Rep. Jerry Nadler is going to be on The Al Franken Show soon to

[Pirate Smile]

discuss election reform.

[SueZhope]

1. Thanks...

I gave up on that show

[Pirate Smile]

3. Franken is in Kuwait and going to Iraq so Conason (sp?) is subbing.

He has been really good and very interesting this week.

[VTGold]

2. When Al is away - how weird is that? n/t

[SueZhope]

4. he thinks

it was Kenneth Blackwell..he forgets his name???
Ok it can happen....I cant get his name out my head

[SueZhope]

5. JN says you cant prove it.....thats the problem n/t

[plasticsundance]

6. Help me out ...

Franken is under the belief that the election fraud is a conspiracy theory?

Katherine Lanpher just asked JN, wouldn't anyone wanting to steal an election do it by a greater margin.

WTF!! You mean like winning by 99 percent like in extreme totalitarian governments!!

I know I exaggerate, but you get the point.

[pgh_dem]

7. re: inability to estimate lost votes due to suppression.

any math/stats wizzes know if major dept store or fast food chains have an established queue theory calculation on how many cash registers/avg wait time/line length requires you to open another register or lose a reasonably accurate estimate of money due to customers walking out?
I just walked out of a Best Buy last week (xmas shoppin) instead of buying about $35 worth of stuff because there was a line 30 people long and only 2 working registers.
I can't imagine that some major retail/food bean-counters wouldn't have some calculation of lost business due to inefficiency/insufficient checkout stations.
I think this would be directly analogous to calculating the effect of vote suppression.
Responses?

[Senator]

15. Why do WE have to estimate?

There's no real reason. There WAS disparate treatment. That is unlawful.

We're done.

They should be able to say, "ok, even if every registered voter that did not cast a vote at precincts with poll-tax-lines voted for Kerry, it still wouldn't change the outcome (when combined with other errors/frauds)."

If they can't say that, they don't know the real result.

That's the position we're asking Senators and Reps to take RIGHT NOW.

www.thedeanpeople.org

__

[pgh_dem]

16. i'm with you 1000%

I'm fishing around for something to pull out of 'their' realm. Just thinking it would be ironic as well as practical to trot out (if true) that Walmart, McDonalds, Sam's Club etc have a policy in place dictating a need for extra open cash registers, based upon a statistical analysis of how much money they lose at a certain length of line.
It's a pretty complicated idea, and I don't have the brainpower to describe it any more clearly if it's still confused.
Anyhoo, I fully agree that any suppression is against the law, whether it changes the results or not.

[zann725]

8. Yeah, why on earth would they put Nadler on this Clear Channel show...

knowing he would ENTIRELY contradict the recent statements and actions of Conyers and Arnebeck?

I know that Al Franken is in Kuwait this week, but this IS the pattern of denial that's been going on particularly on Al's show since the Election. I've almost entirely quit listening to it for that reason.

And remember, Clear Channel owns AAR. And Randi Rhodes has mentioned several times that's she's been warned AGAINST discussing the Election Fraud issue by management.

Nadler's statements were like throwing water on our energies. And by coming on AAR, he KNEW the demographics he was aiming at. I resent that.

[Eloriel]

9. Clear Channel owns AAR?

Where'dja get that?

[pgh_dem]

12. Clear Channel/AAR

I think someone pointed out that Clear Channel owns XM radio, which broadcasts AAR but with some limitations.
Someone with better searching abilities than me might be able to point to that.

[crispini]

17. Clear Channel does NOT own AAR

They DO own some of the stations that AAR shows are broadcast on.

And Clear Channel owns like 10% of XM satellite radio, IIRC.

[SueZhope]

11. Nadler keeps saying you cant prove it .

on any show i see him....
he wants reform for the future

I truly think there all on a different page.
think that many Dem's just feel even if its true
there's nothing you can do to prove it.

[Pirate Smile]

14. Isn't the Clear Channel owners just one station in Cincinnati? What we

really need to do is spread the station to a much larger area of the country and not just the big cities.

If Clear Channel will put them on and not influence the content, great!

Franken was also talking about when they are going to start Air America TV and Katherine had to shout him down because it isn't true. He said they need to be doing it though. I couldn't agree more.

[wildflower]

10. I transcribed some of it (sort of) in a GD thread...here:

2. Update: mentioned e-voting! As well as voter suppression.

Edited on Thu Dec-16-04 10:50 AM by wildflower

Nadler discussed what appeared to be vote-shifting on electronic machines, and need for a paper trail.

Joe Conason asked whether optical scan machines deprived Kerry of enough votes to win election. Nadle said he doesn't know about black box voting; said he can't prove election was stolen that way because there's no paper trails.

Mentioned odds of exit polls being wrong.

Mentioned not enough machines. Says you can't estimate how many Kerry votes were lost because of that.

Said we need to make sure these things don't happen again.

Said HAVA is flawed legislation, does not mandate paper trails.

EDITING to add more:

Joe asking if it's constitutional to require nonpartisan election officials. Nadler said Congress can legislate this, as well as the number of people per voting machine.

Said thousands of people were disenfranchised, probably deliberately.

Nadler said report due in 9-12 months, though he's been urging sooner.

Said Republicans in Congress don't seem to be interested in this. But if we develop enough public pressure when it's not election time we might get something done. Mentioned 1968 - I didn't catch it.

...I was just so excited to hear this show even mention this, as the Al Franken show has become sort of like MSM to me because of the things they do and don't cover. I wish that weren't the case.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2833708

[corky44]

13. Nadler said votes were moved

from Kerry to Bush and Coneson says nothing!
I think the most frustrating thing about what little news coverage
we are getting is the lack of dramatic interpretation of info.
If I were in Coneson's shoes I would respond to vote shifting
claims by a congressman by screaming " STOP THE PRESSES!!!"
frustrating.....