Ohio, Fairfield County, suspends recount...UPDATED WITH REPORT

[mtnester]

At 4 pm today, after failing to get a match of hand counted ballots with punch card tabulator (ESS), two hand counts and two times through machine, after stating they were awaiting a call back from that company to have a new machine delivered, less than 30 seconds later convened a board meeting, voted to suspend recount, to await a new machine from ESS, and recount will be re-done Saturday, same exact precincts, the building is now closed, you are to exit the facility. BOE blaming issues on "machine failure" in order to avoid the now required entire county hand count. Precints were not random, they were selected by BOE, one from the Dem and one from the Repup.

This after their call to SOS Kathy Blackwell.

Greens will be going for a TRO. They are fully aware of entire circumstances of this report.

BOE's trying to get around mandatory handcounts of entire counties by calling it machine failure rather than follow clear statute. This will be breaking I am sure before long.

First hand witness to events above....myself

[dewaldd]

1. Un-frigging-believable. Another breach of the law.

[pgh_dem]

7. kinda like a tree falling in the woods

if you break an election law, and nobody cares enough to charge you with a crime, did you realllllly break the law?

[Eloriel]

39. Or, if you break an election law and oooops!!! too late, your guy

gets in, isn't it worth it after all?

[berniew1]

98. Does anyone know how much the counts differed???

[GetTheRightVote]

8. These Ohio Election Folks have gone to far, breaking the law right & left

this must stop, looking just like Florida and the mayham they put it thru four years ago, they are stealing our Democracy again, call out the Election police = DU.

[DoYouEverWonder]

45. Actually this is going to be worse

at least in FL 2000 they tried to pretend they were following the law.

[AndrewClarke]

32. They violated the procedures . . .

. . . as soon as they ran the ballots through the machine a second time:

"If the computer count does not match the hand count, and after
rechecking the manual count, the results are still not equal, all ballots must be hand counted."

In other words,

1. hand count
2. machine count
3a. if they are equal, count all ballots by machine
eb. if they are not equal, hand count again
4a. if they are equal, count all ballots by machine
4b. if they are not equal, count all ballots by hand

They're not supposed to take another try with the machine.

[Junkdrawer]

69. Laws? They don't need no stinking laws...

Laws are for the little people...

[Darkhawk32]

2. OMG!!!

I'm going to be sick. :puke:

[Stephanie]

3. OMG

How can they switch machines? What happens to the old machine? These machines shd be impounded and held as evidence. Please call Conyers office to report. Thanks for the post!

[mtnester]

6. Will do, have reports to file with a bunch of folks

[zann725]

128. They've had SIX WEEKS now to tinker with the machines.

n/t

[chomskysright]

157. I'm calling Conyers office now...202 225-5126

[MarkusQ]

4. Kick!

[momzno1]

5. Well, it just gets more and more twisted

and the more people involved the more likely that they will trip up and fraud WILL be revealed.
Fuck Katherine Blackhole!

[yardwork]

9. They can't get a match between the ballots and the machine tally

It sounds like they keep trying to get a match to prove that the machine tally was accurate, and their handcount is proving the opposite - that the machine tally is WRONG - so they suspended the count and locked down the building.

Who knows what shenanigans will go on in that building now that everyone's been told to leave? And why do they need a new machine?

[mtnester]

11. True, I will be posting back in here soon, but now I have to get reports

out...so you wont hear from me for an hour or so.

[mattclearing]

64. Can you guys get volunteers to keep an eye on the place?

I know it's cold and people have to work, but it would be great if people could make sure nothing happens to that building.

Maybe talk to local businesses and see if they can keep their security cams on it.

Just a thought.

[mtnester]

84. Building sits right next to Juvenile Detention Facility...

Whole area lit like a Xmas tree, plus detention facilities cameras cover the area...best to keep our "surveillance" plans quiet.
:)

[pgh_dem]

14. It would be kind of nice to know

What 'defective' results they were coming up with.
Couldn't help but notice that Fairfield is a county that Arnebeck suit alleges switched at least 2,110 votes from Kerry to *.
edit : oooops, thanks duncan

[Kota]

21. Maybe the correct results.

[Duncan]

41. Do you mean from Kerry to * ?

[mtnester]

60. The "defective result" was the count does not match

THIS is how they are going to get around the mandatory total county recounts...this exactly

[FreeCajun]

148. OMG! KICK!

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mtnester]

15. Dem board member selected one, Repub board member selected the other eom

[danostuporstar]

12. who cares what the machines say!?

the hand count should be all that matters. what am i missing here?

[Time for change]

74. Yeah

Don't they have a record of how that precinct voted? Why can't they just compare the hand count to the already recorded official vote? Why do they have to recount with the machine?

