People Who Come to Head Movements Can Have Disagreeable Charactersistics

[KoKo]

I've paraphrased this quote from Siegel to fit in subject line, but what he says if one thinks about it is true if one has read alot of history. There are threads here criticizing Bev Harris (BBV) and Symbolman (Take Back the Media). There are other DU'ers who have made important contributions taking the lead by making a stand and DOING SOMETHING! There are so many DU'ers who have contributed so much. But none of them is perfect...and I'm not and neither is anyone else here posting. We need to cut the crap, ripping to shreds folks who are out there putting themselves on the line. I've been guilty of doing this myself so I'm taking my own words to heart. We are in desperate times here and we have to hang together even more than before. We are all stressed to the MAX and when we form into "camps" attacking Bev or Symbolman (both of whom have contributed to so much by focusing on our two most important issue) it doesn't help any of us deal with another stolen election. just my 2 cents but Jules Siegel from a Daily Kos article says it well, here:


Update by Jules Siegel
In general, I've found that people who come to the head of movements often have many disagreeable personal and professional characteristics. Even beatified saints aren't human saints when you examine their lives. Jealousy goes both ways. Leaders can be as jealous of their followers as vice versa. The drive for success often stems from very painful personality problems. Driven people may accomplish noble acts at the expense of others who help them. The fact is, however, that Bev Harris did make electronic vote rigging a national cause.

We don't always get the leaders we prefer. We get the leaders we get. The right is going to do its very best (worst, actually) to discredit the entire vote rigging theme. They will seize on Bev's flaws and the accusations against her to undermine the credibility and free discussion of why America is not entitled to an honest vote count. I'm sure they will do a very good job on their own. We don't have to help them.

At the same time, I fully agree that no one should try to suppress criticism. Even what appears to be unfair criticism frequently turns out to be not unfair at all. We have to try our best to be honest, even when it uncovers some inconvenient truths. I was one of the first experts on the liberal side to declare the National Guard memos a hoax. I did that on the basis of very sound advice from other people I trusted, whose methods I verified for myself, and credited fully.

Telling Bev to shut up and calm down because she embarrasses you is not very useful. Examining her personal character flaws may or may not be useful. Dismissing her accomplishments because of her tone or her personality flaws is simply destructive.

http://dark1p.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/10/193818/27

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

1. Personally, I feel...

That there are several camps, here, as far as the "loyal opposition" is concerned:

Those who have honest philosophical problems with points of order.

Those who have a history of lashing out at anything that moves.

Those who's attendance in these discussions are hardly honest. They only seek to fan flames.

I calls 'em likes I sees 'em.

[jamboi]

5. Its true that leaders often have very strong personalities and often that

includes unpleasant personality characteristic. It takes chutzpa to lead and sometimes leaders run over others inadvertently. Its a commonly observable phenomenon.

[Demit]

2. I would tend to trust Mr. Siegel--who trusts Bev Harris. I like this--

He says, in that Kos post you linked to:

"As a very experienced journalist, I try to use a professional tone in everything I publish. As a former publicist who worked simultaneously in the campaigns of JFK and Nixon in 1960, I know that no one ever made much headway with a controversial cause by being shy and self-effacing. Given her track record, Bev is entitled to raise her voice in the manner that she sees fit and thinks will be most effective."

That's the first take I had on this controversy, and even following down all the complaints these various DUers have about her--most startlingly Maddy McCall--that's the take I still have.

[Village Idiot]

3. I agree -

Olberman's been DU's hero for what - about 2 weeks? What makes anyone think they can trust this guy at all?

He's a mediawhore and works for NBC.

Just because he (barely) covered some voting issues does NOT put him in the same league with Bev Harris, who has devoted all her time and energy on this issue over the last few years...

[KittyWampus]

6. Actually, If You Were ActuallyFamiliar With DU, Keith's Been Appreciated

here greatly for quite some time.

[KoKo]

4. Kick for the night crowd...applies to all the players in this Selection

Docu-Drama...but I might be in "lock down" by kicking this...so Mods do what you will...

[marions ghost]

7. Totally agree... and a question--

I was trying to come up with a coherent line on this point, but you have done it much better. Thanks.

Right--look at what drives certain political leaders. Often they have a very singular vision, a strong obsession, a big picture agenda. They aren't always careful about supporters feelings, esp when they're in a hurry to reach a goal. Right now, BH and KO are both under serious stress as a result of being in the forefront of this issue. It is quite possible for spokespersons in their position to be greatly admired for their work, but then not be somebody you'd want to have a beer with.

----------------------
Question: Are we reflecting a leadership crisis?

I'm new around here, but I guess this blowup about Bev and Keith reflects a whole lotta anxiety about the leadership on our side.
We seem to want certainty, in a strong standard bearer like we saw Kerry and Edwards could be. But for this voting reform movement,do we need more leaders, different leaders? Should we advertise on the net for somebody with a good resume? Pay them well? Half the country could come up with a good salary.

After all, we have been abused, truly abused, by Bushco for 4 years and watched the Dems knuckle under, for whatever reason you want to plug in...
On top of that, this latest selection is insulting to every American voter. $4 billion for new equipment, and this is what we get...junk that is subject to malfunction and wide open for sabotage. We have just made a bad system WORSE. After what we saw in 2000, everyone in this country should be asking...What in hell is going on here?!?

On top of that the media has let us down badly and John Kerry has chosen to take a low profile in the selection aftermath while the counts are going on. But the Glibs are there and Jesse Jackson along with Bev and Keith. And there are several other pivotal people working on this. I am eternally grateful to them all just for being there.

[BeFree]

8. I've seen it happen way too many times

A good activist being crucified for any number of reasons, except for the reason they are active. It's either jealousy or opposition from enemy infiltration.

Too many times have I seen the action injured by the nitpickers and hidden agenda holders. Now I'm seeing it on DU. Sad.