MUST SEE! Cliff Arnebeck Link on C-Span re: FRAUD!!!

[Verve]

This was in another post but it's too important for people to miss:

This is not an exaggeration! You MUST SEE THIS!!!!

Here is Cliff Arnebeck on C-Span discussing Fraud. A MUST SEE!
(It's 29 minutes long)

http://www.c-span.org/homepage.asp?Cat=Series&Code=WJE&ShowVidNum=6&Rot_Cat_CD=WJ&Rot_HT=205&Rot_WD=

It's happening everyone! Let the litigation begin!

[Verve]

1. Shameless KICK! Really if you haven't seen this you MUST!

[Stand and Fight]

3. KICK

[jamboi]

48. See http://jamboi.mydd.com for Arnebeck interview transcript. n/t

[TexasChick]

52. Thanks for that transcript, jamoi! So, they actually have proof of

the switching of votes, huh? Wow! Sorry, Repuketards/Freeptards, if Chimpy McFlightsuit is implicated, he better effin' give up the WH and pay for his crime!!!!!

[driver8]

68. Chimpy McFlightsuit?! That is hilarious!!! n/t

[jamboi]

113. My transcript is not from the C-SPAN interview, its from JJ rally. I'd be

thrilled to post a transcript (or even a partial transcript) of the C-SPAN interview. I did the other one by hand by myself. It was only 2:38 minutes long and took me about an hour to do. If anyone would do one I'd definitely post it.

[Verve]

71. NEW THREAD,

If you've noticed the old thread does not list Cliff on front page anymore so try this:

http://www.c-span.org/search/basic.asp?ResultStart=1&ResultCount=10&BasicQueryText=cliff+arnebeck&image1.x=16&image1.y=8

Click on Cliff Arnebeck 12/2

[berner59]

2. he seems quite credible...

Would love to know the evidence he has of fraud...has that been stated anywhere or will it come out in the lawsuit?? Looking forward to tomorrow!! Thanks for the link!!

[joeunderdog]

20. FreePress had this 2 weeks ago...

From the article...
Moreover, on Election Day there were long lines and widespread accounts of people who did not get to vote in urban Democratic-leaning precincts across the state. These factors and other reports of voter frustration, computerized voting miscounts and still-changing provisional ballot counting rules left many doubts about the unofficial vote count and George W. Bush’s 130,000 vote margin.

Those concerns coalesced into a grassroots campaign for an answer. Within two weeks following Election Day, Arnebeck had talked to the Green and Libertarian Parties about filing for a recount – if the funds could be raised. The Greens and the Honest Election Campaign started fundraising the same day, and in less than a week, the Greens had raised $150,000 via their website to file for the recount. The Ohio Honest Election Campaign raised about $90,000 via the Alliance for Democracy site, after two Air America Radio hosts, Laura Flanders and Randi Rhodes, embraced the cause and talked up the campaign.

Meanwhile, FreePress.org’s Bob Fitrakis inspired Amy Kaplan and Jonathan Meier, two young members of the League of Pissed-Off Voters’ Ohio chapter (www.indyvoter.org) to organize public hearings to gather testimony under oath of the people who saw or experienced what they thought was voter suppression or intimidation. Such intentional acts would violate the federal Voting Rights Act. Two hearings were held in Columbus and hundreds of people showed up and testified. Then activists in Cincinnati and Cleveland organized hearings.

At these hearings, scores of people said too few voting machines were put in Democratic-leaning inner-city precincts, creating long lines and deterring many people from voting. In contrast, Republican-leaning suburbs had plenty of voting machines and did not have the long lines. There were also reports of miscounts by computer voting machines, as well as errors registering the wrong candidate for president. Minority voters also spoke of disproportionately getting provisional ballots, including long-time residents.

http://www.freepress.org/departments/display/19/2004/899

[ewagner]

4. Thanks for the post

and link

The attorney sounds pretty confident in his remarks....no bravado, no over-the-top rhetoric....