[MarkusQ]

13. If you witnessed this yourself, contact Keith at Countdown! (n/t)

[SharonRB]

16. Thanks for the info...

Please keep us updated as this progresses. I can't believe they're getting a new machine. According to the rules, they need to do a total hand recount now. Hope this was reported to Conyers, Arnebeck, etc. The plot thickens!

[seito]

17. This is just more evidence of fraud and cover-up

This is the type of thing that will be uncovered by this recount. They will continue to dig themselves in deeper and deeper.

Thank you for the report.

No Retreat No Surrender

[me b zola]

109. re "more evidence.."

Exactly. The repubs are beginning to run for cover. The more they dig-in the more they expose themselves. MSNBC just ran a piece on Scankborough saying how b*sh won fair and square. They are covering up AND trying to discredit us....they are running scared!

[Alizaryn]

18. Is the building being watched?

[pbartch]

23. YOU GUYS AND GALS....................MONITOR THAT BUILDING.

VIDEO TAPE IS YOUR FRIEND.

Call Ohio Democratic Party and tell them what is going on.

[Ellipsis]

25. yes is the building being watched? n/t

[Broken Acorn]

19. Machines only fail when Recount doesn't = Official Vote

Smoking Gun anyone?

[EQPlayer]

20. Counts not matching

How far off were the counts? Who did it favor? Do we know?

[carolinalady]

22. and of course the new machine will need to be adjusted.....n/t

[pipes]

28. It wont need to adjusting

They are geeting it staright from the source. In stead of sending some poor shmoe in there to do it and get caught, they can do it themselves and nobody will be watching!

Fuckin Pukes!

[troubleinwinter]

24. To think I was shocked before. E-fuckin-gads. Guard the building.

[insane_cratic_gal]

26. Why can't We

Just throw their partisan asses right out onto the street and recount it ourselves. Honest to god just do a damn hand recount! If doesn't match that just means Triad hasn't been in to ensure that it does match!! WTF is wrong with these people.

We need to get our asses to OH and start doing some heavy protesting

[BR_Parkway]

27. Why don't they use another machine already there? I know, they

shouldn't be trying to get a new machine at all, but is it the only one they have? I might have missed something.

[shraby]

50. Don't need another machine..

rules are:
hand count 3%
machine count that same 3%
if tallies don't match
whole county gets handcounted.

They can't keep running them through the machine and if that doesn't work, get another machine. Doesn't work that way. Rules are rules.

[Moonwatcher]

29. Video and/or photograph all going into the building

Especially those "repairmen" on a late night house call.

[Doremus]

30. Please tell your county recount chairperson to get help with surveillance

and keep watch on that building 24/7!

Videotape everyone who enters and exits and their license plate #'s.

And if there's a window to keep watch on them, so much the better -- aim that camera right at them while they do their dirty deeds.

[mdb]

31. Two words MASSIVE PROTEST.

I'm getting tired of hearing we are fully aware of this and that. You know something? So are we all.

[liam97]

53. YES!!!!

[Pepper32]

79. I agree. It's the only thing that will STOP them! n/t

[milkyway]

33. I am confused about one thing: shouldn't the machine count be final,

certified, and public knowledge already for each precinct?

I thought a count would be done by hand, and then compared to the final machine count. So why are the machines even an issue now? Aren't the recounts being done by hand in the select 3% of precincts?

What am I missing?

[Time for change]

76. Yeah

That's exactly what I was thinking. What in the world would they need to do another machine recount for?

[AndrewClarke]

95. Here's what you're missing:

They select precincts with at least 3% of the vote.
They count those precincts by hand, and then count them by machine.
If the counts are the same, they get to do the whole county by machine.
If they are different, they are supposed to recount by hand. If they match the machine count, they get to do the whole county by machine.
If not, they have to do the whole county manually.

[old blue]

34. Are they closing the building in order to "calibrate"

the ballots?

[Liberty Belle]

35. KICK! Forward this to Conyers & the media, please!

[Kota]

42. This would give Conyers more ammo for his countdown

appearance tonight.

[angrydemocrat]

36. This is nothing but a sure sign of

Cover up and Fraud!

[texpatriot2004]

37. SIEZE THE MACHINE! DON'T LET IT GET AWAY!

[Alizaryn]

56. lol, could not have said it better myself!

[AmerDem]

38. A novel couldn't be written anymore intriguing

This is beyond belief.

[BamaBecky]

43. You got that right! n/t

[sunnystarr]

44. What's the sense in watching the building when they're gonna

get a new "fixed" machine? Unless they plan to "fix" the ballots.

[AmerDem]

49. It goes beyond that

In the last couple of days we had an election official charging Triad's tech actually showed up and adjusted the tabulator. Now with scrutiny like that they openly pull this garbage. It's as if they feel there are no laws and they can do what they want with no repercussions. This country is in a sad state, no accountability from anyone anymore.

