New Olbermann blog 12/27, with full text statement from Kerry lawyer

[Miami Liberal]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6210240/

As promised, the full text of the statement to Countdown from the evening of December 23 of Daniel J. Hoffheimer, State Legal Counsel, Ohio, Kerry-Edwards 2004, Inc., (and, yes, he’s referring to himself in the third person here):

“Daniel Hoffheimer, State Legal Counsel for the Kerry-Edwards campaign, told MSNBC today that Kerry-Edwards will support the third-party candidates in asking the Federal Court in the Ohio recount lawsuit to order the preservation of the evidence obtained during the recount and to expedite discovery of the facts. Hoffheimer said that various problems and errors have occurred in a number of Ohio's 88 county boards of elections during the recount, which will conclude next week. Hoffheimer acknowledged that the most publicized of these problems was the machine manipulation in Hocking County but said that the developing evidence will reveal other problems as well. He said that Senators Kerry and Edwards are very concerned that the law for conducting the recount should be uniformly followed. They want to be sure that all circumstances involved in the Ohio election, including the recount, should be put before the Court and disclosed to the American people. Only then, Hoffheimer said, can the integrity of the entire electoral process and the election of Bush-Cheney warrant the public trust."

[MissBrooks]

1. Thanks for posting.

[McCamy Taylor]

2. are people still e-mailing him after reading?

he may be getting hate e-mail so important to send fan stuff too

[smartvoter]

7. Yes. I just hit him with the Iraq vote manipulation story. nt

[SharonRB]

3. Thanks --

I checked a couple of hours ago to see if he had posted anything new and he hadn't at that point. The Coshocton County results are very interesting. I wonder how many more votes would have turned up all around Ohio if all counties had done a full recount.

[Patsy Stone]

4. Usually, I get it right away but not today...

"I spent the weekend holding the latest statement from John Kerry’s Ohio attorney up to the light, to see if I could read the secret treasure map written in invisible ink on the other side."

So, is there a map?

1) Is it that as I thought: this is a bigger plan (not having much to do with the inauguration?) and that the treasure is years from being found?
2) Or is it that if the case isn't dismissed, there is actually a map for a treasure hunt right now?
3) Is he as confused as we are, or is he saying one thing definitively?

Oy, I have to go have some coffee now... Can't thing about this, it's making me "NVTS" nuts! (Gratuitous "Mel Brooks' History of the World Pt. I" reference there...)

In either case, thanks, Keith, and welcome back to the "monkey house."

edited because I type badly...

[seito]

10. Patsy If he told you about the map he'd have to _____________

[Patsy Stone]

12. LOL!! You go!

Oh, and there seems to be a startling lack of :loveya:

Where's crispini????

[Pithy Cherub]

17. KO, A beloved Mr. Iconoclast....

Couldn't leave ya hangin' out there.... :loveya:

[Miami Liberal]

20. There can never be enough floaty hearts for KO

:loveya: :loveya: :loveya:

[DemReadingDU]

23. Ah yes, more floaty hearts

for Keith

:loveya: :loveya: :loveya:

[crispini]

22. here here here!

:loveya: :loveya: :loveya: :loveya: :loveya: :loveya: KO!

there, that's better! :evilgrin:

(still reading the actual CONTENT of the blog)

[seito]

24. Well, we see where your priorities are....

lol :loveya:

[juajen]

29. Hi, Patsy Stone. I really enjoy your posts.

I have loved and enjoyed KO since he began on MSNBC. So, a toast to your fun posts, and the handsome KO.

:toast:

:loveya:

[Patsy Stone]

32. Awww, thanks!

KO is, indeed, a KO! :loveya:

We're all are just trying to make sense of the boatloads of crap piling up around here. Stick with me, kid. We'll all figure it out together. Either that or I hope there's a padded cell big enough for all of us!

[Shopaholic]

15. No--there's no map per se, I think that KO's referring to

the new, lame Nic Cage movie where there's a treasure map printed on the back of the Declaration of Independence.

BTW--isn't Mel Brook's History of the World, Part I great? It's good to be the king. . . ..

[Patsy Stone]

16. "Let's all thank the Queen...

She's been so good to all of us!" LOL! One of the best! Madeline Kahn, I miss you so...