This has some promise I think.

[Stand and Fight]

5. Hmmm.... It doesn't seem to be working for me. n/t

[New Earth]

6. are you getting an error about rtsp files?

on firefox, are you getting an error saying rtsp is invalid?

or if you are using IE, is it giving you a 'page cannot be displayed'?

[berner59]

8. he says they have evidence...

of votes being switched to Bush's column...but it doesn't seem like they know how it happened...hmmm.... Would love to see the lawsuit details...

[Stand and Fight]

27. Yes, IE "page cannot be displayed" is the error n/t

[indigo11153]

29. I'm getting that

rtsp invalid. What is that?

[SharifromOregon]

7. Rats...

Doesn't seem to be working for me either......

[New Earth]

9. for both of you, HERE'S HOW TO FIX

make sure you have the latest version of Real Player installed (V10)

- open up real player

- open up 'tools'

- open 'preferences'

- under 'content', click on MEDIA TYPES

- click on ADVANCED

- scroll down to "Realtime Streaming Protocol"

- tick the checkbox, and hit OK

now try to open the video.

(i had to do this, that's how i know)

[tandem5]

24. thanks that helped n/t

[mulethree]

33. Thanks!

worked

[budkin]

36. Sweet, that worked! n/t

[indigo11153]

42. Thanks Faye!

That worked. Great video. This man is a national hero with the right stuff.

[texpatriot2004]

105. Thanks so much for the fix. n/t

[bmoney07]

10. could someone summarize please

for people who don't have access to a real player???

[berner59]

11. He's talking about....

the lawsuit that is being filed tomorrow which will contest the Ohio vote - he's claiming that the outcome will be flipped when all is counted and irregularites are discovered and corrected - he says he has evidence... Callers are split - some are downright nasty - saying the Dems are whining and they won't stand for "their President" being dragged into this...yikes...

He is very even tempered and very informed about all this...great job!! Anyone else can jump in...

[flyarm]

16. HE ALSO SAID FRAUD!!

HE IS DISCUSSING STATISTICS AND THE EXIT POLLS... AND HOW..UKRAINE EXIT POLLS WERE IMPORTANT...BUT NOT HERE..AND HE IS DISCUSSING THE BLACK VOTE BEING KEPT DOWN...

THIS IS A CHALLANGE..NOT JUST A REVOTE..ITS A CHALLANGE TO THE RESULTS!! THATS IMPORTANT...THIS IS NOT JUST A RECOUNT!!!
AND HE DISCUSSED ALL THE JOURNALISTS COUNT OF FLA THE WHOLE STATE GORE WON!

SO HE SAID THIS COULD ALL BE WRONG.. AND THE ELECTION COULD BE FLIPPED TO KERRY!!

AND HE SAID PERSUING 3 PRONGED INVESTIGATION...AND THEY ARE IN HURRY TO DO IT..AND HE IS SAYING PRESS HAS OBLIGATION TO THEIR ROLL IN OUR DEMOCRACY..AND THEY WILL KEEP PUBLIC AND MEDIA INFORMED ..BUT THAT THE AMERICAN PUBLIC KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON!! AND THE DESICISION PROCESSED!

AND THEN A LADY CALLED THAT I WANT TO PUT A BLANK UNDER HER ASS!! AND BEEM.. HER UP TO SCOTTY!! THEY DONT GIVE A CRAP ABOUT HONESTY OR TRUTH..OR DEMOCRACY!! I HATE THE BUSHITS!! I USED TO DISLIKE THEM..NOW ITS HATE!!!!..THEY BETTER STAY AWAY FROM ME...FLY

[Catherine Vincent]

18. Take a deep breath.

I know how you feel though, I can't stand the bushies.

