A real consipracy theory

[StephanieMarie]

This has been plaguing me for awhile. It was the exit polls that tipped millions of Americans off to the FACT that the 2004 election was hacked/stolen. What will the repugs be doing between now and '08 to "fix" the exit polls? You know they will do something. How can we stop them? Exit pollists are part of corporate american and therefor, can be bought. How can we get out own independent exit polls so that we'll know if we're being screwed again?

[helderheid]

1. you're right

*shudder*:scared:

[WhoWantsToBeOccupied]

40. Precinct auditing

Forget exit polling. How about precinct auditing?

We could station volunteers at hundreds or thousands of precincts around the country, esp. in Florida, Ohio, etc. We would ask EVERYONE whether they were willing to provide their name and address and state for whom they intend to vote for the major contests for the purpose of protecting democracy and ensuring that votes are counted fairly. Given how passionately many feel, we might be able to PROVE that votes were not counted fairly. And this would make it extremely difficult to steal votes in non-audited precincts too because we could show in a convincing way the bias, esp. if precincts to be audited were selected at random. To work well, we would want to inform and educate people BEFORE the election about the auditing.

[merh]

2. The dems will not rely on the media's indepent pollsters, they

will have their own conducted.

[electropop]

17. Take the hundreds of millions Dems raised

and buy enough media time to blast the word into every face in America.

[merh]

20. Then what will they use to campaign with?

The hundreds of millions you refer to were used to run the campaign.

[electropop]

21. Kerry, for one, still has piles of cash left

It would be well spent educating the public. Besides, why bother to waste money on a campaign, if the election is a sham?

[merh]

22. You are mistaken about the amount remaining

Do you watch faux? Have you been rove'd?

It definitely is not hundred of millions and the money left has been committed to the campaigns of dem candidates in 2006.

Don't believe all the lies, they will make you a co-conspirator when you spread them as facts.

[electropop]

24. The numbers I hear on the Dem side are

around $40 million. That would buy a lot of ads, perhaps even a Superbowl ad. And no, I have no idea what they're saying on Faux. Have they managed to blame Janet Jackson's nipple on Clinton yet?

[merh]

25. Now see how those hundred of millions have dropped to around

$40 million. Amazing ain't it.

[electropop]

37. Narrowed the scope

Originally I was referring to the money raised by Kerry before he spent it, in addition to the money raised by the DNC and the 527's. It adds up to hundreds of millions. I let you shift the tense from past to present, and I should have been more clear.

[merh]

42. Now you are the one that put the focus on the present use of the

money, "take it and buy ads". Can't use what has already been spent.

[suston96]

3. Paper ballots

Paper ballots with a copy kept by each voter is the only sure way to prove that a vote was cast.

Next step is real time ballot counting BY HAND in public view.

And I don't wanna here that it cannot be done.

Canadians cast 14 million paper ballots and had them all counted within 4 hours after the election polls closed!

[Blue_In_AK]

16. You're right

Precincts are small enough that ballots could be counted by hand with no trouble at all. I'd be happy to help count.

[In Truth We Trust]

29. Exactamundo! n/t

[DearAbby]

31. I plan to vote Absentee ballot , after which I will scan for my copy.

I will not vote on a compromised machine. Paper and pencil, worked for over a hundred years.

[iwillalwayswonderwhy]

35. Giving each voter a receipt with his/her vote is a bad idea

I can give you two examples why:

Show me your receipt that you voted for XXX and I'll pay you $50 (to someone poverty stricken).

Abusive husband to wife, "Don't forget, your receipt had better show you voted for who I told you to vote for."

The right to vote secretly is there for a reason. Receipts showing your vote would negate that.

[suston96]

43. A worse idea...

It's happening right now.

The wrong person won the election because nothing can be proven otherwise.

If whom you vote for is supposed to be so secret then exit polling would never work.

(Exit polling works because that is why it is under attack and frequent "recalibration" to match prearranged final tallies).

You have receipts at ATM machines, you get bank accounts on line and in the mail.

Your privacy is at risk everywhere else.

Insuring that your vote is counted far outweighs any questionable advantage from the secrecy of your ballot.

[New Earth]

4. A BIG HUGE REVOLUTION

CIVIL DISOBEDIENCE. take it all back!

[spooked911]

14. Really-- this may be our only hope!

[mahina]

41. Faye I have been reading your posts for a while,

and I know you are sincere.
I have two resources for you that I hope you get a chance to see. One is a movie, a two-video set from a PBS documentary on sucessful nonviolent resistance in the 20th century. It will be extremely enlightening and uplifting as well as a great learning tool for how we can make it happen nonviolently. Ghandi was a pragmatist.

There is a book as well, same title. But the movie is a must see. Nobody carries it but University libraries, but you might find one on the web. I hope you get to see it, it will make all the difference.
The other is a book called Organizing for Social Change by Kim Bobo, organizers' bible.
God bless. We shall overcome honey.

[tridim]

5. They already "fixed" the exit polls this year

Rove simply placed a call to the polling firm and had them switch the results at the 11th hour. We all saw it happen.

[StephanieMarie]

6. Right, but next time they'll have "real time" fixing of the

exit polls and we'll never know.

[indigobusiness]

7. The paradigm shifted awhile back.

We are just now waking up to the corrupt status quo.

