Has anyone talked to any Republicans about the possibility of fraud?

[Bill Bored]

Please post your experiences, particularly any positive ones.

I would like to believe that given the facts, honest Republicans would want to follow the law of the land, regardless of who would win the election. They may be few and far between, but I'd hope that there are enough true patriots in Lincoln's party that would be willing to admit that if fraud or gross error could be proved beyond a doubt, and the true results favored Kerry, that he should be awarded the Presidency.

Has anyone tried to have this discussion?

[AtLiberty]

1. Not yet...still fantasizing...

:)

[JoMama49]

30. Go on over to Republicans for Kerry .....

They are into this bigtime. I'm a member of their website, and all their posts are very similar to DUers -- they are a great group!

Republicansforkerry.com

[IndyOp]

41. THANK YOU Republicans for Kerry!!!!

This is fantastic! I had no idea!

This deserves it's own thread -- and a little more detail about what they are posting!!!
Please do it! If you don't, I will!

Wow!

Edit: I went to www.republicansforkerry.com and wound up at the johnkerry.com mainpage. I couldn't find the link for the discussion board and the last time I could they weren't taking any newbies. So -- please, please, please post some detail about what is going on over there in a new thread. We really, really need to know that there ARE others out there working on this.

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

[ailsagirl]

2. I can't even talk to them about Dub... a hot potato

At work, we (Dems) carefully avoid any political talk. With Repugs, that is. There's always a chill in the air whenever we do.

But when we Dems are alone we let it rip!!

But, to answer your question, no

[TheFarseer]

3. They think it's making mountains out of molehills

It's honest mistakes, and the democrats are doing it too. It's like talking to a brick wall.

[Ready4Change]

4. One. He was convinced that Dem's would hack e-votes.

Won't even consider that it might have been the other way around.

[WildClarySage]

5. First off, the 'pub's I know

aren't capable of believing that there could be a question of fraud

and secondly, they don't care as long as it's their guy doing it.

(going by my dad's 'compassionate' attitude)

[Brundle_Fly]

6. I am slowly beginning to convince my father....

his initial gripes were, Oh you can't trust the "Bloggers"

until I pointed out how I had let him use them against Dan Rather, at which point he was all over the bloggers as the future of the news...

I am bombarding him with every article I find, that has an ounce of credibility, and it's getting ot be more and more a day, he is a repub, but he is more to the center....so there is a little common ground.

I am showing him outfoxed this week, that outta give him a few more doubts.

[RevCheesehead]

7. Spoke with my brother about 2 weeks ago.

He's aware that there's investigating about the vote going on, but he's feigning disinterest. My suspicions are that his wife is on the "obsessed freeper" side, and he's tired of hearing about anything election-related.

I just casually mentioned "you realize that this election isn't over yet, right?" and he said "I heard something about that. Don't get your hopes up." My response: "Let's just count the votes fairly, and we'll see."

Then he began to talk about the Packers.

[Chipper Chat]

8. Not a one - they just roll their eyes at me.

I've mentioned this to about 20 repub co-workers. About five said "Bush won-get over it." The rest gave me that "you are loonie" look.

[Erika]

9. Republicans Are Very Nervous

Even they aren't convinced Bush won. But they just want to close the door and pretend all is well. I'm not letting them get away with that escapism.

[Vote4Kerry]

10. They are well aware of the fraud and even come to DU for info! (link)

Just check out this link to read their comments!

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1298745/posts

[NJCher]

12. Does anyone else think it ironic

That freepers are obsessed over the "dummies" at "Dummyworld?"

If we're such dummies, what are they worried about?

And why, in God's name, would such smart people find it so interesting to read "Dummyworld" every day?

Yep, "they a hoot."