Happy Holidays to you, Shopaholic! Let's see if we can get some clarity for the New Year.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Miami Liberal]

6. Go to the link in the original message

I only posted Kerry's lawyer's statement.

[txindy]

11. Read it all.

There's a lot there.

[Cocoa]

8. this is good, but the hype hurts

this is good, because it will affect future action.

But to twist this as people are doing into the possibility of Kerry becoming president hurts. First of all, because it's not true. Despite that person's analysis, Hoffheimer is NOT setting the stage for reversing the election results.

But what he is doing is extremely important, and if everyone misunderstands what he's doing, it will be lost, it will be seen as a defeat, when it's actually an important advance.

[seito]

9. I think most people hope

...with one foot placed firmly in reality. There are some here that are looking only at the short term, but I think most have their eye set on the horizon. The most important issues are exposing * and fixing the election process.

[crispini]

28. I don't think there's much hype in KO's article

re: the possibility of reversing the election results. I think he's totally being realistic about it, as he has all along:

The Ohio election was undeniably full of holes, but barring developments unforeseen, the collective verified hole is not likely to be big enough to drive a truck carrying 10,000 uncounted votes through it.

Now, if you're talking the mood HERE, I'd tend to agree w/ you.

Edited for cool text box.

[Clark2008]

46. And totally realistic about Clint Curtis

IMHO.

I'm glad at leat ONE journalist in the MSM is being responsible - pro or con.

Oh, and :loveya: for KO - or, rather TKO...

[SueZhope]

13. risen from almost nothing, to upwards of one third.??

What KO says here is very different from Conyers on the radio
any one else notice this? Before i read this it seemed like an almost done deal. :shrug:

Kerry’s signature might not even be sought. There has been “very serious” contact among the staffs of leading Democrats in both houses about the implications of the challenge, according to a congressional figure privy to that contact. He estimates for us that the chance of a Senator actually signing on has — in the last week — risen from almost nothing, to upwards of one third.

[Amaryllis]

18. This is one person's opinion. You'd think Conyers would know if

anyone would.

[Amaryllis]

19. Upwards to one third what? Percent of a chance ?

[SueZhope]

21. I dunno good question n/t

[crispini]

26. it ain't Conyers he's getting this from:

at least not on the record: congressional figure privy to that contact.

which is good, independent confirmation and all that.

and would explain the discrepancy.

[SueZhope]

30. so who do we believe

Conyers (almost done deal on ES show)
or KO sources

[Amaryllis]

38. My point was that I'd tend to believe Conyers more than Keith's

undisclosed contact if there is a discrepancy...but who knows. It's all conjecture at this point. I am grasping at any hope. I want to believe Conyers. I desperately want to believe a senator, or senators,will come forward.

[Patsy Stone]

14. Andanotherthing...

"Excepting the possibility that the Greens/Libertarians/Kerry-Edwards suit will be immediately dismissed, this court action in Ohio is not going to be processed quickly enough to affect the inauguration."

Kerry/Edwards, correct me if I'm wrong, is supposedly filing a suit in Federal Court. Thus, this Ohio lawsuit is not the one to which Hoffheimer is referring, and may not actually even have jurisdiction. Yes? No? How many are there?

Can't keep track, vision blurring...

[crispini]

25. I believe that KE is JOINING the suit

See statement:

"“Daniel Hoffheimer, State Legal Counsel for the Kerry-Edwards campaign, told MSNBC today that Kerry-Edwards will support the third-party candidates in asking the Federal Court in the Ohio recount lawsuit to order the preservation of the evidence obtained during the recount"

Edit: Now -- is this the same legal action as Arnebeck's?

[Patsy Stone]

27. So lemme get this...

There is the Arenbeck suit, currently in OH SC, which may or may not be dismissed and may or may not have jurisdiction, that K/E has not touched (or have they?).

There is the Glibs suit filed the other day (Friday?) that K/E will be joining (what we're all waitin' for).

There was an 11-point request from K/E, that is effectively lining the bottom of bird cages across OH. This request went along (sort of) with the Glibs original suit (back when we were young)?

So, we've got three different ones? Or was the original suit re-filed in Federal Court?

Get those LSAT grades wroking and help out an old, senile woman, wouldja?

