the exit polls while Bush fans were snide and snarled their way past.

Kerry lost by more than 136,000 votes in Ohio. This is not a gigantic amount in accordance to national elections, but really, it is a gigantic amount of votes. Political corruption and fraud had taken place in Florida. Or even if we give Bush the benefit of the doubt and say it didn't, their was so much investigation, research, and media coverage of the mishap that Republicans would be crazy to attempt such a thing again on a wide scale movement.

There are some very conservative strongholds in Ohio, such as Cincinnati, and these places played a large role in winning the state for Bush. The race was too close to call for that state during the media coverage of the election. But I do believe it was in Bush's favor most of the time. We all saw the long lines of people showing up and waiting to vote outside their precincts, and Republicans and Democrats were in those waiting lines. Whether it be a suspected Kerry base or Bush.

The point is, and the facts are, that we lost "fair and square" in the sense of it even being possible. I am suprised that we didn't lose more states the way they campaigned. Lottz, or whatever his name is, and others moaning about conspiracies to hi-jack the election are just feeding themselves with fictional stories to ease their pain. They preached and campaigned hard and when Kerry lost they were one of these depressed individuals seeking a "hermit hide-away". You can find fraud all over the place, from McDowell, Mingo and Logan Counties, WV to CA and NY. But the widescale fraud these people are suggesting didn't happen.

I will bet my savings that if it were possible to contact every voter (or intended voter) of the 2004 election in Ohio, the gathered statistics would show Bush won. Thinking rationally, 136,000 is a "large" amount of votes to lose by out of 5,455,811. If it was along the lines of -80,000; then serious determination of recounts and investigations would be necessary.


EDIT:
Check it out for yourself. http://election.cbsnews.com/election2004/county/president_oh0.shtml

Bush won the majority of the counties in Ohio. And in the majority of the counties he won, he won by 15-30% of votes. That is a significant amount.

[Lasher]

36. I Respectfully Disagree

JeremyL,

I was surprised to discover that my source requires a login if you hit the link I provided in my last message. If yop go to Google first

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=Analysis+points+to+election+corruption&btnG=Search

and then select the first result, I don't think you have to sign in. I don't know why this is, but then there's lots of things I don't know.

I must respectfully disagree with you on several points:

I believe Ohio voter fraud was proved, but you said "not in this article", going on to say that "Maybe Kerry voters were kind enough to be involved in the exit polls while Bush fans were snide and snarled their way past."

You are not the first to suppose this might explain the differences between Ohio election results and exit polls. But if you will please read the article, you will find that application of statistical analysis produced the following conclusion:

"The explanation for the discrepancy that was offered by the exit polling firm -- that Kerry voters were more likely to participate in the exit polling -- is an ``implausible theory,'' according to the report issued Thursday by US Count Votes, a group that claims it's made up of about two dozen statisticians."

You said, "Fraud happens in almost every county of every state during these elections." I don't think this is true, and it's certainly not OK. You might have a valid point here, but I'm going to need some help from you, to understand what it is.

You say 136,000 votes is a gigantic amount. But the unexplained discrepancy between recorded votes and exit polls, which is 5.5%, is a much larger number - easily enough to have given Kerry the Ohio vote and the presidency.

You go on to suggest the voting machine shortage had essentially the same impact on Republicans as it did on Democrats: "We all saw the long lines of people showing up and waiting to vote outside their precincts, and Republicans and Democrats were in those waiting lines. Whether it be a suspected Kerry base or Bush."

This just isn't true. This link will take you to study results for Franklin County, which show that shortages certainly did impact Democrats more. The same scenario played out all across the state of Ohio.

http://copperas.com/machinery/

But voter machine shortage is a factor that is beyond the scope of the statistical analysis, as I have said.

Your furnished link was interesting, but it really only begs the question, because it supplies the number of recorded votes. It is the difference between them and exit poll results that is in question. And I don't see any particular signifigance, insofar as this issue is concerned, in the number of counties Bush won, or the percentage of votes he got in them. According to the recorded votes he won Ohio by 2.5%.

In their report, the statisticians concluded, "The hypothesis that the voters' intent was not accurately recorded or counted... needs further investigation." I agree with them, and I think it's highly rational to do so.

