Maybe Kerry thinks the election was generally on the up and up

[theboss]

Obviously, there were some shenanigans going on, but there are always shenanigans in an election; it's what makes politics fun. Maybe Kerry thinks that - by and large - the election was fair.

Then what?

[Sperk]

1. then he's too stupid to be president....just like *

n/t

[MarkusQ]

16. That's EXACTLY what I was planing to say. n/t

[NicRic]

34. My frist thought exactly !

I could not believe when I seen my frist thought ,that ,perhaps if Kerry really thinks the election was on the up an up , my reaction was ,then he is stupid also . Then to see someone else had the same impluse and thought ! Then the other side of the coin is that perhaps he knows exactly what took place ,and also knows that there is nothing he can do about it ,and how easily the repugs discredited his Viet Nam service. Perhaps he is just fed up with the whole thing ,as Iam qickly becoming. It appears the power of this White House is so strong that no one dare ? it. At least anyone with something at stake. Its a big ball of confusion and thats exatly the way the repugs want it.

[Dark Secret]

35. Exactly, because he can't be thinking clearly. n/t

[New Earth]

2. oh my god

stop me now

[Blue_In_AK]

8. Faye

Ignore, ignore, ignore

[Alizaryn]

3. Kerry is not a stupid man.

[Geek_Girl]

4. I try not to think about what Kerry Might be thinking

It makes my head hurt. He's pretty much and enigma to me.

[RaulVB]

5. Let's forget about this tread, shall we? (n/t)

[Niche]

23. Forgotten... out of here...

[Smarmie Doofus]

6. Then he should say, publicly, "The election was generally on the up and up

[codegreen]

7. then he's a fool who won't bother to observe what we have.

and don't anyone give me any of that 'well he wrote a letter' crap.

here's what we need from Kerry, and it's pretty fucking simple:

-hold a press conference
-point out what we already know
-be a damn leader and put up with whatever the right and the media say about you for doing this. just be a fucking leader and lead us, or let the light go out on democracy in america.

that's about all we need to get rallied into the streets and to demand things be set right. real leadership.

[GetTheRightVote]

9. I would like to see a real leader out of this bunch called Democrats

But I am starting to believe that it will not happen from this pond they have developed.

[jdog]

10. Well said. n/t

[Griffy]

11. LET this thread die please.. its purposefully designed to divide us!

[theboss]

13. Not, it's not...

It's just a question. I mean <speaking in really small voice to avoid the inevitable shower of pots, pans, folding chairs, small arms fire, etc> ....I don't think the election was stolen. <runs to far end of room and places back stiffly against wall, enters into defensive crouch>......I think Blackwell played some games as far as allocation of resources, I think we need to stop using electronic voting yesterday, and I think that large urban centers are generally poorly run so why wouldn't elections be any different <puts on motorcyle helmet, catcher's chest protector, shoulder pads, knee pads, and cup>......but I think I'm a smart guy and I just don't see this massive conspiracy <just shoots self in head to end everyone's suffering>....I'm sorry, but I do think that and think it's possible Kerry feels the same way <buried in an unmarked grave>.

[MarkusQ]

20. Forget "conspiracies" and look at the numbers...

There are at least two known and documented abuses (disproportionate allocation of voting resources and multi-precinct polling place problems) that could have changed the outcome. You say Blackwell "played some games"--but that isn't a term I'd use for the chairman of one of the candidates campaigns intentionally taking illegal and/or unconstitutional steps to assure the victory of his candidate. Martha Stewart, to name just one example, did far less and it wasn't considered "playing games".

There are also several serious unanswered questions, some of which would in any other context be sufficient to trigger an immediate criminal investigation. I've worked on financial audits; if I'd ever posted numbers and told people "this is what you should tell the auditors to make it all match", how long do you think I'd be walking around loose?

--MarkusQ

[Viva_La_Revolution]

21. need a hand with that shovel?

See'n how yer dead, I thought you could use some help. LOL!

[Griffy]

26. GAMES.. oh like literacy tests.. look at this in scope of history..

Kerry and bush is the latest round in a long fight for the people to have agoverment of the people, by the people FOR the people. Second guessing Kerry is just dividing us! Do you need kerry to tell you that your rights are being eroded, did you ever think that if there is any hope to expose and overturn this fraud he must not be seen as the leader of a coup... hmmmm there is a huge potion of the population that believe Kerry will weaken the US, tax the people and give gays rights! These people will rise up aainst this, violently if they must... have some perpective and focus on helping get the TRUTH out... not sparking pessimism amongst the soldiers of democracy.. we are scared enough as it is... encourge and enlighten!

