An unfortunate prediction...

[gauguin57]

I do not believe anything is going to come from today's objection, though I am grateful to those who stood up for Democracy. It allowed a couple of hours of debate on an important issue.

But it also allowed a bunch of congresscritters to stand up and say, "I'm for fair voting! Aren't I a great American?" and then turn right around and vote to certify an election, the results of which are in doubt because of all the questions of fraud.

We've been screaming about voter fraud for FOUR FREAKING YEARS, and, basically, nothing has been done. And mark my words ... in 2008, voting problems will be even worse. The Pukes in power will have forestalled any reform whatsoever ... and they can do it. They have all the power. They don't have to do ANYTHING if they don't want to do. They are smug and self-righteous, and they don't believe for a minute that the voters are going to punish them for not doing anything about improving voting accuracy and efficiency. Because all they have to do is scream against gay marriage and the sheeple voters will keep trooping to the polls and voting them back in. On defective machines.

The Pukes keep themselves in power by relying on faulty voting machines, voter intimidation and disenfranchisement, and putting their own campaign managers in Secretary of State positions in battleground states. Why would they mess with the evil system that keeps them in power?

I will be thrilled to eat my words if even one damned thing gets done on election reform before 2008. I'm not going to stop fighting, of course; but I despair for the future of my country.

[Terre]

1. Well, I don't believe in sugar coating the truth either

but geeze, I'm just a bit tired of doomsday predictions.

Time for everyone to catch their breath and re-group, don't cha think?

[Jersey Devil]

2. One question

You said: "The Pukes keep themselves in power by relying on faulty voting machines, voter intimidation and disenfranchisement, and putting their own campaign managers in Secretary of State positions in battleground states. Why would they mess with the evil system that keeps them in power?"

OK, then how the fuck do Dems win on the state level in such places as Montana, where they have taken both houses of the legislature while our candidates for national office get their asses kicked in the same venue?

[PennyMan]

3. Maybe How They Did It In Texas Redistrict The Whole State

So There Would Be More Republicans In One Area When It Come Time To Vote
And They Would Win

[Jersey Devil]

4. What are you trying to say?

What I was trying to point out is that in many states Democrats have made great gains such as in Montana and other states which, while red states, we have elected Dem governors, legislatures, etc. Yet, when it comes to Congress or President in these same states we have lost badly.

Do you think if it was caused by fraud Republicans would stop at President and Congress? Would they let their states go Democratic while fixing the election for national offices?

Clearly something is wrong. Dems on the local level seem to be connecting. Why the difference between local dems and dems running for national office?

That is what we must concentrate on, imo.

[PennyMan]

7. Sorry I Read Your Post Wrong This Is What The Republicans Done

To Get All The Seats They Have. Republicans Said The Democratic Party
Has Been Doing This For Years Nothing Wrong With It According To Them.

[tritsofme]

8. I would imagine that

you would not much care for these local Dems that do so well in conservative areas, because in order for them to win they cannot be as liberal as the national party.

[kath]

11. Several very red states, such as OK, have "Democrats" in the majorities

in the legislature and/or a "Democrat" in the governor's mansion. But these so-called Democrats are so conservative that they would be called Republicans anywhere else. These states always go Republican for Prez. and if a "dem" gets into the House or Senate in DC, they're still pretty conservative. The STATE legislature "democrats" are often not even remotely recognizable as Democrats; they're just not as rabidly right-wing as the Republicans they run against.

[Carolab]

5. Lawsuits. n/t

[Niche]

6. prediction, i was hoping for the metaphysical kind...

[FreepFryer]

9. You're entitled to your opinion, even a pessimistic discouraging nihilism.

But we're not gonna catch your cold.

Believe in grassroots Democracy. Believe in Yourself.

[gauguin57]

10. I believe in grassroots Democracy. I just don't believe in Congress

Our grassroots groups worked our butts off for Kerry, and he won in Pennsylvania. We got the extra votes, even in conservative areas. And I intend to keep working on the local level, and working against Santorum in '06.

But I just don't believe the politicians will do anything to fix this voting situation. And, unfortunately, they're the ones who have to fix it.

If y'all still have idealism about this issue after all that has gone down in this General Election and the last one (and things getting WORSE between 2000 and 2004 despite our screaming about it), go for it. Maybe I'll get mine back someday.

I just don't see that the Republicans have any impetus to change the voting system. The media won't prompt them to do it. And I know they won't listen to us. Because they don't have to. We Dems can scream till we're blue in the face. The Dems in Congress can scream till they're blue in the face. As long as they KNOW (and they KNOW IT) that they won't be voted out by all the God-fearing born-against just because they won't tackle election reform, the Repugs will sit on this till Kingdom Come.

Yeah, lawsuits may work, but I fear the Repugs are gonna own the judicial system in this country pretty soon (if they don't already).

Stolen again.

[FreepFryer]

12. So, better hurry back into that turtle shell - that's how you'll fix it.

[Left coast liberal]

13. Maybe in '08 we'll move into the Orange tent in Lafayette Park!

[mikelewis]

14. 2 Key points that you're overlooking... and give them some fuckin credit

1. Obviously there was some politiking going on. Deals were made, horsetrading, if you will. This was nothing more than an objection that was over-ruled but noted in the official record. That was the best we could have hoped for and we got it. Also, because of the horse-trading, only 1 senator signed the objection even though in the official record 5 stood up. Most likely, they agreed not to sign but never agreed not to stand up. All I wanted was for 1 to stand and I got that and 4 more. What more would you have them do?

2. Because of this embarassment to the Republicans and the incredible grassroots efforts to reform the voting process, they can force legislation that can clean up our election process, just like Senator Kerry said in his letter. If that support fades, so does thier power. Why do you think Sen Boxer wanted so many calls? "Oh, I might not do it, maybe if I got a few more calls, I might." Come on. They're fighting back, finally. Give them some fucking credit. Put yourself in thier shoes for a minute. What'd you want them to do, cry for Civil War? Get real and show some appreciation.

[The Judged]

15. By certifying the election the Re-uglicans stayed on their high horses!

If the Re-uglicans had to use a vote of Congress to install their beloved *, then they would've taken us as a serious threat!

They would not have been able to do damage control, and would have gone into full war attack mode!

Now they can just continue to believe that "We the People" are brain-dead!

A good shot to the eye has left them with a black eye, but no media to take a snapshot!

With the momentum gaining for the cause of the people and the investigations of election fraud moving ahead, the next punch they feel might be the knock-out punch!

Either way, they are too proud to show their pain!

They will reflect it as the Democrat self-inflicted Deathblow.