[JeremyL]

37. Hey

Well from what I have read in the first article you provided, it is all theory and no proven facts. Which is why I said it wasn't "proven".

In the second article you provided it satets that:
"only 61% of the county's registered voters turned out in the 2004 general election." This is about what most places push out in hyped-up elections, but it is a lot more than the "near" average of %40.

It also goes on to say that:
"25% increase in registration rolls and high voter interest in what was billed as the most important election of a lifetime. Indeed, the county did process an increase of 23% in total voters compared to 2000. Many would-be voters were deterred by long lines and hours-long waits, prompting one observer to cite:
"Ohio's new poll tax: if you can't afford to wait four hours in line, you don't vote."

What are the numbers on funding supplied to those areas for additional equipment? It said that they produced "25%" more voters. This is a lot of voters. And in an area with 100,000+ regular voter population, that means 25,000 more people showed up to vote. A county, or precinct can;t just supply additional equipment at their own will. They have to feel out forms and go through a bunch of red-tape to receive additional equipment.

A 25% increase would produce such waiting lines, especially if they were caught unaware.

<b>You said, "Fraud happens in almost every county of every state during these elections." I don't think this is true, and it's certainly not OK. You might have a valid point here, but I'm going to need some help from you, to understand what it is.</b>

My point there, was to let you know that I understand fraud happens. I was not and am STILL not denying that fraud happened in Ohio. The argument I am making is that, the degree of fraud, which you and others feel took place, didn't happen. And fraud (as its definition is applied) most likely does happen in every state and large chunk of the counties.

Now, aside from the 25% increase in voter turnout, I can'tfind the actual statistics, but I am confident that in relation to their size, registered Republicans vote more in comparison to registered Democrats. Percentage wise. Also, the elderly or "senior citizens" turn out in the polls more as well, and I do believe that those are factors in helping Bush win. Aside from fraud and conspiracy, the most likely reason why voting machine shortages took place in those Democratic areas, was because they didn't expect a larger turnout than the previous year, or they felt they had an adequate amount of machines.

"In their report, the statisticians concluded, "The hypothesis that the voters' intent was not accurately recorded or counted... needs further investigation." I agree with them, and I think it's highly rational to do so."

Again, this is all just theory and not factual evidence. Also, Bush won the popular vote, meaning a majority of Americans voted for him. While this does not win elections, it is something to factor in. More Americans voted for Bush. This reasoning should be applied to each state as well.

When I say "fair and square" in quotes, I am meaning we lost even if fraud was not a factor. We Democrats have our share of fraud too. I think we have had more dead voters vote than anyone. Or atleast that was what I heard. But I am not taking up for Republicans or fraud.

That Hubert guy insisted that I was a Republican because I didn't go along with his Conspiracy theories, which is incorrect. I understand that we lost the election because ROve and Co. had the best cards. Look at this election through an electioneering POV. They had the Aces and high cards. They had the media, the funding, lies, and everything else. We had truth and that was about it.

Politics is a game of sorts. It is not the old-timey campaigns of the past. Now it is dig up the dirt and sling it as far as you can, and the more water you pour on it the more mud you get. We lost because they were dirtier, louder, meaner and smarter.

[Lasher]

39. Strong Evidence, Then

JeremyL,

Technically you are correct to say the statisticians' hypothesis is not proven. Using the science of statistical analysis, which is not guessing, they were able to determine that the chance of exit polls being so wrong is one in 959,000. I believe this is strong enough to conclude that exit polling discrepancies could not be the only reason for the difference between the exit polls and the recorded votes. But there's still that one chance in almost a million that I have jumped to a conclusion about this.

But the statisticians conclude their report with a hypothesis that needs further investigation. On reflection of this, I realize I was wrong to cite the report as proof. Maybe 'strong evidence' would have been more in order. Sadly, it is highly unlikely that the 'further investigation' will ever occur, even if we retake control of the Senate next year.

On the other hand, you seem to want to completely reject the report as idle speculation. You have repeated the theory of 'interview-shy Republicans' to explain the discrepancies between exit polls and recorded votes, when the statistical analysis clearly shows there is only one chance in almost a million that you are right. You keep saying we lost fair-and-square, although it is hard to imagine a fair or square scenario, once exit poll discrepancies have been ruled out.