[Joe Chi Minh]

35. I liked his

matter-of-fact use of the word, "fix", too. He wasn't arrogant, but he wasn't kow-towing, either. The quiet self-confidence of someone who knows what he's talking about, and the thought of expressing himself in an unduly deferential tone - still less an unctuous one - would no more have occurred him than would one of railing bombast.

[coreystone]

12. Cliff sounds like a real cool customer. He doesn't shake for...

for anything. Thanks for the link. I was worrking at time.

:-)

[Hobbes199]

38. Definitely well informed. Nice to hear him not stumble through it.

[noclonyofthechimp]

112. He seemed a little nervous at first but really drove it home after the

national guard dude yelled at him. Like a guy who shines under stress!

[smartvoter]

13. Everyone Frustrated Right Now Should Watch This

Great way to offset the bad taste from the Olbermann/Harris thing.

[flyarm]

14. OMG I AM CRYING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OMG....FOR THE FIRST MOMENT I AM FEELING HOPE HERE IN FLA...PLEASE LET IT BE SO!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE PLEASE LET IT BE SOOOOOO!!!!! MY KNEES ARE WEAK!!!!!!!!!!!! AND THE JERK FREEPERS WHO CALLED DONT GIVE A CRAP ABOUT DEMOCRACY!!
AREN'T THEY THE SAME CRAP ASSES..WHO CALLED US NON PATRIOTS...BEFORE BUSHES LIE OF WAR...

I AM SICK TO DEATH OF THE BUSHITS WHO HATE DEMOCRACY, AND WHO DONT GIVE A CRAP ABOUT OUR CONSTITUTION!!

I PROUDLY STAND FOR MY CONSTITUTION, AND FOR THE VOTE OF EACH AND EVERY AMERICAN, AND I DEFY ANY OF THE BUSHITS TO TELL ME THEY LOVE THEIR NATION!!!

TO HELL WITH THEM...WE WILL TAKE OUR COUNTRY BACK AND IF THEY DONT LIKE IT THEY CAN LEAVE!! FLY ( WOW I AM NOW REPEATING WHAT THEY HAVE SAID TO ME FOR 4 YEARS NOW!!! WOW ..IT FEELS GOOD!!)

[pauldp]

15. This Rocks!

Arnebeck is my new hero.

[flyarm]

17. KICK

[Chi]

19. Thnx Verve, Thnx Faye

Thanx for the link Verve, it was good to watch, and reaffirming.

Thanx for the fix Faye, it worked like a charm 8)

[floridadem30]

21. kick

[pauldp]

22. link to another thread about this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=102210&mesg_id=102210

[TumorSupressor]

23. kick

[tandem5]

25. kick

[Hobbes199]

26. This is soo good.

Kickity kick.

[dubyaD40web]

28. KICK

And nominated for homepage!

[Stand and Fight]

30. Kicking it...

:kick:

[Leilani]

31. To all the DU posters who whine about C-Span

being SO biased, SO right wing, so awful!

What other TV channel would have in-depth coverage of voter fraud?

Kick for C-Span!

[SueZhope]

32. Cliff Arnebeck

is my new hero

Is he going to be any other shows? has any one heard?
.he talked about the media being a very important part of this

[NVMojo]

85. he is a man who votes for his conscience ...he was a republican

and now he is democrat. I like this guy.

[Carl Brennan]

34. WOOOOOWWWWWOOOHOOO!!

This is it!! Arnebeck is solid as it gets. He is articulate calm and sticks to principle over politics.

He said unequivocally that Ohio will "flip" to Kerry. BLAM!!

[budkin]

37. Kick the hell out of this!

[IAMREALITY]

39. Awesome Video

The Shit's Gonna Hit The Fan Soon!!!!!

My favorite part was the last female caller saying how all she's heard from Dem's the last few years was whining. What I got a kick out of is that when she tried to say the things WE did this election to hinder the vote the only thing she could say was the stupid isolated tire slashing incident. I got a kick out of that. That is the ONLY thing they have. Imagine if we had an open door to rattle off the ways the repubs engaged in acts? We'd still be goin after an hour.