Cher

[Catherine Vincent]

15. To be honest, some of us go there too. But I don't think everyday though.

[karlrschneider]

48. Wait a minute isn't the MSM supposed to be "liberal"?

"Are you sure? Some attorney on the Dim side is filing some lawsuit on Monday. But I'm glad not much attention is being paid to this but what little attention that is happening..why aren't our guys (tv pundits) talking about this and killing this in case it gets big?"
---------------------------------------------------------------------

"OUR guys"???
and wouldn't "talking about it" just HELP make it get "big"? How fucking stupid can these assholes really be?
:eyes:

[Eye_on_prize]

11. I submitted this on Craigslist-wld.politics forum. it was very interesting

that site is diverse, but has some heavy duty distractors and nay sayers about *even* bringing up the subject of election fraud at all (in case u r not familiar with that environment). anyway, here's what I posted..

IF VoteFraud alligations R so baseless *then* <Does_Not_Add_Up_Dept > 12/10 22:47:25

Why do NeoCons get their panties in such a bunch about it when someone wants to just talke about it, or share information? kinda makes ya wonder..

..WTF do these Neocons have to hide? You would think anyone of either party would want to be assured of the veracity of their democratic institutions

...unless of course they've got something else in mind for us.

...like a slippery slope into totalitarian Fascism, where we have our "winners" handed to us by unverifyable black box voting machines (owned by private corporations with links to BushCo and with proprietry source codes) with no recounts.

So put your inquiry and integity where your mouth is Neocons. IF you think OBL "hates our freedoms" so much, why not really piss him off by helping show the world that we have a REAL democracy here..(end)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
there was a stoney silence. then an anonymous dismissive/distracting post subtly trashing my post. then the anon jumped into discussion, but never would give me a straight answer. more silence . checkmate . then someone posts as ps "it's because they don't have an answer for that"

Hope this is helpful. BTW - i'm new here, and still learning how to lurk around ..trying to keep up with all this as it's breaking. i so appreciate all the great work going on in here to take back our democracy.

[NJCher]

13. welcome, eye

Cher

[newyawker99]

27. Hi Eye_on_prize!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[super simian]

56. newbie, so...

...ducking for cover.

but... YOU ROCK! Yes, very helpful

[ClarkinMich]

14. "get over it"

seems to be the key response

some seem *afraid* to talk about it.... so they give you "I think he went off the deep end" look but I know if I can get them alone... maybe I can make some headway.

The Chuck Herrin Article is not a bad starting point:
http://www.chuckherrin.com/ConservativeEmpathy.htm
the one guy I gave it to said "If that guys a Repub... I will eat my hat"

I will not give up. SOME of them have to understand the importance of fairness, freedome and democracy.

[Carolab]

16. I have been doing my best

to explain it rationally, ala Chuck Herrin's site. For all who haven't seen it, go to www.chuckherrin.com. Chuck is a Republican who is now convinced and working to convince others. He has some great pieces there about Empathy for Liberals and Empathy for Conservatives. Send it out to your Republican friends.

I have one Republican friend that at first became hostile over the discussion but after I sent him the information he now understands and accepts what is going on. I think he was a little freaked out by it at first but the truth has slowly sunk in and he knows what is truly at stake.

Also, I have been going to other sites and when I encounter posts by someone who is being abusive about this and has an e-mail link, I e-mail them to explain that they have been played by politicians who drove wedges over issues that aren't really vital to us all, and that post-election surveys prove that we all share the same top concerns--the war, jobs and the economy, etc. Then I provide a few links, such as Herrin's site. I finish by explaining that we cannot afford to be divided any longer "left vs. right" and must stand together as citizens to save our democracy from fascism. Then I provide a link to Ruppert's site www.fromthewilderness.com so that they understand about peak oil and a link to www.pnac.info and http://newamericancentury.org/ so they understand about neoconservative military empire.

[bunny planet]

17. I haven't even had any luck convincing some Democratic friends that fraud

took place. That's been more frustrating then trying to convince Republicans. I don't even go there. My blood begins to boil way too easily when talking to * supporters. They inevitably say something assinine and I feel like giving them a wedgie on the spot, or maybe a creme pie right in the kisser. My sister-in-law, the Zionist of Nashville, believes any Arab should be a dead Arab so there's no talking to her, and my other sister-in-law who is rich, voted her pocketbook, whoring out her vote for that almighty tax cut. I liked them both before. Such a shame, this administration has even come between families.