Even if only half the discrepancies were due to inaccurately recorded or counted votes, that would be enough to give Kerry Ohio's electoral votes and therefore the Presidency. But you claim, with no credible evidence, that there couldn't be enough of these inaccuracies to make a difference. I don't understand why you persist in this.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree about your belief that fraud occurs in every state. You have offered no proof that it does, and I have none to the contrary.

On the separate issue of voting machine distribution, please consider that the Secretary of State decides where available resources will be distributed. Area-specific funding quantities would therefore be irrelevant. I have not said whether or not these discrepancies were results of intentional acts. I have furnished evidence that they did occur, and that they worked against Democrats more than they did against Republicans. Of course, you are free to accept or reject that evidence.

I have noted your comments about how people voted in other states. I am easily confused, so I want to confine our discussion to the topic of our discussion - the Ohio vote - unless there is some direct relevance.

That Hubert guy is a good Democrat, and I think you are too. But don't be surprised if you get short sheeted.

Thanks for engaging with me in fair debate.

[Hubert Flottz]

40. My tolerance level is running on empty...

It comes from four horrid years of watching our country being gang trashed, by a bunch of freedom hating right wing criminals, lying hypocrites, snake handler GOPer TV preachers and other assorted thugs & trolls! I'm fed up with the "Wimpy Father, The Dim Son, and The Holy GOP," killing, looting, spying, lying and plundering for the GLORY of the Lord, at home and abroad! I'm tired of the fools, that have been fooled and who are here now, to try and fool those of us, who have not been so foolish as they.

The FReepers and other "Faithful" reich wingers have all been SUCKED IN big time! If all that the Cyber Trolls from FR have left to believe in, is George W. Bush, then I pity them and their miserable souls. I'm not sure if the Morans need that TV Rev., Rex Humpjob or whatever his name is, to lay the hands on their poor deluded minds, or a good exorcist to cast out the Reich Wing demonic possessions and spells, that the evil demon Belsi-Shrub has over them. The freepers are totally blinded, by the awesome power of the Blinding Right...winger bullsh*t! They eat it up...........

Edit} Not sure if I spell that one word Bilsi-Shrub or Bilsi-Bush?

[JeremyL]

42. Subject field

Through my understanding of your arguements, I was led to believe that you thought that the error in voting machine placement was the major evidence in fraud by turning away Democrats, which was the cause for the defeat. Let us not walk away from this debate misunderstanding the other.

"I believe this is strong enough to conclude that exit polling discrepancies could not be the only reason for the difference between the exit polls and the recorded votes. But there's still that one chance in almost a million that I have jumped to a conclusion about this."

"between the exit polls and recorded votes"... hmmm. Alright, first let us define exit polls.- A poll taken of a sample of voters as they leave a polling place, used especially to predict the outcome of an election or determine the opinions and characteristics of the candidates' supporters. Fair enough? So, what your saying is that more fraud took place, besides the voting machine shortages, such as fake ballots or the disposal of the Democrat's ballots?

Again, my statement "fraud " was just a point telling you that I understand fraud happens and that I am not insane, or in denial insisting that the Ohio election was 100% fair. And if we both agree that fraud means: A deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain. Then I am correct in my statement. Whether it be fraud on a large scale, such as voter machine restrictions to supress a vote, the disposal of votes, the 'includence' of false ballots, bribery of money or alcohol for vote purchase, coercion to secure a vote(s), etc. Many forms of it occur.

"On the other hand, you seem to want to completely reject the report as idle speculation." -

That is because I have heard these accusations ever since the election ended 7 months ago. I have read all of the arguments and 'evidence' or data that leads to suspicion of mass fraud. I have looked into it all months ago and have concluded that we just plain lost. That is my feelings about the ending outcome of the election. We lost because their strategy was better. They got out the vote more, literally, not illegaly.

"On the separate issue of voting machine distribution, please consider that the Secretary of State decides where available resources will be distributed. Area-specific funding quantities would therefore be irrelevant."