And girl, it's nice to see you've got those :loveya: workin'.

[crispini]

41. Shrug...

I think there's two, but really, your guess is as good as mine! I'm kinda confused too! :)

[Patsy Stone]

43. Can I buy you a drink?

Maybe it will all come clear to us after some liquoring up! :)

[crispini]

45. Sure, girlfriend, drinks all 'round! :)

They will go well with the floaty hearts! :loveya:

[Amaryllis]

39. No, this is Glib's suit. Not related to Arnebeck's.

[Patsy Stone]

44. I know they're different

I'm just trying to keep track of all of 'em. What was that phrase? It's like trying to herd a bunch of cats? Oy vey.

[Amaryllis]

53. Especially for us with no legal background. Lots to track. Puzzle pieces.

[Senator]

31. Very Misleading >>

Keith writes:

"... that only one county (Coshocton) ran a full hand recount of all of its votes, and, oopsie, its certified total number of votes rose from 16,000 on election night, to 17,000 after the recount (evenly split, we might add, between Bush and Kerry, but indicating 6% of all votes disappeared)."

It was not "evenly split."

Bush lost a bit over 5% of his vote -- Kerry lost a bit over 7% of his votes.

And this in a roughly 60/40 bush county.

Oopsie again.

____
www.thedeanpeople.org

[Vektor]

33. Olbermann says...

"...this court action in Ohio is not going to be processed quickly enough to affect the inauguration."

So what exactly is the goal? I know they want to expose the fraud, tampering, and disenfranchising that occurred, but what good does it do if we say "hey, look what Bushco. did..."

...and then he just coasts through the next four years, anyway?

Help me if I'm missing something, which I hope I am.
:shrug:

[crispini]

49. The goal is long-term.

Get a Senator to stand up, put another asterisk by Shrub's name, and continue to spread the meme that Bushco was elected illegitimately. Eventually, drag enough dirt out into the daylight and helllooooo, Watergate II. :evilgrin:

[seito]

51. ooooh I like it

Poor little shrub :evilgrin:

[Vektor]

57. I hope so...

...I really don't want to see a corrupt organization get away with massive fraud. (Again.)

[Imagevision]

34. The best part was about a Senator stepping forward to sign challenge

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6210240/

{This is intense!}

"estimates for the chance of a Senator actually signing on has — in the last week — risen from almost nothing, to upwards of one third".

[Straight Shooter]

35. Keith pokes fun at Kerry/Edwards and their use of veiled nuance

And yet, here, he is doing the same thing.

He talks about a treasure map, as if he can divine something hidden in the statement of the attorney for K/E. Okay, that's all right, if he wants to have some fun, no problem.

But I cannot figure out if he means one-third of the Dem senators, or does he mean one-third of a chance? And who is he to say that the "truck" will only carry 10,000 votes?

I adore K.O., but sometimes he makes statements that have no basis in fact, and I'd like for him to make a stronger statement that we are missing all the facts. He can play Joe Friday, "Just the facts, man."

[e-mail]

[Amaryllis]

42. My thought too-one third Dem senators or one third percent chance.?

[BigBearJohn]

36. What really concerns (confuses?) me is this comment by KO

Regarding the Clint Curtis story mentioned in KO's blog today: "it’s instructive to note that he was not asked to do so until after Representative Conyers left the forum, and had turned the chairing of the meeting over to a local politician. This wasn’t a case of Conyers rushing to catch a bus, nor a problem with too many witnesses, nor a coincidence.(emphasis added) Would Conyers have placed himself in an awkward position by being present while a fellow Judiciary Committee is being accused of a crime? What is the significance of KO's statement here?

[BoomerSoonerOKU]

37. It sounds like

Conyers/other authority figures have a reason to doubt his truthfulness.

[BreakForNews]

40. YOU'RE STILL NOT GETTING IT KEITH......

:)

Keith Olbermann:
"NEW YORK - I spent the weekend holding the latest statement from John Kerry’s Ohio attorney up to the light, to see if I could read the secret treasure map written in invisible ink on the other side."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6667405/#041227a

Not bad Keith,

But you're still not getting it.
It's RIGHT there in the statement.

First:
The words are your "treasure map." Read 'em.