Some of my Dem friends, not all, have taken to asking me if I'm wearing my little tinfoil hat when I bring up election fraud. How droll, and original of them. This is why I am addicted to DU. Even my husband, who agrees with me totally politically and thinks * is the worst president in history is too busy to talk politics with me. I work at home and have to use my computer alot for work, so it's easy to sneak a peak at DU, like hundreds of times a day. Is there a DU 12 step group?

Seriously, look what time I'm still posting.

If it wasn't for the hope that we can oust His Fraudulency before the coronation I would have crawled up into a little fetal ball a long time ago, say Nov. 3rd.

Nitey night, I mean it this time.

[dmac]

18. I also am batting 1 in 20 with my Dem friends/family

As for the Republicans? I had not discussed it with any (except for one yesterday) because in order to discuss it, I would have to admit that GWB has been deemed the winner - and those words refuse to cross my lips. Whenever in the company of Conservatives, I discuss anything but politics and if they say something I either change the subject or discreetly leave the scene.

The one I did approach yesterday was my brother. I called him because I wanted him to hear from me and not someone else that I was intending to go to Ohio to assist with the recount. His answer: You know how I feel about it but you gotta do what you gotta do. And he is right of course - I do. I kind of wanted to pursue what he knows/has heard/has read because of his comment that I know how he feels about it. But I took it to mean this is no different than the other 1100 discussions we have had since 2000 - that regardless he would be in the Bush camp. This totally blew my mind before the election and I spent 2 years sending emails/articles trying to help him see the light - and for every one I sent him, he would send me one back from the right side perspective. I could never understand how he believed the stuff he sent me and he could never understand what I sent him. But I have to admit, he was much more accepting of the fact that we differ; that there is no crime in it. He even gave me Woodward's book for my birthday, with the inscription that maybe we would never see politics the same way but we would always love each other regardless. I think it was hard for me to accept because we are incredibly similar personalities - so how can there be an ocean between us on this? It will never make sense to me.

[KatieB]

53. I find some people hook on to Repug party for false sense of security

My bro is a repug too. He just needs to keep things very simple for him to cope with life. The narrow emotionalism - the simple explanations - and being part of the mythical "haves" versus the "have-nots." I think the Repugs in the masses are basically insecure and want to be lied to. The most horrible are their leaders, because they know have sheep and they are exploiting them.

[seabeyond]

19. just three friends, no one close

all three kept mouth shut and let it go by. no interest

[merh]

20. Just had a run in tonight with a repuke, bushbot that couldn't

believe I would suggest election fraud. I was laughed at and called a sore loser and got that "don't start that shit again" crap.

They just don't want to hear it and they don't want to know the danger our nation is in should the weed in chief be crowned again.

It is so sad, they just don't want to know. :cry:

[Bill Bored]

21. Chuck Herrin's site is great!

Thanks to those of you who pointed it out. I love the dog in the pickup truck reference! I couldn't get the Peter King video link to work though. Will try again later.

I think the comments in this thread, and Herrin's article show how important it is to get some Republicans on board. One source could be the various Republicans for Kerry groups out there. At least they might be willing to listen and they know how to talk to other Republicans. Coming from us, it will always seem like sour grapes but it's so much more than that.

The next question one might ask, if it hasn't already been asked, is:
which well known Repubs are in on the fraud and which aren't?

[ClintCooper2003]

22. Well there's always Chuck Herrin at ChuckHerrin.com

[henslee]

23. The only Republicans I know, don't know they are republicans. Thats how

far gone they are and any attempt to communicate is waste of energy.

[EMunster]

24. This is what gives me pause...talk to anyone who doesn't visit this...

...site incessantly, and they don't know what you're talking about.

[Carolab]

25. No

there are lots of sites with the information now, in case you haven't noticed. Also, radio, newspaper, TV, it is getting out there.

[suziedemocrat]

26. Yes - They dismiss it as "Everyone does this stuff"

and start complaining about Kennedy winning in 1960 because of dead people voting in Chicago. I don't think they really expect fair elections and I don't think they are surprised or worried that election fraud takes place.