[Helga Scow Stern]

40. I want to send this link to the international monitors, but I am not sure

if it is still good. Will someone check it for me, and post the link so I can copy it? :dunce:

[Hobbes199]

41. Link does not display this piece on the homepage anymore, but....

Here's a direct link to the media:

rtsp://video.c-span.org/project/c04/c04_wj120204_arnebeck.rm

[Kralizec]

43. Go down to "Recent Programs" and click on 12/03/3004

[joeunderdog]

45. "page cannot be displayed."

why am I not surprised?

anyone else having this problem?

[New Earth]

46. to fix, read this post

make sure you have the latest version of Real Player installed (V10)

- open up real player

- open up 'tools'

- open 'preferences'

- under 'content', click on MEDIA TYPES

- click on ADVANCED

- scroll down to "Realtime Streaming Protocol"

- tick the checkbox, and hit OK

now try to open the video.

(i had to do this, that's how i know)

[Helga Scow Stern]

47. Did you get my PM, Faye?

[Catamount]

59. Thanks Faye

What a fantastic turn-around.
Today's developments have dragged me a little out of the blues.
Keep your spirits up everyone and remember,
Do not fear
Kerry's near

[Helga Scow Stern]

69. Thank you! Will send to international monitors and Danish Reporter,

who tomorrow just happens to be interviewing the international monitor who was in Ohio!

All because of our good work on DU!!!

[Hobbes199]

96. No, no. Thank you!

[Goldeneye]

44. God those democrats, what a bunch of whiners.

I've been watching them for the last few years, and they've tried every trick in the book, including slitting car tires to prevent republicans for voting. They're totally shameless. Bush won and they just can't stand it. Nothing but complaining since nov.2. Why don't they shut up? The results are in Goerge Bush is the winner, and I support him 100%, blah blah, blah.

And how about that national gaurd guy from MO, what was with him? Can you say totally brainwashed.

[anamandujano]

58. "We're not crying, we're litigating."

was Arnebeck's answer.

[Dinger]

64. I Liked That!

Just saw the last part of the c-span 2 replay (done a 6 cst) Wish I'd have seen all of it. Maybe it will replay....

[Catamount]

60. The guard

What/who do you think he was threatening?
I hope our guys are well guarded.

[Carl Brennan]

63. That reptilian woman from Indiana. I just would have told her

to go crawl back under her rock or sewer. How does the US produce such people. You could see the hate oozing out of her, hate of the truth.

[shakerbaker]

75. How Bout the Guy Threatening Him?

from the National Guard. Argggggg...

She was the role model for all Bushford Wives:puke:

[Carl Brennan]

80. You could hear the hate oozing out of that ugly slime. The National

Guard guy I didn't hear all of. He threatened Arnebeck?

[noclonyofthechimp]

111. Said, "I am not going to let you get away with this!"

[intheflow]

49. Kicked!

:kick:

[goldengreek]

50. Well, I'm hoping for the best.

But if he gets shut down either right before or after proving fraud, similar to what happened in Florida in 2000, that will still reflect well on our citizens. The people of the world will at least understand Little George stole another election.

[TexasChick]

54. Yeah, agree, but at least we'll get rid of that Chimp's bogus mandate! n/t

[intheflow]

51. Nominated for homepage. n/t

[myschkin]

53. amazing

from day to day we have more "fighters": bev, keith, madsen, jesse jackson, now arnebeck.

from day to day we are more...

arnebeck for president!

[myschkin]

101. heroes

ooops, I forgot Jeff Fisher and the Glibs...

[Amy6627]

55. I am so excited

I am shaking. I don't want to get my hopes up and then smacked down again. But this sounds so promising! I am a little worried about what those rabid repubs are going to do. These guys are in power and they are NEVER going to let go without a civil war. I hope I'm just paranoid!

PS-- I'm new here, what does kick mean and what does n/t mean? Is there a glossary I can review the hip lingo?

