I BELIEVED

[joeunderdog]

I kept waiting and waiting for them to drop the bomb, but it never came. What happened today was too little, too late. Better than nothing, but not much. I feel like the contestant on Let’s Make a Deal who passed up the Mustang Convertible behind Door #1 and wound up with a 4-foot salami.

We needed Kerry to be in office. Period. Today’s supposed Election Reform kickoff isn’t even a consolation prize. Despite the lip service shown by most of our Democratic leaders today, what really happened is they voted with their feet. They didn’t get in the ring and let em fly. They screamed their token objections, but chose the rubber stamp anyway.

Public pressure is no longer the impetus for change. What makes anyone think that even if there is public pressure on our elected officials to deal with Election Reform, that they will do so? The very fact that the elections aren’t really determined by voter sentiment anymore renders public pressure nearly insignificant. THAT’S THE POINT. They don’t need to perform well to be elected, and that has been proven once again today. The corrupt system is working just fine. And now with Shrub and his RW Congress and Senate in for 4 more years, they will simply cement the system that has gotten them this far. They don't need the voters anymore.

Hate to say it folks, but Help America Vote REQUIRES computer voting. That’s the “reform” you’re going to see.

[Mistwell]

1. I totally agree

And I am disappointed. I'm also tired of people being at a high level of grief that they are still at the denial stage and painting what happened today in a good light rather than the travesity it was.

[glitch]

3. Yes - but we need to quit demanding every one agree with our viewpoint

and calling each other names. We're Democrats, we're supposed to have our own opinions. We agree on some very central principles but we can disagree on a lot of tactics, strategy and even issues.

For example, I agree today was a good day in that it got the fraud issue out and showed the Republicans making asses out of themselves.

I also think today was a travesty in that more Senators did not vote with Barbara Boxer and the 32 House Democrats. I think it was good they spoke, but their vote would've made a stronger statement.

I fear that because the statements weren't as strong as they could've been the issue will be considered settled, when we've only just begun.

And I think no one needed to state that Bush won.

[Mistwell]

4. But it didn't do that!

It didn't get the fraud issue out. People didn't even really mention the fraud part of the issue.

And Republican's making asses out of themselves? We didn't need that 2 hour debate to have that happen...it happens every friggen day in Congress.

No, sorry, I fail to see how making that bunch of lemons into some nasty tasting lemonaide and smiling a big smile and pretending it was delicious accomplishes anything. We took one on the chin today, HARD.

[joeunderdog]

7. We'll know how successful today was in tomorrow's headlines.

Will the message be "we need reform" or "Dems play politics again"?

If there is no MSM momentum, we will have shot our wad with our little splash today.

[Boswells_Johnson]

2. Despite some being disappointed, today did illustrate the extent

to which "The Man" owns the system. The fact that it took so much effort to get the obvious debated could offer a greater opportunity that just election reform.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

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[hippiegranny]

6. Barbara Boxer on the Ed Schultz Show

earlier today said that only one Senator needed to stand, and one did. She claims that was all that was needed and the ball is rolling. She considers today a great victory and warns Dems not to be sidetracked by the yea/nay vote aspect.

[OneBlueSky]

8. today may have actually hurt the cause of election reform . . .

because it demonstrated just how weak the proponents of reform actually are . . . with one vote in the Senate and 32 in the House, there's certainly nothing to motivate the Repugs to take reform seriously . . . as you said, the only "reform" we're going to get is universal touchscreen voting -- managed and counted by Republican corporations . . . chances of a Democrat being elected president in 2008? . . . zero and none . . .

[Raksha]

9. Now we need to start getting some convictions....

...against the individual perps, and then convictions for CONSPIRACY to commit election fraud. Don't forget that Kerry and Edwards are both prosecutors. They could earn their keep yet.

[joeunderdog]

10. I agree that we may have to go after individuals aggressively.

Systemically, they've cut us off at every path--FBI, CIA, courts. Make some examples out of Blackwell types.