Also, they couldn't care less that there were long lines in the inner city and no wait at all in the suburbs. They say - "Well I didn't have to wait to vote - I walked right in - no problem." I think they are able to turn off any concern for any problems minorities may have the same way they are able to turn off concern for the 100,000 Iraqis who have died because of this war.

[brindis_desala]

32. America is not a democracy....yet..

For conservatives democracy is an affront to the status quo. For them the state is all about protecting property against the claims of the dispossessed; which is why they resent paying taxes. What the Republicans have managed to do is insinuate race into what is a struggle over the privileges of wealth and class. Working-class whites have been convinced that their "values" makes them allies of the elite when nothing is further from the truth. Why the fraud issue is important is that most Americans still believe in their own goodness and vote tampering is a hard nut to spin.

[jdog]

28. I don't know many Republicans, but

I feel like I've become like a life insurance salesman - dropping little comments to every single person I talk to ("Pretty big stuff in Ohio eh?") to start a conversation going. One guy I know never seemed to respond much, so the other day I just flat out asked: "You never respond when I'm talking about this stuff. This isn't politics I'm talking you know, it's about saving our democracy?" He responded "Well, it's not that I don't care, I just don't feel like I'm very well informed." Yahoo! I told him I would be happy to send him a link every now and then to help bring him up to speed, that it was not his fault since it's not being covered in the media.

And you know what? He thanked me and said please do! Gotta hang in there on the one-on-one.

[verdalaven]

29. Sorry, not positive experience

When discussing it with a co-worker, who is also an elderly RW Christian, unable to defend her position she finally gave it up by saying, essentially, "So what? Both sides cheat!" Then regaled me on how John Kerry shot someone in the back in Viet Nam. (sons of dogs SBV for Lies!)

In her mind, Bush was appointed by god, he can do no wrong. Seems like most the Bush supporters I've met feel that way. It's like Bush is the second coming of Christ. They revere him with that type of sick worship.

On a side note, a young lady (republican) I've been talking to was upset recently when I told her about the conscientious objector bill in our state house and while she was discussing her concerns about it with her mother, her mother accused her of "starting to sound like a democrat." I asked her if her mother was trying to say that democrats generally sound more reasonable and informed than republicans and she didn't laugh, I think because she realized that it is just plain true.

All in all, the repubs I know are a vast brick wall.

[BR_Parkway]

31. The one thing that finally got my brother past the "it's over, you lost"

mentality was sending him the link to Conyer's letter to Blackwell. When it's spelled out that clearly in black & white (these are Repugs, they only understand black & white) it's practically impossible to read that and not walk away with a very disturbing feeling about the future of our democracy.

My email to him that showed him this was pretty simple:

I want you to read something, and while you do, please keep these 2 things in mind:

1) If Kerry (or Hillary) "won" by 3 million votes and the House Republican members of the Judiciary committee wrote this exact letter, how would you feel?

2) If you look at the age & computer savvy of the typical Democratic voter vs the typical Republican voter - how long can you be sure that the election won't be hacked in favor of a Democratic landslide - unless we make sure the system has the right checks & balances now.

Ok, now read this letter and tell me what you think

http://www.house.gov/judiciary_democrats/ohblackwellltr12204.pdf

[LiberalAndProud]

39. Did he respond?

Does he now share your concern?

[marions ghost]

59. good idea, br parkway

Thanks for posting the link to the Conyers Letter--

Agree it would be just the right thing to send to conservatives.
And Democrats who havent got a clue.

We should spread that letter around...

[atxryan]

33. mixed response...

I've talked with my Republican co-workers and they are surprisingly open-minded about the issue of fraud. They don't want to believe that their party committed it, but they recognize that the numbers in this election just don't add up. They grew up with every presidential election being called by exit polls. They want to know why they're all of a sudden inaccurate now. They don't buy the line that "moral values" re-elected *.

Perhaps there is hope...

[Needtodosomething]

34. Yes, but by accident

I wrote a letter which I thought was going to Jeff Binghaman, New Mexico. I accidentally sent it to Pete Domenici, New Mexico, who is a Republican. Whoops. He sends me back a letter telling me about all the wonderful things the Repugs are going to do over the next few years. Great. Still waiting to hear anything from either my New Mexico Senator or Representative(I wrote them new letters.) I also contacted Ron Paul and I urge anyone in Texas to please do so!!! This guy isn't exactly your average Bush crime family advocate. Good luck and we'll see you at the Kerry inauguration.