[TexasChick]

70. Amy6627, welcome to DU!! When you see Kick, all it means is that

a member has replied to the original poster's thread to put this topic back to the top of the thread listings. The more a topic/thread is replied to, the more chances the topic will have exposure to be read. So, after I reply to your post, this thread will be listed at the top of the other threads in the "2004 Election Results and Discussion" forum. So, if someone sees that it is going to the next page instead of staying on the first page, a member will reply with "Kick n/t".

This was the DU (Democratic Underground) glossary site (http://www.seattleactivist.org/DiG.html). It doesn't work anymore, so maybe another DU member can share a new link. But, I can share with you a few acronyms that I know at the top of my head:

n/t = No Text (There's no text in the body of a poster's reply, just text only in the subject line.)
eom = End Of Message (Means the same thing as "n/t")
Freeper, Freeptard, Freep, FreeRepulsive = a disgusting member, and an avid smirking Chimp lover, of www.freerepublic.com. Enter this site at your own risk! These people are worse than Nazis and advocate violence on anyone who disagrees with them!
BFEE = Bush Family Evil Empire
Dupe = Duplicate post


Again, welcome to DU! :toast:

[Amy6627]

77. This is great! Thank you! n/t

[m berst]

100. welcome to DU

Hi amy6627. Welcome.

[Kellis]

56. Okay

This can't be anything but good.Now lets see what comes of it.


:grouphug: :thumbsup: :kick:

[OKthatsIT]

57. THANKS!

its a good one

[17yroldtwins]

61. Thank God, someone is stepping up!

I am practically crying now.

This is only the beginning!

I just heard a story about OHIO on PBS NATIONAL NEWS!!

As my login states, I have 17 year old twins. They will be draft age next summer.
I just talked to my husband about accelerating our house payments to get it paid off so when the market crashes we have something to live in.

I really don't think this is doom and gloom. I think it's reality with this irresponsible idiot in the White House.

Everyone, keep praying, visualizing, marching, writing.

GO, GO, GO!!!

Attie

[Hobbes199]

62. Finally able to do something useful...

http://news.guide.real.com

This page gets about 5,000 hits a day (23,437 on election day). If we can double that, then I'll have a good case for getting more links on, and being able to move some up to the front page, which gets about 2.5 million hits a day.

Top Stories: "C-SPAN: Ohio Pres. Election Suit"
http://click.real.com/?clipid=109706&pageid=news2.defaultPage&pageregion=news.module0

[pauldp]

76. kick Ass

[livvy]

65. Excellent!

I like the way he kept his composure and stuck to the issue. Keeping my fingers crossed. I can't wait to see how this pans out. Thanks for posting the link. I'm going to pass it on to those on my email list.

[CantGetFooledAgain]

66. Kick! n/t

[Verve]

67. Kick!

[DemGa]

79. Kick n/t

[proudbluestater]

72. Can't find the dang transcript! I'm on dial-up, no luck with video!

I did see parts of it. I was watching Democracy Now at the same time so I was switching back and forth.

What interested me was the host was reading from a newspaper article, and he quoted the part out loud where Cliff said there was a "fix." He asked Cliff to explain that quote. Cliff explained how the votes were shifted. Silly host, said what do you mean, from county to county? Um, no, Kerry to Bush. I never did catch the name of the newspaper the host was quoting from. Did anybody catch that?

I admit to being hard on C-Span lately myself. Then something like this comes on, although it is a little belated. But when I see something like this, I start to wonder, could it be that C-Span just wants to bring MORE awareness to the neocon agenda? They seem to almost obsessed with them now, where before the election you didn't see as much of them. Of course, the MSM doesn't even KNOW the word NEOCON nor do they mention its agenda of world domination.