Then:
Read our Christmas 'Eve scoop:
Kerry Preparing Grounds To Unconcede
http://www.breakfornews.com/articles/KerryPreparingGroundsToUnconcede.htm

Then:
Read the statement again.

Repeat as required, until you get it. :)

“Daniel Hoffheimer, State Legal Counsel for the Kerry-Edwards campaign, told MSNBC today that Kerry-Edwards will support the third-party candidates in asking the Federal Court in the Ohio recount lawsuit to order the preservation of the evidence obtained during the recount and to expedite discovery of the facts. Hoffheimer said that various problems and errors have occurred in a number of Ohio's 88 county boards of elections during the recount, which will conclude next week. Hoffheimer acknowledged that the most publicized of these problems was the machine manipulation in Hocking County but said that the developing evidence will reveal other problems as well. He said that Senators Kerry and Edwards are very concerned that the law for conducting the recount should be uniformly followed. They want to be sure that all circumstances involved in the Ohio election, including the recount, should be put before the Court and disclosed to the American people. Only then, Hoffheimer said, can the integrity of the entire electoral process and the election of Bush-Cheney warrant the public trust."

It's big Keith. Very.
One word, Keith.
Read it again.

(just one three letter word...Keith)
(there's another word -nine letters - that's just a hummer too :) )
See it yet?

Fintan Dunne, Editor
http://www.BreakForNews.com

[SueZhope]

47. I hope you sent this direct to Keith

if he gets back to you please let us know what he says....
THANKS!!!!:)

[BreakForNews]

50. Oh..... Keith knows....

....that something's up. He's just not writing about it yet.

[crispini]

52. Tease, tease, tease! :) n/t

[Clark2008]

48. So what are the words?

Law?
And...
integrity?

[DemReadingDU]

54. are the words Big? Integrity? n/t

[liam97]

55. I think "the" word starts with u and ends with e

am I right, Breakfornews?

[Patsy Stone]

56. How 'bout

Law?
and
Discovery?

[rzemanfl]

58. My two cents worth

I think Olbermann is suggesting that the best tactic for the Democrats is to keep the legitimacy question building. His comments lead me to believe that he feels that Gore going down quietly in 2000 was a mistake, hence the two years, four years comment as well as the Adlai Stevenson shot at Kerry.

Remember that at one time * had a 90% approval rating. Right now 19%-20% of the people believe the election was stolen. Remember the PIPPA poll from before the election that showed that many Bush supporters thought he agreed with their view on policies when in fact the opposite was the case? These people are dense and take a lot of persuading. I have no idea what fraction of the population needs to believe a person's election was illegitimate before things reach critical mass, but I would think it would be somewhere in the one-third to one-half range. It may take months or years to reach that critical mass, but each Bush screw up makes people think, "How'd we get stuck with him?" and more likely to say, "don't blame me, I voted for the other guy..." publicly.

Most folks don't understand what a standard deviation is or how a computer can be hacked, but they understand what random means, because they play the lottery. So maybe a switch to the simpler argument that the recount in Ohio didn't follow the rules is in order. Molly Ivins wrote a column after the election comparing * to a dead chicken tied around a dog's neck. Maybe having the election issue fester will be an Albatross around *'s.

[crispini]

61. The last half of your comment, I agree with.

The first half of your comment confuses me. Gore did NOT go down quietly in 2000, or were you and I in different universes back then?

[rzemanfl]

62. Same universe, different outlook

Gore conceded after the Supreme Court ruled against him and as Olbermann notes, "swore the Democrats off" arguing the legitimacy issue. He never should have conceded, he should have just said he was bound by the ruling but did not agree that Bush won the election, he just won the court case in a Supreme Court where Scalia didn't recuse himself although his son's firm represented Bush and Thomas didn't although his wife worked for Bush.

I wore all black to work the day after the Supremes decided that asshole was President, black everything, shirt, tie, the works. I could not have imagined how bad things would get or I would have dyed my hair black too and rented a black hearse to drive.

[BreakForNews]

59. Try these words. Expecially the first.

Try "All" and "Disclosed"

[GetTheRightVote]

60. I just emailed KO again to encourage him to stay on the story

and to keep reporting it until other sources pick up as well.

:bouce:

At least KO is reporting on it and keeping it out there in the news world.