[AntiFascist]

35. I'm having enough trouble trying to convince fellow Democrats...

that this is worth pursuing.

You can rest assured, however, that many are carefully weighing the consequences. Some may not want to have Kerry put into office, or have this turn into another Florida 2000, but if this story hits the mainstream consciousness at just the right time it could damage the Neocon agenda. The MSM together with the military already seem to be beating up Bush over certain aspects of not supporting the troops well enough in their greed to advance the agenda.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

36. i don't talk to republicans anymore...refuse too...it's my new life litmus

if you voted for bush you can never again waste my precious time

[Old Mouse]

40. I'm trying not to be a divider

but I find it too difficult to talk to any of my republican friends about anything anymore.

[MarkusQ]

37. Every day since the election!!

See the flier I plan to hand out tomorrow at the march in a very red state.

There are a lot of us out here. If the Democrats could stop with the tin-foil hats (e.g. that guy's dog that got killed), the name calling ("repukes" does not win friends), and the heavy partisan spin (you know what I mean). It's about honesty, not outcomes--I'm a Republican, but I'm working my butt off to reverse any fraudulent outcome, even if it puts Kerry in the White House. The least you guys could do is drop the "Kerry at any cost" and start framing things in terms of "The rightful winner, no matter who."

--MarkusQ

[Bill Bored]

45. I tend to agree as long as

there are Republicans like you, MarkusQ. I don't know how much longer that will be, but if it persists, I might even change my avatar!

I think we need to separate our campaign-style rhetoric from the fact-based discussion of the fraud issue. Otherwise, there may never be bi-partisan support. The Alliance for Democracy seems to have done this quite well. (I'm not suggesting they are the only ones.)

That said, I think we Dems were all a bit disappointed to see people like McCain and other so-called "moderates" aggressively supporting Bush in 2004 after all we now know.

Even Bob Dole jumped onto the "slime Kerry" bandwagon, claiming that JK's war wounds were somehow not up to snuff.

How can we have any faith in the ability or the desire of these people to solve a problem like the one we suspect?

To complicate matters, we have Chuck Hagel coming out as a major critic of the Iraq war plan, if not the actual war itself, and yet also being one of the primary election fraud "suspects." It's enough to make one think about turning Green or Libertarian!

[MarkusQ]

51. McCain called Bush out on the swift boat liars for FUD ads...

But guess how much MSM coverage that got.

When he stood next to Bush, the took pictures.

When he stood up to him, they took a powder.

--MarkusQ

[Bill Bored]

58. Ya got a point there, although personally, I did pick up on both stories

So do you think McCain would be interested in uncovering/doing something about election fraud?

Warren Rudman seems like a straight shooter, but of course he's no longer in office.

[LiberalAndProud]

38. Still trying to get my fellow Democrats to consider the possibility.

I am making some headway in this endeavor.

[righteous1]

42. Yea, they look at me like I'm from another planet, no clue

[genieroze]

43. Honest Republicans? I'll let you know if I find any. eom

[Kellis]

44. I have spoken with several friends

and family members who are Republican and while they believe that "I" believe there was fraud it seems to be too much for them to deal with or even care about-like even if its true there's nothing we can do about it so why bother?
I also get "if thats true why aren't they reporting it in the news?" and when I tell them about Keith Olberman,the lawsuits and investigations going on,internet news sources they just stare at me.It can't be true if the MSM isn't reporting it is what they think.

I do sometimes feel like I am *crazy* when interacting with people who aren't following this story-lol.But it helps knowing that there are a lot of people working on this investigation who know the facts and are working to expose the truth.