[Up2Late]

126. As the RNC Protesters said last summer...

"This is what a 'Police State' Looks like!" :grr:

[enough]

40. Thank you for being there.

Kick.

[kitp]

46. a la washington

In Washingotn the repugs said of us "they'll just keep finding votes until they get enough" we should say of Fairfield "they'll just keep changing machines till they get the result they want"

Unbelievable.

[ReneB]

47. did i understand it right?

the handrecount did not match the machinerecount, and now they are blaiming it on the machine, saying its broken and are ordering a new machine?

wouldnt that probably say, that the machine count at election day was wrong too?

justa thought

[Igel]

72. Maybe.

We seem to be missing a lot of facts (at least as I've read this thread down to this point).

Did the two hand counts match? The two (granted, the second was illegal) machine counts? How much were they off? (Now, possibly having embarrassed myself, I'll read to the end of the thread.)

[Time for change]

77. Yes, exactly

I don't see why they need another machine count at all. If the hand count doesn't match the official tally, that should be all that is needed to indicate that there is something wrong, and that should trigger a state wide recount.

[PennyMan]

82. What About The Other Machines In The Other Counties

What About The Other Machines In The Other Counties Can't They Be Doing What They Want To Them Some Of Those Do Matter

[Peace Patriot]

125. Yeah, I don't get this either...

...bringing in a new machine (?!). The new machine could be correcting the...ahem...'malfunctioning' code that is giving them the...ahem...'inconsistent' result. Isn't the point to check if the machine used to tabulate votes that night, 11/2, was consistent with the hand count (the real votes)? --not if ANY machine, programmed whatever which way, COULD POSSIBLY produce that handcount result!

It is ridiculous that they would bring in another machine to see if they could somehow get the right result!

[DoYouEverWonder]

48. Someone needs a court order

to lock down all these election board and impound their equipment. There is no friggin' reason in the world to take these machines out of the building. There is no friggin' reason for these machines to be constantly breaking either. This is a just a load of crap.

[texpatriot2004]

51. That for sure. SIEZE THOSE DAMN MACHINES NOW!

Before they throw away or destroy any more evidence.

[DoYouEverWonder]

52. Actually, let them

it will make convicting them for treason and federal crimes much easier.

[johan helge]

54. What does TRO mean?

[mtnester]

57. Temporay Restraining Order...eom

[mtnester]

55. UPDATE

Below is the text of my fast report as the legal team is looking for a TRO and I had to get it to them FAST! Also been forwarded to Conyers and Arenback. Here is my report:

Fairfield County, Ohio Recount Statement
Wednesday, December 15, 2004
Statement by my name here, Green Party Representative

On Wednesday, December 15, 2004, we arrived at the Fairfield County BOE at approx. 0730 hours for a recount. There were also Kerry and Bush observers, and the BOE allowed one representative from each candidate to sit at each of the two counting stations, and the rest to stand and watch.

We were informed that the Democratic and Republican board member each selected a precinct to recount. They were Lancaster City 2C and Pickerington C.

I sat at Lancaster C, and the hand count went smoothly. Once both precincts were hand counted, we then were allowed to have only on representative from each candidate in the actual tabulating room, due to its size. All others were allowed to watch from outside the room. BOE Director explained the process of a new test deck, which they created, showed and explained to us how the test deck worked, demonstrated the test, and clearly demonstrated clearing the test results out.

Some troubles occurred with the tabulator. It seemed to stop frequently, giving invalid tally on a card messages (basically a jam). After many starts and stops, both precincts were finally tabulated. The explanation for the troubles was the handling of the cards for the hand count and humidity. There were several dehumidifiers clearly visible in the area.

Lancaster 2C tabulations matched up with the hand count. However, Pickerington C did not. Many of us felt that the hand count did not show the no-votes in the totals (4 cards) and could explain the four-card grand total discrepancy….the hand count showed 4 votes less than the tabulator count.

It was agreed to recount by hand Pickerington C to determine if this was the case. A hand count was then reconducted, and the non-votes were also included in this tally this time. It was then decided to run the cards again through the tabulator. However, it was decided by the BOE that a spare machine should be used after the original machine (the first machine was actually the machine that tallied the vote the evening of 11/2/04). The spare machine was removed from the box, hooked up, and promptly failed completely. The first machine was then hooked back up, and the tabulation commenced again.

After numerous stops and starts, errors and jams (all explained by handling of the cards and humidity.”card-curling”) the tabulation was complete. The 2nd tabulation counts of Pickerington C again did not match the 2nd hand count of that precinct…the tabulation machine failed to register two votes that that hand count had counted.

