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Michael Gove to send copy of King James Bible to all English schools

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oldironside Donating Member (835 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 03:20 AM
Original message
Michael Gove to send copy of King James Bible to all English schools
Every state school in England is to receive a new copy of the King James Bible from the government – with a brief foreword by Michael Gove, the education secretary, to mark the 400th anniversary of its translation. In a move intended to help every pupil access Britain's cultural heritage, every primary and secondary school will be sent a new copy of the 1611 translation by next Easter.

The initiative has been criticised by secular campaigners as a waste of money. The National Secular Society said that schools were already "awash with Bibles". It urged Gove to send out a copy of Darwin's On the Origin of Species instead.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2011/nov/25/michael-gove-king-james-bible


Hmmm. Just what every school needs. Another Bible. What a waste of money.
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non sociopath skin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:20 AM
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1. Meaningless Gesture Politics 101
... Anyway, didn't that guy Gideon beat him to it?

The Skin

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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Agree about the meaningless gesture and waste of money
But Gideon Bibles aren't generally the King James version. I don't even think that Gove is particularly religious, or doing this out of piety; it's all a symbol of Bringing Back the Traditional.

He's recently been spouting about the advantages of Elitism and Good Traditional Education, thereby attracting the approval of the intellecual elite (ha ha) at the Daily Mail. Simon Heffer recently wrote an article for that rag entitled 'Can This Man Save Britains'Schools?' I will not link to it, but anyone who wants a good piece of ecstatic Gove-worship can do so. It includes the line, 'Mr Gove’s remarks were the most outspoken defence of rigorous academic standards since fellow Tory John Patten occupied his office almost 20 years ago.' Don't remind me of John Patten; he was my MP, for my sins but not through my vote, and was one of our worst Education Secretaries ever. Highlights included his being even more of a test-fanatic than most of them; his having to pay libel damages after a particularly hate-filled rant against educationist Tim Brighouse; and his blaming school indiscipline and juvenile delinquency on the fact that no one seeks to believe in Hell any more! As I said at the time: get John Patten as Education Secretary, and you too can believe in Hell! Now that role has been passed on to that dynamic duo, Gove 'n Gibb.

And I have no problem with the idea of exposing people to traditional literature, including the Bible, as part of their culture. But (a) the Bible is one book that is readily available in most schools, and that really can be readily provided by churches and other voluntary agencies if a school has insufficient copies; and (b) schools have so many urgent financial needs that this really seems a seriously empty gesture.

If they really want to encourage as many people as possible to read and value traditional (and nontraditional) literature, then one of the best vehicles for doing so, is encouraging and promoting good TV serializations of such literature. Colin Firth probably did more to encourage people to read Jane Austen than any Education Secretary in history. But that means aiding the Enemy; the Antichrist; in other words the (gasp! choke! horror!) BBC! - so it's not going to happen.

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non sociopath skin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Actually ....
The Gideons principally use the King James Version for their Bibles.<5> The Gideons also distribute New King James Bibles and Testaments, which they refer to as "Modern English Version" (MEV) Bibles and Testaments. According to the Gideon Guidebook, these MEV Scriptures are used as a supplement to the KJV Bibles. Typically, MEV Bibles are allowed to be distributed only when either the Bible purchaser, Hotel, or the recipient specifies a desire for a modern Bible.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gideons_International

The Skin

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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Interesting, I was staying in a Cambridge hotel last week, and the Gideon Bible there was MEV
Edited on Sat Nov-26-11 04:03 PM by LeftishBrit
I thought that this was the case with others I've seen; but admittedly I don't stay in hotels very often (or spend much time reading the Bible when I do!) and my experience might be very unrepresentative.
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fedsron2us Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
5. One per school what a tight wad !!!
Edited on Sat Nov-26-11 04:34 PM by fedsron2us
When I was a kid in the 1960s every kid got an illustrated copy from the local Council. I still have my copy. I cherish the cool picture of a crashed chariot in flames at Ezekiel 24 under which my waggish teenage self appears to have written 'Don't Drink And Drive'. Of course, along with Shakespeare it is the basis for much of the modern English language and its idioms are in use in every day by people who never go near a church. For that reason alone it merits reading. The New Testament is also a hot bed of socialist ideas. I doubt that Michael Gove has ever read it otherwise he would understand that 'By their fruits ye shall know them'.