[propagandafreegal]

46. The Repubs that I know would just call me a sore loser, who needs that? nm

[Roger_Otip]

47. occasionally over on the ABC forum

check it out -> http://forums.go.com/abcnews/forum?start=0&forumID=47

sometimes, when confronted with some of the evidence, particularly chuck herrin's site - http://www.chuckherrin.com/ - and telling them it's more about the election being stolen from the voters rather than stolen from the democrats, then i've seen some of the more reasonable ones move from "bush won, get over it" to "if there is proof of fraud i want to see whoever was responsible locked up", so there is hope there.

[EMunster]

49. As everyone seems to attest, we're all a bit more use to the idea....

of there possibly being a regime change, an actual Kerry Presidency. But as most have related their their experiences, that reality would be a huge, if radical paradigm shift for everyone else. A good thing -- a great thing -- in the end, sure. But it'd still need some getting use to, and with so many unanswered questions. We'd be fooling ourselves to believe it was going to be at all easy.

I think that's one of the reasons Kerry's not out making himself a target for Rightwing radio. He's aware -- as we are -- of what a huge leap in reality may soon occur. He might very well make the transition poorly, whether by his doing or not. There's markets to worry about, terrorist, not to mention a good chunk of the country that hates him. So I think he's being very thoughtful in leading up to that possible role...careful in his appearances to project a Presidential bearing -- strength, confidence, of being in control.

And if there's a transiton, we're all going to have some extra work to do. It'll be a very confusing time; unprecendented. We'll not have the traditions of an election night to cushion us, when everyone is kind of primed for a change, and somewhat braced if it doesn't go our way. This would be change, too, that will come AFTER all the triumphalism of the other side that we've endured. And the reversal will be sudden, swift and out of nowhere. I can't imagine the losers this time will be a fraction as accepting as the democrats were in November. You can already find them writing about us "stealing" the election during the recount. They'll be as eagier to declare it over as we've been.

I'm rambling here -- but in just even trying to communicate all that's happening to my girlfriend, I'm realizing what different realities we occupy right now with relation to the rest of the country. I don't know whether to be in awe or concerned.

[googly]

50. Yes, I know a whole bumch of repubs...at the country club

Almost all of the members are repubs except the few who are mostly from education services background. They are all almost without exception assuming it is all over, and they don't have the slightest clue of all the things going on about recounts and lawsuits etc. Boy, are they in for a surprise when president John F. Kerry is sworn in on January 20, 2005.

[blueatheart]

52. part of conversation with a repuke today:

puke: I couldn’t vote for Kerry, it made me sick to look at him.
He would have nothing and be poor if it weren’t for his wife.

me: So you choose your vote by looks?

puke: some bull about Kerry’s medals

me: He is a senator he makes decent money from that.

puke: (gives me this look like, a senator?, duh I did not know that)

me: uhm, yea he has been a senator for 20 years. Doesn’t sound like a bum to me.

puke: Yea, see he makes a lot of money, it’s disgusting.

me: do you have any idea what Bush makes?

puke: well, I know it’s a shitload. The (iraquians) were killing their own people.

me: you of course know where they got those weapons?

puke: yea. We wouldn’t be there now if Clinton attacked them when he was in office.

(some more bull, I can’t remember because my head was starting to really hurt at this point)

me: (I go on to explain some of major fraud reports)

puke: Well that isn’t surprising I’m sure they all do it, especially democrats.(he then went on to make some comment how Clinton rigged votes or something, asked him to repeat because I did not catch it, and he didn’t repeat it)

me: almost all fraud reports point to Bush.

puke: well I’m not into politics, I don’t read up on it much (no shit)

me: how can you form an opinion without knowing all angles?

puke: well I know what I read on Kerry, I didn’t read anything about Bush.

Theres a lot more but I had to run to the bathroom and vomit. Then get on DU and try to bring my IQ up, oh about 30 points that I had just lost from talking to an ignorant repuke.

Granted I am not a world class debater, but how can they be so blind, so ignorant. Never even gave Kerry a chance just because he is a democrat. Hell his guy had 4 years that he stole and f***ed upped!

Honestly, I have not always voted for democrats in the past, but you have to be a complete idiot to vote for Bush. End of story.

Thanks for the rant:-)

[KatieB]

54. Batting 100% with Dem friends and even persuaded a liberatarian

But things are pretty obvious here in NC. with Carteret County. My Repug friends don't want to even think about it - which is very telling.