At this time, the BOE asked if we would waive their rights, and they were told no. The BOE then suggested contacting their machine vendor to get another machine in to retabulate. The BOE was then told by us that this would be unacceptable…the law was very clear, they would now have to perform a mandatory hand count of the entire county. The BOE then stated they would have to contact the Secretary of State’s office. The Board members then asked us to wait, and they left the area.

At approximately 2 minutes before 4:00 PM, a member of the board came out and stated they were awaiting a call back from their vendor, that the vendor had said it would be 5 minutes and it had already been 10 minutes, and that is what is happening and they would get back with is as soon as they heard from the vendor. Two minutes later, at exactly 4:00 PM, the Board members returned to the area, convened a Board meeting, moved and seconded to suspend the recount until 9:30 AM Saturday, December 18, 2004. On that date, the recount would be conducted again, same exact precincts, with a new machine from their vendor. It was claimed that the tabulator had suffered “equipment malfunction” and a new tabulator would arrive and be in place. All voted AYE, motion carried. The Board then adjourned, announced it was after their normal operating hours, and we were to leave the building. The BOE also then stated that only one observer from each party would be allowed at each of the two hand count tables, and no other observers would be allowed in the counting area at all. The BOE was informed they were violating the law, and the Green Party legal team was contacted.

Statement freely given by Green Party Observer, my name, who personally witnessed these events on Wednesday, December 15, 2004, at the Fairfield County, Ohio, Board of Elections Office, Liberty Center Facility, Lancaster, Ohio.

Respectfully,

name
address
phone

[MelissaB]

62. If this doesn't hit the media

something BAD is wrong.

FRAUD! CHEATERS! LAWBREAKING THIEFS! *&#$%^*$$#%%%

I feel better now.

[crispini]

63. Thank you!

YES!!!!!!!!!! :yourock:

Fasten your seatbelts, brothers and sisters. It's time to get really serious about Ohio.

[Alizaryn]

65. Not to be repetitive but, is the building being watched/taped?

[su01]

66. Forwarded Content to Olbermann!

[troubleinwinter]

67. Clarification please?

"We were informed that the Democratic and Republican board member each selected a precinct to recount."

How were the precincts "selected"? Were they random? Or were they CHOSEN by Board members?

Nice work! Thank you for your work and for your posts.

[mtnester]

86. Chosen...our team leader objected to the non randomness of it

[jmknapp]

87. Weird thing is...

There are 118 precincts in Fairfield, of which two precincts represents less than 2% (2/118).

So if they wanted to slack off by just selecting two precincts, they would have to select two that were 1.8x more populous than the average precinct. I would think that would limit their potential precinct candidates severely.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

73. thanks for the update!

[rumpel]

81. sent statement to LA Times

[AmerDem]

83. Thanks

for keeping us up to speed.:toast:

[jmknapp]

89. I'm not clear on the original miscount

Was it four non-votes that the handcount tallied, but the machine count had morphed those into actual votes?

[Junkdrawer]

91. Looks like you're going to make them counterfeit the whole county...

The automated punch machines (http://www.cardamation.com/) will be working overtime between now and Saturday.

I hope you're proud of yourself... :evilgrin:

[wiggs]

99. Questions

How big are the two precints that were counted? Wish the difference would have been more than four, but if the precint size is small....

Why wasn't the third precinct counted?

If one precinct count was accurate, why would they assume the machine was faulty when the other didn't match?

Which precinct was chosen by the democrat?

[SaveAmerica]

106. county by machine, then by hand....

Is there any way you can get the word out to the counters or whoever is in charge that they should do the machine count first and then hand count so the handling (card-curling) won't be an issue. If they try that here, they could try it in other counties.

[sarahlee]

127. Thank you

for sharing your report and for giving of your time to help protect our democracy.

[The Judged]

131. It's OK, a Republican partisan judge will rule that NO LAW has been broken

because that will make this whole fiasco lawful, get it? The law only counts when it supports Republican endeavors!

The fact that the tabulator could not correctly count the votes is not important, even though it is the actual basis for the law stipulating that the whole county would then have to be recounted!

The Republicans will allege that the intent of the law was to see if the tabulator could correctly recount on the actual Election Day and in the actual conditions it was used, and since they said it worked correctly then, it should not mean anything that it doesn't work correctly now!

This would be a strict reading of the law twisted into radical, Orwellian interpretation of the law!

Even most Republicans should have a hard time with this legal maneuver that runs counter to their own judicial logic.

[donkeyotay]

150. let me see if I got this right

The BOE wants to prove that the machines were right.

If a sample recount shows the machine wrong, then the BOE still maintains that the machine was right on election day.