[kerry2win]

12. Could it be there are actions on both sides

Rep. and Dem. in various elections they don't want the american people to know about because of their big business ties, and thats why only the 3rd party candidates are outraged?

[theboss]

15. I do think cheating in elections is largely a game of chicken

I mean, I would be supremely disappointed if Bush rigged every precinct across the country and we didn't get one dead guy to vote for Kerry. I think both sides probably do some things (mainly to help in local elections) and trust the fact that neither side wants too much sunshine on cheating. But I think of it terms of cheating, not fraud. Legally, the two are the same, but fraud - to me - means massive vote rigging on a Tammany scale. Cheating - to me - is whatever the hell it was Joe Kennedy was doing in 1960 during the primaries.

[robbedvoter]

38. BS! "They all do it" - is what GOP yells when caught. Like: Enron

also supported democrats! They even tried to meet Gore (he didn't receive them , but that's paragraph 7)

[hijinx87]

14. kerry abandonded us.

and now maybe we should get some shit straight as far as : who is "us", and who is "Them".

"we" were abandonded at the first sign of trouble.

"they", as far as this board is concerned, banned any folks that think like I do as "troublemakers".

"we" are moderate democrats, that are here; more than willing to help for the cause.

so maybe "you" ought to get with the fucking program.

"WE" are here.



Are you?

[theboss]

17. I lost track of the we's and you's...

Am I a we or a you? Are you a we or a you? I'm lost.

[hijinx87]

18. "I" am WE, and that's the whole point. n/t

[hijinx87]

19. moderate democrats are DYING to contribute to this board . .

but we haven't been given the best reception.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

22. the "Underground" part of DU...

We're happy to assist in your education. ;-)

[hijinx87]

25. actually, that is exactly what I thought. n/t

are moderate democrats welcome here?

[understandinglife]

24. Totally, totally, totally unlikely that he thought any such thing (n/t)

[debl]

27. Only Kerry knows what he's thinking...

and I've never really warmed to him, but read between the lines, and look at what he has said:

http://www.solarbus.org/stealyourelection/articles/1121-kerry.html

Regardless of the outcome of this election, once all the votes are counted -- and they will be counted -- we will continue to challenge this administration. This is not a time for Democrats to retreat and accommodate extremists on critical principles -- it is a time to stand firm. I will fight for a national standard for federal elections that has both transparency and accountability in our voting system. It's unacceptable in the United States that people still don't have full confidence in the integrity of the voting process. I ask you to join me in this cause. (video message to supporters)

You know they haven't finished counting the votes in Ohio yet, and so it is way to early to start talking about another race. But I will tell you this -- I'm far from finished fighting. I'm passionate about these issues. As I say, 50,000 votes and we'd be in a different place with a different conversation. (Janet Wu interview)

We were 50,000 votes, approximately, moving the other way, short, in one state. That's a very close race. No one’s ever beaten an incumbent president in a time of war. And ‘terror terror terror’ was being thrown at people in a huge, in a huge, negative campaign. I’m very proud of what we did. I don’t look backwards and say well, we did a lot of things that were rather remarkable. Brought out more people at any time in history, I won 57 million votes, plus, still counting. ... I haven’t ruled anything out, I haven’t ruled anything in. Look, they haven’t finished counting the votes yet – we’d be talking about the race 4 years from now and it’s WAY to premature. (King interview)

If I were playing against Karl Rove, I'd be holding my cards pretty close to the chest at this point. Wouldn't you? I love the idea of Kerry standing up and saying everything I want to say, but I can see many reasons why he would not, in today's climate. These are strange and dangerous times for America. I do not defend his actions, I just ponder their meaning.