[seabeyond]

8. they have already done it with help of media

exit pols are unrealiable and useless dont you know, see wrong in florida 2000 wrong in georgis and florida 2002 and now wrong nation wide 2004

was an ooops they came out this time, they thought over last four years they had gotten them dismissed, by next election, we will not use exit polls because they are so unreliable

[bobbieinok]

23. except those that prove moral values were the big issue, many

blacks and Hispanics voted for W, etc

[tandem5]

9. we could buy those people that they used in the Ukraine...

They aren't just exit pollsters they are the whole PR job. And on election night we can ram them down big media's throat with the fact that they were deemed credible with their work in the Ukraine. So who's got 30 million handy?

[PATRICK]

19. Are we presuming wrongly about the Ukraine?

They used questionable polls to try to unseat Chavez. That was exposed here at least. There is very uncritical acceptance of the American financed polls because this election was more credible for "our" guy, but the process itself was skewed to boost him. Exit polls are not supposed to be partial, but I am convinced these were, ironically aided by the chicanery of the other side.

So if you get duped like Kerry, outmaneuvered like in the Ukraine or successfully(but with great difficulty) stave off the assault like in Venezuela- the exit polls are being used globally to advance Bush candidates regardless.

People went along with the Ukraine and opposed Chavez and the same people meekly submitted to any editing done locally. I see exit polls differently than I used to except for one thing. They are generally used AGAINST bi-partisan democracy no matter what their potential. Judge by results in their usage, not their scientific underpinnings.

If the GOP needs to use the butter knife to stab you in the back they will use the butter knife. If they want to use it to force open a door, they will use it that way. If they want to lock it away they will do that too. So what is totally independent about any tool?

[Lurker321]

26. Read this article

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/11/28/wukra28.xml

then you will see that Ukraine was not about exit polls.

[euler]

39. Wow. This can't be good news.

[tandem5]

27. presumption and perception is the point - fight fire with fire. nt

[Stephanie]

10. The day after the election or right around that time

Some pollster talking head, probably on the Newshour, was saying that they would have to make sure not to release exit poll info to the public anymore until after results were in. I'm sure that is their game plan.

We need our own exit polls.

[Zan_of_Texas]

11. They didn't even have exit polls in the 2002 Mid-Term

They melted down on election day, or so we were told.

Voter News Service just up and said, "Sorry, computer broke. No exit polls," even though the news media were relying on them.

Voter News Service was the previous incarnation of a national exit poll service hired by the major media. Mitofsky is the current.

Having studied this closely, I tell you:

Do not trust anything that is done behind the scenes, nontransparently.

If a group of independent citizens cannot see it, don't believe it.

Second -- citizens clutching little copies of ballots to take home with them is not a particularly useful concept. QUIT TALKING ABOUT RECEIPTS folks!

Paper ballots, counted in public in the precincts, is what we need.


BALLOTS. Not RECEIPTS. (Sorry, this is only the 900th time I've said this.)

[NationalEnquirer]

12. Foreign exit pollers

Who knows, maybe even the UN?

[spooked911]

13. They have long wanted to get rid of the exit polls. Probably this will

be the extra incentive they need to make them illegal-- likely in the name of anit-terrorism.

[spooked911]

15. Getting our own exit polls is possible but very expensive-- the problem is

if the DNC says the Repub really lost according to their own exit polls, would anybody believe them?

I think the only thing that can work is to get candidates and campaigns that are so good that the election simply can't be fixed without it being far too obvious of a change.

The other solution is to take back the media!

[keepthemhonest]

18. I was going to say that too

I think that our only way to still have an exit poll is to hire on of them.At least we will know who really won ,although they will say as they do now that exit polls are not legit.

I would love to hear the people who were saying Kerry was winning on election night try to back peddle now.I wish I had them all on tape.

[wakemewhenitsover]

28. Set up voluntary video exit polls...

...for districts that are suspect.

In other words, after you vote, voluntarily state your name and record that you voted Dem.

When the rigged numbers come in, this will be incontrovertible court evidence.

[In Truth We Trust]

30. Good point and I have been thinking along the same lines. I consider

paper ballots and hand counts the ONLY way to go. However as I expect we will not get this from our so called representatives then something along the lines you suggest might be a effective preventative. My thought was a checks and balances "public" ballot for which we could leave a duplicate ballot with our signed names and contact information with a third party monitor. This is just an idea however I am afraid it isn't without some vulnerability to accusations that not all voters will participate or they will say this violates secret ballotts or some other such BS.

[wakemewhenitsover]

32. Video the Vote!

Even if it's just a few counties, even if the Repubs try to discredit it, 1000 African-Americans stating they voted for a Dem candidate on video, when the results state only 100 votes for that same Dem candidate, is something even the MSM could not ignore!

Video is compelling in a way that mere words and numbers are not, e.g. Rodney King.

[Amaryllis]

33. I heard somewhere they are working on banning exit polls.

[zann725]

34. ...and the Electoral College. That way they only have ONE thing to 'fix'

...the Popular Vote.

[tngledwebb]

36. Exit polls, independent, honest, fair, whatever, won't matter much

if MSM is still corrupt and complicit and doesn't report the story. The average voter ( even the avg Dem ) takes their cue from MSM. If MSM continues to pair almost every voting issue story with 'internet Conspiracy Theory', no one will bite, despite strong evidence from exit polls and other statistical abnormalities.

[euler]

38. Come up about 10 million....

....then specify to your pollster that you want a exit poll that will enable you to certify the results as fraud free. That should get you what you want.