The now-malfunctioning machine must merely be replaced, now, in order to prove that the original machine was correct even though it is now malfunctioning and should be held as evidence.

So, as far as the BOE is concerned, their only mission is to validate the machine, not the actual vote.

[MarkusQ]

58. Please edit; his name is "Ken" not "Kathy"; we need facts, not cuteness.

If people could try to call things by their correct name, it will make it that much easier for newcomers to get up to speed (and remove a small barrier to credibility).

--MarkusQ

[juajen]

117. Gee, do you think we should go back and edit all posts

where we call him "Kathy"? We take admonishment from the administration of this board and moderators. Are you either?

[Stand and Fight]

141. I could not agree more. MarkusQ is NOT a mod. n/t

[jmknapp]

59. BTW, Fairfield fits into the 2004 election "frame"

...that Kerry won the cities but the Conservatives/Fundies trumped us in the exurbs.

Fairfield is an exurb county around Columbus (Franklin County) and has been an area of very high growth and GOP support.

[mattclearing]

61. Awww shee-it. It's on now.

eom

[trudyco]

68. dear mtnestor - have they been verifying the punch order?

We've mentioned here a few times about how the label/voterguide could have been switched to cause voters to punch the wrong number. Are the glibs giving recounters a list of punch order that people witnessed on election day by precinct so they can verify it is the same order on recount day?

I hope they do a full handcount on these counties. Are they letting you see the pollbooks yet?

Thanks for your work, BTW!
trudyco

[Alizaryn]

71. Good questions.

[mtnester]

90. I do not believe it is a matter of punch order,

the machine appears to be unable to tabulate anything except a pristine ballot. It starts, then stops with 50 ballots left, you have to take them out, shuffle them, put them back in, try again. Sometimes you just have to put the front of the pack into the end of the pack. It eventually got through it, however, the TOTAL BALLOTS CAST COUNTS DID NOT MATCH THE HANDCOUNT, which matched itself two times.

As stated above, the randomness of this selection of precincts sucked. Both are HEAVY republican precincts, rather than the VERY close City of Columbus City A, B, C, D, E and F precincts (YES, parts of the city of Columbus are in Fairfield County...annexation/urban sprawl). These precincts also had a higher rate of provisionals, and more problems reported on election day. Funny, I noticed that in the provisionals in the two we counted went to *. THAT is how Republican these precincts were.

We were HOPING that if a mandatory hand count was brought about by mismatching totals, this would also give us a chance to examine the actual precincts we believe there to have serious problems...not the "hand picked" precincts by the BOE.

Yes, we are going through the polling books...slow work, mostly seeing no signature in the books to compare to, sloppy stuff.

I hear Perry County starts Friday and is already FAR worse....

The irony of this all....this problems that gets us the hand count of the entire county so we can look at ALL the precincts, not the "hand picked ones"? The tally count that is off between the machine and the hand count is -2 for Bush.....hee hee

[trudyco]

103. COnsidering these were the machines that were used on E-day

I think it matters that the specific machine used on election day be the only one to use. After all, if they aren't reliable on a recount then they weren't reliable on election day. Time for a hand count.

The punch count order is a separate thing. Since you've actually participated I wanted to know if the Glibs have given out a list of punch card order that they verified people used on election day, by precinct.

I'd hate to see us fight for a hand recount in a county only to find nothing unusual because they swapped the punch card order under the recounter's noses.

trudyco

[idealista]

118. about these "democrats" on the boards of election....

Its interesting that the Democrat did not choose one of the inner city Precincts to recount.... and all this we hear from the right-wing conspiracy accusers - "how could such fraud exist when there are half Democrats on every county Board of Election?"

I heard one of them interviewed on KCRW's "To the Point" program about 10 days after the election. He sounded like he was either a yes-man/apologist for Kenneth Blackblot, or he was a scared little man with a knife to his throat - just so wimpy, mealy-mouthily repeating the tired mantras of fairness.

Theresa LePore is a "Democrat" too. Anyone can be a registered democrat, can't they? They just lose their priveleges of voting in Republican primaries, who cares?

I wonder if the R's have been doing a stealth campaign to collect up as many election/school board type offices as possible, that don't seem that fun or important, and don't get much attention. Then they have their troops in place and take over elections, eduction, etc.

Since all the precincts should have been counted correctly in the first place, in any fair system the requester of the recount should be able to pick which precincts. WHY NOT? UNLESS THEY ARE HIDING SOMETHING.

[BR_Parkway]

142. Actually very simple - if something was wrong, whether they knew

or didn't know, they will be seen as incompetent and not fit for their jobs. It's self interest at work, doesn't have to be anything else.

If you boss walks up to your desk bitching about something in general, it's still normal for your first reaction to be "is there any way this is going to get blamed on me?"