I agree that the silence we've heard from the people we expect to be interested in the suppression of African-American votes and widespread election "irregularities" is disturbing. Where are the media, Michael Moore, Al Franken, the Vote for Change people? It makes me wonder what the silence means. I listen to what Jesse Jackson says when he talks about the importance of people protesting in large numbers over this civil rights violation and the theft of elections. I listen to what the congresspeople are saying when they urge people listening to show how they feel in a public way. Cliff sent me an email, and here is what it said: "Ultimately, it will be the support of citizens like you for the truth that will determine the outcome." Cliff is our Frodo, on a mission to save the day by throwing the ring into the fit of fire. But many things can happen to Cliff on the way, and they're going to stop at nothing, just as they did in the 2004 election. By any means necessary is their method of operation. Cliff and Jesse need back up. and the only people who can provide that backup are we the people. There is a reason why Jackson keeps talking about Selma. It's only we the people who can force this change, and they're trying to tell us that. We want transparent and fair elections, and we have every right to them. We have the technology, now our leaders must be shown that they must have the will. The * administration knows all of this, so they're feeding us Kerik and Challanges for America's Economic Future and the holidays.

I can't help but feel that some of these quiet democratic leaders are waiting for us to march in large numbers. Perhaps January 6 will be that moment. There is still time, but not much.

Election tampering been going on forever, we all know that, and all elections are to some extent manipulated by both parties, and I understand the democrats don't want their activities exposed, either. But hey, it's 2004, and we have the internet now, and so far they're not in complete control of it. We must take advantage before it all slips out of any control. Eventually things will right themselves, but we can save ourselves years of pain and misery, and untold numbers of deaths, by stopping this NOW. With the elections of 2000 and 2004, our election process has come under more scrutiny than ever before, and that's not going to go away. Change is coming. It's just a matter of when and how. * wants us to wait until he's done with his plans for us. By then, it may be too late. Can you even remember what America was like in 2000? It was ... quite different.

[New Earth]

29. aww

i think whoever runs that site got that transcript from the one i did when the interview came out. it is exact punctuation and everything.

i feel all proud now (shh dont' tell me if i'm wrong!)

[dzika]

28. Kerry knows there was fraud.

I have no doubt.

[KerryReallyWon]

30. You are wayyyyyy off base...I'll explain

John Kerry is very aware of ALL of this, BEFORE November 2nd. Did ou hear the stories on the campaign trail about Kerry on the phone with Max Cleland when he lost his Georgia race? I heard Kerry cried for a whole hour on the phone with him, and I know they later investigated that states equipment, and found the computer patch and it was actually called "rob georgia" Kerry has been aware of all this. Now he's gonna get them. This is his speciality!

[fasttense]

31. Some Shenanigans????

That's how it starts. As I was retiring from the military there was talk about the use of torture. Just talk, just theory. Obviously it went from talk to action.

The same goes with your Shenanigan theory. It starts with people like you who are willing to look the other way when the cheating goes on. You justify it to yourself by saying both sides are doing it. Are they? How do you know? Prove anyone gives a crap about your vote.

Now that your willing to ignore vote manipulation, we'll just introduce some massive fraud. Oh is that where you draw the line? Why? You just looked the other way with the Shenanigans.

In your later post you were willing to admit that Ted Kennedy was playing around with the vote. That's OK, he's on our side, let him pull some Shenanigans. My the best cheater win.

But we can't admit that election fraud is going on right now this moment, making your vote all but worthless in this Democracy. No just a little Shenanigans. Perhaps you did get the leader you deserved.

[jsascj]

32. Hey!

You were in the military...THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR SERVICE!!!

This is entirely off topic but...

Nothing pissed me off more than the Bushees saying that if we did not support the war we didn't support our troops. BS. I have never spoken to one person who does not support our troops.

Bless you all.

[robbedvoter]

37. Excellent analogy!

Complacency made 3 thefts of elections possible. It gets easier all the time. No more judicial fiat needed - "glitches" suffice.

[The Flaming Red Head]

33. Old saying “After the election’s over I’ll fold up like a card table"

[robbedvoter]

36. he also believed W when he promissed him not to go to war

or so the story goes....According to a WaPo article he told friends it was God testing HIM (John). We were extras in that epic.

[SueZhope]

39. Love your little old man icon n/t

[Heewack]

40. I would tend to agree

From everyone I have talked to in the party that seems to be the consensus, and given Kerry's actions since the election I think that's the most obvious conclusion.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Heewack]

42. He does not suck.

I don't understand why eveyone has to rag on Kerry because he hasn't taken the actions that some people think he should. Just because he has a difference of opinion is no reason to disparage him.

I'd be willing to bet that they have far more information than any of us here.

[catgirl]

43. Who gave the orders to divide here?

Jeepers Freepers! You're right, this ridiculous thread should die already.