[Verve]

73. Try jamboi's thread

Did you try jamboi's thread? Hopefully it will work for you:

http://jamboi.mydd.com

On edit, I'm not finding it on this thread either. Maybe jamboi is working on it. It looks like he does have some similar Cliff Arnebeck interview transcripts on his website. Also, the Keith Olbermann rerun is on tonight. He interviewed Cliff today as well. I'm looking forward to seeing it. Sorry you can't find it yet! I'll keep looking for you.

[BernieBear]

74. WONDERFUL

Arnebeck was VERY credible. Maybe, just maybe something will come of this!!!!

This is my first kick since becoming a DU member on the most depressing day of my life, Nov. 3rd.

Kick!!!!

[mary195149]

78. This link may work.

Top Stories: "C-SPAN: Ohio Pres. Election Suit"

http://click.real.com/?clipid=109706&pageid=news2.defaultPage&pageregion=news.module0

[Helga Scow Stern]

116. One was the Moonie *-rag, Washington Times...

is that the one you mean?

[Imagevision]

81. SURE LOOKS LIKE BUSH'S INAUGURATION TO BE DELAYED

KERRY'S GOOD...HE SIMPLY LAID LOW WAITED FOR THE CERTIFICATIONS AND IS MAKING HIS MOVES...THIS IS INTENSE STUFF, LOOKS LIKE THE CHEERLEADER WILL HAVE TO POSTPONE HIS INAUGURATION...WHAT A WAY TO NOT ONLY WIN, BUT EXPOSE THE REPUBLICANS FOR WHAT THEY ARE,"UNWORTHY OPPONENTS. GOD BLESS AMERICA!

[GetTheRightVote]

82. This is increditible news, I have tears and a smile on my face at one time

This is beyond my wildnesses dreams, I am so very, very happy.
They are doing it, really doing it, protecting our votes and right to them, Hurray !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[4democracy]

94. I felt the same way, watching with tears in my eyes

[LiberalUprising]

83. KICK

GREAT NEWS!!!!!

[NVMojo]

84. this is great!!!

impressive and we even get an example of what the koolaid drinkers sound like. We hate soldiers? Give me a break, another Karl Rove lie for the sheep.

[RaulVB]

86. Watch this video!

This interview needs more exposure.

[RaulVB]

87. Kick (n/t)

[RaulVB]

88. Kick (n/t)

[RaulVB]

89. Kick (n/t)

[RaulVB]

90. Watch Arnebeck (n/t)

[Peace Patriot]

91. Will someone please post...

...a description of the interview, more content, quotes, why the whoopee about Kerry, maybe copy and paste the transcript ...

PLEASE! --for those of who cannot access...

[4democracy]

93. are you having trouble getting to link?

[Peace Patriot]

92. The transcript at http://jamboi.mydd.com/

"Full tilt" Election Fraud Litigation in Ohio: a transcription of an interview with Cliff Arnebeck (transcribed by JamBoi at DU)

Intro from the Pacifica Radio web page:

"A brief interview (2:38) from a press conference interview with Cliff Arnebeck, lead attorney in the Ohio Contest of Election suit which will be filed on or near Nov. 31. Here Cliff explains his theory regarding the method(s) that were used to rig the Ohio election. Evan Davis, of the Columbus Community Radio Foundation (CCRF) in Columbus, Ohio and FSRN files this report."

Note that separately from this interview the Pacifica reporter Evan Davis reported that the attorneys had stated what is described below constituted "prima facie" evidence of election fraud.

Cliff Arnebeck speaking:

"The only logical explanation is that there was a movement of some 65,000 votes or so that were cast for Kerry into the Bush column. Which created a margin that is approximately the total margin by which Bush was reported to have won Ohio. So our current view of the evidence is that this is where the fix occurred.

"There were a variety of other problems in the election. There was the suppression of black voters in Franklin Co. by shorting machines in black and high Democratic performance districts. There was what we would call a precinct shuffle in Summit Co. and Cuyahuga Co. where a deliberate confusion was created about where people could vote. They cast their provisional ballots...there were election officials were telling them that they could vote in any precinct of the county and it would be counted. And then you've got Blackwell saying they won't be counted.