[BlueDog2u]

70. How large was the difference?/eom

[Pepper32]

75. They are covering up their fraud right in front of our faces and yet

...NO REAL OUTRAGE

Do we have to stage a protest like the republiCONS did in 2000? We are too nice about all of this, emailing and posting flyers will only go so far.

These people are breaking laws and no one is stopping them. That's why they are so arrogant. They obviously sense our fear for real civil disobedience (which is the only thing that will stop them) so they are doing whatever the hell they want and getting away with it.

[Bill219]

78. send it to Randi...

I just forwarded the thread to Randi Rhodes

suggest others do the same so we can get this on the air before she signs off today

[e-mail]

[mdb]

80. What do you think?

Majority rules in the House, so the Republicans control any voting reforms. And guess what? Repubs love e-voting.

[Pepper32]

85. Exactly! And the only thing that will stop them is Massive PROTESTING

Sorry, if you want to save democracy that's what's needed. The corporate media is not going to save us. The republican controlled House and Senate is not going to save us. The bias Supreme Court is not going to save us. So what's left? Civil disobedience! :think:

On edit: corrected typo

[dogindia]

88. kick

[texpatriot2004]

92. kick

[haifagirl1]

93. not illegal!

[mtnester]

94. EVERYTHING they did once the totals did not match

even after we allowed them a second try (which we did NOT have to do) to do a machine tabulation, is a violation of Ohio Law...

Not to mention, if there is nothing to hide, why get bent out of shape? The shenanigans happened AFTER the BOE made the call to the SOS and the lawyers.

[wiggs]

96. AWESOME! Best news of the week! Questions...

What was the magnitude of the difference? Why do they get the choice of trying a third time with a different machine?

Doesn't matter if the machine is inaccurate, broken, rigged, in fine shape, brand new, or has "Rove Inside" sticker on it....the official tally doesn't match the recount.

If Arnebeck needs to file an injunction lawsuit for the immediate commencement of the County-wide recount, let's do it tomorrow!

We've seen the smoke. We might be seeing the fire here!


Yeeeaaaaaahhhhh!!

[mtnester]

102. Magnitude irony - 2 Bush

legals working on TRO and impounding machines

Fighting third chance, they are not following the law, however, they appear to be skirting it by claiming "equipment malfunction"

[merh]

97. Prima facie, prima facie, prima facie woooooooooooo!

Prima Facie, Prima Facie, Prima Facie yyyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeaaaaaaahhhhhhh

:bounce:

[BushSpeak]

100. Anything look suspicious on the election day results for these precincts?

For the record, the 2004 results in Fairfield county
Bush: 42,057 Kerry: 24,321

In relation to 2000, Bush picked up +8,534 Kerry: +5,256

[mtnester]

104. So far just sloppy work on the poll books

We want to examine the Columbus precincts that are weithin the county, they had the most problems election day, the most provisionals, the most complaints to election protection, etc.

If they follow the law, we will get to examine them now.

[On the Road]

120. How Cab You Distinguish Sloppy Poll Work from Fraud?

Just curious.

Great work, mtnester. You are front and center.

[tandem5]

101. kick! n/t

[Cobalt Violet]

105. Time for a revote.

We got to put dems on notice if they don't challenge this election.

[Zeebo]

107. kick n/t

[Razorback_Democrat]

108. Conyers just needs to deputize a bunch of us folks that CARE about this

and confiscate those damned machines!

take them by force!

they won't play fair

we'll take their toys and make them play fair!

[Botany]

110. KERRY & EDWARDS JUST JOINED IN A LAWSUIT AGAINST BLACKWELL

http://rawstory.com/exclusives/kerry_ohio_suit_1215.php

If you haven't heard!

ALL FUCKING RIGHT!

:kick:

:bounce:

[rodeodance]

111. "election tampering" signed Dec. 15, 2004

http://rawstory.com/exclusives/kerry_ohio_suit_1215.php
Wednesday, December 15, 2004

The lawyers for Green presidential candidate David Cobb and Libertarian presidential candidate Michael Badnarik, along with Kerry-Edwards 2004 have added election tampering to a civil suit filed against the state of Ohio over problems with the state's recount, RAW STORY has learned.

The suit, detailed here, alleges that a manufacturer of voting machines, Triad Election Systems, which serves 43 counties in the state, is tampering with the recount. It is unclear exactly what recourse the plaintiffs' seek; the filing adds on to an original suit to have the recount take place before Ohio electors meet, which failed in the courts. Green Party spokesman Blair Bobier did not respond to immediate calls for comment.
.......more and the original suit

[yourout]

112. kick

[SoCalDemGrrl]

122. We need a wistleblower, not just an "election systems expert" who smells

a rat. While it's great that Mr Jones has submitted this affidavit, we need someone with first hand knowledge of the fraud, a Deep Throat, if you will before the American public will come to the party.