Anyway it is a bit dumb paying £375,000 for a book in these times of austerity when you can download it from Project Gutenberg for free

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/10
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non sociopath skin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 07:47 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. You've read it? All of it? Or just most of it?
You have my deepest admiration. I think most of it is pretty hard going even if, like me, you are fortunate enough to have a Jewish intellectual in the house to help you through all the begattings and smitings.

I'm currently reading EP Sansom's fascinating book on the historical figure of Jesus which has me dipping back into CH Rieu's lovely 1950s Penguin Classics translations of the Gospels and the Acts which I enjoy much more than the King James or the NEB. They're a fascinating insight into an earlier social and spiritual culture when freed from a contemporary political spin.

Of course, Govie's political gesture will just gather dust in thousands of school libraries. Most books do. The poor buggers are too busy cramming for SATs and GCSEs to read real books.

The Skin
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fedsron2us Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Read all the New Testament
Edited on Sun Nov-27-11 03:11 PM by fedsron2us
Also got through Genesis, Judges, Kings, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel and bits of the other prophets from time to time. I agree the Kings James version can sometimes be hard going but its language often contains a punch that is lacking in some of the rather 'washed out' modern translations

I suppose it helps that I studied Ancient History at University so I get the chance to try tie in the Bible to wider events in the Persian, Hellenistic and Roman world (the chronology is all a bit suspect the further back you go). Strangely, this training makes me somewhat sceptical of some of the attempts to reconstruct the historical figure of Jesus because I know how scant are most of the sources behind this work and I am not sure that the results are any more revelatory than just reading the Bible as it stands. In some ways this search for textual authenticity carries an implicit acceptance of the Protestant idea that religious texts must be purified (ie shaved of all later additions). To my mind it is just another version of 'Sola Scriptura'. This is a hangup that Catholics, Jews and many Muslims seem to avoid. Personally I think its simply nonsensical to think that religious ideas should be frozen in aspic at a fixed point in the first century AD. So while the attempt to nail down exactly what Jesus said in his lifetime may be interesting from a historical view point I dont think it has much to say about the Bibles value as a book unless you explicitly accept that Jesus was literally the Son of God and his original words were sacred. As a non religious individual I dont buy this idea of a single definitive divine revelation. Having said that I think the Bible has a lot of interesting things to say about how humans should treat each other in a just society and how rulers should treat the ruled. Indeed, the need for true Justice be it divine or human and care the priviliged owe the disadvantaged is the central message I take from its texts.


Isaiah 1:17

Learn to do right! Seek justice, encourage the oppressed. Defend the cause of the fatherless, plead the case of the widow

New International Version
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fedsron2us Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. And for an alternative view here is what one Amazon reviewer had to say about the Bible
Edited on Sun Nov-27-11 03:21 PM by fedsron2us
The plot in all over the place and characters keep popping in and out of existence with no real character development. The only character who is consistently present throughout is highly unpredictable and almost behaves as if he were four different characters over the course of the book. The story line has several glaring self contradictions. There are large chunks which are simply lists of characters and this really prevents the story from drawing you in. I enjoyed the style of writing to some extent in that the sentence structure was unusual but this was it's sole redeeming feature. There was no discernible protagonist and it was often difficult to understand the motives of the characters. There was no real conclusion to the story and there were a huge number of loose ends which were simply ignored.

Overall, most readers will derive much greater enjoyment from other books. It is something of a heavy read and, even if you press on, doing so is unrewarding. Not worth your money.
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