"Our present feeling is that this is, while a serious conspiracy to violate the civil rights of a protected class of voters namely those of the black race, that this is not where the real fix occurred. This is something we will discuss in the lawsuit, but we intend to focus very, to hone in very aggressively in full tilt litigation with full discovery on what we believe is the fraud that occurred in the southern part of the state with the shift of votes.

"Look at the two races. In effect the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court race is a benchmark race for the presidential race because both of these races were competitive, they were running neck and neck. All right so this gives you a basis to say "all right what happened in this situation and how does it relate to the other, the benchmark." Now a more ingenious approach might have been if you're going to do this you should have made the adjustment also in the Supreme Court race too, so this wouldn't stand out. This stands out like a sore thumb.

I think what happened is, all this civil rights violation was a red herring intended to stimulate the public interest groups and civil rights organizations to hone in on this, on this horrendous, horrendous attack on the rights of black voters. They thought that's what we would go after, the clock would run out, we wouldn't be able to prove our case. The real fraud occurred in this switching of votes in southern Ohio. That's our present view of the evidence."

(end of text)

Wow! --me.

[4democracy]

95. this is different from c-span, he was on for app. 20 minutes on there

[Peace Patriot]

98. What he's talking about...

...I picked this up from the Jesse Jackson interviews, and from an email I got from the Alliance for Democracy: They had a largely unknown, poorly funded Dem candidate in the judicial race who pulled way more votes than Kerry, real obvious and improbable--a red flag for electronic fraud. In other words, THAT is where they stole the votes from Kerry and gave them to Bush. He's saying if they'd been smart they would have taken votes ALSO from the judicial candidate (but they weren't smart!).

I am just crazy with happiness right now! These folks really, really know what they're doing! I thought they were doing a somewhat quixotic thing, concentrating on vote suppression, and hoped and prayed they could keep the OH recount alive on that basis until more evidence arrived of the much bigger fraud that occurred probably in the central vote tabulators (with the Republican-owned secret source code)--and of which we have so much evidence already in other states.

You see, the Berkeley study was about FLA (100,000 to 200,000 or more phantom votes for Bush, or votes stolen from Kerry, in the 3 big Dem counties in FLA), and it said they didn't find this in OH (at least not the specific kind of fraud they were studying). Here's what the Berkeley study said:

"Our Ohio data was entered on Nov. 6 but, not subsequently re- checked. This is due to the fact that, as of preliminary tests, e- voting did not appear to be a significant factor in the change of percentage of Bush support from 2000 to 2004 in Ohio (see Results)."

What they did was study the Gore/Kerry and Bush/Bush votes in FLA in '00 vs. '04, and found a statistically impossible increase in Bush '04 votes ONLY in the electronic voting data.

I was thinking that the intense vote suppression in OH had eaten into whatever differential might have been found between electronic voting vs. traditional voting methods ('00 vs. '04). But Arnebeck and his team are obviously looking at something else--something that didn't show up in the Berkeley study (because of the Berkeley study's specific parameters).

But it did show up in the North Carolina study done by 'ignatzmouse,' that is, the big discrepancy between the presidential race and the lower races (with anomalies such as people voting FOR an increase in the minimum wage over the federal standard, but ALSO voting for Bush--which makes no sense). The OH lawyers are also obviously looking at the Exit Poll studies, which provide the big picture (across many states).

NC study (by 'ignatzmouse'):

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x45003

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/12/233831/06

Berkeley study: http://ucdata.berkeley.edu / (scroll down to "Voting": "The Effects of Electronic Voting Machines...")