[sabra]

113. Wow! Thanks for update!

It's growing each day...

[november3rd]

114. Glad we're gonna have REAL DEMOCRACY in Iraq soon!

Things just aren't going well in the American heartland anymore. Let's have a fresh start in the Sunni triangle. Who needs Ohio?

We'll just bring Fox News and Tom DeLay over to Baghdad and we can have a real red, white, and blue FEELING again!

[stella2cat]

115. kick

[satya]

116. What are they hiding? n/t

[MileHiStealth]

119. It's the software ... Seize that machine !!!

If the tabulator is kicking out a different number
than what the hand count says, the software in
that machine is working mathematical mojo against
the input (punch cards) before creating the (false)
output. They haven't corrected the software in this
machine .... YET... The evidence is in THAT machine !!!

[zimba]

123. Do it now, sequester that sucker

[anamandujano]

132. that was my first thought

the repairman hasn't done the "patch" yet

[SoCalDemGrrl]

121. Question, is anyone watching that building 24/7?? Otherwise Triad or ESS

could possibly gain entry and who knows what they could do?? My God it seems like we need a virtual army in Ohio!

[Up2Late]

124. Of Course they DON'T match

Punch card machines have something like a 2 1/2% "margin of error!" :spank:

THAT'S Why we call for HAND COUNTS!

When an election falls below the counting machines "Margin of Error," you have to re-count by hand to really know who won. :hurts:

[shraby]

129. That's what they are supposed to be doing

right now, not getting another machine.

[zapped 1]

130. thanks! nm

kick

[EMunster]

133. This could be Bingo County! Kick n/t

[EMunster]

134. kick

[liberal N proud]

135. Kick

[sepia_steel]

136. THANK YOU SO MUCH mtnester. KICK

[flintdem]

137. Fraud or Lazy?

What is sad is this may not even be fraud but laziness.

I've got friends and relatives in Ohio (including a former county commissioner) and they are pissing and moaning about spending the time and money to do the recount (most of them Democrats!). They think the election is decided. These counties don't want to spend the money or time to do the recount and are doing their best to match-up vote counts so they don't have find the money in their budgets for a complete recount.

If the numbers are off by one in a precinct they have a moral and legal obligation to recount, but we may be up against local officials who can't see beyond their local turf and budgets to the larger issue of a fair election.:(

[fliesincircles]

145. Its not the money

I was at the Stark County recount Wed. I know for a fact that at least 1 "election worker" was a volunteer. They might have put her on the payroll to make it "official" but she would have done it for free. These counties could easily find the vols to carry out a full hand recount. The fact is THEY DON'T WANT A STATEWIDE HAND RECOUNT!!

Budget worries are just a front. And Blackwell knows it.

[Carolab]

159. Why is it ALWAYS about MONEY????

Our system of democracy has NO price--tell them THAT! Greedy buttheads. Sorry.

[lonestarnot]

138. Undamnbelievable!

Everyone needs to sit on that machine. It should not be removed from the premises. I thought the equipment was "locked down" for investigation. It is more evidence of vote fraud and should not be touched.

[McCamy Taylor]

139. unless the machine gave "impossible" number, this is illegal

[rjbny62]

140. Thanks for the report....keep up the good work

[Stand and Fight]

143. Great work!

I just hope that justice prevails and democracy is saved.

[Moonwatcher]

144. What is "TRO" as in "Greens will be going for a TRO" - EOM

[lostnfound]

147. temporary restraining order nt

[Emit]

146. I know this has nothing to do specifically...

But I'm too new to post and I know we have people from Ohio on this thread so I'm trying to get the word out here about this action alert that I received Ohio Voters


Probably could use a post of its own.

"In this email:
AcTiOn aLeRt 1: Board of Elections Public Hearing
AcTiOn aLeRt 2: Contacting Voters Whose Provisional Ballots did Not
Count
AcTiOn aLeRt 3: Oppose Ohio House Bill (HB) 1 / Ohio Senate Bill (SB) 1

please reply to: [e-mail]
***
AcTiOn aLeRt 1: Board of Elections Public Hearing
Thursday, Dec 16, 2004*** TONIGHT
6:00 pm
Franklin County Memorial Hall (same building as Board of Elections)
280 East Broad, Columbus
In their continuing effort to meet the changing needs of democracy, the
Franklin
County BOE will hold a public hearing to receive input from Franklin
County
voters on their experiences, both good and bad, during the Nov 2
General
Election cycle. Spread the word. We want to have a presence there to
show that
not everyone is satisfied with the local administration of this
election.