I am very much aware the the SoS office is in control of this, and trust me, if a voting destitnation feels it has sufficient suspicion of a larger turn out, a plead can be issued. The SoS has the duty of distributing extra resources to the areas that show it is needed. This is done by research, however it may not always be unflawed.

Also, I must state that I do note your arguments are your opinions based on the information and data you have seen and researched. And I must also state that even though I firmly proclaimed "wide scale fradud didn't happen", I too must acknowledge that it is just my opinion based on what I have read through.

"I have noted your comments about how people voted in other states. I am easily confused, so I want to confine our discussion to the topic of our discussion - the Ohio vote - unless there is some direct relevance."

Will do.

"That Hubert guy is a good Democrat, and I think you are too. But don't be surprised if you get short sheeted."

I am sure he has good intentions, but he is going about it the wrong way. And what do you mean by "short sheeted"? You mean kicked from the DU? Bah, would not harm me. I am very much use to these types of situations. Some times, when I am in a place where I disagree with the ideology of over 50% (possibly 99%) of the people on a board, I tend to argue with them. After a while I get tired of dealing with them, but can not drop it. I never leave my ground, so I push for an administration "parking". This mostly is the only way to settle an issue if it expands into a flame war.

"Thanks for engaging with me in fair debate."
No problem. Anytime.

[WildClarySage]

23. There isn't a doubt in my mind that Smelly is planning to run

for Byrd's seat. The local repug machine is already sending in LTTE's to try to convince voters that Byrd doesn't represent their conservative interests and that WV would be better without him. Blah Blah Blah. There are not many who are buying it, as far as I can see. But yeah, the smears have already begun.

[Hubert Flottz]

27. Smear and Fear Republicans always hit below the belt!

The GOPers can't ever run on their own sorry assed records, so they always belittle and try to trivialize or dehumanize the other guy, to change the subject! Shelly is nothing but a greedy tool for her neocon masters! Look at her record in congress, can you say LOCK STEP, or maybe I should say GOOSE STEP? Robert Byrd will no doubt, go on being chastised relentlessly, for what amounts to his great patriotic spirit and his honest heart-felt love for his country! Robert Byrd took an oath to uphold the Constitution and he does the very best he can to keep that promise! Shelly does her best to uphold a crooked fascist regime that constantly seeks to undermine and to nullify our Constitution, our freedom and our good name around the planet!

The Choice, is Quite simple, RIGHT is WRONG, IF, you really love your country! If you truly have compassion for your fellow man, you cannot vote for a party that strives to enslave, deceive and dominate! A party who's leaders lie and deceive constantly, to grab more and more wealth and political power. Selfish, Greedy, Liars, tricking their faithful flock of fools! Lazy Fools, that don't love their country enough to seek the truth, or to spend the time needed to analyze the facts that are hidden from them right out in the open! Half of the voters in this country, and the people around the planet see Bush for what he really is. The rest are LAZY, SELF-SERVING, WICKED, UNPATRIOTIC, FOOLS!

[JeremyL]

29. Calm down.

What is your problem? Where do you think you are? You sound like you are screaming at a bunch of 5th grade Young Republicans.

People who behave like that damage the Democratic Party.

You seem to be spitting out conspiracy crap with no understanding of facts and history. Lemme guess, you read a couple Michael Moore books, a couple Al Franken books, you listen to Air America and possibly bought the CD set, then you made a blog to talk about conspiracies of the GOP.

Grow up and understand that government and politics is not science fiction, but real life. If you want real change you do it from the inside, not scream at people. You just look like an idiotic nutcase by doing that.

Sorry if it offends, but I felt it needed to be said.

[Hubert Flottz]

30. Don't talk down to me Jeremy L !

I was playing this game when you were still shittin' yellow! You won't last long around here!

You read too many Ann Coulter Books! Did you vote for Bush both times, or were you old enough?

Attacking us and calling us names is the best you can do I guess! Typical GOPer MO!

[Hubert Flottz]

33. I can't hear you Worm!

First time in three years I've used that feature!

[hollowdweller]

38. Whatever Happened to Chuck Chambers?

I thought he was one of the few good folks in the legislature and he was very intelligent and forward thinking. Did he totally get out of politics? Would love to see him back in office someday.

[davidinalameda]

41. he's a federal judge