Exit poll studies:

(The Freeman report-shift to Bush in 10 of 11 states studied:) http://www.buzzflash.com/alerts/04/11/The_unexplained_exit_poll_discrepancy_v00k.pdf
(Freeman report update:) http://www.buzzflash.com/alerts/04/11/ale04090.html

(The Jonathan Simon-Alastair Thompson Report--47 state Exit Poll study, shift to Bush in 12 critical states--CO, FL, MI, MN, NE, NV, NH, NM, OH, PA, WI, IA:) http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0411/S00142.htm

(Paulos, on the improbability:)
http://www.math.temple.edu/~paulos/exit.html

(The Mealy study re: Electoral Vote)
http://www.selftest.net/redshift.htm

Here's a little puzzle to clear up. Can someone help? The Freeman study shows 4 states (of the 11 states studied)--OH, IA, NE and NM--in which the Exit Poll data gives a different winner (Kerry) than the Republican-controlled official tally. These states total 37 Electoral Votes. Bush 'won' the Electoral Vote by 34. So, those 4 states change the outcome of the election.

OH has 20 Electoral Votes. In my reckoning, OH alone cannot technically change the outcome of the overall election. Am I right?

Of course, massive fraud in OH--whether it technically changes the outcome or not--will throw the whole election into doubt. And now that it's clear that the lawyers involved are onto the electronic fraud issue, and are not confining themselves to the vote suppression evidence, the arguments and details of their legal briefs will point to fraud in other states where there were similar conditions (no paper trail, partisan Republicans owning and controlling the secret source code for the vote tabulation, the same companies providing the voting machines, partisan Republican election officials in charge, etc.)

[fearnobush]

99. No, if Ohio's 20 EV's go to Kerry, Kerry wins.

[JohnOneillsMemory]

97. Dean was so right when he cogently said "Yeeeeeeaaaaarh!!!"

Is this why Con-di isn't being confirmed as SOS until January? Because an overturned election will make the Torture White House fair game for criminal trials?

I can still dream...

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

102. A MUST SEE!!!!

Thank you so much for posting this!!!

It took me a while to view it (how to re-download Real Player V10..my copy wouldn't take the change to streaming video) and it was well worth it!

The Truth Is Willing Itself Out!!!

[Verve]

103. Another kick!

[FredStembottom]

104. OK! Now _this_ is something!

:-)

I am completely new to DU. Would have been here sooner but didn't know about ya! But we now have a big, strong Air America signal here in Minneapolis and St.Paul which leads to Mike Malloy which leads to DU.

I have been just reading since that horrible day Nov. 3 but must comment now. I find this Arnebeck fellow to be something REALLY compelling and exciting. This fraud issue needs just this kind of guy. Lots of "walk". Subdued "talk".
Straight-up, calm, no cloak-and dagger stuff, no turf-battle stuff. The kind of guy that is really hard to discredit.
Go Cliff! :thumbsup:

[Oilwellian]

107. Welcome to DU Fred

Glad to hear you found us via Malloy. :toast:

[cry baby]

117. Hi Fred - welcome!

[Amy6627]

106. Any new developments with this today?

Does anyone know if the lawsuit was filed? I'm so anxious I'm ready to start biting my fake nails!

[Sugarcoated]

108. Kick

[Sparkle]

109. Does anyone know Arnebeck personally?

I think this guy (and the other lawyers) may know something beyond election fraud that the rest of us don't. Wish I knew.

[jamboi]

114. Friend got e-mail back from him approving my transcript. n/t

[Jo March]

110. Kick

This is some good news. Of course, coming on a Friday, that's not too great for getting any press but we probably wouldn't have gotten any press anyway.

OTOH, this does bookend nicely with the protests in Ohio tomorrow.

[progressoid]

115. Thanks - glad Cspan posts this stuff on line n/t

[floridadem30]

118. kick

[WillyT]

119. Thank You !!!

:kick:

[Applan]

120. Thankyou-we should keep this on top

Buzzflash has a link to this story on another website:

http://www.thefreespeechzone.net/

[Sodium Pentothal]

121. awesome awesome awesome

one more big kick! Man this made my night.