***
AcTiOn aLeRt 2: Contacting Voters Whose Provisional Ballots did Not
Count

The BOE posted a list on their website with the name and address of
every voter
in the county who voted provisionally. The names are grouped by
category (Wrong
Precinct- No Vote; Insufficient ID- No Vote; Not Registered- No Vote;
Pollworker
Mistake- Vote). Some of us will be part of a campaign to contact voters
whose
votes were discarded to make sure they know. This will mean looking
them up in
the phone book and making phone calls, probably. We can start a new
org: the
Columbus League of Uncounted Voters! There?s a constituency to
organize! Let me
know if you want in on that."

The email goes on to info about opposing House Bill

[Blue in the face]

149. Good points

Is anyone planning on bringing this up at the BOE hearing tonight?

[delphine]

151. Can someone please explain

the posts where people say "forward to Conyers!!" or whatever. Why doesn't the person posted forward it to Conyers.

It seems we (myself included) are always waiting for someone else to "do something".

We could take a lesson from the Ukrainians.

[AlexHamilton]

152. Vote difference...

If I am understanding correctly, there was only a 4 vote differential between the machine count and the hand count. This is hardly a momentous discovery. Any machine inherently has some chance of random error. If the differential were 4%, that would be mind blowing. Let me know if I am missing something...

Alex
Impeachment by the People

[bobbieinok]

155. amt is irrelevant - WHAT THEY'RE NOW DOING IS ILLEGAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bobbieinok]

156. amt is irrelevant - WHAT THEY'RE NOW DOING IS ILLEGAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ms liberty]

153. Standing O to you!

Thanks and a big hug to you and everyone working to try to get some justice and democracy for all of us...
A couple of semi-related points:

Yea, we do need to take to the streets. If we had even 1/3rd of the dem voters in the streets that would be more than 15 million people. That would be so awesome! I realize it might be an optimistic thought, but even one million people in one place would be a real wake up call to the american people. I think even the so called liberal media would have a hard time ignoring that. It would take planning for it on a day when most people are off work, etc., etc.. But IMO most of america doesn't even know what's really going on. After all, they haven't heard about this on the news or the radio or from their friends. They are all in their little daily grind bubble. It's time for us to pierce that sweet domestic bubble they're living in and give them a taste of the dark, evil reality that the good ol' US is now a fascist theocracy and the founding fathers are spinning in their graves.
I've also been thinking that it might be time to start protesting against the corporatized media. My fantasy on this idea is standing outside NBC or whomever and laying the truth on Matt & Katie when they start talking to their adoring deluded fans.
But the thought that gives me the most pause...
Where is the John Kerry who testified before Congress? The John Kerry who participated in the protests against the Viet Nam war? That is the John Kerry I saw and fell for when I listened to him speak at the Dem convention - That is the John Kerry I voted for - that is the John Kerry we need right now, the man who speaks TRUTH to power. If he continues to sit this out, if he continues to allow lawyers to work behind the scenes, if he continues to allow the professional dem party careerists to talk out of both sides of their mouths (not all of them, I know), and continues to allow the repukes to marginalize us and frame the agenda and argument, then he is NOT the leader I believe him to be. Where are you Lt. Kerry? You could hold a press conference and in the blink of an eye, awaken the american people to the travesty of this "election". The time has come to throw caution to the winds. Come with us and make a stand for our democracy. We the people are desperate and despairing. Speak out forcefully! America needs you now more than ever.

Sorry if this is got off topic, after I got started I got into rant mode. I'm so upset and angry that every time I think or talk about this I go ballistic.

[Person_Of_Interest]

154. WOW, WOW, WOW, WOW, WOW

HEY LETS ALL JUST BEND OVER NOW WHILE THEY CONTINUE TO BREAK THE LAW:argh:

[jasmineblue]

158. OMG KICK!

[CoffeeCat]

160. Can someone please explain...what do the Reps hope to do from now-->Sat??

I am trying my best to understand all of this.

I'm relatively new here and I do have a couple of questions.

Can someone please help me to understand what the Republicans could accomplish between NOW and Saturday, when they said the re-counts can resume?

Also, since the LAW is that we should be hand-counting the entire county (since 3 percent hand/machine counts didn't match), what gives the SOS any authority to usurp this law? Can't we just say...screw you buddy...we're starting the county-wide handcount--according to the law--step aside!

Thanks so much for any info...

[chomskysright]

161. call Conyers 202 225 5126 and....

ask to be through to the judicial committee and when you are there ask to speak to an attorney. I just called and left a message on a message machine for Ms. Richardson, one of the attorneys.

11:45 ESDT 12.17.04

[chomskysright]

162. ask for this re: this matter....

to have the DRE machines impounded re:Fairfield county. they are trying to change out the machines and from what I can understand, source code could be different.