[Hamoth]

55. Yeah, I've convinced many

What I usually do is explain to them how many things we have turned up, and be careful not to imply that they personally would have anything to do with such crap. I might even say (and I do believe this) that I doubt G.W. knows anything about it. But that it is our sacred duty to jealously guiard our votes and check, then check again the iwll of the people. Freedom was pruchased with blood of patriots. How would we squander this for mere "expediency"? Our votes are the fabric of our flag and the grains of our noble soil! They are what makes America what it is! Who wants to tel la soldier returning from Iraq that we didn't get his absentee ballot, or found it in a stack in some moldering office? To interfear with our votes is treason, no matter WHO it is. I say we find out if ANYONE from ANY party messed with them, and do it as quick as we can. And if we find out that anyone tried to betray our nation, we hold them accountable. We are all patriotic americans here and none of us will endorse treason!

With a speal like that, I was able to explain our cause to a right-wing journalist who was slamming KO in editorials and I got him to back off and come to our side of the issue.

The fact is that no reasonable human being would want to prohjibit votes from being examined. We jsut have to discuss this in the open light and frame it thus, that they have room to come to our side.

When you talk to R's be sure to make this issue inclusive, rather than accusitory. It really does affect us all.

[terry4kerry]

57. Look at this republican!!

Hi,
I wanted to post this web-site because I was so surprised that Scarborough County Congressman Joe (repug) would be so against some of Bush's agenda. And even more shocked to see him write about it.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6330851/

[JoMama49]

60. From Sean Hannity's Discussion Forum ...

I've infiltrated several right-wing discussion forums and posted there asking if anyone has heard anything about election fraud in Ohio. Here is one Repub. response:

there was ONE MACHINE in ONE PRECINCT that had 3000 some odd votes when they turned it on
but that machine wasn't used, it was caught before the polls opened
the liberal media played it up like it was cheating
i welcome a recount in Ohio
more than likely it will cost Kerry votes because in MOST elections the democrats have dead people voting and some people were bussed around to different democrat majority precincts voting more than once
they did it in St Louis and KC in 2000 too
thats when a DEAD democrat actually got elected to the senate.

Other than that, I've mostly gotten very liberal responses, and then I realized there are quite a few democrats and liberals on these boards -- the same at the Dynamic Truth board. It's weird, but I didn't get flamed like I thought I would -- I actually sparked interest and a lot of responsesl that said they would not be surprised to find that the election had been rigged! I was flabergasted!

[Bill Bored]

62. From one newbie to another, Welcome to DU, terry!

Prior to the election, there were a slew of conservative/Republican endorsements for Kerry. There are whole websites dedicated to this and the blogs reported it almost daily. There were newspaper editorials from some of the red states and even the great state of Texas, including Bush's home town, that either endorsed Kerry, or did not take sides after decades of Republican support. This is another reason why the results of this election are so disturbing and, dare I say, improbable.

[ColoradoDemocrat]

61. Republicans I know...

are not political junkies-they're rancher-types here in the west who were pretty moved by spotted owl forest closures.

HOWEVER, they have been open to hearing from my husband (I've made him into a political junkie!)--and are VERY swayed by topics that the MSM buries:

-the flu shot fiasco was NOT a British company, it was a Californian country with a factory in Britain;

-the repukes were trying to push thru laws restricting access to public lands and imposing HARSH CRIMINAL fines for people ON PUBLIC LAND without buying a pass;

-they're of course VERY MOVED by stagnant wages and high health care costs, but thought Kerry was too rich to care. His message was not direct enough! Edwards' two americas I thought might sink in with them;

-I also find them very persuadable if you emphasize keeping our tax dollars HERE FOR OUR KIDS, not sending them overseas/to Halliburton.

-and of course corporate greed.

the voter fraud thing needs to stay direct and not get wordy-I know there are millions of examples, but short, clear, outrageous ones like the 3,365 votes for the chimp in the precinct with 658, or whatever the #s were.

Of course, it helps if we call our fraudulent leader "The Chimp"!